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Why isn't Virtua Fighter as popular as Tekken?

IKSTUGA

Member
More boring/realistic character designs. You have a fucking playable Bear in Tekken. Who's not gonna love that.
 

PhaseJump

Banned
Tekken was always flashy, and supported button mashing to give the illusion of accomplishment, even if that accomplishment is movement & offense capable of landing on an unskilled opponent. Tekken 3 on Playstation was awesome, and the Playstation took over the planet by then.

On the other side of it, Sega's 3D hardware has never been successful in the west. VF2 being the flagship product for the Saturn was dampened by the Saturn's overall irrelevance, arcades were dying out, VF3tb wasn't that good and people would rather play DOA2, or eventually DOA3 as it launched Xbox.
 

Varteras

Gold Member
If I had to guess I'd say it's simply because Tekken looked cooler back in the day. Virtua Fighter was pretty much just an assortment of plain looking fighters. Tekken had two guys wearing leopard heads as masks and one of them was in body armor. A ridiculously buff guy that was actually a robot and another that actually looked like a robot. A freaking bear. Two ninjas with sick masks. A Bruce Lee lookalike. A dude that looked like a cross between Guile and Ken from Street Fighter. Plus two hot girls. Well... as hot as you could get with those graphics back then. That was just the first game. The second game upped the ante with an angel, a devil (technically was in the first game but looked lame), a kangaroo, and a fucking dinosaur. Plus the music was better.
 
Virtua Fighter 1, 2 and 3 were not´on PlayStation. The long pause does not help. But, is Tekken 7 that popular?
Tekken 7 is close to 8 million copies.

I was more of a Virtua Fighter guy back in the day, but yeah Tekken seems more popular overall. Probably to do with it being associated with Playstation.
These days its a pretty dead genre outside of MK anyway.

Above

I’m pretty sure I heard Tekken 3 reached over 9 million units just on PSOne and as you said, on a single platform. If it was multiplatform? Probably quite a bit more. I think Tekken 5 did really good as well.

8
 

SkylineRKR

Member
While I still like VF a lot I am disappointed by its sound design. Even VF5 US still uses the VF3 sound effects. Which were mediocre even in 1996. When I slam a dude on the ground or counter elbow him, I want to hear something different. The sound does make the game feel less exciting than it is, even though VF never was about flash as much as Tekken is.
 
To go back to the context of the late 90s, Tekken 3 was the one big 3D fighter that had good graphics and came out at a time where everyone had a PS1 or was going to buy it in the near future. I had a magazine that came a free book detailing all the character moves in Tekken 3. The characters were really fascinating and memorable, from Kazama, with his badass hairdo and pants, to Heihachi, Yoshimitsu, Hwoarang, King, Anna & Nina, and that ancient aztec/demon boss. Soul Edge was more impressive on the technical level (that intro!) but Tekken 3 had more mass appeal.

Virtua Fighter on the other hand has characters that are a tad too down-to-earth. The protagonist is rather bland as well.

During the PS2 era Tekken remained relevant with multiple games while Virtua Fighter only had a new games with a couple iterations. VF kinda died off after 5 while Tekken continued to be present in the 3D fighting scene -- despite a period of absence in the late 00s.
 

Kokoloko85

Member
1.Playstation and PS2 were always more popular than Sega Saturn and Dreamcast.

2. Tekken is alot easier for beginners and casual fans to pick up and play. Pulling off combos and special moves etc
Virtua Fighter is alot harder

3. Maybe Storyline and character designs are more fan

4. Tekken got alot more advertisement

I love both, Virtua Fighter was my first lol
 

Tiamat2san

Member
Both are very good games at high level but tekken is more flashy and easier to do cool stuffs.
It also has more story and characters cinematic endings.
 

Neff

Member
But none of those sold 8 million copies. Not even a third of that.

Tekken established itself early and was a real looker, arguably the best-looking fighting game on consoles at that time. The sheer sex appeal of the visuals, the red-hot music, cutting edge CG movies and the large rosters of characters from T2 onwards made it a very appealing series which gave you a lot for your money. Plus it had Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan in it, which is a shrewd selling point in itself. Namco went the extra mile with their PSone fighters in terms of content and sales reflected that.

I can shove the controller into the hands of people who've never played either game, but tekken will produce a bunch of flashy shit just by button mashing.

You'll get that in VF as well. What's more, VF only has two attack buttons vs Tekken's four. Anyone can be introduced to VF and get quick, pleasing results. Signature moves are strong, and safe/unsafe moves are easy to comprehend and process thanks to the excellent animations. That's not to say VF isn't a yawning, abyssal rabbit hole of infinite strategy to fall into, of course it is, but the notion that VF is in any way difficult to play is nonsense.

See the difference?

Not really, no.
 
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Shouta

Member
It's been stated already but on a casual level, Tekken simply has broader appeal and is more accessible to the average player. The accessibility part is huge too. Tekken uses 4 buttons for attack with the occasional directional input which is much more intuitive to a random player since hitting left punch, right punch, right kick can turn into a combo. With VF, you only have 3 buttons and one of them is a guard so doing combos requires that you memorize a lot more directional inputs and button combinations to execute moves. It's not hard at all once you sit and start learning it but most people just hit buttons and call it a day.

Combine the above with the greater success of the Playstation and Sega's utter failure in the console business, VF's growth abroad was pretty hampered as a result. Tekken's also done a lot in the last few years with Tekken 7 while VF has been pretty much dead since VF5: Final Showdown came out.

As for depth, IMO, VF is much more difficult at a high level overall. The various options, particularly defensively, require keeping track of a lot of info when playing it. The back and forth in a match that results from it is wild from a player standpoint.
 

mejin

Member
VF had a bad starting in the console gaming. Saturn, Dreamcast...failure after failure.

Tekken on Playstation quickly grew bigger.

Anyway, I like VF but the lack of features for single player always bugged me. Too lazy to not even have a story mode.
 

SkylineRKR

Member
No offense intended, but the people saying Tekken is casual or easy to play do not know the game at all. If you want to be even a half-decent player who has proper movement, it is a very difficult game to learn.

Today I would say Tekken is more complex than VF. There is such a big roster, so many moves, combos juggles etc. Tag 2 was almost science with its tag setups.

But around Tekken 2 and 3 time, VF was harder to master at least. Its true that VF isn't hard to get into, you only have 2 attack buttons. But you're likely only doing stuff like PPPK with 2 or 3 chars and toss it aside. In Tekken you could do crazy shit by mashing with Eddy, Hwoarang, Baek etc. Poster boy Kazuya was ofcourse far easier than Akira.

I was in awe by Law's somersaults with LK+RK back then and the awesome throws Tekken had in general. Blocking was just holding back (or rather neutral, but I never realized that back then).
 
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supernova8

Banned
I’m still waiting for Battle Arena Toshinden to take over.

Yes.
Proud Of You Yes GIF
 

ITsameBS

Neo Member
Because most new western players don’t take the time to learn the game and get frustrated when they get bodied by a player who has. It is impossible for a new player to beat a good player, and a good player to beat a great player.
However, if you stick with it, there is no greater satisfaction in a fighting game when you become good in VF. It will then lead to you becoming better at other fighting games as well. That is why this series desperately needs a great online matching system.
 
No offense intended, but the people saying Tekken is casual or easy to play do not know the game at all. If you want to be even a half-decent player who has proper movement, it is a very difficult game to learn.

AGREED.

The most popular fighting game series (Street Fighter, Smash, Marvel vs Capcom series, Tekken, etc) often strike a perfect balance:

- For casuals and beginners, it's the ability to easily pick up the game and see "results" -- i.e., your character doing something cool on the screen.

- For experts, it's the high level meta game and reward of high skill: learning frame data, specific matchups, advanced offensive and defensive techniques, combos, comeback mechanics, distance management/zoning, etc.

It seems Virtua Fighter simply couldn't strike that balance.
 

Real-HipHopGamer

Neo Member
It always confounded me how big Tekken is compared to VF.

The first 3 Virtua Fighter games outdid Tekken in looks in the arcade and on consoles. More fluid animation, faster paced gameplay, better music, and more than 3 memorable characters.

The only weakness I found was plot, but Tekken only had throw away stories in game until Tekken 5 anyway. Oh, and the game ending when winning or losing to Dural, a lot of people didn't like that.

Some will say Tekken was bigger earlier because of PlayStations growth, but more people brought a Saturn for VF1 and 2, than they brought a PlayStation for Tekken 1 and 2.

Even if we decide that's a valid excuse VF4 and 5 were still better looking, better animated, more fluid, faster paced games. Those titles were on multiple platforms.

Almost every other 3D fighter pales in comparison yet not only is Tekken much bigger by a wide margin, but VF isn't even a close second place.

Am I missing something here? Why are people gravitating toward Tekken all the time? It can't be the story surely? Tekken Force? Heihachi?
Very interesting thread for real. 1. Tekken is a easier game to play much more pick up and play and less technical so it's easier to adapt to 2. character design is alot more unique and fresh for example if you look at Akira in Virtua Fighter it's like looking a another version of RYU so having that image there and the game plays nothing like it becomes a big turn off. 3. in terms of story, marketing, and special effects tekken easily hit home with the end users in the fighting game genre to the point where the reach of the brand went beyond fighting games and the rest is history
 

Enjay

Banned
Because it's not as fun to play virtua fighter as it is tekken. also because it went through its peak as a sega saturn exclusive
 
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Patrick S.

Banned
Tekken is just awesomer. Cooler fighters, cooler visuals, cooler sounds, cooler moves, cooler stages. Basically, cooler everything. Many summer nights were spent with my friends getting high AF and playing Tekken 3 till three in the morning.

Virtua was revolutionary, VF 2 improved on it a lot, but in the end, it wasn't really that much fun to play IMO.
 
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JeloSWE

Member
Personally, I love the way Tekken looks, it's character designs, look of the animations and physics, hit sparks, music and stages. For me, the character designs are one of the major points for me if I'm drawn to a FG. Air combos (juggling) while far from physically plausible, in Tekken at least, they float pretty high and fall with realistic physical weight and speed but in VF and DoA they hover mostly closer to the ground with unnatural weight, I call them ugly floaty combos and it turns me off like nothing else :messenger_grinning_sweat:. Also VF's attacks are just stiff and ugly looking in general, they look old school hand animated with a lack of understanding of weight and speed where's Tekken looks smoother with snappier more impactful hits in my eyes.
 
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lyan

Member
The characters are more edgy (a good thing back then) and the average game between two total noobs look more flashy, platform availability and minigames. That's all to it really imo.
Whats with people talking about the block button, never heard of Mortal Kombat or Smash?
 
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I will say it may not have been a good idea to make the most complex character the protagonist, but otherwise I'm not seeing how VF is more complicated than Tekken. Tekken has more moves to learn, more spacing mechanic, a jab system, multiple grab counters, varying character speeds, and all kinds of frame nonsense.

A casual can pull off combos by accident since VF is a two button game. Without Eddy Tekken has no ease of play advantage and even then that's just one character.

Maybe this false narrative of VFs learning curve came from making Akira the main character since Tekkens main was well rounded while VFs was one of if not the most complex character to use.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
VF is not a more complex game. I played Tekkens and VF games in the 90s like everyone else has. Granted, I havent played them lately so maybe the more recent games are way different.

You want to see ultras cheap wins everyone can pull off against people and the AI?

Virtua Fighter Ring Outs.
 

Miles708

Member
I will say it may not have been a good idea to make the most complex character the protagonist, but otherwise I'm not seeing how VF is more complicated than Tekken. Tekken has more moves to learn, more spacing mechanic, a jab system, multiple grab counters, varying character speeds, and all kinds of frame nonsense.

A casual can pull off combos by accident since VF is a two button game. Without Eddy Tekken has no ease of play advantage and even then that's just one character.

Maybe this false narrative of VFs learning curve came from making Akira the main character since Tekkens main was well rounded while VFs was one of if not the most complex character to use.

The funny thing is that Virtua Fighter started as the easier game compared to its similars at the time. It had only 3 buttons, while the stardard was the Street Fighter 6 buttons layout.

It gained mechanical complexity over time but at its heart it was always the easiest one.
That's also why it doens't have specials, bars to fill, roman cancels, complex juggle systems (up until the latest one) and all that crap.
 

SkylineRKR

Member
Tekken is just awesomer. Cooler fighters, cooler visuals, coolers sounds, cooler moves, cooler stages. Basicall, cooler everything. Many summer nights were spent with my friends getting high AF and playing Tekken 3 til three in the morning.

Virtua was revolutionary, VF 2 improved on it a lot, but in the end, it wasn't really that much fun to play IMO.

It wasn't. I had VF2 on Saturn and while the framerate and animations were awesome the CPU AI was cheap as hell. I ran a controller through the wall after losing to Lion 10 times. Jeffry was also cheap, grabbing you constantly on block. And in VS play VF2 absolutely had nothing on Tekken 2 let alone 3. Perhaps even the first Tekken. 3 or 4 hits and fights were done. I didn't have much fun with VF2 to be honest. I still play it in Yakuza and its just not that fun.

Megamix however, as shit as it could look it was incredibly fun to play. I played that game more. The expanded VF3 movesets and sidestepping, easier to play with more combos. VF3 itself is also a fun game, played it a lot in vs mode in fact. Inputs of VF3 felt more forgiving, sidesteps and faster recovery made fights flow better. But Tekken was instantly more appealing, had a bigger and more outspoken roster and kick ass sounds and music. Its easy to see why everyone went to that instead. And in all honesty, Tekken 2 already was a full package with like 10 unlockable characters, endings, intros, extra modes of play. Namco always went the extra mile for consoles. Just fire up Tekken 2 or Soul Blade, let the intro play and people were already hyped af. I mean shit, Soul Blade might have the greatest intro ever made.

Sega never did much for their console ports. Even not VF3 if you put it next to SC and compare their content.
 
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Keihart

Member
Saying that one franchise is more popular because of accessibility it's such a strawman, it's been told for countless years and never ever has a fighting game become popular because it's easier then the rest.
What usually matters the most for people it's how cool the fights look to them and the roster.

Overly convoluted fighting games have been popular since forever if they are cool enough for people to get interested.
Same goes for depth, it really doesn't matter if the game is super deep if it looks horrible to people too.
 

PaintTinJr

Member
It always confounded me how big Tekken is compared to VF.

The first 3 Virtua Fighter games outdid Tekken in looks in the arcade and on consoles. More fluid animation, faster paced gameplay, better music, and more than 3 memorable characters.

The only weakness I found was plot, but Tekken only had throw away stories in game until Tekken 5 anyway. Oh, and the game ending when winning or losing to Dural, a lot of people didn't like that.

Some will say Tekken was bigger earlier because of PlayStations growth, but more people brought a Saturn for VF1 and 2, than they brought a PlayStation for Tekken 1 and 2.

Even if we decide that's a valid excuse VF4 and 5 were still better looking, better animated, more fluid, faster paced games. Those titles were on multiple platforms.

Almost every other 3D fighter pales in comparison yet not only is Tekken much bigger by a wide margin, but VF isn't even a close second place.

Am I missing something here? Why are people gravitating toward Tekken all the time? It can't be the story surely? Tekken Force? Heihachi?
The PlayStation connection is definitely the reason for the difference in player base IMHO, but for me it is as simple as Tekken moves can all be executed expertly on just a PlayStation pad, where as the virtua fighter's three button layout is unbalanced on PS/XB pad, as all the more advanced combos for the likes of the poster boy (Akira) - start with small frame window, and involve using of all three buttons pressed together at some point or some intricate on hit directional input, or both in a combo - really require large arcade buttons for accurate inputs, so an arcade stick is needed for VF, but optional for Tekken.

Playing VF4 or 5 on pad probably doesn't work for the majority of players to allow them to easily utilise all of a character's move-set, which is basic competence to advance to using those moves expressively by strategy in fights . By comparison, Tekken from the early days(1, 2) always felt like the controls were designed with the PS's face buttons/positions and d-pad in mind - even though it was an arcade game first or at the same time.
 

01011001

Banned
So was Street Fighter EX, Toshinden, Tobal, Bushido Blade, Dead or Alive, Ehrgeiz, Psychic Force, Fatal Fury Wild Ambition, Rival Schools, Star Gladiator, and Bloody Roar.

But none of those sold 8 million copies. Not even a third of that.

well Tekken was the game that won the attention of the masses. every time one game in a genre becomes super popular, sometimes at random, every other game in the genre will be left in the shadows of that one big game.
I would also say that Tekken 2 and 3 are better than any of the games listed and those 2 were largely responsible for the success of the franchise. you can see the jump from 1 to 2, Tekken 1 sold about 1.3 million while Tekken 2 sold almost 6 million and Tekken 3 of course 8 million.

Tekken 2 was just above all the others in the genre in terms of polish and content. it also helped that on the surface it is pretty simple. no weird and special mechanics that you need to know in order to play. Virtua Fighter is similar in that way and I think that's one of the reasons it did as well as it did, it's not like VF failed or something.

just like how Call of Duty killed basically every other military shooter other than Battlefield, Tekken did this in the fighting game scene. and being on PS1 + being relatively simple + coolness factor is why it is more successful than VF
Virtua Fighter didn't have a chance to compete being on Saturn only.
this is not about why Tekken was so much more successful than "Street Fighter EX, Toshinden, Tobal, Bushido Blade, Dead or Alive, Ehrgeiz, Psychic Force, Fatal Fury Wild Ambition, Rival Schools, Star Gladiator, and Bloody Roar" but why it was more successful than Virtua Fighter after all.

and Virtua Fighter sold 2.2 million unity on Saturn, which is huge on its own. meaning it sold better than basically and game you listed. if it was on PS1 it would have had a very good chance of competing more closely with Tekken
 
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MiguelItUp

Member
Tekken always felt more approachable to me. I mean, people could button mash in it and get further than they would in Virtua Fighter. But I'm surprised VA didn't drawn in a larger crowd in general. I always loved both.

Seeing VF in the arcade for the first time blew my mind.
 
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