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Do you consider “pro” controllers as “pay 2 win”?

Do you consider “pro” controllers as “pay 2 win”?

  • Yes

    Votes: 21 9.7%
  • No

    Votes: 175 81.0%
  • Undecided/No Experience With These Controllers

    Votes: 20 9.3%

  • Total voters
    216

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
I thought backbuttons were some esports sweat thing but once you try it there ain't going back
Once you get used to them its super hard to play shooters without them

I know several people who hate their elite controllers but I have asked them how long they tried them and they say something like "a few games"

It took me quite awhile to have them be second nature
 

Deerock71

Member
My cousin has an Xbox Elite controller and he loves it. I'm down to my Xbox One X controller due to my Series S controller's audio issue. With those two inequalities, I almost always rack up more kills than he does in Fortnite, but who's counting?
 

Esca

Member
No. My only reason for wanting the new Sony one is the back pedals for comfort, all the rest of the features are just icing
 

BadBurger

Is 'That Pure Potato'
Maybe I am just thinking too narrowly, but I can't see how having a little extra customization and back paddles available with the controller could overcome skill, reaction, time, etc.

I played with a Xbox pro controller for a few years on PC and it didn't give me any advantage that I could tell. I'm a scrub, and it didn't make me any less scrubby, despite how much I customized it. It only made gaming more comfortable for me in some circumstances.
 
In fact, that's the opposite. Those are so trash!

There was a time when SEGA was doing "pro" controllers and, oh boys, those were great and yeah you could achieve better results. Sony and MS should be ashamed with the trash they put on the market.
B000BKUT2S001.jpg
 
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64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
They're not pay to win because you still need considerable skill to really use them to their fullest extent. Same goes for a lot of other things too,
higher refresh rate monitors, better GPUs, bigger TVs, etc
It's not as egregious as paying a bunch of money for an OP weapon (say, an opressor mk2 in GTAV) and fragging everyone in the game instantly with 0 skill.

I do wish pro controller features were just the standard though. Back pedals especially should have been default with the new console controllers in 2020
 

bbeach123

Member
I consider people has better hardware and beat me is p2w .

I consider people has better hardware and lose against me is noobs.

I consider people has lower hardware and win against me is no-life loser.
 

Hoddi

Member
Not really. There are far bigger offenders than pro controllers and there's no such thing as an even playing field nowadays. Surround sound gives you better location data and someone playing with higher FoV does the same. And if you play racing games then someone with a racing wheel setup has a far bigger advantage over a gamepad player than any pro controller will ever do.

And that's not mentioning ultrawide displays on PC. Someone having a few extra buttons on his controller is the least of my worries in that sense. Some controllers even allow you to program macros for special moves in fighting games which is infinitely worse.
 
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Tams

Gold Member
For competitions sure.

But for you're average schmuck? Well, yes, but it matters so little that it might as well be 'no'.
 

Kabelly

Member
back paddles could have set new standards for console gaming but they wanted to be greedy this gen.

and to answer the question, no. the person still needs some skill. if people want to pay $200 just to win they can go right ahead.
 

SHA

Member
I play on regular controller and still consider myself pro though I've seen many who suck at games praising it , I could relate the pro controller to those notions.
 

01011001

Banned
not really no... they are just a different way to bind your buttons if you need it.

I personally don't really use paddles or anything since my usual button layout doesn't require them at all
 

Elitro

Member
The core essence of your question would be answered with a Yes.

It's like paying to get better gear in MMO's. Sure, if the player who payed is bad he will still lose most duels, but it undoubtedly makes him more competitive, especially against same MMR competitors.

I see people here saying it does not, but how is it not when you have controllers with the same layout as non pro controllers but with more buttons? Lucio in Overwatch 2 is a character that gets so much easier to play when you have back buttons to wall ride for example.
 

Ozriel

M$FT
Xbox Elite models, upcoming Dualsense Edge from Sony, and the litany of other models from SCUF and its competitors. Controllers that offer any combination of rear paddles, trigger locks, adjustable stick tension, and additional sensitivity settings and/or tuning curves, etc.

Very clearly offer a competitive advantage for the user, and I would consider them as a pay 2 win but unfair? Hard to say.

I have the Series 2 Elite for my Series X, have really got into tuning it for CoD as for late. Full locked triggers with the sensitivity set to max, full stick tension, and rear paddles set so I never have to use the face buttons to take my right thumb off the stick. Have noticed since I’ve really dialed it in, and this is anecdotal as I cannot back it up with data, but I am winning at closer battles at a higher rate now.

Anyway, thoughts?


Nope.

Same way we can’t say the same for PC gaming people with high end GPUs and CPUs that can drive high framerates. Or folks with low response rate monitors. Or ultra low latency mice.
 

Soodanim

Member
I see people here saying it does not, but how is it not when you have controllers with the same layout as non pro controllers but with more buttons? Lucio in Overwatch 2 is a character that gets so much easier to play when you have back buttons to wall ride for example.
That's a controller design/ergonomics problem, and the main driving force behind wanting back buttons. I haven't played it, but I imagine there isn't an intentional contortion behind wall riding. Instead, they just didn't have a better way to implement that input because controllers themselves are limited. Back buttons solve that in the same way they solve claw grip in Dark Souls.

Console manufacturers have stopped adapting to requirements like they used to. Sony brought us all 4 shoulder buttons and they've proven invaluable, but now in an age where we need even more they're not bothering. Maybe it's because they can get away with charging a premium for it, as with so many other things these days.
 

VN1X

Banned
haven't thought of it that way but they definitely give you an advantage as it unlocks a higher skill/ability ceiling.

so ya you are paying for an advantage so technically it is pay to win. but kind of in the way of higher refresh screens and faster GPUs also give an advantage.
So you're saying if I buy a more fancy guitar I'll become a better guitar player overnight?

Neat!
 

Lasha

Member
Pro controllers are not paying to win. Muscle memory must still be developed to effectively use a new controller. The same effort could be spent on remapping buttons to find something more comfortable.
 

Xane

Member
Pff nah, I have the XBox Elite Series 2 and I'm still hot-garbage levels of utter trash in competitive games.
 

Happosai

Hold onto your panties
Any fighting game or action I'd prefer using a Pro controller. I don't see as pay to win though...I'm not a 'pro' gamer and I'll still suck at certain games regardless =P
 

Crayon

Member
Lettuce use the gyro on PS for f***** sake. That s*** is devastating.

Back paddles? Sure, useful I guess. Probably gives you a little edge but hey it's just a game.
 
nope. They are way more comfortable to game on however to the point where I have “pro” models for all three consoles. It’s hard to game on other controllers once you’re used to the back buttons. I have never really fucked with the sicks sensitivity or anything but having those back buttons are godlike.
 
Maybe I am just thinking too narrowly, but I can't see how having a little extra customization and back paddles available with the controller could overcome skill, reaction, time, etc.

I played with a Xbox pro controller for a few years on PC and it didn't give me any advantage that I could tell. I'm a scrub, and it didn't make me any less scrubby, despite how much I customized it. It only made gaming more comfortable for me in some circumstances.
The trigger locks and ability to adjust their sensitivity is maybe the most elite feature when it comes to the controller. All things like reaction time being equal my trigger will activate well in advance of yours and therefore will begin shooting sooner.
 

Hurahn7

Banned
No, if you suck you suck. Having a pro controller isn't going to help you against a great player on a regular controller. You put a pro mountain biker on a 5k bike and me on a 10k bike and they will still wax me.
 
So you're saying if I buy a more fancy guitar I'll become a better guitar player overnight?

Neat!
dont know about that but for sure a controller with back buttons will make you a better player in Dying Light 1 PVP.
 
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nikos

Member
It's just hardware, same as having a better PC or monitor than the next person. When it comes to controllers, the advantage/issue is still aim assist, macros, etc.
 
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Fbh

Member
Not really, no.
It's not like those devices that actually have auto aim and stuff like that
 

GloveSlap

Member
Back buttons are an advantage, but not an unfair one. You should be able to keep your thumbs on the sticks and keep control of your character without having to use some ridiculous claw grip.
 

HoodWinked

Member
So you're saying if I buy a more fancy guitar I'll become a better guitar player overnight?

Neat!
why are people like this.... I was very precise in my language and yet people invent a different interpretation of what's written. incredible.
 

22•22

NO PAIN TRANCE CONTINUE
Halo Infinite you need to be able to look around and move ie the core fundamentals.

Left and right thumb constantly occupied.

That leaves Jumping, Aiming (zooming) running, crouching, sliding, reloading, switching weapons, melee, equipment and grenades. Those actions are supposed to be able to execute while moving and aiming. That are 9 actions preferably done while moving and aiming. With only two back buttons that leaves one action where you're forced to use your thumb which means you can't move or look for a brief second. And this hypothetical comes from using a pad with two back buttons. So even going the extra mile you're still at a organic disadvantage regarding a smooth experience.
 
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VN1X

Banned
why are people like this.... I was very precise in my language and yet people invent a different interpretation of what's written. incredible.
It's just a dumb premise that when taken to its logical extreme makes it nothing more than a glorified shower thought.

People will never instantly get more "skilled" with "better" hardware. A CSGO pro will play just as well on lower-end hardware and a CSGO noob won't ever make it to the professional circuit just because he has a 360hz monitor and the lowest latency input hardware possible.
 

GametimeUK

Member
You can make that argument, but then again you can make that argument for any third party controller too as long as you perform better with it than the one that came with the console.

But no, I don't really see it as pay to win. You can have the fanciest controller in the world, but if you don't have the fundamentals mastered, map knowledge, good aiming etc in a shooter for example you're just gonna get wrecked by someone that know what they're doing.

I think guns that offer more damage or higher stats in general have more of an impact in game balance than the controller.
 

PSYGN

Member
Would they make you win all your games? No. Would they put you ahead of many others that don't have back buttons and don't play claw in FPS games? Most definitely. In that regard I would say yes, as it would give you an advantage. But it ultimately depends on if you're adept at the game and if the genre benefits from this config. I've owned modded (back button) controllers since 360 days.
 
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HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
Would they make you win all your games? No. Would they put you ahead of many others that don't have back buttons and don't play claw in FPS games? Most definitely. In that regard I would say yes, as it would give you an advantage. But it ultimately depends on if you're adept at the game and if the genre benefits from this config. I've owned modded (back button) controllers since 360 days.
I agree it doesn't make you win but I also agree it gives you an advantage

Thing is in a game like the current COD making you a little better just puts you in a better SBMM

But as others have said like I am playing on 3 gig fiber on a PS5/XSX on a super fast monitor and I feel all of this gives people an advantage as well.
 

Elitro

Member
That's a controller design/ergonomics problem, and the main driving force behind wanting back buttons.
Fair point! It could certainly be fixed with a different layout instead of more buttons (for this specific case).

Console manufacturers have stopped adapting to requirements like they used to. Sony brought us all 4 shoulder buttons and they've proven invaluable, but now in an age where we need even more they're not bothering. Maybe it's because they can get away with charging a premium for it, as with so many other things these days.

Exactly! The fact that these controllers exist is proof that companies are well aware of the needs of more competitive players (or shooter games in general) and they clearly decided to upsell these players instead of just evolving the base controller.
 
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TheKratos

Member
Having used scuff i can say 100% yes. I mean a bot won't become a beast no no, but give the best driver the fastest (read: best) car and he will win more. It's literally marketed and meant to give you a competitive edge.
 
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