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Ex-Halo Infinite developers criticise "incompetent leadership" at Microsoft

DarthPutin

Member
One thing they complain about which is MS-wide apparently and might be an actual concrete problem is outsourcing work on MP to temporary hires and then firing all this people in 18 months for some financial reason which I am too lazy to look up. Alluded to here:
Between the contracting policies they abuse for tax incentives
It could suck when most of game's development is in the hands of contractors who get kicked out of the door with all their expertise - all while you desperately need to produce new content for your MP game.
 

XXL

Member
Sky Uno Wow GIF by X Factor Italia
 

STARSBarry

Gold Member
I mean while I am sure incompetent management outside of 343i played its role, the pretty obvious awful direction internally from 343 management showed for far too long.

They had 6 years... 6 years and lessons learned from two prior releases that people didn't like that much that put a focus on chasing trends other popular games had.

From the loadouts of Halo 4, to the pay2win loot boxes of Halo 5 and finally the Tencent rotating store + battle pass of Infinite. Money money money was the goal, problem is they forgot to attach a game worth playing to it... and for all those who say "it just needs more content" well we have forge now and it's not rocketed to the top of xbox most played despite being free, quite frankly infinite just was not a very fun game for the majority of people that tried it, and they ain't coming back.
 
Stark contrast to how Sony runs their gaming division huh. You have Druckman thanking Sony corp every chance he get for getting tlou to be as big as it is now.
 
I gotta ask - what exactly should have been done re: halo via the management? Like what specifically was the issue - more time needed? Because from the outside it looks completely baffling that they spent over five years and didn’t have a fully formed product yet - like I don’t know what caused that
 
Matt Booty is basically the equivalent to Herman Hulst, but the structure isn't conducive to success. They're too aligned with the hardware strategy, which is what places enormous downward pressure on the studios.

Do you notice that Sony left E3 and they don't force out state of plays or showcases anymore and their games are still selling like gangbusters and their hardware is still selling like gangbusters. Maybe we're frustrated because we don't get as much hype through the year, but there is significantly less pressure on studios now and they can focus on making games.

Letting Bungie go was the first mismanagement. Rare has been mismanaged historically, though they've had some recent success. The relationship with Epic was mismanaged. All of their IP outside of Forza have been mismanaged. Microsoft is the common link across all of these things. They've never had good leadership and Phil Spencer basically said it himself, he was the last guy on the ship at Xbox fighting to keep the brand alive. Everyone else there has left and they haven't developed a pipeline for succession, something Sony has alway done.

Like it or not, and I know many won't but decent chance that Neil Druckmann is the next head of PlayStation Studios. Herman Hulst is probably the next SIE president.
Losing Bungie was a huge misstep since it was entirely avoidable from how I understand it, but Rare is another story. Rare was purchased by MS after the top guys left to form their own development company so what MS ended up getting was a shell of the company that was, and it didn't help that MS corporate tried to have them conform to MS culture. I think they are on the right track now if Sea of Thieves is the benchmark to go by, a wildly successful and polished game. Everwild once it releases will tell us all we need to know.
 

64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
That is less than three years ago. How frequently do major studios produce major titles? When was Naughty Dog's last new release? I don't count a remake of a game that was released multiple times before. I'm thinking people have some serious misconceptions about game development.
Capcom's last AAA release was in 2021. They have multiple new titles announced for 2023.
Insomniac's last AAA release was in 2021. They ALSO have multiple new titles announced for 2023.
Santa Monica just released their newest game a couple months ago.
Fromsoftware's last AAA release was in 2022, and they have DLC planned for it.
Guerilla Games' last AAA release was ALSO in 2022, and they also have DLC planned for it.

The Coalition's last AAA release was in 2020, debatably 2019. No new game announced for 2023.

I expect at the very least an announcement for a game coming out in late 2023/2024.
 

Nvzman

Member
You mean like proclaiming MS 'can't manage studios' because of 343i but ignoring successful studios like Obsidian, Playground, and The Coalition?
These are all terrible examples barring maybe The Coalition.

Obsidian hasn't made anything interesting since MS acquired them, most key staff allegedly left anyways a while back. Their big game keeps constantly getting delayed as well.

Playground is absolutely excellent at Forza, yes, but have you seen whats happening to Fable? If anything, Fable is a PRIME example of how incompetent and stupid MS's upper management is. They basically tasked the racing game dev to do an open world RPG. Surprise surprise, the game is in development hell and they are also bleeding talent because nobody there knows how to even go about making it.

The Coalition is probably the only decently competent studio left at MS, but even then I'm not exactly on board with saying they are managed well, given Gears 5 was just "okay" and they mostly are offering technical support to other devs to utilize Xbox hardware, while its taken forever for the next Gears game to be developed.
 
Capcom's last AAA release was in 2021. They have multiple new titles announced for 2023.
Insomniac's last AAA release was in 2021. They ALSO have multiple new titles announced for 2023.
Santa Monica just released their newest game a couple months ago.
Fromsoftware's last AAA release was in 2022, and they have DLC planned for it.
Guerilla Games' last AAA release was ALSO in 2022, and they also have DLC planned for it.

The Coalition's last AAA release was in 2020, debatably 2019. No new game announced for 2023.

I expect at the very least an announcement for a game coming out in late 2023/2024.
Capcom skipped almost a whole gen in failure until they got RE Engine ready to go. Now they're cranking out titles, many of them remakes. It took them several years where everyone constantly trashed them and just endlessly moaned about MML3.
 

BeardGawd

Banned
People seem to think employees will work at the same company forever.

This is called a reset. Yes they are looking to save money but they are ALSO laying people off so they can hire people with better talent/skills or people that mesh better with the team.

They've said they will continue to hire people so this is a shake up and needed to happen given how long shit takes at Xbox Studios.
 

fallingdove

Member
But guys, Halo Infinite was NeoGafs GOTY. Surely it can't be that bad.
I think you just had some overzealous Microsoft fanboys that influenced the outcome of the vote. SenjitsuSage alone probably would have spent money to get people to put Infinite up on the pedestal.

Glimmers of greatness but the overall HI package was unremarkable — which is crazy given the resources and development cycle the game had access to.
 

Flutta

Banned
Now MS gives their devs creative freedom and are now being accused of not tamping down on them enough. Doesn't look like they can win.
False.

Creative freedom is given to people who are competent. Basically having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully.

Clearly in this case MS can’t even tell who’s competent and who’s not.
Mismanagement in a nuttshell.

Stop giving a trillion dollar company excuses it’s embarrassing.

Also 343 is not the only studio That’s been mismanaged by Phil & co.
 
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False.

Creative freedom is given to people who are competent. Basically having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully.

Clearly in this case MS can’t even tell who’s competent and who’s not.
Mismanagement in a nuttshell.

Stop giving a trillion dollar company excuses it’s embarrassing.

Also 343 is not the only studio That’s been mismanaged by Phil & co.
Shit happens. Sony Santa Monica got funding for a game that made it pretty far in development and got canned. Then the director left and made Jedi Fallen Order. Guess Sony can't tell who is competent oh my god.
 
I'm pretty happy with the output and strategy at MS. Own a PS5 and Series X, each have innumerable reasons to be owned and used. Series X because Game Pass is a killer value + I enjoy many of their 1st part titles, and PS5 because Sony releases top tier exclusive content on the regular. These threads are fun to theorize about, no doubt, but sometimes I feel like many of you forgot the entire point of gaming was to have fun. Seems like people today are far more interested in discussing the corporate health of a company more so than playing games. Whatever floats your boat, I guess..
 
really looking forward to an interview with someone who says 'it's fucked up! & it's all my fault!'. but i'm not holding my breath...
 

geary

Member
It's not that bad. Gameplay wise, probably my favorite FPS ever. Just missing content. What's there is pretty solid.
Do you mean the area where the guy on twitter worked, meaning multiplayer…incompetent developers exist as well as incompetent middle management. Do you think that the pink hair devs and twitter whores are top of the line in their area?
 
Do you mean the area where the guy on twitter worked, meaning multiplayer…incompetent developers exist as well as incompetent middle management. Do you think that the pink hair devs and twitter whores are top of the line in their area?
No, I mean the core gameplay. Enemy AI. Grappling hook. The feel of the gunplay generally. The gameplay itself is pretty much my favorite for FPS genre. Campaign was fun, but lacking content. Multiplayer was fun but lacking content. The base game they built is actually extremely good, but needed more variety in the campaign, and more variety for the multiplayer. They actually got the hardest part right and dropped the ball on just making more levels.
 

Represent.

Represent(ative) of bad opinions
I keep saying it. Phil needs to go. Incompetent leadership of the first party studios. Absolutely zero gameplay of many upcoming g games. No release dates. Low quality games.

All he gives a fuck about is gamepass and “value” and being able to play games everywhere.

I don’t know how any serious gamer can be a fan of such a model.

I’ll be selling my Series X this year if Starfield is anything less than a 93+ MC and a bonified GOTY contender
 
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ChorizoPicozo

Gold Member
I keep saying it. Phil needs to go. Incompetent leadership of the first party studios. Absolutely zero gameplay of many upcoming g games. No release dates. Low quality games.

All he gives a fuck about is gamepass and “value” and being able to play games everywhere.

I don’t know how any serious gamer can be a fan of such a model.
he can't go. No one wants the job.
 
I honestly would not be surprised if the most successful Microsoft game (ie the one that makes the most money) is Fallout 76.

Pretty much the only thing MS has going for it is Bethesda's titles, the big boys right now in 76, Starfield, Redfall, Deathloop, etc all having been largely developed prior to being acquired/on momentum before MS could institute structural changes to Bethesda.

I'm kinda worried what TES6 and Fallout 5 will look like, assuming they come out at all.
 
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onQ123

Member
yea its confirmed, theres some major mismanagement going on in Xbox. this is the most definitive proof you could find

I wanted to start a thread about Xbox not creating a runaway hit since Kinect Adventures & ask what's going on but I knew the thread would get derailed .
 

ChorizoPicozo

Gold Member
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