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50.55 million Xbox One unit have been sold worldwide as of February 2022. (Only relevant data that we have now)

Xbox Series X/S is at over 12M in 13 1/2 months and should hit 50M in half the time it took Xbox One to hit 50M. Massive improvements compared to 2013 and excluding the horrible decision to try and raise the price of Gold, no major fuck ups thus far.
Isn't the console at like 12M or 13M after a year and 4 months? How is it hitting 50M in half the time? That would be in less than 5 years...and it only has 3 years and half to go...
 

Louay

Member
Don Matrick literally left six months before the console even came out lol. Let's not blame everything on him.
sure it's not just him but that disaster launch killed the brand. Xbox was heading to it's death until 2017 somehow Phil managed Satya to give him the key for warchest and bring MS on board. i have to see Xbox hold up very well for 3 generation without same support as PlayStation had from Sony.
 

Louay

Member
I think it's unfair to blame one generation too much.

Wii U failed, but didn't Nintendo Switch succeed? They just broke the record of fastest 100 million units with Nintendo Switch.
PS3 failed, but didn't PS4 succeed? They are almost at 120 million units sold. Now PS5 is pacing to likely beating that record as well.
I think Xbox fk up in the worst timeline/generation, pretty much the era of social media internet.
 

Louay

Member
Yep, it was a massive set back from the 360 successes.
But having said that, the Xbox One X was the best console. As far as the hardware goes it destroyed the PS4 pro in every way. It played UHD bluray discs, PS4 Pro didn't. It was whisper quiet, the PS4 Pro sounded like a jet engine. It was way more powerful than the PS4 Pro, was built better.
It was just had a pesky little thing called games that held it back.
To think what could have been if they did they didn't do all that stupid shit.
Xbox One X can still hold up in current gen if it had an SSD
 

Louay

Member
Major fuck up you say?

They just picked up Bethesda and will likely have Activision.

Most diverse, best line up of games delivered via gamepass in affordable way.

Time to get out of the past. They have best system this gen. Just the brand needs to recover so casuals would pick it up like PS5.
MS weak point marketing outside the US. how do you build brand again with weak marketing ? even GP which their Ace plan don't have any marketing.
 

nush

Gold Member
Sony was nearly invincible with PS2; had they kept the market share in PS3 then no one would be able to face them.

There's an alternate timeline where the Super Nintendo launched on time with backwards compatibility that I'd like to have seen how it played out.

The third console always seems to be a stumbling block.
 

mejin

Member
Xbox one is hitting 50+ million since 3 years Ago. Is It true this time?

Anyway, Spencer had ALL gen to make things better and in the end all we got were memes of "wait till next E3" which some still use till today.

Chips shortage is a real problem which could hurts the Sales of PS5 and Séries X. Pity.
 

zaanan

Banned
x360, which had sold 85.8 million* units across the world, including over 49 million units in North America.
*As many as 31m of the 86m were replacements for hardware failures, which leaves as few as 55m actual customers:
Perhaps more damning, 41.2 percent of 360 owners had a second hardware malfunction--meaning that potentially 12.36 million people have had their consoles fail again. Some 36.4 percent of 360 owners reported having to buy a second console, versus 13.4 percent of PlayStation 3 owners and 8.4 percent of Wii owners. Also, Game Informer found that 69.9 percent of respondents said they had at least one friend who had an Xbox 360 cease working.
-GameSpot 2009

55m 360’s is not far off from 51m X1’s. Have we found the actual core audience for Xbox?
Nonetheless, only 3.8 percent of respondents said that the 360's hardware failures convinced them to not buy a replacement console from Microsoft.
Imagine consumers so loyal that they will give you more money after your product fails on them prematurely. Such a customer would surely buy the next iteration, despite warning signs.

Don Mattrick was just going where the facts led him.
 

kingfey

Banned
*As many as 31m of the 86m were replacements for hardware failures, which leaves as few as 55m actual customers:

-GameSpot 2009

55m 360’s is not far off from 51m X1’s. Have we found the actual core audience for Xbox?

Imagine consumers so loyal that they will give you more money after your product fails on them prematurely. Such a customer would surely buy the next iteration, despite warning signs.

Don Mattrick was just going where the facts led him.
The replacement doesnt count as sales. As that is falls down on insurance coverage. Or else every console would have had insane numbers of sales.
 
*As many as 31m of the 86m were replacements for hardware failures, which leaves as few as 55m actual customers:

-GameSpot 2009

55m 360’s is not far off from 51m X1’s. Have we found the actual core audience for Xbox?

Imagine consumers so loyal that they will give you more money after your product fails on them prematurely. Such a customer would surely buy the next iteration, despite warning signs.

Don Mattrick was just going where the facts led him.
That is my reading as well.

I also had an Xbox 360 that died because of the Red Ring of Death. That played a major role in my decision of buying a PS4 instead of an Xbox One. Also, I had a new Xbox One in my office and the right trigger just popped off as soon as we pushed it. That left a sour taste in my mouth, too, and I went with PS4 and never looked back.

People blame Kinect and Don -- and that is fair to an extent -- but the RROD during the 360 generation also must have played a huge role.
 

zaanan

Banned
The replacement doesnt count as sales. As that is falls down on insurance coverage. Or else every console would have had insane numbers of sales.
False. Since you didn’t get it the first time, here is the statement from the article again:
“Some 36.4 percent of 360 owners reported having to buy a second console”

See the word “buy”? That is not a warranty replacement, nor insurance coverage. That is a consumer shelling out more money for a console.
 
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Wasnt phil spencer the head of xgs at the time? Or who was it
He was reporting to Don mattrick. He only took full control, after Don left, and reversed everything.
He was. He held the position that Hermen Hulst now holds, while Don held the position that Jim Ryan holds now for PlayStation.

He literally was the person responsible for XGS games' quantity and quality.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
And yet it started out better than this gen.

Nope.


Microsoft's Xbox Series X and S are outpacing sales of previous Xbox console generations - despite the fact that supply has been unable to meet demand.

In a wide-ranging New York Times interview, Xbox boss Phil Spencer said Microsoft had "at this point... sold more of this generation of Xboxes, which is Xbox Series X and S, than we had any previous version of Xboxes."
 

kingfey

Banned
False. Since you didn’t get it the first time, here is the statement from the article again:
“Some 36.4 percent of 360 owners reported having to buy a second console”

See the word “buy”? That is not a warranty replacement, nor insurance coverage. That is a consumer shelling out more money for a console.

As for you article, its wrong. As that is 5k respond. Its not the correct data for the overall business.
Now, Game Informer magazine has conducted a survey of 5,000 subscribers to find out how often consoles conk out. The September issue of the Minnesota-based, GameStop-owned magazine features the results of the survey, which found that a whopping 54.2 percent of Xbox 360 owners surveyed reported having the console fail on them once. Were that figure applied to the platform's 30 million-unit installed base, the result would be 15.72 million failed consoles.
Perhaps more damning, 41.2 percent of 360 owners had a second hardware malfunction--meaning that potentially 12.36 million people have had their consoles fail again. Some 36.4 percent of 360 owners reported having to buy a second console, versus 13.4 percent of PlayStation 3 owners and 8.4 percent of Wii owners. Also, Game Informer found that 69.9 percent of respondents said they had at least one friend who had an Xbox 360 cease working. Nonetheless, only 3.8 percent of respondents said that the 360's hardware failures convinced them to not buy a replacement console from Microsoft.

MS recalled the failed consoles, and supplied new consoles.
 

kingfey

Banned
He was. He held the position that Hermen Hulst now holds, while Don held the position that Jim Ryan holds now for PlayStation.

He literally was the person responsible for XGS games' quantity and quality.
Again, Don mattrick had the last say. Just like how jim ryan has the last say for hermen Hulst.
The top level bras is the one responsible for managing the budget of the company, and any big decision.

Hermen Hulst, Phil spencer before the take over, and Matt booty all report to the ceo of the company. Without their approval, they cant do anything.
 

zaanan

Banned

As for you article, its wrong. As that is 5k respond. Its not the correct data for the overall business.
Now, Game Informer magazine has conducted a survey of 5,000 subscribers to find out how often consoles conk out. The September issue of the Minnesota-based, GameStop-owned magazine features the results of the survey, which found that a whopping 54.2 percent of Xbox 360 owners surveyed reported having the console fail on them once. Were that figure applied to the platform's 30 million-unit installed base, the result would be 15.72 million failed consoles.
Perhaps more damning, 41.2 percent of 360 owners had a second hardware malfunction--meaning that potentially 12.36 million people have had their consoles fail again. Some 36.4 percent of 360 owners reported having to buy a second console, versus 13.4 percent of PlayStation 3 owners and 8.4 percent of Wii owners. Also, Game Informer found that 69.9 percent of respondents said they had at least one friend who had an Xbox 360 cease working. Nonetheless, only 3.8 percent of respondents said that the 360's hardware failures convinced them to not buy a replacement console from Microsoft.

MS recalled the failed consoles, and supplied new consoles.
Your unwillingness to admit plain English meaning, understand survey methodology, or extrapolate statistics makes you an unsuitable participant in logical debate.

For everyone else: MS released the 360 in 2005. They denied there were issues until 2007, at which time they extended warranties. The above survey of 5k was conducted in 2009 and clearly used the word “buy;” not “return,” “warranty,” “recall,” or any other word which means anything other than “purchase.” With money.

Neither MS nor anyone else has ever stated the number of warranty replacements, let alone the number of replacement purchases. So it is left to us to use all the available data to figure it out, which is what I have attempted to do. Happy to hear out any honest opinions otherwise, provided they are based on arguments in good faith and not willful ignorance.

edit: 360 released in 2005, not 2006. Which makes their delayed reaction until 2007 even worse
 
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Yes! Great numbers for MS here! They would have destroyed the ps4 if only they had used the power of the cloud and DX12 properly, and released Gamepass a bit earlier!

I got mine with a 5 games bundle early on, what a deal that was, this meant that the machine was practically FREE! Sony could not even make their console available for me to buy at this point, they didn't offer good deals either!

The machine is still a great little console to play Gamepass and it's still well supported with games like Halo I, Forza Horizon + an army of YouTubers!

MS truly got our backs there and we need to be thankful that they're there 😘
 

yurinka

Member
Can't enter Statista to see the report properly and to reach which is their source, but I see their numbers perfectly match the current VG Chartz 'estimation':

As we know VG Chartz numbers are fake and wrong, they are only fan guesstimations. As I remember XBO did pass 50M while ago, I remember that we got a couple of estimations from credible people many time ago (can't remember who) who were above that, closer to 60M.

Do we have PS4 numbers to compare?
If we get the same source than (apparently) the OP and Statista, which is the VGChartz estimation for February I linked above, it would be:
  • PS4 Worldwide 116.88M (vs XBO 50.55M)
  • PS4 North America 38.59M (vs XBO 32.45M)
  • PS4 Europe 48.74M (vs XBO 12.47M)
  • PS4 Japan 9.39M (vs XBO 0.12M)
  • PS4 Rest of the world 20.16M (vs XBO 5.51M)
But again, VGCharz numbers are fake. According to Sony they had 116.9M shipped back in December, not in February (shipped units don't need 2 months to be sold, and PS4 is also supply constrained so many of the shipped ones must be sold faster than in a normal scenario).

VG Chartz only has access to the same public worldwide numbers we get from Sony and the public sales numbers from some countries like Japan, so their numbers for the rest of the world are made up.
 
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kingfey

Banned
Your unwillingness to admit plain English meaning, understand survey methodology, or extrapolate statistics makes you an unsuitable participant in logical debate.

For everyone else: MS released the 360 in 2006. They denied there were issues until 2007, at which time they extended warranties. The above survey of 5k was conducted in 2009 and clearly used the word “buy;” not “return,” “warranty,” “recall,” or any other word which means anything other than “purchase.” With money.

Neither MS nor anyone else has ever stated the number of warranty replacements, let alone the number of replacement purchases. So it is left to us to use all the available data to figure it out, which is what I have attempted to do. Happy to hear out any honest opinions otherwise, provided they are based on arguments in good faith and not willful ignorance.
You are going on a data that is 5k. Especially with how MS recalled the product. Not to mention the other xbox 360 versions.

Also every product is being bought twice, because of how cheap they are to replace. This is not something exclusive to Xbox 360.

Microsoft clearly issued a recall for the product.

Even if people don't use that recall, and spend their own money, that figure won't go past 5m. No way, will that much people go buy the same product again, if it fails them before.
 

DaGwaphics

Member
I even doubt that the actual active user base for the 360 is anything like the units sold after RROD and enough circumstantial user testimony of how many brought replacement consoles.

Most of the replacement units were free from MS and never hit the sales charts.
 

Topher

Gold Member
You are going on a data that is 5k. Especially with how MS recalled the product. Not to mention the other xbox 360 versions.

Also every product is being bought twice, because of how cheap they are to replace. This is not something exclusive to Xbox 360.

Microsoft clearly issued a recall for the product.

Even if people don't use that recall, and spend their own money, that figure won't go past 5m. No way, will that much people go buy the same product again, if it fails them before.

Microsoft did not recall anything. They created a warranty specific to the RROD issue that went beyond the standard warranty length
 

kingfey

Banned
Microsoft did not recall anything. They created a warranty specific to the RROD issue that went beyond the standard warranty length
Isn't that the same thing as recall. Since they were giving special treatment to the RROD issue.

So any x360 owner had the option to send their product back to MS and get a new one, if they experienced RROD.
 

Topher

Gold Member
Isn't that the same thing as recall. Since they were giving special treatment to the RROD issue.

So any x360 owner had the option to send their product back to MS and get a new one, if they experienced RROD.

No, it is not the same thing as a recall. A recall is where the company asks every customer who purchased the product to send it back for replacement or repair. Extending the warranty only for those who experience the issue is not a recall. Not "any x360 customer". Only those who experienced RROD.
 
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NickFire

Member
No, it is not the same thing as a recall. A recall is where the company asks every customer who purchased the product to send it back for replacement or repair. Extending the warranty only for those who experience the issue is not a recall. Not "any x360 customer". Only those who experienced RROD.
You are correct but it feels like a technicality on this one. Those things were shipping back for replacement left and right. Both my OG and my replacement had to be sent back.
 

Lognor

Banned
I think it's unfair to blame one generation too much.

Wii U failed, but didn't Nintendo Switch succeed? They just broke the record of fastest 100 million units with Nintendo Switch.
PS3 failed, but didn't PS4 succeed? They are almost at 120 million units sold. Now PS5 is pacing to likely beating that record as well.
The PS5 is behind the PS4, launch aligned. Why do you think it's pacing to beat the PS4? Granted, I know supply is a huge issue right now or things might be different. But the PS4 was selling very well for most of its life. The PS5 would have a lot of ground to make up.
 

Sosokrates

Member
The PS5 is behind the PS4, launch aligned. Why do you think it's pacing to beat the PS4? Granted, I know supply is a huge issue right now or things might be different. But the PS4 was selling very well for most of its life. The PS5 would have a lot of ground to make up.
Seems unlikely PS5 will sell more considering the competition is a lot better this gen, not only from XBOX but cloud services, switch and PC.
 
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The PS5 is behind the PS4, launch aligned. Why do you think it's pacing to beat the PS4? Granted, I know supply is a huge issue right now or things might be different. But the PS4 was selling very well for most of its life. The PS5 would have a lot of ground to make up.
1. The demand seems higher this time.
2. During the PS4 generation, PlayStation was coming off the back of a "failed" PS3 generation. PS5 has all the momentum built in the last PS4 gen.
3. PS Studios are better now than they were in the last gen. This will likely result into better and more games, which would likely increase PS5 sales.
4. Analysts have been projecting higher number for PS5: PS5 to outsell Xbox 2:1 in 2022, and PS5 sales may surpass 200 million units according to analysts. (While I personally don't believe that, I think it can hit 125-130 million).
5. The gaming industry itself has grown significantly since the PS4 generation.
6. This generation, PlayStation will also be targeting more casual gamers with films and TV shows, which may open up the console to a whole new market, resulting into an extra 10-20 million units sold.
 

IDKFA

Member
The Xbox One recovery under Phil was one of gamings greatest comebacks of all time. I even doubt that the actual active user base for the 360 is anything like the units sold after RROD and enough circumstantial user testimony of how many brought replacement consoles. So, like for like it seems there's a core Xbox audience that did stick with them, even if it was their 2nd console.

Good work.

I know people may mock this, but the story of Phil Spencer spearheading the Xbox comeback is such a inspirational story that I wouldn't be surprised to see Hollywood turn it into a film soon.
 
The Xbox One recovery under Phil was one of gamings greatest comebacks of all time. I even doubt that the actual active user base for the 360 is anything like the units sold after RROD and enough circumstantial user testimony of how many brought replacement consoles. So, like for like it seems there's a core Xbox audience that did stick with them, even if it was their 2nd console.

Good work.
I see good intentions but not a serious comeback they are still behind
 
Just on this one, Piers said he was going to redo the numbers.
I didn't know that. Thanks for the updated info!

Though I think that prediction would be pretty accurate. At the moment, the ratio is what 1.7 or 1.8 : 1? (off the top of my head, could be wrong tho). Considering how strong 2022 is going to be for PlayStation (probably their strongest year this gen), and how weak it is expected to be for Xbox (probably their weakest this gen, until things start taking off in 2023 -- yes I do believe Starfield is getting delayed), this 2:1 expectation in 2022 seems very, very reasonable to me.
 

reksveks

Member
. At the moment, the ratio is what 1.7 or 1.8 : 1? (off the top of my head, could be wrong tho)

Xbox Zhuge - 12m
Xbox Piers - 10.5m
Sony Official - 17.3m

So between 1.65 and 1.44

I don't think Starfield is getting delay personally but yeah, interesting to see what the final year results look like. Sony says that the first Q should be 2m. I will have a look at whether the NPD/UK numbers gives us whether MS is up or down YoY so far. Spain is a weird one but that one is a lot closer than it has any right to be.
 
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Lognor

Banned
1. The demand seems higher this time.
2. During the PS4 generation, PlayStation was coming off the back of a "failed" PS3 generation. PS5 has all the momentum built in the last PS4 gen.
3. PS Studios are better now than they were in the last gen. This will likely result into better and more games, which would likely increase PS5 sales.
4. Analysts have been projecting higher number for PS5: PS5 to outsell Xbox 2:1 in 2022, and PS5 sales may surpass 200 million units according to analysts. (While I personally don't believe that, I think it can hit 125-130 million).
5. The gaming industry itself has grown significantly since the PS4 generation.
6. This generation, PlayStation will also be targeting more casual gamers with films and TV shows, which may open up the console to a whole new market, resulting into an extra 10-20 million units sold.
Thanks. Good reasons. Will be interesting to see how this plays out over the next several years. As someone else mentioned, Xbox is being much more competitive this gen so that is one point against the PS5 outselling the PS4. The Xbox One was a huge misfire (not to take anything away from the PS4 success).

I think also if supply issues continue for the rest of the year and into next year it will be just that much harder for the PS5 to top the PS4.

Let's come back in a couple of years and see how things look!
 

ShirAhava

Plays with kids toys, in the adult gaming world
The diff from the launch Kinect Xbox One and the Xbox One X is like night and day! I love my Xbox One X w/ SSD, Backward Compat and 12tflop XCLOUD Game streaming
 
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yurinka

Member
1. The demand seems higher this time.
2. During the PS4 generation, PlayStation was coming off the back of a "failed" PS3 generation. PS5 has all the momentum built in the last PS4 gen.
3. PS Studios are better now than they were in the last gen. This will likely result into better and more games, which would likely increase PS5 sales.
4. Analysts have been projecting higher number for PS5: PS5 to outsell Xbox 2:1 in 2022, and PS5 sales may surpass 200 million units according to analysts. (While I personally don't believe that, I think it can hit 125-130 million).
5. The gaming industry itself has grown significantly since the PS4 generation.
6. This generation, PlayStation will also be targeting more casual gamers with films and TV shows, which may open up the console to a whole new market, resulting into an extra 10-20 million units sold.
7. In addition to bring their gaming IPs to movies and TV shows, they are also expanding them to mobile and PC, so will get new fans from there.
8. With over 116M PS4 sold and having BC, many people will prefer a PS5 for the next gen to keep their library.
9. If PS5 isn't way ahead of launch alined PS4 numbers is because of the chips shortage, not due to lack of demand.
10. All internal PS Studios have been growing their headcount, plus SIE is acquiring more dev and support teams, meaning they will have a bigger and better output.
11. According to Jim Ryan PS5 will have more exclusives than any previous PS console. The big majority of Sony exclusives are 3rd party, which means that they not only will increase their 1st (+2nd party).
12. They are working on a next gen iteration of PS Now, if more appealing will bring new people.
13. They are working on a next gen iteration of PSVR, if more appealing will bring new people.
14. They have 111MAU, meaning most PS4 users moved to PS5 or continued active during the last month on PS4, meaning they are happy and engaged with it. So when moving to next gen pretty likely may continue with PS.
15. This gen all MS games will be day one on PC, so if someone has a gaming PC and decides to have only a next gen console may decide to play the MS games on PC and get a PS5 as console.
16. Sony's gaming revenue and profits keep growing, so will be able to reinvest more in games, deals or acquisitions.
 
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