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[German Hops]

So for quite awhile, but especially now there has been lots of debate on how various media can attract more of a female audience. I am curious what your thoughts are.

A good example is video games. Lots of men such as myself buy the new systems coming out to play the new games, a lot of the time they are of the very violent category. Of course a lot of women are turned off by it and won't buy it.

But companies going back to the old days would release "girl games" such as Barbie games, Mary Kate and Ashley games, Tomb Raider, etc. etc. which usually did not sell that well. Same could be said for other forms of entertainment despite it being said they used focus groups.

So my question is is do you think there is really anything companies can do to make women more likely to spend $300+ on a new gaming system as well as the money on games to make women more willing to buy video games while at the same time releasing the type of games men typically like, or do you think it's more of a futile effort?

 

[Zeroing]

Didn’t Sony said 40% of their gamers are women?

Found it
Link

I’m not sure the percentage of the rest of the industry. What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

people will burn me alive for saying this aren’t they?

 

[killatopak]

40% of people playing on PS are women if we are to believe the statistics posted by Sony.

Personally in my household there are three women who plays more games than me.

One plays Genshin and Persona religiously.
The other plays Valorant, CODM and is a huge fan of Yakuza, Far Cry and Days Gone.
The last is a huge survival fan. Games like Dying light, Stardew, Minecraft, Dead by Daylight.

Generally, in the games we four play similarly, we like coop games like Diablo, L4D and Overcooked.

As you can see there is a spectrum of different tastes and there isn‘t one type of game that all women likes just as men have different tastes.

The barrier for entry has always been the community and how games are marketed to a specific audience. It also helps that a female lead character is on the rise in gaming and gaming itself has been becoming more mainstream as well as simplifying many of the mechanics found in the earlier years of gaming.

The fact that girls that plays games has become more acceptable in the society whereas in the past it was strictly a leisure for men and even specifically men who have been called nerds.

 

[rofif]

I don't know any gaming women personally.... So 40% is not something I imagine. Online gaming also confirms my observation.
But ok. I only see a small bubble

 

[mansoor1980]

womxn only play games when they are bored

 

[Radical_3d]

Didn’t Sony said 40% of their gamers are women?

Found it
Link

I’m not sure the percentage of the rest of the industry. What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

people will burn me alive for saying this aren’t they?

The percentage is actually higher, but that still counts my mother playing scribble in the phone as a gamer. We don’t have access to the data of the demography of the hardcore gamer, but if you look at the themes and generes of the games made by large companies that actually have that data you can make an educated guess.

 

[reksveks]

Invest in moderation of communities and better ways to limit the dicks on the Internet.

 

[bitbydeath]

Stop catering to the uglies.
Pretty girls have feelings too.

 

[Tschumi]

We don’t have access to the data of the demography of the hardcore gamer, but if you look at the themes and generes of the games made by large companies that actually have that data you can make an educated guess.

I'm not trying to pick on you but those two statements are so colossally lacking in any kind of content, so heavily reliant on a wink and a nudge that i can't even.

---

On topic: I've never really thought of mainstream gaming as being not for women, unless we're talking about Duke Nukem et al, thankfully his last game got shat on. I believe that if a woman wants to like Age of Empires 2, they will. For example.

I think it's good that they're not making all the women look like 3D hentai characters, frankly I'd be pretty impressed if men in video games weren't always chiseled and handsome, too~ Next game to star my neighborhood grocer and their spouse saving the world gets my vote.

 

[mxbison]

Worldwide there are more women than men playing video games, they are also more likely to spend money on games.

The mobile market already focuses on women. Nintendo seems to have gotten the message too. MS and Sony, not so much.

 

[nush]

40% of people playing on PS are women if we are to believe the statistics posted by Sony.

I'd like to know how they got to that number. I'm fairly sure that gender isn't a field when you setup a PlayStation account.

 

[keraj37]

They could make more simulators of:
Cooking,
Cleaning,
Babysitting,
Doing selfies,
Hunting for old rich men,

Okay I went too far.

 

[tommib]

Didn’t Sony said 40% of their gamers are women?

Found it
Link

I’m not sure the percentage of the rest of the industry. What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

people will burn me alive for saying this aren’t they?

Nope, you’re right. That thread was a shitshow. I hate all the inclusion bullshit but to have dozens of pages of men telling everyone how disgusting alloy looked and how she was on a journey to morbid obesity was ground zero for turning women off from videogame culture.

 

[EDMIX]

40% of people playing on PS are women if we are to believe the statistics posted by Sony.

Personally in my household there are three women who plays more games than me.

One plays Genshin and Persona religiously.
The other plays Valorant, CODM and is a huge fan of Yakuza, Far Cry and Days Gone.
The last is a huge survival fan. Games like Dying light, Stardew, Minecraft, Dead by Daylight.

Generally, in the games we four play similarly, we like coop games like Diablo, L4D and Overcooked.

As you can see there is a spectrum of different tastes and there isn‘t one type of game that all women likes just as men have different tastes.

The barrier for entry has always been the community and how games are marketed to a specific audience. It also helps that a female lead character is on the rise in gaming and gaming itself has been becoming more mainstream as well as simplifying many of the mechanics found in the earlier years of gaming.

The fact that girls that plays games has become more acceptable in the society whereas in the past it was strictly a leisure for men and even specifically men who have been called nerds.

Agreed.

I believe it will get better and over time we will see more and more women design games knowing that women will play them too. I think this is a great thing as we can't just be tone deaf to reality when creating such things.

tommib Agreed. I'm never going to say a developer MUST do this or that, when women design games and have a say, its up to them to decide and I have nothing against it. I always love the term in the black community, "no one can speak for us, but us" and it makes sense. As a man, I don't know what goes on 100% with women mentally and I live with 3 lol , but living with 3 makes me realize that many things are created with a bias even if it wasn't intentional.

I'd argue that Aloy thread goes to show such ideas truly exist in gaming and those that keep saying this or that isn't needed, seem to be the ones that even support that damn argument in the first place that women have. Its a shame when in an industry with so much possibility, creativity and freedom to explore such crazy ideas, we have people hung up on the size of a woman's chin or Aloy face. Now I'm not for anything forced, but if some SJW makes an argument about how the industry is and uses such threads as an example.....is she really wrong? So I feel its exactly why women are needed in the industry. As the medium gets more and more diverse, that input is needed as we don't know what we don't know and how can a SJW attack a game with a woman that might not look the most pretty arguing that the industry is trying to make women ugly to make them look lessor if it was indeed a woman that made the character?

I think many really need to consider that. Making such threads doesn't help the industry, it simply gives more ammo for SJW. No all men are like this or give a shit about such things in video games and I think they need to know that before assuming ALL MALE gamers really think that way. When they make their game, they can make people look how ever they want lol

 

[Spukc]

Implement more ways to monetize their tits in esport games. E-ink bras that show more whenever someone sends a tip.
Bathtub friendly e-sport games. So they allow the user to not use a controller. Perhaps kinect or eye toy like controls. Making it possible to give more attention to the audience. Instead of playing the game.

srsly tho.. Plenty of games to play, A lot of female heroes in games etc etc . I think it's pretty even these days.

 

[Dick Jones]

The more people playing games the better. You'd hope the developers wouldn't need to have "surprise mechanics" to maximise profits.

Just like movies, you can have diverse genres of games. Not all movies need to attract all viewers and not all games need to attract all players. I wouldn't be a fan of just homogenised games. Fuck that.

 

[Daymos]

My wife is too busy playing Ryza2 on switch to care about your question.. or to care about answering my question I should say. 'uh.. I don't know. I never really thought about it.'

She hated the microsoft conference full of angry characters, violence, and guns. Microsoft needs help when it comes to audiences beyond 16-26 yr old men.

Shin Megami Tensei is the game she's most likely looking forward to. Nintendo does it right when it comes to catering to women (in my useless man opinion).

 

[G Boaty]

I think the gaming community needs to do more than console manufacturers. See the "lol sexist jokes but seriously" posts already in this less than 20 posts long thread. Large parts of the gaming community are still immature when it comes to this and treat girl gamers as some other species that need special treatment, then try to pass it off as a joke.

 

[Shubh_C63]

Maybe. I mean good story or good games are good games.
Doesn't matter who is watching/playing them, men or women.

Are we thinking Tlou is better catered to women than, say Just Cause 2 ?

 

[German Hops]

Are we thinking Tlou is better catered to women than, say Just Cause 2 ?

Absolutely. JC2 is only about machismo, testosterone, and blowing stuff up.

TLOU 2, on the other hand, features a strong female lead, which is very encouraging and engaging to female gamers

 

[Kiriseki]

Absolutely. JC2 is only about machismo, testosterone, and blowing stuff up.

TLOU 2, on the other hand, features a strong female lead, which is very encouraging and engaging to female gamers

This is the same as saying monster truck rallies are only for boys, while soap operas are only for girls, it's sexist to assume that only men can enjoy certain things, while only women can enjoy certain other things.

Representation is not the massive roadblock people think it is, women can enjoy big explosive machismo fests just as much as men, and men normally don't care if they're playing as a woman in some narrative focus experience.

 

[German Hops]

This is the same as saying monster truck rallies are only for boys, while soap operas are only for girls, it's sexist to assume that only men can enjoy certain things, while only women can enjoy certain other things.

Representation is not the massive roadblock people think it is, women can enjoy big explosive machismo fests just as much as men, and men normally don't care if they're playing as a woman in some narrative focus experience.

I mostly agree with your points, but I think you're basing your opinion off of outliers.

 

[FreedomOfSpeech]

Does the world not cater to women enough?

 

[Toots]

I’m not sure the percentage of the rest of the industry. What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

people will burn me alive for saying this aren’t they?

Spoiler: I'm sure they will

 

[junguler]

i don't know any women that plays and enjoys AAA games, they play a lot of indie and mobile/android games tho. they like the pick up and play nature of those smaller games because they have a lot of small chunks of free time here and there.
the fortunate thing is gaming has become so massive it can provide for every kind of gamer no matter the age or gender.

 

[Gaelyon]

Stop making Barbie games to lure women to gaming, for once.

 

[underwater]

Women can do whatever they want and with this freedom of choice most do not play games. Anybody who does not respect this or think it needs to be "changed" is basically saying women are dumb and don't know what they want.

I understand why companies want to change this (more $) but nobody else should give a damn. There is no rule that says we need 50/50 sex divide in every part of society and recreation.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

I don’t know why “if this game isn’t for you, then don’t play it” can’t be made a bit more general to become “if you, a woman, don’t feel like video games are for you, then it’s OK for you not to play them”.

Video games as a hobby/pasttime/timekiller etc, don’t have to cater to specific audiences. There’s so much variety in gaming, that it should be accepted by know that if “women” aren’t interested, maybe it’s not because the industry isn’t doing enough, but because some people aren’t interested, period.

Plenty of men out there who don’t play games, ever. Should the industry “do more” to get them in? Imagine that.

Should the handbag industry do more to sell to men? Curious how that one isn’t an issue.

Let women do the fuck they want.
If some devs feel like they HAVE to get more women on board, then they have their priorities wrong, and/or a desperate, misguided need for validation.

 

[rofif]

My wife is too busy playing Ryza2 on switch to care about your question.. or to care about answering my question I should say. 'uh.. I don't know. I never really thought about it.'

She hated the microsoft conference full of angry characters, violence, and guns. Microsoft needs help when it comes to audiences beyond 16-26 yr old men.

Shin Megami Tensei is the game she's most likely looking forward to. Nintendo does it right when it comes to catering to women (in my useless man opinion).

there was a "wholesome" conference too. It was the worst thing ever

 

[Zeroing]

Nope, you’re right. That thread was a shitshow. I hate all the inclusion bullshit but to have dozens of pages of men telling everyone how disgusting alloy looked and how she was on a journey to morbid obesity was ground zero for turning women off from videogame culture.

Yeah it’s a snowball that has impacts, then guys wonder why women have no interest in gaming or in men who play video games…

 

[Birdo]

I'm sure there will be a new Sims game soon enough.

 

[underwater]

Yeah it’s a snowball that has impacts, then guys wonder why women have no interest in gaming or in men who play video games…

Women read magazines that do nothing BUT make fun of other women's appearance. 'Look how this celebrity has got fat' etc. They love that shit

 

[laynelane]

I'd like to know how they got to that number. I'm fairly sure that gender isn't a field when you setup a PlayStation account.

It's not, but I remember being asked that question. I believe it was when prompted to set up my profile.

 

[zcaa0g]

More men watch college football and the NFL than women. More women watch Oprah and what was Ellen than men. Shocking.

Regardless of a small segment of ignorant and lunatic society wanting to think that men and women are the very same, they are very wrong and both math and science proves this time and time again since the beginning of time.

I also don't think mobile games are a good benchmark for women's interests in gaming. Mobile games are more of a distraction or a way to pass the time and I think that's applicable 5o men as well.

More accurate benchmarks would be women that play games on the PC or The Big 3 consoles, but I would say there are definitely a lot more women that play games on those platforms these days than back in the 90s.

Is that due to accessibility? To a degree I imagine, but I also think we have continued to evolve from stereotyping so much as what a male or female should or should not do at a certain age from a hobby/interest standpoint.

 

[Zeroing]

Women read magazines that do nothing BUT make fun of other women's appearance. 'Look how this celebrity has got fat' etc. They love that shit

Nah, women look at magazines and though, I’ll never be as beautiful or skinny like that bitch!

we all have misconceptions about genders. It’s the society’s fault.

anyway back to games! some women might like shooters as some men might like candy crush…

the issue here is the gaming industry making games as diverse as possible so it caters to everyone’s tastes.

 

[reksveks]

Time to ignore this thread, can't tell whether some of these thoughts and opinions are genuine or not.

 

[underwater]

Nah, women look at magazines and though, I’ll never be as beautiful or skinny like that bitch!

There is a whole genre of magazines which are little more than photographs of fat celebrities, or without makeup and looking rough. Kim Kardasian etc

A couple of guys making fun of a fat fictional character is nothing compared to this stuff.

 

[nush]

It's not,

but I remember being asked that question. I believe it was when prompted to set up my profile.

It's not but you also remember it was?

 

[Rat Rage]

The better question is: is the gaming industry obligated to? If video games want to be expressions of "art", let the people creating the art decide what they want to do and for whom they want to do it.

I don't believe video games are obligated to be a medium to promote social justice - they're just video games. They can promote whatever they want as part of their artistic freedom (as long as it's not against the law), but they don't have to.

So... Can the gaming industry do more to cater to women? Yes. Do they have to? No.

 

[CitizenZ]

I have a niece who just graduated and basically plays Minecraft on their phone all the time. My Mom and another woman i know also just play phone or ipad games. ive never known any other to play consoles or PC but they sure do like to play hot tub on the double snake.

 

[ChuckeRearmed]

The gaming is so diverse that anybody can find anything for himself.

 

[laynelane]

It's not but you also remember it was?

I'd like to know how they got to that number. I'm fairly sure that gender isn't a field when you setup a PlayStation account.

It's not - a question when setting up a PSN account. At a later time, the question was asked when setting up my profile. This process could not be skipped and I was impatient because I just wanted to play my game. At that time, I was also re-asked a few questions concerning privacy settings along with gender.

 

[cormack12]

Either it interests you or it doesn't.

We don't change the rules in sports to entice more women. Women watched men played football/golf, liked the sport and took it up. They now have their own leagues and tournaments.

I would never take up a pasttime then demand we change a lot of it so it appeals to me. Video games cater towards gore, violence, shooting etc. There are some games that cover other genres. They are smaller in number because the demand isn't there. Capitalism depends on growth, if companies arent making the effort to grow a market, its one they usually don't see as fruitful. It's that simple. It's probably more fruitful to just blackface a character and expect more sales to be honest or an increase in marketing/advertisments.

 

[Zeroing]

There is a whole genre of magazines which are little more than photographs of fat celebrities, or without makeup and looking rough.

https://www.independent.ie/incoming/8d3af/30459033.ece/AUTOCROP/h530/BtVb58HIYAANCVb.jpg

A couple of guys making fun of a fat fictional character is nothing compared to this stuff.

I don’t wanna start that type of discussion but it has nothing to do with women, that is just plain trash magazine, we all love seeing celebrities having downfalls, gossip or crazy conspiracy theories.
you know there’s also hunting boats and fishing monthly. It is just an owner of a magazine thinking what will women/men like?

not saying men and women are the same, biological we are not! But our differences aren’t that huge.

 

[Sander Cohen]

It would be helpful if we had those species sometimes here on the forum to discuss with, instead of bunch of guys arguing what’s best for them.

 

[Xeaker]

A question for women and only guys reply in here

 

[cormack12]

A question for women and only guys reply in here

You could say it proves the point about trying to appeal to be honest.....

 

[AJUMP23]

My sister played all the same games I did growing up. She still plays more of the same. The only game she plays that I don't is the SIMS.

 

[InterMusketeer]

What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

Women don't have to engage with the gaming community to play games though. They can just go ahead and buy a game and play it. It's no harder than listening to music, reading a book or watching a movie. This idea that the barrier to entry is so high for women is ridiculous to me.

 

[G Boaty]

It would be helpful if we had those species sometimes here on the forum to discuss with, instead of bunch of guys arguing what’s best for them.

Might have more of them if a bunch of guys weren't falling over themselves to make sexists "jokes" as soon as they come up in conversation tbh.

Like imagine being a woman, seeing this thread, opening it to give your input and within a dozen posts you see people making jokes about how you belong in the kitchen or need a cleaning simulator like it's still 2005.