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A question for women and video gaming

Can the gaming industry do more to cater to women ?

  • Yes

    Votes: 49 35.8%
  • No

    Votes: 88 64.2%

  • Total voters
    137

llien

Member
Neogaf is too loose
Go Away GIF
 

Phase

Member
I honestly hate these types of discussions. People like what they like, whether male or female, and forced diversity is dumb. It doesn't create better environments for those who are in their respective communities. In fact, it usually fractures and degrades them.

As for the thread, is there not enough pandering to women today in games? Women, just like men, gravitate to quality products. Make good games, and they'll come. But you won't attract a 50/50 split. It's just not how it works. Trying to pander to women in fps games is a strategy, but one that won't be successful. Not many women gravitate to competitive shooting games. There could be many reasons why. No point in trying to force a change when they've shown their interest lies elsewhere.
 
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I honestly hate these types of discussions. People like what they like, whether male or female, and forced diversity is dumb. It doesn't create better environments for those who are in their respective communities. In fact, it usually fractures and degrades them.

As for the thread, is there not enough pandering to women today in games? Women, just like men, gravitate to quality products. Make good games, and they'll come. But you won't attract a 50/50 split. It's just not how it works. Trying to pander to women in fps games is a strategy, but one that won't be successful. Not many women gravitate to competitive shooting games. There could be many reasons why. No point in trying to force a change when they've shown their interest lies elsewhere.
When is diversity not forced? Does it have to be an indie game?
 

Kholinar

Banned
I'm more wondering when we'll see the first woman e-sports gamer to win a championship or occupy a position in a winning team. That'll be the biggest sign for me personally that more women than ever are invested in video games. I don't think there are any notable female e-sports gamers than maybe... Geguri?
 

llien

Member
Go check out the AT&T-girl thread in off-topic and Easy Allies thread here. I can name more threads but those are just samples.
It's exactly that toxic shit (which curiously resembles girl on girl bullying) which I do not want to creep in here.

Have an argument? State it.
Want to ban people who disagree with you? Uh, don't be a nazi.

There is overwhelming evidence that men and women, on average, quite differ in their tastes.
And then there are unfalsifiable theories explaining cherry picked gender gaps by there being male conspiracies or generic "men are bad".

My wife has played a lot of WoW (raiding guild) as a kick ass mage.
It is not even remotely imaginable that she'd ever bother checking out a gaming forum.

As for that other site, I've seen one of the "women... gaming" threads in there.
A bunch of grievance studies types spouting nonsense left and right, with mods banning users who show slightest sign of #wrongthink.

Why would anyone want to see people of that kind here?
 
J

JeremyEtcetera

Unconfirmed Member
It's exactly that toxic shit (which curiously resembles girl on girl bullying) which I do not want to creep in here.

Have an argument? State it.
Want to ban people who disagree with you? Uh, don't be a nazi.

There is overwhelming evidence that men and women, on average, quite differ in their tastes.
And then there are unfalsifiable theories explaining cherry picked gender gaps by there being male conspiracies or generic "men are bad".

My wife has played a lot of WoW (raiding guild) as a kick ass mage.
It is not even remotely imaginable that she'd ever bother checking out a gaming forum.

As for that other site, I've seen one of the "women... gaming" threads in there.
A bunch of grievance studies types spouting nonsense left and right, with mods banning users who show slightest sign of #wrongthink.

Why would anyone want to see people of that kind here?
Because a long time ago, in a galaxy far far away, those people you criticize used to be here, having good back and forth debates and conversations with those here. There used to be a better balance, with users and moderation. Now both sides are glorified echo chambers. Theirs is just slightly louder than ours, but similar opinions are similar opinions. And both sides are stupidly throwing mud across the field at each other not knowing they're a reflection of the other in different clothing. It's dumb.
 

teezzy

Fantastik Tuna
I'm more wondering when we'll see the first woman e-sports gamer to win a championship or occupy a position in a winning team. That'll be the biggest sign for me personally that more women than ever are invested in video games. I don't think there are any notable female e-sports gamers than maybe... Geguri?

Yuyu and CuddleCore are some of the best Tekken players around rn
 

Croatoan

They/Them A-10 Warthog
My wife is too busy playing Ryza2 on switch to care about your question.. or to care about answering my question I should say. 'uh.. I don't know. I never really thought about it.'

She hated the microsoft conference full of angry characters, violence, and guns. Microsoft needs help when it comes to audiences beyond 16-26 yr old men.

Shin Megami Tensei is the game she's most likely looking forward to. Nintendo does it right when it comes to catering to women (in my useless man opinion).
My wife loved the Battlefield 2042 gameplay, and halo. She hates talky games (basically RPGS). Give her a gun and let her kill shit is all she wants lol. Women are just as diverse in taste as men.

I think the actual percentage of females playing games is very, very low. Internet thots play or pretend to play only for exposure and fame. And I don't count mobile and trashy facebook games as real games.
I've yet to see a female who's into gaming in real life.
Bitches be into taking selfies rather then gaemz.
My wife would never admit she is "into games" because she is a former sorority girl (Tri-delta) and has a stupid image she feels the need to uphold....but this woman has played Escape From Fucking Tarkov. That's pretty hardcore when put up against the soy boys who wet themselves over zelda games. I'd call her a real gamer.
 
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Cactuarman

Banned
Because a long time ago, in a galaxy far far away, those people you criticize used to be here, having good back and forth debates and conversations with those here. There used to be a better balance, with users and moderation. Now both sides are glorified echo chambers. Theirs is just slightly louder than ours, but similar opinions are similar opinions. And both sides are stupidly throwing mud across the field at each other not knowing they're a reflection of the other in different clothing. It's dumb.

NeoGAF likes to tout that it doesn't ban anyone like "that other site" but it's certainly self-moderated itself into it's own echo chamber. It bums me out that you still get that straw-man counter point of "OH SO YOU WANT TO BAN CONVERSATION?" whenever you suggest that maybe we should have slightly higher standards. And I honestly think a lot of conversation here is great, but a solid portion of it really isn't.

I agree with you - moderation doesn't mean removing opinions, it means removing bad faith posts. Or at least trying to elevate the discourse. And if we're going to have a thread where women are directly asked a question, then we also need to discuss why there don't seem to be a lot of women on this site. The same goes for any thread about representation and if it matters. "I never gave a shit therefore no one else can or should" isn't going to get conversation going.

This board should champion variety in both video games and video game discussion. Simply not banning people doesn't automatically make this board a beacon of honest discourse.

What?
Did I rattle your progressive little brain?

Goddamn I wish I could tell if this is satire...
 
Of my entire extended family, my co-workers and my friends the only women I know that play video games is my sister who only really plays whatever new Zelda game releases and a woman from Hong Kong I used to play games like Hexic on MSN with back when that was still a thing.

Of the same group just about every male born after 1975 plays video games at least casually.
 

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
My best friend loves cute Nintendo games and certain mobile games, and plays all the time. She likes anything cute and abhors violence in games or on TV or in movies.

One of my good friends has a wife who is a hard-core Call of Duty player, loves scary games and shows and movies, and really only likes cute things for their daughter. She could also easily be a supermodel and has a very active social life.

My sisters and I growing up loved Nintendo and cute things, while also loving fighting games and scary more violent games and shows. We HATE real-world violence, but are okay mostly seeing it in media.


People, whether male or female, are ALL DIFFERENT. Men and women aren't a different species, and a lot of the time we enjoy the same things. Often, it's all who you enjoy those things with that make a difference in how long those varying interests will last as we go through life.
 
Didn’t Sony said 40% of their gamers are women?

Found it
Link

I’m not sure the percentage of the rest of the industry. What can the gaming industry do? No idea, but after that thread of “ugly Alloy” maybe the problem is not in the industry but in some gamers perception of women.

people will burn me alive for saying this aren’t they?
Sometimes I think people expect all women to be caked in makeup at all points in time. This doesn't fit Alloy. Alloy is a fucking rock climber and the last thing she needs is dirt getting stuck in make up.

Sometimes I feel like people on gaf have never spent time with outdoorsy women because of comments like in that thread.

Backpacking? Why would you carry the extra weight of make up?

Biking? Why would you want runny make up?

Swimming? Shit is coming off anyways.
 

zeorhymer

Member
My best friend loves cute Nintendo games and certain mobile games, and plays all the time. She likes anything cute and abhors violence in games or on TV or in movies.

One of my good friends has a wife who is a hard-core Call of Duty player, loves scary games and shows and movies, and really only likes cute things for their daughter. She could also easily be a supermodel and has a very active social life.

My sisters and I growing up loved Nintendo and cute things, while also loving fighting games and scary more violent games and shows. We HATE real-world violence, but are okay mostly seeing it in media.


People, whether male or female, are ALL DIFFERENT. Men and women aren't a different species, and a lot of the time we enjoy the same things. Often, it's all who you enjoy those things with that make a difference in how long those varying interests will last as we go through life.
Just wanted to drop a note to say that, yes, YOU ARE AWESOME!
 

48086

Member
Sometimes I think people expect all women to be caked in makeup at all points in time. This doesn't fit Alloy. Alloy is a fucking rock climber and the last thing she needs is dirt getting stuck in make up.

Sometimes I feel like people on gaf have never spent time with outdoorsy women because of comments like in that thread.

Backpacking? Why would you carry the extra weight of make up?

Biking? Why would you want runny make up?

Swimming? Shit is coming off anyways.
Wow, you do realize women can be attractive without makeup don’t you? What a dick thing to imply lol my gosh.
 
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BlackM1st

Banned
Looks like most of you guys have no idea how invested a woman can be in her favorite series/hero.

Talking about "women ruining our hobby" is a caveman level of logic. Our hobbie isn't ruined by women who play games, it's getting ruined by people of all genders and colors who DON'T ACTUALLY PLAY games and spineless devs/publishers who cater to them and listen to their constant and baseless whining.

Just like the majority of men gamers, majority of women gamers don't spend their time complaining about games , they play them and thank God for that, more power to them because they care about games just like we do. Sure, maybe they're not as much into Battlefield/CoD like games which involve heavy competitive modes, but in action, RPG'S and even "soft coop" action games some of them rock as much as any guy or even more.
 

Phase

Member
Talking about "women ruining our hobby" is a caveman level of logic. Our hobbie isn't ruined by women who play games, it's getting ruined by people of all genders and colors who DON'T ACTUALLY PLAY games and spineless devs/publishers who cater to them and listen to their constant and baseless whining.
This is the main issue so many are tired of having to endure.
 

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
What can drama soaps do to cater to men is the better question...
 
Is there something wrong with women doing this for themselves? They too can take an interest, they too can learn the same indie tools or work for a studio, create art, animate, code, project lead etc. Why does it have to be a focused effort? Why can it not be organic and natural for who has interest in what?

I just think forcing things based on any gender is bad idea. If more women want certain games why aren't more women developing the games they want? Incentives throughout the chain of interest, learning, opportunity, execution, self-learning, publishing etc is better than just mandating "more games for women" or a quota hire.

When you look at mobile vs PC vs console, the ease of development these days enables whatever creator with the passion to drive themselves. I'm not sure there is a glass ceiling anymore with ladies like Bonnie or Jade etc running studios.

TL;DR - just let the industry be organic and develop whatever comes out of the melting pot. Women are plenty capable of doing for themselves and working in a team, just like Men or any other gender identification these days.
 
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Kenpachii

Member
I encounter woman the most in games like
farming with cute cartoon characters ( animal crossing is a good example )
The sims type of games
cosmetic mmo's with cute hats as example. ( ragnarok online, honestly 90% is female )
Chat box games
two point hospital type of games.
Nintendo games. practically any girl i spoke to and asked about if they played games it was nintendo. I would love to see there demograph.


I barely notice them in shooters.

My sister for example and my girlfriend basically both play on switch zelda horse catching / animal crossing / harry potter games / survival games ( forgot the name of it, surviving on a island ) / mario / some other game i forgot about.
 
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J

JeremyEtcetera

Unconfirmed Member
You already told us the answer, didn't you? Since you produced all the NeoGAF statistics out of your ass?
Weirdly enough this response reveals more than my own. I won't go further into it though.
 

MagnesG

Banned
They are booming steadily, organically as ever.

Look at The Sims, Animal Crossing, Stardew Valley (all farming sims), Nintendo games like Splatoon, or Overwatch for MPs. They would buy systems when there are games offered and catered to them.

No need for the artificial push, ultimately just for virtue agenda.
 

Radical_3d

Member
I'm not trying to pick on you but those two statements are so colossally lacking in any kind of content, so heavily reliant on a wink and a nudge that i can't even.
The content is that the data is telling us more than 50% of the players are woman and still every major production is dudebro, I’m going to shoot you slice you. Is either the industry executives are leaving money on the counter or the woman are massively buying dudebro.
 
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llien

Member
My best friend loves cute Nintendo games and certain mobile games, and plays all the time. She likes anything cute and abhors violence in games or on TV or in movies.

One of my good friends has a wife who is a hard-core Call of Duty player, loves scary games and shows and movies, and really only likes cute things for their daughter. She could also easily be a supermodel and has a very active social life.

My sisters and I growing up loved Nintendo and cute things, while also loving fighting games and scary more violent games and shows. We HATE real-world violence, but are okay mostly seeing it in media.


People, whether male or female, are ALL DIFFERENT. Men and women aren't a different species, and a lot of the time we enjoy the same things. Often, it's all who you enjoy those things with that make a difference in how long those varying interests will last as we go through life.

A friend of mine met his wife via (student campus) LAN parties, playing shooters.
She was also into stuff like MK, they even bought PlayStation specifically for MK alone.

Is that, however, typical? I don't think so.

There is that jump from "women are less likely to be interested in" to "no women on Earth are into that", a fallacy.
 
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llien

Member
Is there something wrong with women doing this for themselves? They too can take an interest, they too can learn the same indie tools or work for a studio, create art, animate, code, project lead etc. Why does it have to be a focused effort?

Are we seriously assuming, that there is that market waiting to be harvested, as in money to be made, but male conspiracy is preventing game studios from doing it?

Really?



What about erotic books for men?
Well over 90% of consumers are women.
What kind of conspiracy is causing that?

 

mxbison

Member
I think the actual percentage of females playing games is very, very low. Internet thots play or pretend to play only for exposure and fame. And I don't count mobile and trashy facebook games as real games.
I've yet to see a female who's into gaming in real life.
Bitches be into taking selfies rather then gaemz.

How many women do you know in real life?
 
Are we seriously assuming, that there is that market waiting to be harvested, as in money to be made, but male conspiracy is preventing game studios from doing it?

Really?



What about erotic books for men?
Well over 90% of consumers are women.
What kind of conspiracy is causing that?


It's been proven a pretty balance market in terms of mobile gaming but PC and consoles firmly remain male dominated. I'm all for ladies producing and playing what they wish, I just don't want some forced mandate or hiring policies ruining creative freedom or where the actual dollars come from. My daughter and wife love things like two point hospital, the sims, Rayman, Crazy Chick Horse and occassionally play a rare round of Apex for a laugh. I wouldn't want COD, Halo, Apex etc chasing ladies just for the sake of it. If there is demand then great, I seriously doubt many ladies want to play those sorts of games in any huge numbers to rival investment in male dominant games/genres/brands etc.

In short there is more than enough out there, nothing stops women from developing games they love, whatever that may be. Just leave the corporate virtue signalling out of it thanks.
 

Exede

Member
My Wife is playing games like Story of Seasons, Animal Crossing and the likes. My daughter is actually enjoying Outriders a lot currently. So in my family the split beteen genderd is exactly 50%
 

llien

Member
It's been proven a pretty balance market in terms of mobile gaming
As in "candy crush" right? Ok.

but PC and consoles firmly remain male dominated
And, say, students studying veterinary have become female dominated (90%+), although, they all want to work with cute little thingies, which has become a problem for farmers who happen to need people who can come and cure, you know, cows.

I disagree with the very statement that a gender gap per se is a proof that there is some problem, there might or might not be.

As far as I got your point, it revolves around assumption that a male team cannot create games that cater to female audience.
It might well be true, who has created Sims and endless sequels?

My problem in this area is that women might not be playing games, because, you know what, they are not into that stuff and that's it. (I know plenty of men who are not into it either, by the way, it's not like it's every human being's ting). And even though it might be because women simply are not into spending hours upon hours on gaming every week and hence, even though we might never "fix" that "problem", there will be a bunch of assholes, making un-falsifiable claims, labeling people left and right and terrorizing developers who do not bend to their will (most do bend)
 
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