Fredrik
Member
Yeah, I’d go as far as to say gaming in general is in serious need of less realism, not just in the art but in the game concepts as well, especially in the west.
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All Games Should Be Pushing The Graphic Barrier
- Thread starter SuperSaiyanWithDreads
- Start date
Team Andromeda
Member
Where do these people come from? Flight Sim cartoony and could be done on last gen ?
When it comes down to it any game could be done on a said system it's what needed to taken away to make it work that's the issue.
I grew up in the era of asking the ZX Spectrum to handle the state of the Art Arcade games like PowerDrift or G Loc and the era of the Master System being asked to handle Sonic and many other state of the art Mega Drive games like SOR 2.
When it comes down to it any game could be done on a said system it's what needed to taken away to make it work that's the issue.
I grew up in the era of asking the ZX Spectrum to handle the state of the Art Arcade games like PowerDrift or G Loc and the era of the Master System being asked to handle Sonic and many other state of the art Mega Drive games like SOR 2.
Soodanim
Gold Member
Good point. Good art ages a lot better than currently impressive graphics.
Walk before you run, you're right. Games that aren't finished at launch shouldn't be allowed.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
And thats my biggest reason I can never get excite for high tech graphics because that only direction its going, when people showing off UE5 tech demo all they ever show is visuals looking more photo realistic with scan face characters and to me boring. If that people's idea of "Pushing The Graphic Barrier" then I have no interest in it.
E-Cat
Member
But just imagine how many rays per pixel you could render at that resolution & fps
KungFucius
King Snowflake
No. We need a few technical power houses, ideally a new one every 1-2 years but not every game needs to be able to push the top GPUs to their limits. Especially when you consider the costs. I would rather have an 85% solution visually if they game comes out 6-12 months sooner. More games is better than less games.
ahtlas7
Member
Op, you use Hogwarts as an example. But I challenge you to step back back and look at the architectural achievement that is Hogwarts Castle. It doesn’t blur the lines of reality but it’s an amazing environment that pushes architecture art in gaming, I’d argue, and that’s just the castle.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I would take a step back in graphics to re adjust the stability of games to a locked 60 fps reset and allow developers to actually focus on gsme play.
Who gives a fuck about a motion captured cut scene really. Just go watch Netflix.
Who gives a fuck about a motion captured cut scene really. Just go watch Netflix.
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Fredrik
Member
Yeah, I don’t like the anime visuals but in general I still think the eastern part of the industry is ahead right when it comes to the art direction.
I think the western part of the industry is currently focusing so much on realism, representation and modern audience themes that they kinda forgot that gaming could be fun and crazy and actually don’t have to have anything at all to do with the real world.
And for real, why do the human characters have to look normal? Why are we even playing as humans? Why not play as a green slimy blob? or a ball or a ghost or a robot larva, fly, fish, mole, vacuum cleaner?
Indies still make some unique stuff but there is no imagination left in the industry in the AAA space. There is still Ratchet & Clank though but we’ll see how long the IP is allowed to exist now that Insomniac has to juggle two big Marvel IPs too.
Nah, totally done with rendering fidelity. We've hit a unsustainable barrier of entry (acquiring bigger budgets and bigger teams to even reach such fidelity) without any meaningful leaps to the games themselves.
I wish the industry would focus more on simulation complexity:
I wish the industry would focus more on simulation complexity:
- physicalised animation (instead of canned)
- physics reactivity/interactivity
- Systemic interplay (generating emergent moments)
- Believable ai adaptability/reactivity to changing environment
- Better persistence of the world and what the player does to it.
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Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
I love anime aesthetics but that doesn't mean every game needs to have that artstyle.
Just look at FROM games, they dont have "anime" artstyle but their aesthetics is distinct and interesting.
I care faaaaaaar more about interesting aesthetics over raw graphical power.
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ZoukGalaxy
Member
The Order 1886 salutes you, but you'll farted on its face.
Fredrik
Member
Yeah FROM’s artists are amazing, they may not have the surface polish of Ragnarök and RDR2 etc but I like the visuals a ton more. Even just looking up at Stormveil Castle in Elden Ring and seeing the birds and clouds and general art direction on the castle makes me think no western studio would be able to reach that level. I really like Capcom’s artists as well, people were a bit down on SF6 after the demo but if a western studio would try to make a fighting game I know they would put me to sleep and do some boring full body scans of actors or whatever.I love anime aesthetics but that doesn't mean every game needs to have that artstyle.
Just look at FROM games, they dont have "anime" artstyle but their aesthetics is distinct and interesting.
I care faaaaaaar more about interesting aesthetics over raw graphical power.
X-Wing
Member
Us? I completely disagree with everything you said so I'm not sure who 'us' is.
I'd say 1440p. 1080p on 4K TVs looks like ass.
supernova8
Banned
I suppose such leaps should be possible given that the "absolute best" from squeezing every last drop from the PS5 should be a lot better than the same from PS4.
Even though people always say the PS4 launched as a pathetically underpowered console, the truth is we got games like Uncharted 4, Last of Us Part 2, Spiderman and God of War, none of which look like they even have a hope of running on a PS3.
If (1) PS4 was grossly underpowered and (2) we all generally agree that PS5 is at least not underpowered (let's not claim it's "superpowered" or "overpowered" for sanity's sake), logically we should eventually get some absolute visual bangers this generation.
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Because it's a terrible game.The Order 1886 salutes you, but you'll farted on its face.
Kataploom
Gold Member
Hell no, realism is boring, there are games I'll never play or beat because graphics bore me unbelievably, like RDR2 or AC games.
We don't need all games pushing for realism, not even graphics in general, we need games to focus on art style graphically, it's cheaper, way more appealing for most people and lasts longer... It's harder though barely anyone in the industry can push amazing art direction consistently, probably that's the reason why realism is so prevalent in western AAA gaming.
We don't need all games pushing for realism, not even graphics in general, we need games to focus on art style graphically, it's cheaper, way more appealing for most people and lasts longer... It's harder though barely anyone in the industry can push amazing art direction consistently, probably that's the reason why realism is so prevalent in western AAA gaming.
I don't agree that "art direction" is basically some kind of cel shading. For instance bloodborne has both specific art direction and realism in terms of shading. Also heavy art direction as top down from games art director tends to be slow and thus expensive. Not to mention photogrammetry is cheaper than trying to go for anime style looks for instance.
All games should be pushing for a healthy balance between graphics, devtime, costs and everything else.
The current triple A model isn't working anymore and will ruin this hobby. Although, reading Neogaf, it has already been ruined for most of you. I have a hard time believing most of you guys are even enjoying playing videogames anymore. All most of you care about is graphics and even then, most of it is whining about unrealistic grass or whatever.
What we need is more A and AA games. I've been greatly enjoying the output of Japanese and other Asian devs these past few years. Lots of great games that only need to sell a million or something to be considered a succes and get a sequel.
The current triple A model isn't working anymore and will ruin this hobby. Although, reading Neogaf, it has already been ruined for most of you. I have a hard time believing most of you guys are even enjoying playing videogames anymore. All most of you care about is graphics and even then, most of it is whining about unrealistic grass or whatever.
What we need is more A and AA games. I've been greatly enjoying the output of Japanese and other Asian devs these past few years. Lots of great games that only need to sell a million or something to be considered a succes and get a sequel.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Art direction is probably more important to me than raw graphics.
There are super nintendo games that still look amazing to me today because their art direction is perfect. Meanwhile, games that pushed the PS1 really hard look like complete ass.
There are super nintendo games that still look amazing to me today because their art direction is perfect. Meanwhile, games that pushed the PS1 really hard look like complete ass.
Neff
Member
There's an easy solution to your problem, OP. Rent a large office building, install a few hundred desks with PCs, hire staff to sit at those desks, announce your new game development studio to the press, and on the first day of your first project gather everyone for a team briefing and tell them to 'push the graphic barrier'.
NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
I wish I could take some of you back to even the early 90s so you can appreciate how fucking good you have it these days.
If TV tech hadn’t gotten cheap enough to be able to sell 4K screens for peanuts we wouldn’t even dream of having all these threads, but here we are.
If TV tech hadn’t gotten cheap enough to be able to sell 4K screens for peanuts we wouldn’t even dream of having all these threads, but here we are.
theclaw135
Banned
More unwavering photorealism. I want games it'd be possible to construct sets of the environments, and characters that can be portrayed on stage before a live studio audience.
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Valt7786
Member
Perfect world would be everything looking as crisp and sharp as something like Horizon 2 or Ghost of Tsushima, but with more interactivity within the worlds itself. More physics and destruction, no more trees that stand in my way, no more "oh i cant get past this door with my stack of C4 in my inventory or my Lightsaber" or "Oh no, this 2 foot wooden bench is in the corridor, better find the long way round that needs 3 keys as well".
Corpsepyre
Banned
Speak for yourself. Doofus thread.
Sakura
Member
Generational leaps will get smaller and smaller. It is what it is.
Or mostly, it will be less and less noticeable.
For example, imagine going from a resolution of 960 x 540 to 1920 x 1080. The visual difference is very significant. 1080p has about 1.5 million more pixels than 540p.
Now imagine going from say 16k to 32k. 32k would have about 400 million more pixels than 16k. Yet, the noticeable difference between the two, the "leap", would be much smaller than the 540p to 1080p (if you can notice it at all).
This is the same for most of the visuals. Even if every generation had a console 10x more powerful than the last, the actual noticeable difference will get smaller and smaller. There is only so much you can do here.
Hypereides
Member
EDIT: comment withdrawn.
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daninthemix
Member
OP's post is just gibberish, clearly the product of a confused mind.
Scotty W
Gold Member
Lil’ gaffers is always bitin’ my shit.
anthraticus
Banned
Jesus Christ....this place gets more & more retarded each day.
Captain Toad
Banned
Billy Madison quote goes here.
TehGoomba7s
Member
Going from playing HZD in 30fps to HFW in 60fps is a generational leap to me. Simply doubling the frame rate is enough to feel a generational difference as you can actually appreciate the detail in motion as opposed to a slideshow of judder.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I find it amusing that some of you guys didn't realize that there'd be a graphical cost when moving from 30fps being the standard, to 60fps.
Modern upscaling tech is great for saving on render-budget but that's just part of a pipeline that is always going to be restricted to moving at the speed of its slowest part.
Modern upscaling tech is great for saving on render-budget but that's just part of a pipeline that is always going to be restricted to moving at the speed of its slowest part.
Dirk Benedict
Gold Member
15fps@4K would be much better.
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
and frankly i don't see how people can say "photorealistic game graphics will age over the years" when many of the best looking games of the past decade like Order 1886, RDR2, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Forza Horizon 5, Jedi Fallen Order will still look good 5 or even 10 years from now. People are using 10 year old games like Ryze Son of Rome in modern graphic comparisons. We're long past the point of photorealism aging badly IMO, the only place to go from here is up
Buggy Loop
Member
All the backlash in the thread is surprising.. should we bring back all the complaints peoples had for Elden Ring graphics? Every single threads had peoples complaining.
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
And gameplay has had even less advancement over the years than graphics have.
Both need a generational leap.
We’ve gotten neither
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
you should play the upcoming zelda
this will push the medium.
also TLOU2 pushed games and story
this will push the medium.
also TLOU2 pushed games and story
please don't use the R word
StereoVsn
Member
Looking at "performance" of these latest games, I am not sure that pushing graphics is the right way to go.
It's alright to have the options for $4K PCs with 4090s or future equivalents, but not for consoles or even PCs with good but not crazy specs.
And these graphics will cost major $$$ to develop to boot. The ROI isn't there. Now, give it a few more years and AI tools will probably deliver some of that asset creation so it can be an option.
It's alright to have the options for $4K PCs with 4090s or future equivalents, but not for consoles or even PCs with good but not crazy specs.
And these graphics will cost major $$$ to develop to boot. The ROI isn't there. Now, give it a few more years and AI tools will probably deliver some of that asset creation so it can be an option.