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Apple's M1 Max GPU is as powerful as an Nvidia RTX 2080 desktop GPU and the Sony PS5 gaming console

Topher

Gold Member
So why are we making a comparison again?

Don't know a $500 console and a $3000 laptop...

The Office Reaction GIF


Seriously.....it is fine to talk about, but this can't be taken too seriously beyond pure speculation. It is not a gaming laptop. Having teraflops doesn't change that.
 
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MrMephistoX

Member
What a shame there are barely any games to make use of it though. Apple are still not doing enough to encourage developers to port AAA titles.

And Bootcamp has gone the way of the Dodo so Windows on Parallels or VMware is the only option which bottlenecks performance.
 

Topher

Gold Member
Man, the mention of RTX 2080 next to PS5 in the title triggers me a lot. That fact that the claim it is stronger than 2080 is enough, how close do people think a PS5 to RTX 2080?

That's based entirely on teraflops and it is a click bait title from notebookcheck.net. Most folks who follow gaming know teraflops are not very useful when comparing dissimilar architectures.
 
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FStubbs

Member
I don't even know if Apple is claiming the M1 Max is at the level of the RTX 2080. I thikn their claim is slightly weaker than RTX 3080 mobile which is nowhere near RTX 2080 desktop. They're just saying it gets near that level of performance with a fraction of the wattage.

EDIT: I take that back. Depending on the wattage apparently the 3080 mobile can benchmark right there with the 2080 desktop.
 
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LordOfChaos

Member
This is a crappy article that's just going to confuse people who don't already know.

They're just looking at Tflops, which are only a paper calculation of ALUs * clock speed * 2 operations per ALU per clock. I think Apple groups 128 ALUs into each core. You can work this out mathematically on any GPU and see it's the case.

This isn't to downplay it - I'm confident the M1 GPU is MORE efficient per Tflop on paper than RDNA2, and so should the M1 Max be, so it might end up more performant than that.

This is akin to spreading the decades old MHz myth that clock speed is a CPU performance number.
 

Buggy Loop

Member
I don't care about price or "LOL GAMING MAC??" memes, it's cool engineering and tech. Apple is getting better and better at this, their only limiting factor is their own ecosystem. But if it even affects the roadmap of AMD/Intel/Nvidia a tiny bit in a better direction, then it's mission accomplished and we'll all benefit from it.
 
There's not need of a market switch from x86 to ARM, there's no need for x86 to be abandoned and when it eventually does in the future it'll not be overnight, of course.
Apple just needs wide support and they'll have it and fast. All relevant software for Mac OS already runs native, and as I already mentioned Apple x86 emulation is really good.

The non believers that are not impressed with the M1 Max need to open their eyes and pay attention that this is only the mobile variant. It's "Jade 1C". Apple's engineers are very excite with what they have been working these past few years and already confirmed that the Mac Pro will come with Jade 2C and Jade 4C variants.





Jade 2C = 20c CPU + 64c GPU
Jade 4C = 40c CPU + 128c GPU


Quadruple performance is still not enough for you?
 
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Topher

Gold Member
I don't care about price or "LOL GAMING MAC??" memes, it's cool engineering and tech. Apple is getting better and better at this, their only limiting factor is their own ecosystem. But if it even affects the roadmap of AMD/Intel/Nvidia a tiny bit in a better direction, then it's mission accomplished and we'll all benefit from it.

Not sure I follow about the ecosystem "limiting factor". Mac OS is an open platform just like Windows. What are the limiting factors?
 

Buggy Loop

Member
Not sure I follow about the ecosystem "limiting factor". Mac OS is an open platform just like Windows. What are the limiting factors?

Well, that it's going to only be used within the walls of their garden. Which is fine, Apple is fine with that obviously, but what i mean is that even if Apple bests Intel, AMD or Nvidia at chip making eventually, it's limited to that ecosystem, thus it doesn't really matter for... 99% of gamers? We can only hope that whatever improvements they find, drives a bit the roadmap in a positive way for the other manufacturers.
 

Topher

Gold Member
Well, that it's going to only be used within the walls of their garden. Which is fine, Apple is fine with that obviously, but what i mean is that even if Apple bests Intel, AMD or Nvidia at chip making eventually, it's limited to that ecosystem, thus it doesn't really matter for... 99% of gamers? We can only hope that whatever improvements they find, drives a bit the roadmap in a positive way for the other manufacturers.

Makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.
 

Dr Bass

Member
Apple wrote the book on spin…Sony just copied it

just chiming in to say M1 chip support on most mainstream apps is pretty shitty outside of the marketing deals Apple has

u buy an M1 mac and u will quickly hate your decision
I have an M1 Mini and MacBook Air. Best computers I've ever owned, and software support is fantastic. Nearly native everywhere in less than a year. My mini was almost as powerful as my 2019 Mac Pro that cost me 8 grand and would heat my office to 80 degrees in Winter, and it draws like 13 watts. Your post and understanding of what Apple is doing is complete and utter nonsense.
 

PSYGN

Member
This wasn't a comparison for gaming, it's for professionals in video editing, 3d modeling, etc that prefer Mac and need the power to render them. But it allows normal people to put the numbers into perspective.
 
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tkscz

Member
Those specs are really good for using photo manipulation and video editing software specifically made to run on it. However, MacOS isn't known for or really meant to run video games. I'll be more impressed if it runs in iPad form. We really should have engineering tablets by now.
 

Spukc

always chasing the next thrill
There's not need of a market switch from x86 to ARM, there's no need for x86 to be abandoned and when it eventually does in the future it'll not be overnight, of course.
Apple just needs wide support and they'll have it and fast. All relevant software for Mac OS already runs native, and as I already mentioned Apple x86 emulation is really good.

The non believers that are not impressed with the M1 Max need to open their eyes and pay attention that this is only the mobile variant. It's "Jade 1C". Apple's engineers are very excite with what they have been working these past few years and already confirmed that the Mac Pro will come with Jade 2C and Jade 4C variants.





Jade 2C = 20c CPU + 64c GPU
Jade 4C = 40c CPU + 128c GPU


Quadruple performance is still not enough for you?

Pro worthy moniker?

decked out macbook pro 16 is like 7 grand.
so that one wil prolly be 50 grand
 

dcll

Banned
Apple wrote the book on spin…Sony just copied it

just chiming in to say M1 chip support on most mainstream apps is pretty shitty outside of the marketing deals Apple has

u buy an M1 mac and u will quickly hate your decision
Not true for me, it is an excellent computer IMO
 

Notabueno

Banned
Where is the false PR? From Apple?

From whomever wrote the OP.

A PC with the same configuration as the PS5 wouldn't even be as powerful because of standardisation and optimisation. A laptop with an RTX 2080 mobile wouldn't be as powerful as a desktop with an RTX 2080.

But more importantly, there's almost nothing to test and benchmark the MBP with, and when you know what's actually behind the opaque marketing scam that Apple has built with it's ARM chips, you know that...yes, we're in FUCKING LOONEY TUNE world when it comes to Apples.

People who still buy or are fan are either profoundly stupid and influenceable loser or borderline intellectually deficient. And I grew up with Apple, I know what I'm talking about, but this plus the notch in the middle of the MBP amongst other things...people using recent Apple can't be considered competent to work with anymore as a colleague of mine said.
 
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Clear

CliffyB's Cock Holster
Its all irrelevant anyway. Because its Apple, and they are never, ever going to give up their price premium.

So market penetration isn't going to change.
 

chonga

Member
They're also super-over-priced...so who cares?
Kind of this. The comparison to devices that costs way less is kind of pointless.

The MBP with the Max in is nearly 10x the cost of the PS5 DE and we're supposed to be in awe that they're near equal on power?

You can say oh yeah but they've got more transistors, but having 1 transistor or 1 trillion is irrelevant to me. What is relevant is what displays on my screen.
 

UnNamed

Banned
A pc laptop with a 3080 Q could cost 2K or slightly less.
When you buy a Mac, you also buy the design, the compactness, the materials, the engineering, the sound system. But all these things can't justify 2K of difference. The Imac is still the best in quality/price.
 

octiny

Banned
I don't even know if Apple is claiming the M1 Max is at the level of the RTX 2080. I thikn their claim is slightly weaker than RTX 3080 mobile which is nowhere near RTX 2080 desktop. They're just saying it gets near that level of performance with a fraction of the wattage.

EDIT: I take that back. Depending on the wattage apparently the 3080 mobile can benchmark right there with the 2080 desktop.

The 165w 3080 beats a desktop 2080 (and 2080 Super), stock to stock in rasterization & RT. In Timespy, with both OC'ed to the max, you're looking at around 11K-12K on GPU w/ desktop 2080 & over 14K w/ 3080 165w over which brings it in line w/ a stock 3070 desktop GPU (which is essentially what it is, albeit a few more cuda cores but lower headroom w/ wattage). All which translates to games.

My X170KMG w/ 165w 3080 for reference

Regarding the MBP in general, If it can get anywhere close to a 165w 3080 or even 135w 3080, that's pretty damn impressive. The 120hz mini-led screen alone on the new MacBook Pro makes it worthwhile, top that off w/ a competent GPU and you're off to the races. You're looking at upwards of $3600 for a 4K 120hz (no mini led) 165w 3080 laptop ($3300 for 16 inch MBP w/ top-end GPU). And that's without taking the extremely thin form factor into account, it's nearest competitor would be a Razer 17 Pro ($3700) which can only house a 130w 3080 w/ a heavily throttled 11900H. And while the MBP isn't marketed as a gaming laptop, it surely looks like it's going to include the power of one if Apples experience w/ their in house mobile GPU's is anything to go by.

There's still a ton of old & new games on MacOS, while paltry in releases compared to PC, it's still available if someone wants a combo laptop where gaming is secondary. Games surely would look gorgeous on that screen. I can see it being viable option for some people.

I may pick one up out of curiosity if only to benchmark for possible heavy load throttling, SOTTR comparison w/ my laptop etc.
 

Topher

Gold Member
From whomever wrote the OP.

A PC with the same configuration as the PS5 wouldn't even be as powerful because of standardisation and optimisation. A laptop with an RTX 2080 mobile wouldn't be as powerful as a desktop with an RTX 2080.

But more importantly, there's almost nothing to test and benchmark the MBP with, and when you know what's actually behind the opaque marketing scam that Apple has built with it's ARM chips, you know that...yes, we're in FUCKING LOONEY TUNE world when it comes to Apples.

None of the OP came from Apple. There are few games to benchmark the laptop, but again this isn't a gaming laptop and Apple isn't claiming it is. What marketing scam are you referring to regarding the ARM chips? They work as advertised. I'm typing on one right now and have used this MB thoroughly in developing software. It is a great piece of tech. Shit for games, but everything else works extremely well.

People who still buy or are fan are either profoundly stupid and influenceable loser or borderline intellectually deficient. And I grew up with Apple, I know what I'm talking about, but this plus the notch in the middle of the MBP amongst other things...people using recent Apple can't be considered competent to work with anymore as a colleague of mine said.

You can't seriously be judging the competence of people based on whether they buy Apple products or not. Please tell me you are being sarcastic.

Apple is stupid. Those are two different statements, since a RTX 2080 isn't even on par with the PS5.

None of this came from Apple at all. Just a random website making silly comparisons.
 
Have an m1 air with 8gb. Great little machine with stupid battery life. But let’s be realistic. Even if apples gpu was 3x ps5 power. Who would get it to game? Get a pc. It’s for people in media. 7 streams of 8k video editing or 30 streams of 4k. You can’t deny apples tech.
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
Not sure I follow about the ecosystem "limiting factor". Mac OS is an open platform just like Windows. What are the limiting factors?
nothing. They think only apple software works on apple machines i guess. or its just the apple products and software work seamlessly together.

doesnt matter either way you slice it windows is still shit. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 

LordOfChaos

Member
M1 Max is already impressive. The author making silly comparisons doesn't change that. Bottom line, this is just click bait. And it worked.

If anything Tflops being incomparable across architectures may make it even more impressive in the real world, but the point is you can't make comparisons like that except knowing they're in similar worlds.

I think M1 was doing more per paper flop than AMD and comparable to slightly more than Nvidia before the RTX ratio change. M1 Max with the 32 core GPU could well be better than the PS5, but we'll just have to see what the performance is actually like, Tflops are not a performance measure just like MHz aren't.


You do however have to skip past a bunch of binned parts that Apple didn't mention at the keynote to get to the full fat 32 core GPU. Gets quite costly for sure. Still wish Other OS was supported on PS5, that would be interesting as the cheapest SSG you can get.
 
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Topher

Gold Member
Nothing Apple does is in a vacuum with these guys. It's always "hey, look, who is Apple about to run out of business with this new thing?"

They yearn for an Apple monopoly for all things tech.

If Apple were to ever even try to make a monopoly in the desktop/laptop market.......well this ain't it. Apple's marketshare is about 8% which is fourth behind Lenovo, HP, and Dell. Moving up any on that ladder is going to require some cheap ass tech far below $1000. That isn't in Apple's wheelhouse. Apple makes good money on Mac, but their big money is and always will be iPhone.
 
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