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[Axios] Former PlayStation worker sues gaming giant, alleges gender discrimination

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Manual labor skews heavily towards men, while office heavily towards women. I have seen tons of women work on office, while more men worked on the floor.
For Sony, most of their work are office, were you will find alot of women on that field.
I hear ya. Still depends on the career sector.

Office jobs are often pretty split. But check out who works in the office regarding supply chain and demand planning and it's probably 90% guys. But something like sales and marketing is probably around 50/50.

All I know is the IT crew (internal, or hired as contractors from India) is probably about 80% guys too from where I work. And I've dealt with tons of them, including working with them to launch our new internal ERP systems. Some of the jobs arent even hardcore coding people but simply facilitators or "the account manager contact dude". Still almost always a guy.
 
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ANDS

Thought gaf was racist. Now knows better, honorary gaffer 2022
They fucked up their story: a quick Google shows Moja has 16 years of experience, not all of it at SONY (a bit more than half). Otherwise, good article and those gender imbalances are fucking ridiculous (the "interruption" statistic was dumb though; rude people interrupt and meek people get interrupted).

70 vs 4?
I think there is a big problem, when that much gets promoted, while the other side gets 4. You dont get almost 70 men to be qualified for promotion, while there are 4 women, who get those promotion.

Don't you know, all the women just HAPPEN to not be interested in getting promotions.

But fuck the rest. The representation is far from being 50/50, and although it should probably be at least 70/30, most women are factually and statistically less interested in working in fields like STEM, tech or video games.

Where is your evidence for ANY of this?
 

Kuranghi

Member
Its idiom for things that are hard to believe. You wrote that women are less to ask for promotion. That 70/4 pants something else.
for every 5-8 men, there should be 1 women. here its close to 18 per 1 women. For every 18 men, there is 1 women that got the promotion. It doesnt make a sense at all.
Only possible answer, is that the women working there are low, compared to men.

Why do you think that? Whats it based on?
 

cormack12

Gold Member
Its idiom for things that are hard to believe. You wrote that women are less to ask for promotion. That 70/4 pants something else.
for every 5-8 men, there should be 1 women. here its close to 18 per 1 women. For every 18 men, there is 1 women that got the promotion. It doesnt make a sense at all.
Only possible answer, is that the women working there are low, compared to men.
Dangerous game you are playing......

At a multi national company like Sony, if only 8 women complain in a predominantly office based environment, then it's statistically not likely to be an issue.

See what happens?
 

kingfey

Banned
This is just not true. Men go into engineering more. There were hardly ANY women/girls in my college courses back in the day. There is no "discrimination" on who is admitted, or who is to apply to those programs. There could be a number of reasons why that is the case, but it ain't discrimination.
Men usually skews towards labor job. Anything that is related to labor such as engineering, mechanics would have alot of men. For women, their physical limitation is what gets them discriminated. Plus the decade of men dominating these fields, which fosters, the mentality that these type of jobs are for men, and not for women.

Men also tend to put in longer hours at offices. Software engineering is a white collar job. If one group tends to put in longer hours who is more likely to get those promotions? And yes studies back this up.
That is the dark side that people overlook in these situation. Women get alot of good treatment in these areas. We men suffer from higher ups overworking us to death. This type of treatment have been going for a long time. Its not limited to office field, but in all fields.

And women complaining that they were "interrupted" and chalking it up to being a woman is stupid. Everyone gets interrupted, including every man who has had a job where discussions take place. Men are out there eating a shit sandwich every day of the week, just like everyone else. The idea that everything that inconveniences you or displeases you happens to you because you are a woman is absurd. I can't imagine going through life with that attitude.
This is when they are saying something work related. There was a show, that highlighted these "Interruption" problems. It usually comes from disgruntled men, that dont like the idea, that a women can talk to them about the work. This is a big issue in big companies, where everyone is competing.
 

ANDS

Thought gaf was racist. Now knows better, honorary gaffer 2022
Dangerous game you are playing......

At a multi national company like Sony, if only 8 women complain in a predominantly office based environment, then it's statistically not likely to be an issue.

See what happens?

This isn't someone saying the air conditioning is too high, it's someone saying "Look the hiring practices and general workplace culture suck." More, people are unlikely to "rock the boat" so if eight women are coming forward and complaining, for sure you have more in the wings who have experienced their share of this environment.
 

kingfey

Banned
Why do you think that? Whats it based on?
Its not just "skills" or experience, or time put in. Its actually asking/pressing for the promotion because you think you deserve it as well. Women are traditionally less likely to think they deserve a promotion, or to ask for it, or be aggressive in the process if they do ask for it.

If I were a woman I'd work hard and ask for a promotion based on my hard work, then if I didnt get it I would reflect on why that might be.
Based on what you pointed out.
 

kingfey

Banned
Dangerous game you are playing......

At a multi national company like Sony, if only 8 women complain in a predominantly office based environment, then it's statistically not likely to be an issue.

See what happens?
Kuranghi Kuranghi made a point, that women tend to ask less for promotion. This was based on those points.
 

SlimySnake

Member
The women describe a range of behaviors across multiple U.S.-based PlayStation offices, including demeaning comments, unwelcome advances, a lack of attention paid to their work or ideas and, most frequently, a sense that it was harder for women to be promoted in the company.
Every single thing they have described here has happened to me and I am not a woman.

One of the comments even suggested that they were interrupted in meetings. EVERYONE gets interrupted in meetings. Even my bosses. Especially in zoom meetings. Thats normal.
 

Dr Bass

Member
Men usually skews towards labor job. Anything that is related to labor such as engineering, mechanics would have alot of men. For women, their physical limitation is what gets them discriminated. Plus the decade of men dominating these fields, which fosters, the mentality that these type of jobs are for men, and not for women.


That is the dark side that people overlook in these situation. Women get alot of good treatment in these areas. We men suffer from higher ups overworking us to death. This type of treatment have been going for a long time. Its not limited to office field, but in all fields.


This is when they are saying something work related. There was a show, that highlighted these "Interruption" problems. It usually comes from disgruntled men, that dont like the idea, that a women can talk to them about the work. This is a big issue in big companies, where everyone is competing.
Man this entire post is made-up nonsense. This is nothing personal, but you are out of your league in this discussion dude. I think we should stick to games rather than acting like we are experts on the internal culture of a multinational corporation neither of us work at.
 

Kuranghi

Member
Based on what you pointed out.

So am I right in saying you're thinking:

"All those things he said, theres no way a higher percentage of women out of this group wouldn't have done those things because women have all the same tools and can be just as good as men at jobs"?
 

recursive

Member
70 vs 4?
I think there is a big problem, when that much gets promoted, while the other side gets 4. You dont get almost 70 men to be qualified for promotion, while there are 4 women, who get those promotion.
What are the positions in question? Are women entering those fields per college major statistics?
 

kingfey

Banned
Your narrative is flawed.

What's the distribution of men to women on those teams? If there were 74 employees total and 4 were women, and there are 10 promotions available, it's "statistically impossible" to promote the same number of women as men. And that's ignoring how qualified these people are.
How is my narrative flawed, when there are 70 men who got promoted. While the women working there, only 4 got promoted. No one is asking the same number of men. Its just that these huge disparity shouldn't exist. There could be 70/30 split. Not 95/5 split. You could have 50/24 split.
 
I am sorry, but that shouldnt be the case. If that was the case, then they wouldnt have put this lawsuit there. No fool believes that 70 men can go ask for promotion, while only 4 women ask for promotion. If the numbers were 15, that would have been somewhat on the grey line. But 4, that paints something different. It discourages other female employees, and that their contribution means nothing to the company.
Dude you have no clue how many women were even there to begin with. If the office was 10 women and 100 men (not far fetched at all as its stem and skews that way) and 4 out of 10 got promoted, thats 60%. You don't have the data. No one does. Going by a hunch is so emotional and sjw. Logic, and reason, please.
 
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kingfey

Banned
Why shouldn't it exist?
Because it shows other women arent really that important. It creates work tension, were 1 group gets favorable chances, while the other just sits down, and get nothing.

Why would women working there strive for success, when there is these huge results.
 

Sega Orphan

Banned
No normal guy wants sexual harassment in the work place. We all have gfs, sisters, mothers, daughters, and we want them protected and safe in their workplace. You won't find a normal dude who thinks otherwise. The issue is what certain types of people now consider harassment, and when you put that rubbish in with the actual real harassment, you water down the real issue.
 
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Because it shows other women arent really that important.

Because you're in a niche work enviroment for your sex? How does that show you're less important? On the contrary you should feel more important

It creates work tension, were 1 group gets favorable chances, while the other just sits down, and get nothing.

That isn't a result of gender disparity
 

kingfey

Banned
Dude you have no clue how many women were even there to begin with. If the office was 10 women and 100 men (not far fetched at all as its stem and skews that way) and 4 out of 6 got promoted, thats 60%. You don't have the data. No one does. Going by a hunch is so emotional and sjw. Logic, and reason, please.
Well according to your maths, and those 70/4 promotion, there should be 35 women working for that company, compared to 700 men. Also, this isnt 60% promotion. Its 94.3% vs 5.7%. for every 17 men promoted, there is 1 women promoted.
 

anthony2690

Member
Where is Jason Schreier? He needs to get down to Sony HQ immediately. I don't care if you can't find your LGBTQ pin, no time can be wasted. They need a white knight down there ASAP.
You could also ask them about Crunch while you are at it.
And ape escape! That is off the utmost importance!

Threaten them with a hit piece if you have too, just get me ape escape!
 

kingfey

Banned
Because you're in a niche work enviroment for your sex? How does that show you're less important? On the contrary you should feel more important
seriously? Dont you see the irony on your post?

That isn't a result of gender disparity
Its either A) the company is being dominated by men, which shows gender disparity or B) There is clear discrimination against women.
 

nush

Gold Member
Well according to your maths, and those 70/4 promotion, there should be 35 women working for that company, compared to 700 men. Also, this isnt 60% promotion. Its 94.3% vs 5.7%. for every 17 men promoted, there is 1 women promoted.

So you want all these groups to get discriminated against?

Asian, black, LBQT, Hispanic, neurodivergent, Muslim, Jewish and Shintoists.

Or it's only OK if they have one of those +woman?
 

A.Romero

Member
Just a note: It says people considered for promotions, not necessarily that they got them.

I'm interested in seeing where this goes. At this point it could go either way, in my opinion. I have treated with a large number of entitled employees that think that just because they have seniority they deserve a promotion, for example.

Also a couple of years ago a woman accused her boss for unwanted advances including unwanted physical contact. I felt very pressured about that and decided to let the boss go. A few weeks later she accused me of something similar (obviously a lie). Good thing I've been working on that company for a long time and people know about my work ethics, otherwise it could have gone the other way. I regret letting that guy go, I think about it often.
 

kingfey

Banned
So you want all these groups to get discriminated against?

Asian, black, LBQT, Hispanic, neurodivergent, Muslim, Jewish and Shintoists.

Or it's only OK if they have one of those +woman?
??????
Who is talking about them. The article mentions between men and women. I am staying on that topic.
 
 
Im gonna guess this is gonna be more woke culture stuff. In a new age world where pretty much anything can be considered harassment, news like this ain't surprising tbh . Plenty of people will throw a fit if an enviroment isn't bland, sterile and robotic.
 

kingfey

Banned
Ok than stop trolling.
How is that trolling? Gender disparity would have tons of men, compared to women. The article doesnt mention that. If Sony does have that, all my previous would worthless. But if its not, then they got a big problem.
We are just going with what the article provided us.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
How is that trolling? Gender disparity would have tons of men, compared to women. The article doesnt mention that. If Sony does have that, all my previous would worthless. But if its not, then they got a big problem.
We are just going with what the article provided us.
Just because the world is 50/50 men and women, does not mean everything is life is split 50/50.

That's like saying if 30% of the world is in the 25-40 year old bracket, 30% of all jobs should have people aged 25-40 no matter what job it is.
 

adamsapple

Member
"demeaning comments, unwelcome advances..."
What kind of accusations are that ?!

Of course you will have "unwelcome advances". You are a person, not a rock on the parking lot... someone going to flirt with you sooner or later.
I've not read too deep into this but I already have a mental image.
I work in a huge international company and there are always assholes. It's work.. with people. The company policy is open and I can't imagine it's different in playstation US. Most of HR managers are women too. They do not discriminate.
Depending what positions. We have many engineering positions open but most of people applying are men. It's just facts.

What the fuck ?

You're seriously saying women should just let it happen and not complain about unwelcome flirtation and sexual advances/comments at work ?

A lot of oddly dude-bro posts here just outright dismissing this, pretty fucking disappointing.
 

AGRacing

Member
Every single thing they have described here has happened to me and I am not a woman.

One of the comments even suggested that they were interrupted in meetings. EVERYONE gets interrupted in meetings. Even my bosses. Especially in zoom meetings. Thats normal.

I hear that.

When my wife had a baby... the company I worked at only allowed me to return from parental leave on midnight shifts. Women who returned took any shift they wanted.

But Sony, like most companies, helped cultivate this horse shit... so they'll get whats coming to them.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
What the fuck ?

You're seriously saying women should just let it happen and not complain about unwelcome flirtation and sexual advances/comments at work ?

A lot of oddly dude-bro posts here just outright dismissing this, pretty fucking disappointing.
Dont believe everything you read, especially sexual harrassment.

Years back a female employee at my work was on the firing line, so she pulled out the sexual harrassment accusation. And when that happens you cant fire someone.

A big investigation happened involving around 10 people, where this chick dragged other people into it. Turns out she lied and the dude kept his job and she still got fired. The people she tried to drag into it went against her.

Now if this accusation first got out Twitter style, most people would assume in modern day the guy did something shady. He didn't. She just tried to BS sex assault line. Didnt work.
 

tmlDan

Member
How is that trolling? Gender disparity would have tons of men, compared to women. The article doesnt mention that. If Sony does have that, all my previous would worthless. But if its not, then they got a big problem.
We are just going with what the article provided us.
Gender disparity is entirely up to the gender, in media its 80/20 men versus women where every boss i have had was a woman.

Is it gender discrimination that men don't want to work in media and advertising? no.

In tech its male dominant, so likely why its so skewed.

I'm not here to argue here btw but we shouldn't make assumptions because of what we see at face value.
 
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RoboFu

One of the green rats
It’s always a hard issue to really have an opinion on as 8 women coming forward at the same time means a lawyer somewhere rounded up 8 women. That along with the filler arguments of “ being talked over” IMO it could go either way. Be absolutely true or complete greedy lawyer BS. IDK I’m not privy to evidence.

I want to know what happened to the pedophile PS guy?
 

AGRacing

Member
What the fuck ?

You're seriously saying women should just let it happen and not complain about unwelcome flirtation and sexual advances/comments at work ?

A lot of oddly dude-bro posts here just outright dismissing this, pretty fucking disappointing.

The term unwelcome advance is hilarious. If a guy made an "advance" and was rejected - I agree he should assume any further attempts are unwelcome. The advance itself should also be no more than an invitation to go out socially.... no sexual context. THAT BEING SAID... after the stories I've heard... if I were in my 20s and working on the west coast at one of these companies ? I'd never even be in a room alone with anybody.

I won't assume these women have been wronged because there's 8 of them. Period. There's way too much absolute garbage out there.

Colin Moriarty interviewed a guy who was let go from IGN... not going to look it up again... but that clowns story is clear evidence that when you mix immature men and immature women.... the women are ticking accusatory time bombs and you better be DAMN careful. That guy was an "ally" - thought he had a social relationship with a woman and it imploded on him for next to no reason whatsoever. It's not a game worth playing.
 

nush

Gold Member
??????
Who is talking about them. The article mentions between men and women. I am staying on that topic.

I am because you're whole 70 to 4 argument is totally flawed if it's just stripped down to a male feminist agenda of "Generic men".
 

kingfey

Banned
I am because you're whole 70 to 4 argument is totally flawed if it's just stripped down to a male feminist agenda of "Generic men".
The article gave us this piece of info.
Marie Harrington, a veteran of Sony Online Entertainment and Sony PlayStation for more than 16 years, cited a lack of women considered for senior roles during “calibration sessions.” During one session, she said, only four women were considered for promotions, compared to nearly 70 men.
 
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