Digity
Member
Lots of children can’t handle the fact not everything is made for them.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Demon’s Souls Remake needs to have an Easy difficulty setting
- Thread starter The_Dama
- Start date
- Account Suicide
Hostile_18
Banned
But at least they would be able to enjoy a game they bought. What is easy mode for us might be a fair challenge for them.
GymWolf
Member
Too much words to say "crybabies shut the fuck up", do you cite shakespeare when people ask you how was your day?!
TheContact
Member
Do people just blindly buy games now? I mean, Dark Souls is known for being difficult. Not sure why someone would buy a difficult game then complain about it being difficult. That's the appeal.
royox
Member
Well, next time they will inform themselves better about what they buy. It's like if I buy a fighting game and I ask for changes cause I suck at fighting games.
Also we come back to the point: Souls games are enjoyable cause of their oppressive atmosphere. Take that out and the result is not a Souls Game, it's another thing.
As I always say, if somebody wants an "easy souls" they have Souls Like games with easy mode like Lords of The Fallen, The Sourge or Code Vein. Go play those and let FromSoft do the games they want to make and not the casual shit you want them to make.
borborygmus
Member
Too much words to say "crybabies shut the fuck up", do you cite shakespeare when people ask you how was your day?!
Why don't you come over and look down this pit, compeer, there's plenty of treasure down there.
scoobidoo112
Member
Nothing is stopping them from enjoying the game. The whole point of the Souls series is the difficulty and the accompanying sense of dread and stress, struggling to overcome that challenge, and ending up being more skilled, knowledgeable and experienced than before. If someone is unwilling to go through that process, then they are fundamentally not insterested in experiencing a Souls game.
How about they save their money, watch a playthrough on Youtube, and spend their money on games they are actually interested in, rather than complaining that every game should cater to their needs.
I remember a reviewer not being able to get past the tutorial level of cuphead. Should that game come with a 'automatic movement' mode where the game plays itself, because not having that option would mean the game is not 'accessible enough' for people without the ability to press a button at the correct time?
GymWolf
Member
You don't sound suspicious at all.
Hostile_18
Banned
But your presuming every gamer has the same skill level. Easy may well offer the same challenge as normal to a novice gamer.[/QUOTE]
Last edited:
Hostile_18
Banned
Well to your point about fighting games is Tekken a worse game because it has short cuts to specials for people who haven't learned the advanced moves?
royox
Member
And that's when the "gid gud" came from. If it's too hard you have 2 options. Surrender or improve and finally beat that fucker. I'm a HORRIBLE souls player, I die at most bosses at least 10 times...but I still beat all the souls games cause I love "gitting good".
scoobidoo112
Member
I'm not presuming anything at all. The Souls series challenges everyone to get to a certain skill level, and the satisfaction of earning that skill is the point of the series. And you ignored my other point, which was where does this argument stop? What if the easy difficulty offered in many games is not easy enough for some small subset of players, should every game have an 'I will pretty much play myself mode' in case the player cannot be bothered to even try? At what point can we just say, this game is not for you, try something else?
Last edited:
Airola
Member
Good example.
Here's another:
Maybe they could make the flag of the US so that one side is what it is and the other side is a Confederate flag, or the Russian flag, or whatever else. More people would like it, I mean, you could be just looking at the other side if you don't like the other, and the other side shouldn't have any effect on you who likes the other side.
Airola
Member
Yeah, I think Hostile_18 for one has me on ignore (probably from the last thread I tried to tell him why this is a bad idea).
I haven't seen him address my "it's about the presentation" examples here, and that's an answer that would be good to say every time he or anyone else says easy mode doesn't have an effect on people who like to play on Normal or Hard. But as he goes back to that without ever trying to refute what I say, I'm guessing I'm on ignore for him.
Nymphae
Banned
I think it's just as simple as the fact that a developer is allowed to produce a piece of content that is shaped the way they want it to be, and they are not, and should never be, beholden to anyone in that process.
They should not have to provide mod like content for people who don't want to engage with the challenge they wish to present, despite their potential benefits to doing so.
Personally I find almost every individual element of these games not all that incredibly impressive, I couldn't imagine needing to play this to see the levels or hear the music or whatnot, the main draw and fun is overcoming the challenge they present. I wonder how many people are actually crying about an easy mode, you know what these games are by now and other than overcoming the challenge, they're nothing to write home about.
They should not have to provide mod like content for people who don't want to engage with the challenge they wish to present, despite their potential benefits to doing so.
Personally I find almost every individual element of these games not all that incredibly impressive, I couldn't imagine needing to play this to see the levels or hear the music or whatnot, the main draw and fun is overcoming the challenge they present. I wonder how many people are actually crying about an easy mode, you know what these games are by now and other than overcoming the challenge, they're nothing to write home about.
Cybrwzrd
Banned
Yeah. World of Warcraft. Raids became stupid once they were opened up for raid finder pick up groups.
FunkMiller
Gold Member
Well, you’re charming, aren’t you? You basically couldn’t give a fuck about anybody else’s enjoyment of the Souls games, as long as you’re fine and dandy.
Wrong forum, my lad. Wrong forum.
OldBoyGamer
Banned
Fuck me. Doesn't. take much for people’s claws to come out.
royox
Member
Nobody is forcing you to play FromSoft games. Just play another thing. Why are you so angry? You have million more games you can play.
borborygmus
Member
The thing is you asked for a "normal human" mode which is kind of baffling. Have you played these games at all? It comes off like you haven't really even tried them, yet you're making demands, and ignoring the comments of like 100 people who are going blue in the face repeating the same points.
I get that you're annoyed because I criticized you pretty harshly, but can you address any of my points? For instance, does the following have any effect on your idea that the game is inhumanly hard?
edit: I will say though that I hope nobody takes my criticisms too personally. The way I see it, everyone here's been taking shots at each other because that's the nature of this thread. There is a bit of troll energy going on with the OP that I assume everyone recognizes and is somewhat playing along with. I'd still save you if you were drowning.
But no, your demands are not convincing and I'm gonna call it out.
Last edited:
FunkMiller
Gold Member
I went through blue about ten posts ago. Now I’m blacker than Nito’s codpiece.
borborygmus
Member
Even this phrase is interpreted dishonestly. They're acting like there's a sticker on it that says: "not for you," when really it's just designed a certain way.
OldBoyGamer
Banned
The thing is you asked for a "normal human" mode which is kind of baffling. Have you played these games at all? It comes off like you haven't really even tried them, yet you're making demands, and ignoring the comments of like 100 people who are going blue in the face repeating the same points.
I get that you're annoyed because I criticized you pretty harshly, but can you address any of my points? For instance, does the following have any effect on your idea that the game is inhumanly hard?
edit: I will say though that I hope nobody takes my criticisms too personally. The way I see it, everyone here's been taking shots at each other because that's the nature of this thread. There is a bit of troll energy going on with the OP that I assume everyone recognizes and is somewhat playing along with. I'd still save you if you were drowning.
I’ve played DS several times. Ive spent hours trying to figure it out and I can’t get anywhere with it. I like the idea of the game. I love the genre. I enjoy the themes and the general ‘gameplay’ Is right up my street. But it’s just too punishing for me. I get so deflated by it I give up. So yeh. for me, I’d love to have a baby mode.
what I don’t understand is how that would impact anyone else other than me?
for instance. I’m also shit at the SF series. But they give people like me a baby mode so I can enjoy playing by myself and I get to see quite a bit of the content.
no one who plays the SF series is impacted by that as far as I’m aware?
WindomURL
Member
Been playing through the OG again. If they allow for omni-directional rolling while locked on in the remake, it will basically be like an easy mode. Been doing a lot of combat without lockon, but the camera can be finicky as hell. Have to git gud all over again. Been spoiled. Used to ace this game and now I feel enfeebled.
Didn't find it as difficult to get into the 4 way groove in DS when I played it again recently, and I'm not exactly sure why. But that change alone would make all the difference in the world.
Didn't find it as difficult to get into the 4 way groove in DS when I played it again recently, and I'm not exactly sure why. But that change alone would make all the difference in the world.
borborygmus
Member
I appreciate the genuine response, but most of this has been addressed. Resources are finite, and a lot of series lose their appeal once they start trying to pursue broader audiences. You could watch it on YouTube. But I feel like you could get better at it, there's just a few things to know and once they click, you're good. And of course, there are *tons* of games out now so you can play other things that do what you want.
There are plenty of games that don't click with me and I feel it'd be self centered to want them to change for my sake.
Kind of going in circles here. Sigh.
Last edited:
Nymphae
Banned
I don't think anyone has ever claimed that it would impact them, it's mostly just insults directed at people who want to play the game but can't/won't do what is required to finish them.
To me this is about developer intent and whether or not you as a gamer who does not like what they present should have a say in what type of content they produce. They don't want you to play their games in an easier way, should you be catered to regardless? If this was enough of a problem, someone would meet the market demand.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
FROM are confident in their design and they unapologetic what type of games this is. Its reason why most people love their game and its reason why they are so well known. The difficulty its DNA of this series same way Turn based combat and Akira Toriyama artstyle is DNA of Dragon Quest series.
You either going to like what they made or you don't.
royox
Member
It impacts on the game they deliver. They focus on delivering the most balanced game as possible so you can never say your death was "unfair". Every enemy, every trap, every enviromental hazard...all of them are located with the intention of being hard to notice but at the same time super obvious to notice if you pay attention. The moment they have to make an "easy mode" they have to split their assets(and I mean time, money, people) into building this mode, and at the same time the balance of the "normal mode" loses it's purpose.
Also, I insist on this, it impacts on the game the developers want to deliver and the things they want the player to feel. They want the player to feel opressed by the enviroment, the enemies and the bosses. They want the player to be "scared" every time he turns a corner in a dungeon in fear of an enemy waiting there, they want the player to be scared of activating a surprise trap in the middle of an empty hallway, they want the player to be alert because he can hear an enemy in a room but cannot see it, they also want the player to be scared at bosses that at first glance look impossible or super hard but in real they are super scripted and have no more than 5 diferent moves.
Take all this and what you get is "just another game like there are millions out there". So yeah, Souls fans don't want Souls games to become "just another easy game for the casuals". Not even for the "but if more people play them they will earn more money", thanks god they are one of the fewer companies that focused on delivering what their audience want and not pandering to the casuals or the press.
You want to enjoy Souls games? Git gud and you will. You start using mods, cheat codes and whatever to make it easyer? Ok, it's on you....but you won't be enjoying a Souls game, just a decaffeinated version of it.
Last edited:
xacto
Member
Said the grown-up, proud of beating up pixels.
Whitecrow
Banned
Options are ALWAYS GOOD.
There's no reason (besides time and money) to not make anything be enjoyable by a bigger audience.
We are not talking precisely about censorship, or changing a story, just a difficulty setting.
Come on people, no one will take you out of your 'normal' experience. Why all the complaints??
There's no reason (besides time and money) to not make anything be enjoyable by a bigger audience.
We are not talking precisely about censorship, or changing a story, just a difficulty setting.
Come on people, no one will take you out of your 'normal' experience. Why all the complaints??
Last edited:
borborygmus
Member
No, that's just a slogan. Resources are finite (you acknowledge this yet ignore it), and presumably we're buying a well defined game, otherwise they'd just ship a game engine. It's said that perfection is when there's nothing left to take away.
If I'm working on something and I know everything is optional, it's going to compromise my process because nothing matters anymore. I'd second guess everything I was doing, because if it's optional it may just as well be something else. Any options provided should be intentional and designed, rather than with the idea that everything should be customizable.
Besides, you have thousands of options in the other games that exist on the market.
Last edited:
Hypnosekroete
Member
I played Bloodborne years ago with the glitch to level me up in minutes (offline).
Did it hurt anybody here?
Did it hurt anybody here?
borborygmus
Member
Nobody cares about this at all. It's hopeless to get through to you if this is your takeaway from the discussion.
royox
Member
Not all the games are for everybody.
Not all the games have to be "enjoyable by a bigger audience"
This "bigger audience" have millions of other choices of games they can play instead of trying to change the core of an existing game just to pander their uselessness at getting good at playing 1 game.
And Souls games give you "Easy Mode" options. It's called Summoning. Demon's Souls have Summoning and Magic. Not being labelled as "Easy mode" with a button in the interface don't stop them from being Easy Mode options.
Nobody got hurt and you didn't play Bloodborne.
Last edited:
Whitecrow
Banned
Nobody in this thread is anyone to tell others what they should choose to play lmao
The fact that you struggle to understand other people motives to enjoy certain experiences different than yours does not make you a judge to decide if something should exist or not.
Last edited:
royox
Member
Correct. And nobody did. We are just recommending/giving advice. If you don't like A we recommend you to just don't play A. What you are trying is to transform A in B because you like B and that's unfair for people that likes A.
Nobody is forcing you to play A or to enjoy A...but for some reason you are smashing your head in the A wall "I WANT TO ENJOY A!! CHANGE A!!! GIVE OPTIONS SO PEOPLE THAT LOVES B CAN ENJOY A".
Not all the games are for everybody, not all the games SHOULD be for everybody. I love A, I don't like B...so I play A games and I never buy B games. It's super easy.
Last edited:
CrysisFreak
Banned
OP is literally insulting the artistic vision of the developers.
The artistic vision is not just polygons, shaders and level design.
It includes every single stat, animation and all enemy behaviour.
And much more. It includes everything.
You know this thread is really pathetic if you ask me. Instead of embracing this work of art and appreciating the artistic vision, OP wants the game to accommodate for his lack of skill.
It's awful. You're not a real gamer if you want games to accommodate for your feelings.
"oooh woooh mommy it hurt my feel. my fee fees are so hurt. oooh mommy please. I need to sign a petition against Sony"
Listen here kid and listen well. Don't be a pathetic sack of casual shit. You only live once, show us what you got.
Or be forgotten like all the other low energy losers.
Absolutely baffling.
You're lucky that I don't report you.
Mods gtfih and lock this clown thread. Or you know what. Don't. Let more people see what kinda users we got on this site.
I can tell you right now Sekiro, one of the greatest games of all time, would be worse with full-on difficulty settings.
What do you say about that huh?
Are you one of those cheating cucks who used the trainer to slow enemies down?
Jeez.
Alright I'm out I need to calm down fuck outta here.
The artistic vision is not just polygons, shaders and level design.
It includes every single stat, animation and all enemy behaviour.
And much more. It includes everything.
You know this thread is really pathetic if you ask me. Instead of embracing this work of art and appreciating the artistic vision, OP wants the game to accommodate for his lack of skill.
It's awful. You're not a real gamer if you want games to accommodate for your feelings.
"oooh woooh mommy it hurt my feel. my fee fees are so hurt. oooh mommy please. I need to sign a petition against Sony"
Listen here kid and listen well. Don't be a pathetic sack of casual shit. You only live once, show us what you got.
Or be forgotten like all the other low energy losers.
Absolutely baffling.
You're lucky that I don't report you.
Mods gtfih and lock this clown thread. Or you know what. Don't. Let more people see what kinda users we got on this site.
I can tell you right now Sekiro, one of the greatest games of all time, would be worse with full-on difficulty settings.
What do you say about that huh?
Are you one of those cheating cucks who used the trainer to slow enemies down?
Jeez.
Alright I'm out I need to calm down fuck outta here.
TheSHEEEP
Gold Member
Funny that so many people don't get what others would lose if there was an easy mode.
Think about it like a club.
An exquisite club that only allows a select clientele to join. Anyone in the club is assured of their elevated status and their shared experience by the high standards.
Now people outside of the club demand the clubs standards to be lowered so that everyone can join.
The members of the club would naturally be against that, as that would mean they would lose what is special about being in the club to begin with.
Yes, this is gatekeeping.
And gatekeeping is good, because it is what keeps a hobby healthy and its standards high. Just look at PnP gaming or comics to see what happens when you open the floodgates and try to appeal to more people instead of catering to your core audience...
Think about it like a club.
An exquisite club that only allows a select clientele to join. Anyone in the club is assured of their elevated status and their shared experience by the high standards.
Now people outside of the club demand the clubs standards to be lowered so that everyone can join.
The members of the club would naturally be against that, as that would mean they would lose what is special about being in the club to begin with.
Yes, this is gatekeeping.
And gatekeeping is good, because it is what keeps a hobby healthy and its standards high. Just look at PnP gaming or comics to see what happens when you open the floodgates and try to appeal to more people instead of catering to your core audience...
Spaceman292
Banned
Guys. Does anyone else think 2001 A Space Odyssey is too long? My life is so meaningful and important that I can't waste three hours watching it. We should passive-agressively ask for a thirty minute cut.
Ar¢tos
Member
I can't play 1st person view games because of motion sickness.
Should I demand that every developer making 1st person view games to include an optional 3rd person view and balance the game for it?
Destiny and Borderlands should be fully playable in 3rd person and balanced so I would have no disadvantage when playing it in 3rd person.
This actually trumps inclusion of easy modes, since motion sickness is a real physical ailment, can cause nausea, vomiting and headaches, while not being able to play a game without an easy mode is just lack of skill or lack of willingness to develop that skill.
Why don't we just remove all creative freedom from developers?
Should I demand that every developer making 1st person view games to include an optional 3rd person view and balance the game for it?
Destiny and Borderlands should be fully playable in 3rd person and balanced so I would have no disadvantage when playing it in 3rd person.
This actually trumps inclusion of easy modes, since motion sickness is a real physical ailment, can cause nausea, vomiting and headaches, while not being able to play a game without an easy mode is just lack of skill or lack of willingness to develop that skill.
Why don't we just remove all creative freedom from developers?
KiNeMz
Banned
Don't give up. Keep at it. I believe you can kill the next boss.
It will click once you experience the progress within yourself. 2 attempts everyday. It will be well worth it.
Praise the sun.
Keihart
Member
No they aren't ALWAYS GOOD.
Although the problem with adding easy mode it's not the amount of options, parroting options are always good it's so short sighted.
June
Member
Yes, it's my opinion. I'm not speaking on behalf of anyone else.
OldBoyGamer
Banned
It seems to me that there is hyper sensitivity to anyone just simply saying ‘I’d like it for X To also include a Y’
no one here is demanding the devs do anything. This isn’t a thread about creative freedoms being repressed. This isn’t a call to arms demanding a developer do a thing or we’ll boycott it.
fucks sake. Fight the fight when it needs to be fought. Not when it doesn’t.
id like DS to have a baby mode. You don’t? Ok...
no one here is demanding the devs do anything. This isn’t a thread about creative freedoms being repressed. This isn’t a call to arms demanding a developer do a thing or we’ll boycott it.
fucks sake. Fight the fight when it needs to be fought. Not when it doesn’t.
id like DS to have a baby mode. You don’t? Ok...
FunkMiller
Gold Member
His point is that you clearly don’t care about the experience of other gamers, just your own. Instead of letting Souls players enjoy these games, and you moving on to something else, you want to see the games change to suit you.