FatKingBallman
Banned
Let's see how XSS will stand out at 120fps graphically. Already it doesn't have the RT at 60.
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Doom Eternal Next Gen upgrade performance targets revealed
- Thread starter Snowdonhoffen
- Start date
Let's see how XSS will stand out at 120fps graphically. Already it doesn't have the RT at 60.
01011001
Banned
it will most likely look better than the Xbox One version.
the Series S has about 3.3x the GPU power of the base Xbox One (3.1x in raw TF numbers, I added 0.2 as a conservative estimated RDNA2 performance improvement over GCN2), and the base Xbox one runs the game at 60fps. more than enough to boost the game to a 2x framerate and have enough headroom to push the visuals beyond what was possible on Xbox One
and in the 60fps mode at 1440p it will be about 2x the resolution, so again more than enough headroom in that 3.3x GPU boost to push visuals way higher than on Xbox One
add to that 2GB of additional usable ram as compared to Xbox One and the textures also have space to be improved. less texture pop-in as well due to the SSD (but that's already the case in the back compat mode I guess)
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EdGalTBR
Banned
FatKingBallman
Banned
Discontinued, though. And that price was 4 years ago. Surely today would be a lot cheaper.
Craig of War
Banned
1584 is a weird number why not make it an even 1600p is id Software trying to make the Series X look better now since they are apart of Microsoft now.
FatKingBallman
Banned
And compared to X1X?
Banjo64
cumsessed
Yeah like TES Online is 4k 30fps on One X, but the Series S enhanced version is running at 1080p 60fps with all of the PS5/Series X enhancements e.g high resolution textures, higher LOD, denser foliage, the new water, the new lighting system and the high shadow settings.
But the One X is 4k so that must automatically win against the Series S version.
lostinblue
Banned
Resolution might not be the only difference to take into account here, if Xbox Series S is based on the Series X/PS5 version you might have a game with a heavier graphical makeup going on.
squarealex
Member
It's pretty cool for MS to let Bethesda working on PS5 Upgrade for Doom Eternal.
Thanks
Thanks
01011001
Banned
in raw TF numbers the GPU is about 66.6% as powerful as the One X. add RDNA2 improvements to it and it's closer to it.
it has more ram and a way better CPU, as well as faster storage.
all of this basically results in a lower res, but better textures, better settings, better performance and loading.
also the One X version isn't 1800p60, it is dynamic, it can drop well below this, VG tech found 1276p. so if the Series S holds that 1440p at 60fps well, and doesn't fall below it often, it will run way better than the One X version outside of the occasional situation where the One X actually reaches 1800p
and, the Series S is the replacement of the base Xbox One, which dropped well below 720p in this game... so yeah.
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DarkMage619
$MSFT
You are the one spinning and trying to create a problem when there isn't one. The XSS is doing exactly what it is supposed to be doing. Jason Ronald never said all XSS games would have raytracing that is the voice you heard in your head. You also failed to address my point of comparing the XSS to the X1X over the X1. It's clear you are pushing some sort of agenda trying make a point that was never made. The XSS gives you plenty of bang for your buck over the X1 and that is exactly what it was supposed to do.
I assume you were singing from the rooftops when Watch Dogs Legion and Resident Evil 8 had raytracing on the XSS right? You seems to making the point that the XSS can't do raytracing so when it does have it I'd assume you'd be pleased. I'm positive you aren't being disingenuous with your arguments. Right?
Why don't you compare the X1X to the XSX and the XSS to the X1? You realize they have different audiences don't you? It's not that complicated.
What are you talking about? Doom is a last gen title that is getting an upgrade to run at 120fps on a current gen console. It is doing this for $300 and it is doing something NONE of last gen consoles could do. It's almost like the XSS is the current gen device it was advertised to be.
FatKingBallman
Banned
XSS doesn't have more RAM, nor it is not faster at all. In RAW TF numbers XSS is weaker compared to X1X
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Lmao.
Banjo64
cumsessed
I genuinely see you spend more time writing gobbledegook (and that’s exactly what it is) about Xbox than I see you saying positive stuff about PS.
01011001
Banned
the Series S has more ram than the base Xbox one, and it has fast storage, meaning textures can be loaded in and out faster. all of this added up results in the Series S being able to display way better textures, and especially for the target resolution.
also it has been demonstrated that the GPU of the Series S can hold up to the One X very well. the One X version of Forza Horizon 4 looks worse in the 60fps mode than the Series S version does.
FatKingBallman
Banned
Dude, what said Jason literally means overall for all games, not per game basis.
"This means Xbox Series S delivers the SAME incredible experience next-generation experience and features as Series X"
Man, you're messed up.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Mister Wolf
Member
Well he lied. You should try to sue him after you sell your Series S.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Framerate my good sir. It is offering the same framerate. Jason Ronald NEVER said all XSS games would have raytracing. If he did post the quote my good man.
01011001
Banned
well if people talk out of their ass, you have to set them straight... that's about it. I also defend the PS5 if people talk out of their asses... don't know if you saw that Twitter conversation with D dark10x and an Xbox fanboy who made fun of the PS5 because in Ratchet there's a structure that disappears when the camera goes near it... in such cases I will defend any system... stupid people need to be told when they say stupid shit
FatKingBallman
Banned
OK then. But you compared to it X1X in previous post
Wasn't the other way around??
01011001
Banned
no, I think what you are thinking of is the comparison of the 4k30fps mode on One X vs. the 4K60 mode on Series X, where some effects have been slightly altered. but it still mostly looked better, only the real time night shadows were reduced during races.
but it also has to be said that the game is not a native Series X|S title, but still an enhanced Xbox One game that was patched to support the new consoles
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FatKingBallman
Banned
He didn't need to say specifically at all for framerate or raytracing what XSS will have or not. He said in one sentence for all features and difference will be only in resolution. End of the discussion. Cheers. No need to spin it. You look ridiculous now
RaZoR No1
Member
Would be interesting to know, if things like SFS are already implement to overcome the RAM size if the XSS.
About One X vs Series S:
It is comparing apples with pineapples.
One X uses old gen textures etc and pushes it to 4k.
The XSS one uses the next gen ones with 1080p resolution.
I think as soon the update is out, we can compare, which version looks better on the same screen/resolution and I bet it will be XSS, altough the One X version could look sharper.
About One X vs Series S:
It is comparing apples with pineapples.
One X uses old gen textures etc and pushes it to 4k.
The XSS one uses the next gen ones with 1080p resolution.
I think as soon the update is out, we can compare, which version looks better on the same screen/resolution and I bet it will be XSS, altough the One X version could look sharper.
Md Ray
Member
And RAY TRACING. I mean there's a portion of precious silicon area in the GPU being devoted just for this computation alone, something not found on the X1 or X1X. You conveniently leaving this out is hilarious though.
If you're implying that MS didn't lie about "same experience" because "muh 120fps" then what about those games where 120fps is missing from the S whereas it's present on the X like Destiny 2, Cold War? What do you have to say about that?
Clearly it's very inconsistent and isn't providing the "same experience as X, at lower res" as MS hyped it up. But hey, keep damage controlling though.
MasterCornholio
Member
Im curious about this. Was it a bug or does it disappear so you can see Ratchets?
01011001
Banned
it is done so you can still see stuff, as usually done in games.
the issue really was that it was a giant structure and it was 1 big mesh.
so even the parts in front of Ratchet will disappear when the camera goes inside it. easy fix would be to cut this big mesh into like 5 smaller ones so only the specific parts that obstruct the cam would disappear. (I think it is supposed to be a dead dinosaur or something... looked like 4 legs and a body on top, but hard to tell in the posted video)
edit: here's the idiot in question who posted it
and yeah, it does look a bit... crappy, but it would be an easy fix. I think it's an oversight, they most likely didn't think about what happens if you phase the camera into this thing lol
but those twitter idiots made fun of the console for it... like the no brain idiots fanboys are (so very usual stuff)
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
Yeah it's a bug as it makes the whole thing disappear because the leg would block Rivet from the scene. It should have only parts disappearing.
01011001
Banned
it's not really a bug, like I said it's an oversight. they made this 1 gigantic mesh, which would not be an issue if it was off to the side where you can't get close to it. but they didn't think about what happens when you move the camera into it.
but yeah, easy fix is to make each leg and the body on top into separate meshes, so only the part that obstructs the camera disappears.
GHG
Gold Member
If this is the box you want and you understand what you're getting then I don't have a problem with it. However there's been a lot of denial with regards to the devices true capabilities ever since it was announced.
The talk of the town was that it would be the same but just at lower resolutions and that's proven to not be true on several occasions now.
The discussions are still on this board, you can look at any discussion with "lockhart" in the title or even the official announcement thread.
I agree. In which case I would suggest you go back and look at the discussions that have taken place regarding the console. The time period I'm referencing is the same one I mentioned to Banjo above.
It's being criticised because it's not delivering on what it was originally promised to do. They even changed target resolution marketing:
Microsoft Now Advertising Series S as a 1080p/60 Device
It's more representative of real world games, but I don't think they had to do this. The machine can run games up to 1440p resolution (and even 4K) so the original advertisements were correct. Secondly, PS5 and Series X are advertised as 4K machines but it's rare to find games running in 4K...
That's not always true either though is it? :
Wreckfest Xbox Series X update adds 4K/60fps support
Wreckfest is now playable at 4K/60fps on Xbox Series X and 4K/30fps on Xbox Series S thanks to an optimisation update. New content and tournament have also been added.
The results seem to be pretty inconsistent so far.
This wouldn't be a discussion in the first place if the console was never oversold as something it isn't.
If it can't even do some cross gen games with RT then how do we expect it to perform if a developer wants to create a game without rasterization in mind? Guess we will just have to wait and see.
Md Ray
Member
"Framerate my good sir" he says.
Ask him then why is the S missing 120fps in some of the games where it's present on X...
In Cold War both 120fps and RT are missing from S. See, that's not the "same experience" I was promised "my good sir"
DarkMage619
.
JackMcGunns
Member
1584 is a weird number why not make it an even 1600p is id Software trying to make the Series X look better now since they are apart of Microsoft now.
Hmm, wasn’t Sony doing rounds to different studios to money hat exclusive features and maybe performance parity? You might be on to something
01011001
Banned
it does what it was promised to do. it simply doesn't do it in this specific title. You can't hold the console accountable for the performance profiles or decisions made for a random game.
Watch Dogs' RT implementation is very performance heavy, and it runs on Series S. there is no way Doom can't run with RT on Series S. They might patch it in later down the line. they are currently working on enhancement patches for 4 platforms at the same time. PC, PS5, Series X and Series S. my guess is that the S is the one they put the least amount of work into.
the reason I think this is because the RT implementation in Doom Eternal seems to be very performant and it running at 1800p60fps with all the shit that's going down in a typical Doom battle on Series X is proving this.
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DarkMage619
$MSFT
Nope. He never said the ONLY thing that would be different was resolution and he NEVER said all XSS games would have raytracing. That was you making stuff up. That is what is actually ridiculous. Just accept you are wrong and appreciate that the XSS is doing things for $300 you can't get anywhere else. I promise it won't hurt you or make you love any other console less.
You (too) two are wrong. You holding MS responsible for what 3rd parties do on their console? That is another ridiculous standard placed on the cheapest current gen device. It's so odd to see people so opposed to more gamers having access to current gen experiences. There is nothing to damage control as long as the XSS keeps doing what was actually offered and not some imaginary standard people on a message board have.
The XSS didn't make my breakfast this morning either but I am not going to complain about it. The system has the same CPU, SSD, and feature set as the other current gen devices. It will always have compromises with this graphics and news flash, that's the point! It was never going to offer the same graphics as a system that is $200 more EXPENSIVE. I know you are smart enough to know it wasn't and most importantly MS never said it was.
Still it is a $300 box that sometimes offers raytracing, sometimes offers 4k, and with regards to to 1st party offers 120fps. You can't find ANY device PC or console that offers that for less. There is nothing wrong with acknowledging it's a great value and moving on with your day. No need to make up crap and move the goal posts to score points in a fanboy war my dude.
FatKingBallman
Banned
Experience and feature means - framerate, raytracing, resolution. All of it. And he mentioned it in one sentence. No need to spin it. You look ridiculous now. I mean, YOU ARE.
Banjo64
cumsessed
I understood pretty well from the start to be honest. Due to the GPU delta between the S and X it was never going to render games at 1440p when the X hit 4k. It’s a 1080p box. Due to the RAM there were always going to be some compromises to fidelity.
I would disagree with some of the comments re framerate. 90+% of the time it matches the X unless the developer decides to go for 1440p instead.
The console costs £250 bundled with the controller and already has like 50 120fps games, it’s not for some people; but it’s an amazing complimentary device.
And saying the One X is a better machine is just bait at this point or a sign of serious mental illness.
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MasterCornholio
Member
Looks really odd but I agree it's nothing to do with the I/O. Hopefully it gets fixed and if it doesn't it isn't a big deal.
01011001
Banned
it's just a funny looking oversight... it will only get fixed if the devs notice people talking about it is my guess. it doesn't really affect anything in any major way
MasterCornholio
Member
I'd be a lot more worried if it was something game breaking which isn't the case here.
MasterCornholio
Member
Isn't peformance parity an excuse that people use for any game that's similar on the two systems?
01011001
Banned
I bet they just increased the settings. the game on PC also doesn't get anything beyond RT in the enhanced patch I think.
the consoles ran at medium I think... (base consoles even lower) so anything above that will be an improvement
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GHG
Gold Member
Doom Eternal is created by what is now a first party studio for Xbox. There are no excuses in this case. They will have access to all the resources they would ever need.
At this point you're just guessing to make excuses. We can only talk about the facts that are presented to us today and they state there is no ray tracing for the Series S on Doom Eternal. If it comes at a later date then the question needs to be asked as to why it took more effort or time when people were saying it's a machine that won't have any impact or cost developers time because all they have to do is "move some sliders down".
You can't just ignore all the games where it doesn't perform equally in terms of raytracing (or framerate since the goalposts have now been moved to interpret the marketing as "framerate") and then say "but look this handful of games it does do what they said it should". The results so far have been wildly inconsistent and of you are are Series S owner you cannot be sure of whether or not you will be getting ray tracing in future titles.
It wasn't marketed as a "sometimes" or a "maybe" machine, the statements being made were pretty definitive.
Hey, don't take that up with me, I'm not the one saying the following statement was referring to framerates or anything else:
"This means Xbox Series S delivers the SAME incredible experience next-generation experience and features as Series X"
I was actually saying pre release that you would see a variety of results (dependant on the game/engine) due to the ram configuration and bandwidth being different between the two machines. I was called the boogyman as a result.
Md Ray
Member
It's placed by MS themselves.
Nothing wrong with that. It's their false messaging that I have problems with.
"Same experience as X, at lower res." is a lie though and shouldn't have been advertised as such.
If it were to offer the same experience then where's RT in DOOM Eternal, Control? Where's 120fps in Cold War, Destiny 2 on the S?
It's inconsistent.
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