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[01011001]

Quality mode frame rate drops pretty low at points

that mode is unplayable even when it is a perfect 30, so not much lost here. anything outside of the 60fps mode in this is basically unplayable, the 40fps modes are right on the edge but still fucking awful.

so performance not being perfect is by far the least of the 30fps modes' issue. we are talking more than 220ms of latency.
as a comparison the infamously input lag ridden Killzone 2 had input lag of about 150ms to 160ms.

this game in 60fps mode has input lag of more than 110ms, which is funnily enough about the same latency Killzone 3 had on PS3, which is of course a 30fps game and not even the most responsive one either.

 

[Imtjnotu]

There is a reason kingdom hearts 3 had to scrap the game and start all over.

They had to drop this shit engine and rebuild the game in unreal engine 4. Square wtf are you doing

 

[Hoddi]

In the game's defense, AC Unity still looks smashing even by today's standards. Just look at this thing.

There's a certain irony in that Series S comment though. Maybe more gamers should start wishing for it to be the baseline console.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Game looks much better than other videos suggested, but then I always thought that.

 

[LordOfChaos]

Jesus christ, that Agni demo was 10 years ago?????


I remember this being crazy impressive, now I can see where the textures fall a bit short and look game-ey more than cinematic, but of course the hand crafted animations in a canned demo are still ahead of most games in gameplay

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Jesus christ, that Agni demo was 10 years ago?????


I remember this being crazy impressive, now I can see where the textures fall a bit short and look game-ey more than cinematic, but of course the hand crafted animations in a canned demo are still ahead of most games in gameplay

Kind of like Nvidia demos. Those 2 minutes demos look incredible (that one with the marbles and toys is especially cool). Demos mean nothing as the final product typically looks nothing like it.

That's like a Nabisco showing a trailer of an awesome new Oreo cookie they made in their R&D lab hyping up people that future cookies might be quality stuff you get at a mom and pop bakery. But when they launch the new flavours the next few years, the real products are small, brittle and low quality. Not even close to the promo video.

 

[LordOfChaos]

Kind of like Nvidia demos. Those 2 minutes demos look incredible (that one with the marbles and toys is especially cool). Demos mean nothing as the final product typically looks nothing like it.

That's like a Nabisco showing a trailer of an awesome new Oreo cookie they made in their R&D lab hyping up people that future cookies might be quality stuff you get at a mom and pop bakery. But when they launch the new flavours the next few years, the real products are small, brittle and low quality. Not even close to the promo video.

Oreos are perfect

 

[Jaybe]

In the game's defense, AC Unity still looks smashing even by today's standards. Just look at this thing.

Yeah It’s not like they just picked some random game to compare Forspoken too, AC Unity’s lighting was arguably the best implementation of the gen. It’s like comparing a game’s animation to TLOU2’s or its animal testicles weather reactivity to RDR2’s.

But while we praise AC Unity’s lighting, remember it also contained this famous horror:

 

[Pagusas]

I wonder where the one guy is, surprised he hasn’t jumped in here to tell us how beautiful a game it is, and we must all just want COD.

 

[Hoddi]

Yeah It’s not like they just picked some random game to compare Forspoken too, AC Unity’s lighting was arguably the best implementation of the gen. It’s like comparing a game’s animation to TLOU2’s or its animal testicles weather reactivity to RDR2’s.

But while we praise AC Unity’s lighting, remember it also contained this famous horror:

Ya, AC Unity was way ahead of its time. It got a lot of (mostly unwarranted) flak for its graphics issues but most of them were caused by driver problems on PC. Especially on the AMD side which I think is where your screenshot is from.

I only first played through the game last summer and it was frankly jaw dropping at 4k. It's not the greatest game I've ever played but I can't think of many games that look better.

 

[ChiefDada]

John was struggling to be as diplomatic and lenient as possible here. Truth is the game's downright embarrassing from a tech presentation standpoint; forget about current gen, this is barely passable as a last gen AAA. Some body/people seriously effed up here as I don't know how you allow such low quality work to reach (digital) store shelves. And to make things worse, the issues extend far beyond graphics with subpar animation, non-compelling story, and awful writing/dialogue to match. Literally goes against every signature characteristic that makes PS 1st/3rd party exclusives great. It should have been either delayed or cancelled. I don't take pleasure in saying any of this but it needs to be said.

 

[hussar16]

That 2012 demo looks miles better then this ugly game

 

[hussar16]

Ya, AC Unity was way ahead of its time. It got a lot of (mostly unwarranted) flak for its graphics issues but most of them were caused by driver problems on PC. Especially on the AMD side which I think is where your screenshot is from.

I only first played through the game last summer and it was frankly jaw dropping at 4k. It's not the greatest game I've ever played but I can't think of many games that look better.

Ac unity was downgraded itself by a Lil bit

 

[rofif]

I'm pretty sure HFW is fully dynamic





Unless I've misunderstood what you're saying

It’s not dynamic. They have like 24 bakes compared to 7 or something in zero Dawn.
But I might be totally wrong

 

[rofif]

that mode is unplayable even when it is a perfect 30, so not much lost here. anything outside of the 60fps mode in this is basically unplayable, the 40fps modes are right on the edge but still fucking awful.

so performance not being perfect is by far the least of the 30fps modes' issue. we are talking more than 220ms of latency.
as a comparison the infamously input lag ridden Killzone 2 had input lag of about 150ms to 160ms.

this game in 60fps mode has input lag of more than 110ms, which is funnily enough about the same latency Killzone 3 had on PS3, which is of course a 30fps game and not even the most responsive one either.

Yes it’s yet another game worth crazy high input lag in 30 fps. I don’t get what’s so difficult. Bloodborne controls like 120 fps game in comparison lol

 

[01011001]

Yes it’s yet another game worth crazy high input lag in 30 fps. I don’t get what’s so difficult. Bloodborne controls like 120 fps game in comparison lol

it is indeed ridiculous. but this one has super high latency at 60fps as well. 110+ms is what you would usually get from a decent 30fps game... not even an especially well made 30fps, but just decent.

God of War Ragnarök is the same, but that one thankfully has a VRR mode that turns off Vsync, and that reduces the latency to an extreme degree. the 120hz mode in Forspoken doesn't do that, it still locks the game to 60 with vsync on, which is a fucking stupid ass decision for sure.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Me too... IDK why he/she was banned but I appreciated their summaries... Psst adamsapple come back home buddy!

Persecution complex and console warring is what the mods said. That person is on a perm warning now.

 

[kuncol02]

infamously input lag ridden Killzone 2 had input lag of about 150ms to 160ms

If I remember correctly that 150ms was AFTER patches and before them it was closer to 250ms.

 

[Corndog]

Does he have quality expression during those side quests? I’m sure it has great cutscenes during main mission but I highly doubt it’s same quality during side quests.

You especially see how midt NPCs who are giving those side quests are much lower quality compare main characters. (That’s true almost all games but games with realistic models it stands out much more.)

Plenty of older games had good facial expressions even on side quests.

 

[yamaci17]

Yes it’s yet another game worth crazy high input lag in 30 fps. I don’t get what’s so difficult. Bloodborne controls like 120 fps game in comparison lol

nothing is difficult. you're practically acting like low input lag 30 fps was the standard. IT never was. majority of ps4 titles play with high input lag (the ones I've tried and confirm that plays with upwards of 130 ms of input lag: spiderman, god of war, rdr 2 [around 200 ms of input lag due to 3 prerender + 2 vsync buffer]) and more. these are some of the titles that most ps4 userbase claims to run super smooth and cool at 30 fps .

this is why they appear " smoother " because they're using multiple buffers. this creates the famous vsync smoothing effect. this is why for years; the console people have claimed "console 30 fps looks smoother than pc 30 fps; pc 30 fps suck". if you givem the low input lag 30 fps, majority of them won't like it due to how raw, jittered and juddered it is. this is in fact why I've never seen you moan about PC's 30 FPS or 40 FPS or 60 FPS, because you also like responsive jittered low FPS gameplay and you actively want it (like me). you and me are extreme outlier people. majority of people couldn't or wouldn't stand it. VRR is not enough to save it either. you gotta have them VSYNC buffers.

its a deliberate choice made by developers to appease the majority of console userbase. and you're not in majority. tough luck. only reason you have 30 fps defenders here and there is because they are not disgruntled by the input lag and they're okay with vsync. if not for vsync, you would hardly find anyone supporting 30 fps around.

without heavy amounts of input lag, delays and buffers; you cannot create the famous "smooth 30 fps" effect.

vsync is practically a blood pact, where you give up responsiveness for image smoothness. and since most people do not care about how laggy their games are, devs tend to be on the vsync side of things. i dont know why you act its all different in PS5 gen.

god of war on ps4 and god of war ragnarok on ps4 has the exact same Vsync input lag; and that is one of the most coveted "super smooth 30 fps" console people tout. even marvel's spiderman has ridiculuous amount of input lags on a PS4 and PS4 pro. these are all documented by DF. this is not a new trend that started with PS5. no one is trying to compromise your precious 30 FPS. it was always this way. you're mistaking or you're generalizing on some outliers and make deductions. games like witcher 3 and bloodborne are outliers. and funny enough, unlike you, most people hate their 30 FPS and think how they lack special magic sauce some other 30 FPS games. it is clear that most people do not care about input lag like you do (I do)

 

[GymWolf]

I played the demo for 3 hours and it didn't felt like something with heavy input lag like rdr2 for example.

Maybe it's because i turned on the 120hz option?

 

[Three]

It’s not dynamic. They have like 24 bakes compared to 7 or something in zero Dawn.
But I might be totally wrong

Baked what though? Indirect lighting?

The shadows, lighting/ToD is dynamic in the videos. I think the person mentioning AC Unity was asking for baked lighting and shadows and only set times of day which is how AC Unity works.

 

[anthony2690]

I don't understand why ff15 and AC:unity look considerably better than forspoken.

When it was revealed as project athia for ps5, it looked insane, even my brother in law sent me the trailer saying how good it looked.

Pretty disappointing from sqaure enix.

 

[yamaci17]

Ya, AC Unity was way ahead of its time. It got a lot of (mostly unwarranted) flak for its graphics issues but most of them were caused by driver problems on PC. Especially on the AMD side which I think is where your screenshot is from.

I only first played through the game last summer and it was frankly jaw dropping at 4k. It's not the greatest game I've ever played but I can't think of many games that look better.

it got a lot of flak because it ran at <24 FPS on base consoles at the time

 

[DenchDeckard]

Kind of like Nvidia demos. Those 2 minutes demos look incredible (that one with the marbles and toys is especially cool). Demos mean nothing as the final product typically looks nothing like it.

That's like a Nabisco showing a trailer of an awesome new Oreo cookie they made in their R&D lab hyping up people that future cookies might be quality stuff you get at a mom and pop bakery. But when they launch the new flavours the next few years, the real products are small, brittle and low quality. Not even close to the promo video.

Just like the unreal engine 5 demo on ps5...but we all fell for it.

 

[M1chl]

Also this game is ugly artistically as well.

Called that it would have shitty IQ on release when it just a Project Athia, was called salty fanboy, good times. Sadly you still cannot do really high frequency details, like complex particle system on consoles, well you can but it probably ended up as noise, as shown here.

 

[sandbood]

I wonder where the one guy is, surprised he hasn’t jumped in here to tell us how beautiful a game it is, and we must all just want COD.

rofif
You've been summoned.

 

[rodrigolfp]

220ms of latency.

Think of the poor RDR2 fans. They need to have games some times to appreciate.

rdr 2 [around 200 ms of input lag due to 3 prerender + 2 vsync buffer])

rookie numbers:

 

[rofif]

rofif
You've been summoned.

Oh I am here. Getting the game today.
It’s unfortunate the game looks so flat but I didn’t mind it in the demo too much. Other aspects of it can looks great as John fro
Df said.
It’s a mixed bad with bad ambient occlusion and poor fsr.

That said, on overall if it will look like the demo, I think it’s a pretty unique artistic look.
I don’t always look at the games this technically. Only at the end result.

Elden ring is the best looking game for me last year bar none. I’ve take like 300 screenshots of it. I know it’s simple tech but it’s done so well.

I never claimed forspoken is any more than it is. But it’s also not as bad looking as people really hard try to make it look. Watch df video. It’s pretty well summarised what are the issues

 

[rofif]

nothing is difficult. you're practically acting like low input lag 30 fps was the standard. IT never was. majority of ps4 titles play with high input lag (the ones I've tried and confirm that plays with upwards of 130 ms of input lag: spiderman, god of war, rdr 2 [around 200 ms of input lag due to 3 prerender + 2 vsync buffer]) and more. these are some of the titles that most ps4 userbase claims to run super smooth and cool at 30 fps .

this is why they appear " smoother " because they're using multiple buffers. this creates the famous vsync smoothing effect. this is why for years; the console people have claimed "console 30 fps looks smoother than pc 30 fps; pc 30 fps suck". if you givem the low input lag 30 fps, majority of them won't like it due to how raw, jittered and juddered it is. this is in fact why I've never seen you moan about PC's 30 FPS or 40 FPS or 60 FPS, because you also like responsive jittered low FPS gameplay and you actively want it (like me). you and me are extreme outlier people. majority of people couldn't or wouldn't stand it. VRR is not enough to save it either. you gotta have them VSYNC buffers.

its a deliberate choice made by developers to appease the majority of console userbase. and you're not in majority. tough luck. only reason you have 30 fps defenders here and there is because they are not disgruntled by the input lag and they're okay with vsync. if not for vsync, you would hardly find anyone supporting 30 fps around.

without heavy amounts of input lag, delays and buffers; you cannot create the famous "smooth 30 fps" effect.

vsync is practically a blood pact, where you give up responsiveness for image smoothness. and since most people do not care about how laggy their games are, devs tend to be on the vsync side of things. i dont know why you act its all different in PS5 gen.

god of war on ps4 and god of war ragnarok on ps4 has the exact same Vsync input lag; and that is one of the most coveted "super smooth 30 fps" console people tout. even marvel's spiderman has ridiculuous amount of input lags on a PS4 and PS4 pro. these are all documented by DF. this is not a new trend that started with PS5. no one is trying to compromise your precious 30 FPS. it was always this way. you're mistaking or you're generalizing on some outliers and make deductions. games like witcher 3 and bloodborne are outliers. and funny enough, unlike you, most people hate their 30 FPS and think how they lack special magic sauce some other 30 FPS games. it is clear that most people do not care about input lag like you do (I do)

I can’t believe you actually wrote a good informative post haha. Good work !
Yeah I 100 agree. I will take jittery but low lag bloodborne over this bad 30fps. Motion blur helps to hide the occasional bad frame pacing here and there.

This begs to question. Wtf is up with final fantasy xv on ps5. Quality 30 fps mode is stuttering so much, that bloodborne frame pacing is great looking in comparison.
They managed to make it both 30fps locked, slow and stutters.

Other examples like you say are just as slow like god of war.

One of few fine 30fps games I’ve played this gen was forbidden. West and ratchet if I recall correctly

 

[TrebleShot]

Oh I am here. Getting the game today.
It’s unfortunate the game looks so flat but I didn’t mind it in the demo too much. Other aspects of it can looks great as John fro
Df said.
It’s a mixed bad with bad ambient occlusion and poor fsr.

That said, on overall if it will look like the demo, I think it’s a pretty unique artistic look.
I don’t always look at the games this technically. Only at the end result.

Elden ring is the best looking game for me last year bar none. I’ve take like 300 screenshots of it. I know it’s simple tech but it’s done so well.

I never claimed forspoken is any more than it is. But it’s also not as bad looking as people really hard try to make it look. Watch df video. It’s pretty well summarised what are the issues

What platform are we buying on?

 

[Drizzlehell]

Honestly, technical problems at launch aside, Unity is still one of the best looking AC games, and still one of the better looking games overall, even today.

 

[Hugare]

Game doesnt have day/night cycle and doesnt use baked lighting? lol, fucking idiotic

Game looks horrendous. Worse than a FF XV. How is that possible?

Close Luminous Studio, Square

 

[ToTTenTranz]

AO is poor despite all the AMD sponsorship

Doesn't look like they're using anything other than FSR2 from the FidelityFX suite. FXAO looks good in open sourced demos and whatever AO they're using is just bad.

 

[GHG]

I might need to reinstall unity to see it in all its glory in 4k 60fps.

 

[DavidGzz]

PS5 SSD loads early PS4 graphics fast is all I'm seeing. I wonder how it looks maxed on PC.

 

[Three]

Game doesnt have day/night cycle and doesnt use baked lighting? lol, fucking idiotic

Game looks horrendous. Worse than a FF XV. How is that possible?

Close Luminous Studio, Square

It's because most of the industry is moving more towards easy development and agility over time spent creating set baked graphics like AC Unity, The order, Infamous Second Son etc.

This is why I believe factions will not be that different graphically to TLOU2 or Part 1 but may even be slightly worse. Not saying it will be bad looking but they want the ability to easily change things and have very few things "baked".

 

[Hugare]

It's because most of the industry is moving more towards easy development and agility over time spent creating set baked graphics like AC Unity, The order, Infamous Second Son etc.

This is why I believe factions will not be that different graphically to TLOU2 or Part 1 but may even be slightly worse. Not saying it will be bad looking but they want the ability to easily change things and have very few things "baked".

Factions is 100% going to be baked.

Every ND game was baked. Changing the engine to have dynamic lighting only would be harder than just baking, and results would be worse.

Also baking is less expensive, so if they want to make it also for last gen, they have to implement it.

The only decent substitute to baked lighting is RT GI like in Metro, Dying Light 2 and etc. But even then, results arent always better than making it by hand.

 

[Doctor Hades]

I liked the PS5 demo but decided to go for the game on PC due to the console version's iffy image quality and performance. I knew that it would happen eventually but it is still disappointing that we are now finally seeing current-gen only releases at long last but they come with so many compromises, whether it be dodgy performance, sub-standard lighting and/or low rendering resolutions. What baffles me about the lighting in Forspoken is that the game has no real-time day/night cycle so the lighting could have easily been pre-baked (Digital Foundry mention how poor the ambient occlusion is) and been much, much better than what we're seeing here. The game looks nice in terms of art design, for sure, but technically it looks like a game that could easily run on PS4 or Xbox One with a few tweaks (I mean Final Fantasy XV does running on this same engine and still looks fantastic bar some weak anti-aliasing).

I am quietly hoping that the PC version scales beyond the PS5 version in terms of ray-tracing and graphical options to get around that bland lighting and short shadow draw distance. This will also be the first game to support DirectStorage on PC, offering faster loading times that hopefully will come close to the sub-1 second ones of the PS5 version. Only a few hours left now to find out...

 

[Three]

Factions is 100% going to be baked.

Every ND game was baked. Changing the engine to have dynamic lighting only would be harder than just baking, and results would be worse.

Also baking is less expensive, so if they want to make it also for last gen, they have to implement it.

The only decent substitute to baked lighting is RT GI like in Metro, Dying Light 2 and etc. But even then, results arent always better than making it by hand.

They talked about easily swappable areas without massive downloads. Not sure exactly what that means but having a baked world would make that more difficult. Maybe baking is done at some in-game installing stage instead? Maybe it's something else entirely? Not sure what that is referring to to be honest.

 

[01011001]

Think of the poor RDR2 fans. They need to have games some times to appreciate.

rookie numbers:

jeeesus 3 prerendered frames? I mean, that might have been the only way to smooth the performance out on last gen I guess.

I wonde what Forspoken is doing to get the same latency on a PS5

 

[SmokedMeat]

Looks like one of dips to 720p

 

[01011001]

Looks like one of dips to 720p

Xbox One 900p master race!

 

[Represent.]

Here's a better TL;DW:

Nothing actually works, it's a piece of shit from a technical point of view and he's trying really really hard to find some ok points about it. There is none. Avoid this turd.

He had more good things to say about this games graphics than he did about Elden Ring.

 

[rofif]

What platform are we buying on?

ps5. I was hesitant but usual recent releases are better on ps5.
I might grab it on pc if I like the game and it's all patched up for a replay in the future

 

[adamsapple]

Me too... IDK why he/she was banned but I appreciated their summaries... Psst adamsapple come back home buddy!

Just in time for the revised Dead Space video to come out this week (hopefully).

 

[Kilau]

Just in time for the revised Dead Space video to come out this week (hopefully).

Welcome back