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[Azurro]

It is not a bad point, but then again there are people that do criticise when they see a 110 pounds woman beat up someone the size of Dave Bautista or Terry Crews…

Well, the context of this game is a lot more sci fi than TLOU2, so it wouldn't look out of place, as long as the character isn't a stick.

And hey, there's always Gina Carano if you want a strong, thick and attractive lady. I am not sure why they went with the chubby cheeks look.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Well, the context of this game is a lot more sci fi than TLOU2, so it wouldn't look out of place, as long as the character isn't a stick.

And hey, there's always Gina Carano if you want a strong, thick and attractive lady. I am not sure why they went with the chubby cheeks look.

Sure, Gina worked really really well in Mandalorian .

 

[TGO]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

 

[DispatchNinja]

She looks fine. Y’all are weird. I do love this fat pic though

 

[TKOFromTokyo]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

I don’t think the character needs to look like her, but I do think that the character’s face seems to have more body fat than in her arms. That seems inconsistent to me, more like facial swelling, hence my original food allergy comment.

 

[Astral Dog]

Its not as bad as what they did to peter

 

[The Chairman]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

She got the Western AAA game treatment.

 

[Corndog]

But they didn’t look like they do today, and if they did it was at a very young age which is why marriages gravitated to much younger girls.

Why are you fibbers pretending you know how attractive the average females were through our history?

There is this thing called painting. You may have heard of it.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

She got the Western AAA game treatment.

Bald and this would be Timthetatman

 

[TKOFromTokyo]

There is this thing called painting. You may have heard of it.

You do realize that many paintings and sculptures often weren’t made to look like their source material, right?

 

[namekuseijin]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

after captured, the data needs to run on Sony's proprietary emasculator engine

 

[Astral Dog]

for years our people had to deal with flat ass Nate Drake from uncharted… joking but it’s true.

I’m sure people will survive with a woman who doesn’t fall on that Hollywood “ideal of beauty”.
Yes I understand that games are fantasy but after all that 21st century feminism view on video games that turned into that mess… I doubt any company wants to be involved in that type of drama.

Ps. Feminism on the 20th century was about women, what we are calling in this era feminism is not that, it’s just women hating men… thus making even more friction.

No

 

[namekuseijin]

found the real model

 

[Putonahappyface]

One for the furries.

 

[Astral Dog]

This looks more fun, definitely not silly as fuck and for children.

What do you have against link and Cloud dude they are like, super beautiful

 

[Bo_Hazem]

What do you have against link and Cloud dude they are like, super beautiful

 

[Putonahappyface]

What do you have against link and Cloud dude they are like, super beautiful

The problem I have here is a common problem for me with most anime unfortunately. I can find it difficult differentiating who is male, female or androgynous. The one wearing the Niqab is that a lady or a gentleman?

I miss the Manga series/films from the eighties and early nineties. I'd love to see Nintendo make a Mario themed Urotsukidōji: Legend of the Overfiend game.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The problem I have here is a common problem for me with most anime unfortunately. I can find it difficult differentiating who is male, female or androgynous. The one wearing the Niqab is that a lady or a gentleman?

I miss the Manga series/films from the eighties and early nineties. I'd love to see Nintendo make a Mario themed Urotsukidōji: Legend of the Overfiend game.

The one with the Niqab is the lead character of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Link. Most male protagonists in JRPG's are feminized, and don't see similar outrage about that.

 

[Bladed Thesis]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

The character clearly looks a lot chubbier in the face than her. This gif she looks smoking.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The character clearly looks a lot chubbier in the face than her. This gif she looks smoking.

I honestly think the head and face shape is similar, but Aloy kinda have smaller eyes if you put them next to each other which makes her look this weird from some angles. I think they should just make her as slim as the first game.

Other than that I've never seen a game character so expressive facially.

 

[MayauMiao]

Hollywood is probably seeking Melissa McCarthy right now.

 

[Putonahappyface]

The one with the Niqab is the lead character of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Link. Most male protagonists in JRPG's are feminized, and don't see similar outrage about that.

Cloud in FF7R confused the hell out of me at times. Why have they made him so feminine?

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Cloud in FF7R confused the hell out of me at times. Why have they made him so feminine?

It's a weeb thing, same with Noctis in FF15:

Although more masculine here. I prefered Gladiolus, better character and leadership and his DLC was good.

Overall if anything those JRPG's know how to make each character unique.

 

[Putonahappyface]

It's a weeb thing, same with Noctis in FF15:

Although more masculine here. I prefered Gladiolus, better character and leadership and his DLC was good.

Overall if anything those JRPG's know how to make each character unique.

 

[Sinthor]

It's a weeb thing, same with Noctis in FF15:

Although more masculine here. I prefered Gladiolus, better character and leadership and his DLC was good.

Overall if anything those JRPG's know how to make each character unique.

I don't think I agree with characters like Cloud and Noctis being "feminized." I don't want to get banned from the thread here, but I think that the topics of culture and art style are relevant even to this thread's questions about changes to the Aloy character model. Let me explain:

Japanese art is quite a bit different from at least a number of other cultural 'norms' for art such as modern Western art, Middle Eastern art and South American. The first main difference is that if you look at the art in anime and movies...most of the characters are not visually identifiable as Asian. While the other art styles and cultures I mentioned tend to represent characters as their host ethnicity. So that's a big difference.

Secondly, on feminization, I don't believe that's what characters like Cloud and Noctis represent. If this was a trend, you would expect to see more consistency, but as noted here, characters like Gladioulos exist and are very definitely alpha male types. Japanese art tends to represent younger and inexperienced male characters in the ways that Cloud and Noctis are represented. Not 'feminized' per se, but definitely not as fully mature males. They are often surrounded by older, more experienced male mentors or friends however, that ARE very definitely male. Also, even if you take Cloud and Noctis..while they may seem feminized in comparison to those older male mentors, they are still very definitely male and easily distinguished from the female characters. Female characters have this same difference with young or more innocent females being portrayed as less feminine, younger women or childlike. The more powerful and mature females (Tika and Jessie for example in FF 7) are very definitely female. So Japanese art uses youth and non maturity to represent the innocence of the characters or the beginning of the hero's journey. I think that's what is at work in Japanese games, anime and art, not what we see as 'feminization.' This makes sense as well since Japanese culture and history was very alpha male and male dominated.

It is modern Western art where we see more of this true feminization of male characters. Actually it's more like a move towards androgyny. While male characters look less typically MALE, we also see female characters looking less like the typical female ideals. Interestingly, this is a pattern in history. You can look up on youtube...there are a few professors who have written about art and the arc of civilizations (Camille Paglia is one you can find videos and written articles about). The short version of it is this...in multiple ancient cultures or world powers, you can see that the art early and thru the prime of those powers was very representative of male power and female femine qualities. However, towards the end of these civilizations, the art androgenizes and your see more feminine males and more masculine females in the art. You can see this for example in early Greek and Roman sculptures as opposed to sculptures from just a few decades before the fall of those empires. Same with the Medio-Persian and Egyptian powers as well. Fascinating stuff. It really makes me think of art and culture mirroring that old saying about how 'hard times make strong men...strong men make good times...'

So bottom line, while I agree that what we're seeing (to a lesser degree here with Aloy) in Western games with character design is representative of the move to androgenize the sexes, I don't think that's what is being reflected in the Japanese games. I've never gotten the sense from those games that that was the intent either.

Just my two cents..

 

[The Chairman]

It's a weeb thing, same with Noctis in FF15:

Weebs like to see beautiful males and females while Western culture loving weebs like you like to see manly women like this,

Didn't you say that LOU2 is one of your favorite games? i'm sure if one of your family members entered the room while you are seeing this Abby scene they would think that you like hardcore gay porn

 

[Corndog]

You do realize that many paintings and sculptures often weren’t made to look like their source material, right?

I have paintings of ancestors from the 1600s. Try again. Why is your argument that some paintings were styltized so all must be? And before you say you didn’t say that, then what is your actual point.

 

[cormack12]

Weebs like to see beautiful males and females while Western culture loving weebs like you like to see manly women like this,

Didn't you say that LOU2 is one of your favorite games? i'm sure if one of your family members entered the room while you are seeing this Abby scene they would think that you like hardcore gay porn

Dat first dry bum session. Mmmmmmmm.

 

[TKOFromTokyo]

I have paintings of ancestors from the 1600s. Try again. Why is your argument that some paintings were styltized so all must be? And before you say you didn’t say that, then what is your actual point.

My actual point is you cannot just assume paintings are matched to reference. Often, they were not because they were intended to portray subjects a certain way. This is a fact. I don’t care about your example. I care about what art historians say.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Weebs like to see beautiful males and females while Western culture loving weebs like you like to see manly women like this,

Didn't you say that LOU2 is one of your favorite games? i'm sure if one of your family members entered the room while you are seeing this Abby scene they would think that you like hardcore gay porn

Yeah that scene was disturbing as fuck and came out of nowhere.

 

[Sinthor]

Yeah that scene was disturbing as fuck and game out of no where.

'and came out of nowhere...'

THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!

 

[TKOFromTokyo]

Weebs like to see beautiful males and females while Western culture loving weebs like you like to see manly women like this,

Didn't you say that LOU2 is one of your favorite games? i'm sure if one of your family members entered the room while you are seeing this Abby scene they would think that you like hardcore gay porn

That’s a woman?! I’ve been thinking it was a dude the whole time I’ve seen it just randomly posted on here.

 

[cormack12]

 

[tassletine]

It looks like they tweaked her to look more like Greta Thunberg. I actually really like the model, the most offputting thing for me are her freckles.

 

[Bladed Thesis]

Yeah that scene was disturbing as fuck and came out of nowhere.

Definitely threw me off when it happened. My wife was nearby in the kitchen and I had to turn down my TV.

 

[cormack12]

Definitely threw me off when it happened. My wife was nearby in the kitchen and I had to turn down my TV.

and pretend you was peeling bananas really quickly and loudly

 

[Dirk Benedict]

 

[Corndog]

My actual point is you cannot just assume paintings are matched to reference. Often, they were not because they were intended to portray subjects a certain way. This is a fact. I don’t care about your example. I care about what art historians say.

Sure you do. So those personal portraits of my ancestors at a Germany college are just fake. They were professors there.

 

[Corndog]

One for each game?

 

[GymWolf]

Lol yeah they kinda say that it wouldn’t be believable if a strong person was also beautiful. Guess they need to start watching sports?
Just one local example, needs to be uglier so she’d win more I guess...

Guerrilla studios probably never saw a female vault pole competition on yt where all the gentlemen reunites.

 

[GymWolf]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

The real life actress has such a cute face, it's mindblowing how they fucked up so badly.

 

[Fredrik]

Guerrilla studios probably never saw a female vault pole competition on yt where all the gentlemen reunites.

First comment:
”Such incredible talent. Really splendid.
I’m talking about whoever edited the video.”

 

[Coolwhhip]

First comment:
”Such incredible talent. Really splendid.
I’m talking about whoever edited the video.”

That's a much more impressive way to show off your ass than going to the gym and taking selfies where you twist your spine in front of the mirror.

 

[Eron]

The real female version of Aloy

Vittoria Puccini (@vittoriapucciniofficial) • Instagram photos and videos

instagram.com

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I don't think I agree with characters like Cloud and Noctis being "feminized." I don't want to get banned from the thread here, but I think that the topics of culture and art style are relevant even to this thread's questions about changes to the Aloy character model. Let me explain:

Japanese art is quite a bit different from at least a number of other cultural 'norms' for art such as modern Western art, Middle Eastern art and South American. The first main difference is that if you look at the art in anime and movies...most of the characters are not visually identifiable as Asian. While the other art styles and cultures I mentioned tend to represent characters as their host ethnicity. So that's a big difference.

Secondly, on feminization, I don't believe that's what characters like Cloud and Noctis represent. If this was a trend, you would expect to see more consistency, but as noted here, characters like Gladioulos exist and are very definitely alpha male types. Japanese art tends to represent younger and inexperienced male characters in the ways that Cloud and Noctis are represented. Not 'feminized' per se, but definitely not as fully mature males. They are often surrounded by older, more experienced male mentors or friends however, that ARE very definitely male. Also, even if you take Cloud and Noctis..while they may seem feminized in comparison to those older male mentors, they are still very definitely male and easily distinguished from the female characters. Female characters have this same difference with young or more innocent females being portrayed as less feminine, younger women or childlike. The more powerful and mature females (Tika and Jessie for example in FF 7) are very definitely female. So Japanese art uses youth and non maturity to represent the innocence of the characters or the beginning of the hero's journey. I think that's what is at work in Japanese games, anime and art, not what we see as 'feminization.' This makes sense as well since Japanese culture and history was very alpha male and male dominated.

It is modern Western art where we see more of this true feminization of male characters. Actually it's more like a move towards androgyny. While male characters look less typically MALE, we also see female characters looking less like the typical female ideals. Interestingly, this is a pattern in history. You can look up on youtube...there are a few professors who have written about art and the arc of civilizations (Camille Paglia is one you can find videos and written articles about). The short version of it is this...in multiple ancient cultures or world powers, you can see that the art early and thru the prime of those powers was very representative of male power and female femine qualities. However, towards the end of these civilizations, the art androgenizes and your see more feminine males and more masculine females in the art. You can see this for example in early Greek and Roman sculptures as opposed to sculptures from just a few decades before the fall of those empires. Same with the Medio-Persian and Egyptian powers as well. Fascinating stuff. It really makes me think of art and culture mirroring that old saying about how 'hard times make strong men...strong men make good times...'

So bottom line, while I agree that what we're seeing (to a lesser degree here with Aloy) in Western games with character design is representative of the move to androgenize the sexes, I don't think that's what is being reflected in the Japanese games. I've never gotten the sense from those games that that was the intent either.

Just my two cents..

Amazing, just amazing, man. Wonderful input, and I agree with you there and the history part is fascinating indeed!

 

[Killer8]

The level of simping i've seen on Twitter for a 3D model who isn't even real almost makes this game worth existing.

 

[Chris23]

If she was called Big Bertha, i'd understand.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

If she was called Big Bertha, i'd understand.

There's some kind of joke there about "Relentless Assault," but I'm not going to put it together.

 

[SlimySnake]

After looking at some footage of her

Yep, don't look like her

Fuck

Marry

Kill

 

[Sinthor]

Fuck

Marry

Kill

My god...now I've read a bunch of online articles frothing at the mouth about that Tweet that showed Aloy on the left and then the version more like the actress but with makeup and 'perfect teeth' on the right. Those people would just have a fit and drop dead if they saw this thread I guess. But they all miss the point of the comments (and the Tweet was basically just a sardonic comment on things, not a serious proposal like they want to pretend it was!). The articles claim that men are being 'triggered' by more 'realistic portrayals of women like this or (get this) like Abby in TLOU2. The FUUUCK? Abby was 'realistic?' LOL. Now THAT is some damn funny stuff right there!

These people don't get that they are actually being ANTI-FEMINIST with their views. A lot of the comments or objections are from the developer themselves saying they made the character of Aloy look LESS like the actress portraying her because they felt that she would look TOO feminine and that made her look WEAK! Do they not see what that is saying? It is saying that a woman cannot be 'feminine' and be strong at the same time! How the FUCK is that a 'feminist' point of view?

Look, bottom line, is that they have MILDLY masculinized Aloy as part of an ideological mode of thought. They flat out admitted that in a way that SHOULD be insulting to feminists. That is a sign of just how crossed up all this ideological madness has become. Women must be more masculine so they don't look feminine and weak...but at the same time...masculinity is bad and men shouldn't be that. So what...men need to be feminine and women masculine? Wouldn't we just have the same thing we have today, just gender swapped? It makes no sense.

In the end, the changes to Aloy are pretty minor and I certainly don't care one whit. I'll still play the game and enjoy it if it's good, which I expect it to be. But the developers comments and reasoning on how they changed Aloy's appearance in the original game and in this one, is fucked up. Period. Western developers are going to take this shit too far, mark my words. Then their products will fail in the market and they will rage and flail about and blame the consumers for being 'sexist' or whatever suits their mood. Then they'll have to make changes again to recover sales. Same thing that has happened to Hollywood with a few movies in recent years. They can be pissed off all they want, but if people don't buy the products, they won't succeed. That won't stop them from pushing this too far though and maybe in the end that's all to the good as it will educate them on what exactly their market supports and what it does not.

I dunno man.. In the end.....on the internet, pretty much anything that gets put out there- half the people will hate and the other half will love. It's exhausting trying to track all the trends and feedback. Look, if you DO feel strongly about this kind of thing then you only have one course of action. Your only power is the power of your wallet and money. So if you feel strongly about something, support it with your money, or conversely DON'T support it with your money if you don't like it or agree. That's about it. You won't have much success in trying to convert people with opposite views to your line of thinking. Half the people are going to agree with you anyway and the other half never will!