killatopak
Member
I was shitting on people who like the breakable weapon mechanic day 1.
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Has Genshin Impact change anyone's mind on breakable weapons in Breath Of The Wild?
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DESTROYA
Member
Fixed it for you
01011001
Banned
no?
they are completely different games, Genshin Impact is an RPG and Zelda is an Action Adventure, first of all...
and also the weapon durability in BotW is simply like Ammo in a shooter. you are out of ammo you gotta find new ammo. and you will find new ammo EVERYWHERE... by the end I had multiple high tier weapons hung up in my house (yeah you can get a house) and my inventory was constantly filled with good weapons.
people that have issues with the weapon durability are a breed of human i will never be able to understand. you always have enough weapons and you save the reall good ones for stronger enemies. just like you would do with ammo in an FPS... you save up the rarer RPG ammo for the big guys and kill the small ones with your standard weapon. it's literally the same in BotW only that instead of an RPG you have a fire sword, and instead of a standard RPG you have iron weapons.
they are completely different games, Genshin Impact is an RPG and Zelda is an Action Adventure, first of all...
and also the weapon durability in BotW is simply like Ammo in a shooter. you are out of ammo you gotta find new ammo. and you will find new ammo EVERYWHERE... by the end I had multiple high tier weapons hung up in my house (yeah you can get a house) and my inventory was constantly filled with good weapons.
people that have issues with the weapon durability are a breed of human i will never be able to understand. you always have enough weapons and you save the reall good ones for stronger enemies. just like you would do with ammo in an FPS... you save up the rarer RPG ammo for the big guys and kill the small ones with your standard weapon. it's literally the same in BotW only that instead of an RPG you have a fire sword, and instead of a standard RPG you have iron weapons.
GymWolf
Member
Last time i checked, zelda was an action\adventure open world rpg not an fps (and many fps have weapons that you find and keep forever), finding and keeping a new weapon is part of the fun, not everyone love to explore just to find seeds, breakable weapons, and health\stamina upgrades, sometimes you want to find a cool weapon that you can use for the entire game.
Is it an inherently bad mechanic? maybe not
does it kill the meaning of exploration and sense of progression for many people? you can bet your sweet ass dude.
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pixelation
Member
BotW is overrated (a good game sure, but not the masterpiece people claim it is), people will start realizing that soon enough.
Kumomeme
Member
Monster Hunter's weapon repair mechanic is what crossed my mind when playing botw. It nice if we have that features. the material needed like whetstone can be pick up along the way when traveling or when defeating monster for example. they can add durability to the stone or limit it. but not on the weapon itself.
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MagnesG
Banned
A different game with different game economics. Would you want a BOTW game just grinding for the next weapon to get the perfect stats? Those unbreakable weapons would just become some fodder at the end.
Do you want gated progress on a SP game? Ever heard of resins?
Man fuck these moronic comparison.
Do you want gated progress on a SP game? Ever heard of resins?
Man fuck these moronic comparison.
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S
SLoWMoTIoN
Unconfirmed Member
Nintendo GAF can you verify this? LMAO.
I mean you can run 40 hours without worrying about resin. That's about the time you'll get in BOTW without fighting things. Which you won't do much of because shit breaks.
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Unknown Soldier
Member
What's hilarious is that in BOTW the breaking mechanic even extends (in a different way) to the Master Sword, they couldn't even leave Link's iconic weapon alone.
pullcounter
Member
I love how you can download a patch for BotW on CEMU that disables weapon durability lol
MagnesG
Banned
I've always destroy those camps when I able to, which I do most of the time. Some people just wanna hoard trash when they could just throw them out. You just don't avoid camps when you have to get good even with trash weapons.
At some point I'm doing a self time attack for every new camps I've encountered, while being more proficient on saving durabilities.
This is just an item management 101 skill and people still can wrap their head around with it.
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MagnesG
Banned
Yes they have durabilities too, and it's around x3 compared to their weapon tier counterparts, and shield breaks faster when you surf or land on hard surfaces.
That minigame is piss poor easy though you can beat just it with a new middle tier shield (you would have tons of those at that point) and it would still have like half of its durability.
MagnesG
Banned
Oh tell us how you can implement that. It is gonna be a full fledged RPG at the end?
Scotty W
Gold Member
I love progressive rock. One of my favorite bands is Queens of the Stone Age. Conversely, I cannot stand Dream Theatre.
Now QOTSA has tons of simple, non-proggy, even garbage short songs- I Wanna Make It Wit Chu, In My Head, Go With the Flow. I don’t love all of these songs, but when I get to the good stuff, it makes it seem even sweeter:
What’s the takeaway from this? A principle: always give the people exactly what they want and the hunger will surfeit and die.
There is no pleasure without pain. Eliminate pain as far as possible and you will invariably eliminate pleasure too. No, what must be done is to bring pain and pleasure together into harmony. That is what Breath of the Wild does.
Now QOTSA has tons of simple, non-proggy, even garbage short songs- I Wanna Make It Wit Chu, In My Head, Go With the Flow. I don’t love all of these songs, but when I get to the good stuff, it makes it seem even sweeter:
What’s the takeaway from this? A principle: always give the people exactly what they want and the hunger will surfeit and die.
There is no pleasure without pain. Eliminate pain as far as possible and you will invariably eliminate pleasure too. No, what must be done is to bring pain and pleasure together into harmony. That is what Breath of the Wild does.
Yoboman
Member
You just design it so different weapons are more effective or less effective against different enemies. Plenty of games do this already, its not rocket science
MagnesG
Banned
That means you have to have a full 4 set of weapons everytime, and it's not better. And how do you deal with useless loots? Gonna go with how "different" games work already?
Why not play those games then? BOTW wants you to use whatever that the games throws at you. It's simple.
GymWolf
Member
Nah many people still think that the game is the second coming of jenna jameson until the sequel are gonna come out fixing all the flaws in the first one (at least we can hope).
I understand why people don't like the weapon system in BotW but I also understand why the developers wanted it to be this way.
It is a game after all and games tend to have rules.
This is why its so easy to dismiss "Link gets the legendary sword but it needs time to recharge LOL" type arguments. Yeah, cos its a game. They dont want you to just use that sword infinitely so the put in a rule to prevent that.
If anything it's been Sekiro and Ghost of Tsushima that made me think the weapon system in BotW is not the best. Give the player ONE sword and a whole range of gadgets and different ammo and items to make it more interesting.
Thats like the usual way Zelda games did things though so "OMG Nintendo never offers anything new". Its a no win situation for them.
If you look at say Shadow of War and Assassin's Creed Origins/Odyssey they are giving you a fuck ton on items and weapons and upgrades and shit but it's all a waste of time because the games are not finding ways to force you to use them. It feels like they are there because people will moan if they aren't there. Or becuase open world games are supposed to have loads of customization options so have a ton of weapons you'll never use. It's too easy to beat the game without bothering with any of that so you are left messing about with difficulty to try and experience the games systems.
Maybe in BotW you are seeing a consequence of having so many people making a single game. Someone designs all these cool weapons and wants them in the game but then someone else points out that the player will never use all that so just leave it out. So the "breakable weapons" thing is almost like a compromise. They'll put in all those weapons but they'll also force you to use them.
At the time BotW released I think Jim Sterling made the point that having breakable weapons stopped him from just playing the game how HE personally wanted to play. So it already shows there is an attitude towards games from some people that they just want to experience a game on the players terms not according to the game creator's rules. This also plays into arguments over Dark Souls etc difficulty where a common argument is "I don't have time to do a boss fight multiple times give me an easy mode".
There's no real correct answer here but I would tend to side with the games developers. It would be a bit shit to design a game with loads of weapons and loads of elemental attacks etc that interact with the game world and then players are like "you can get the master sword 1/3 of the way in and just use that for the rest of the game".
It is a game after all and games tend to have rules.
This is why its so easy to dismiss "Link gets the legendary sword but it needs time to recharge LOL" type arguments. Yeah, cos its a game. They dont want you to just use that sword infinitely so the put in a rule to prevent that.
If anything it's been Sekiro and Ghost of Tsushima that made me think the weapon system in BotW is not the best. Give the player ONE sword and a whole range of gadgets and different ammo and items to make it more interesting.
Thats like the usual way Zelda games did things though so "OMG Nintendo never offers anything new". Its a no win situation for them.
If you look at say Shadow of War and Assassin's Creed Origins/Odyssey they are giving you a fuck ton on items and weapons and upgrades and shit but it's all a waste of time because the games are not finding ways to force you to use them. It feels like they are there because people will moan if they aren't there. Or becuase open world games are supposed to have loads of customization options so have a ton of weapons you'll never use. It's too easy to beat the game without bothering with any of that so you are left messing about with difficulty to try and experience the games systems.
Maybe in BotW you are seeing a consequence of having so many people making a single game. Someone designs all these cool weapons and wants them in the game but then someone else points out that the player will never use all that so just leave it out. So the "breakable weapons" thing is almost like a compromise. They'll put in all those weapons but they'll also force you to use them.
At the time BotW released I think Jim Sterling made the point that having breakable weapons stopped him from just playing the game how HE personally wanted to play. So it already shows there is an attitude towards games from some people that they just want to experience a game on the players terms not according to the game creator's rules. This also plays into arguments over Dark Souls etc difficulty where a common argument is "I don't have time to do a boss fight multiple times give me an easy mode".
There's no real correct answer here but I would tend to side with the games developers. It would be a bit shit to design a game with loads of weapons and loads of elemental attacks etc that interact with the game world and then players are like "you can get the master sword 1/3 of the way in and just use that for the rest of the game".
LegendOfKage
Member
Because the the world exploration feels a LOT like BOTW. Combat is different, but exploration is very similar.
You are wrong.
Yup. It's a no win situation.
"Do something new or different."
Hm. OK. How about this?
"Nooooo! Do it the same as plenty of other games."
As you say, if they design the game around needing specific items against specific enemies then the open world context begins to fall apart. You either need to have one item/weapon of each type at all times or keep the weapons types for each enemy close to those enemies and steer towards a more linear game.
The idea of forcing the player to use a variety of weapons is sound, in theory. The problem seems to be that the players themselves don't actually want this at all.
I'd guess the "sweet spot" is to have tons of loot so that the player feels a sense of accomplishment in finding the best item and then sticking with that for the duration of the game. So, in a sense, you deliberately put in loads of useless stuff and the game part of this is finding the viable weapons in the pile of useless stuff.
Not that this is a bad thing necessarily. Games like Nioh for example are just overloaded with stuff but you can beat the game through skill without freaking out too much about using the "right" gear.
As usual with gaming discussions, thing are always presented as all sugar or all shite. BotW is the most overrated game ever with the worst weapon system ever or its the best game of all time and the breaking system is amazing.
People who are against it are never going to say "I see what they are trying to do here so I will go with it".
Instead always moaning that the game isn't EXACTLY what they think it should be.
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royox
Member
Most of the game's stuff is a 1:1 from BOTW. I have seen trees, bushes, rocks and a looong etc that are literally copy-pasted from BOTW. This and also the enemies are basically the same with same mechanics. It's BOTW with gatcha shit added.
fersnake
Member
ppl in this thread
cel shading (anime) game = zelda copy
open world = zelda copy
rpg = zelda copy
magic/power/elements = zelda copy
walk/runing/glide = zelda copy
have music in your game = zelda copy
quest/side quest/misions = zelda copy
having a story = zelda copy
etc etc etc been playing botw for like 1000 hours and this game (genshin) for the last week and i dont feel it's a copy paste very different experience and with Genshin in a good way and with the gatcha shit added but for a F2P game it's so great for what it is.
cel shading (anime) game = zelda copy
open world = zelda copy
rpg = zelda copy
magic/power/elements = zelda copy
walk/runing/glide = zelda copy
have music in your game = zelda copy
quest/side quest/misions = zelda copy
having a story = zelda copy
etc etc etc been playing botw for like 1000 hours and this game (genshin) for the last week and i dont feel it's a copy paste very different experience and with Genshin in a good way and with the gatcha shit added but for a F2P game it's so great for what it is.
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