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vodka-bull
Member
Money for the kids, she ain‘t taking care of them suckers for free.
Games of Today
Member
Yes you're right. Go play any PS1 game and you'll literally want to put a gun in your mouth because of how hard they are. Go further back than that and they get impossible.
You have to be a borderline genius mind reader to beat older games. Now 95% of games hold your hand like a child.
That's why games that are challenging but not impossible like Uncharted and The Last of Us that have limitd HUD but guide the player using lighting and enemy placement are a lot of fun to play.
Most of the time you know where to go but you also feel like you're discovering things on your own. Of course now Naughty Dog also uses NPC voice lines to help in some instances. But at least they are not irritating.
This is also why I have so much praise for Ghost of Tsushima and the way Insomniac decided to guide the player with the wind instead of HUD icons.
DonkeyPunchJr
World’s Biggest Weeb
100% agreed OP, but I’d appreciate it if you don’t design your thread title like a clickbait article’s headline. No need for that.
FoxMcChief
Gold Member
I’m playing through GoW:R, and i don’t remember the boy and talking head talking so damn much in the first game. They never shut up in the new one.
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jakinov
Member
Didn't say it wasn't well done in Uncharted just that it popularized it.
Crayon
Member
It is, though I'm on the worse side of the scale when it comes to missing that sort of thing. Especially fucking ladders. They get me all the time.
ResurrectedContrarian
Suffers with mild autism
Agreed, this is the worst decade for any kind of production with only the rarest bright spots, an absolutely abysmal culture across the board. Marvel defines it, and Marvel-ified Disney is the worst trash excuse for a pop culture I've seen in my life.
For a random comparison... even D&D is trash now. Fifth-edition basically leaned into a simplified Marvel-esque style of play where everyone is a hero and a badass and the rules are a fraction of what they once were.
This also comes from the idiotic and dishonest "expand the base" pushes, where they act as if we have some ethical need to get non-traditional gamers to play. Bullshit, they just want a wider base for more profit, there's no ethical meaning whatsoever to having more people play games or getting new audiences involved.
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delfrickintree
Banned
Doesnt seem like he did anything wrong, except be an annoying sperg about it. The jumping mechanic was bugged? Ive never played it so i cant really judge..
MiguelItUp
Member
Definitely not new, but for whatever reason devs think it's what people want. I feel like it just got worse with the rise of games with "hero" characters after the MOBA fads. Because they all just keep talking, have "unique" personalities, etc. Maybe the rise of Marvel film fandom hasn't really helped either.
Some games have done it pretty well, but the majority just douse it in all that shit. It just because a yapping mess, annoying, etc.
Ragnarok irritated the fuck out of me with all the forced talking and walking segments. It felt like I watched more than played. Also the excessive chatting during combat when you're focused and the characters are like, "USE YOUR BLOCK!" or something similar. The whole telling you how to complete puzzles before you even realize it's a puzzle thing too. I get you can change the time to be informed or whatever. But why is the default what it is? It was so stupid, lmao.
While not AS excessive, I love that they tried to introduce that kind of thing into Battlefield 2042, and it failed. They eventually muted and removed the voice lines for their characters. Now they're adding classes, lmao. Beautiful.
Some games have done it pretty well, but the majority just douse it in all that shit. It just because a yapping mess, annoying, etc.
Ragnarok irritated the fuck out of me with all the forced talking and walking segments. It felt like I watched more than played. Also the excessive chatting during combat when you're focused and the characters are like, "USE YOUR BLOCK!" or something similar. The whole telling you how to complete puzzles before you even realize it's a puzzle thing too. I get you can change the time to be informed or whatever. But why is the default what it is? It was so stupid, lmao.
While not AS excessive, I love that they tried to introduce that kind of thing into Battlefield 2042, and it failed. They eventually muted and removed the voice lines for their characters. Now they're adding classes, lmao. Beautiful.
eastcoastkody
Member
i like it when its done well. I find it odd if my character is with other characters and there is complete silence for like an hour.
Dragon Age has lots of banter, and u learn things that way. Guardians of the Galaxy has tons of banter.
Avengers has pretty much none, unless u are in an elevator. Which sucked. There def should've been more talking during gameplay
I like hearing my Ghost in Destiny. Though 90% of the time he says stupid stuff like "This is a fallen cache left here" or "im not sure about this".
Dragon Age has lots of banter, and u learn things that way. Guardians of the Galaxy has tons of banter.
Avengers has pretty much none, unless u are in an elevator. Which sucked. There def should've been more talking during gameplay
I like hearing my Ghost in Destiny. Though 90% of the time he says stupid stuff like "This is a fallen cache left here" or "im not sure about this".
nkarafo
Member
One of the problems in modern gaming that exists for quite a while (since the optical disks were introduced) is that developers no longer have to think about available space.
For decades, space was something they had to think about. They had to use it sufficiently. Add important features and remove stuff that maybe not worth wasting precious space. Optimize as much as possible and even compress as much as you can.
For a long time now though, this isn't a thing, at least for the main home consoles and PCs. Back in the day you would guess such idea should be a huge improvement with no negative side effects. Developers having as much space as they want to complete their vision? How can something like this have a single negative thing about it?
Turns out it does have a lot of negatives. Developers use the unlimited space they have with intense greed. They bloat their games and their code, they don't optimize, they don't compress, etc.
But the biggest problem is the audio. This (or FMVs) is the thing that used to take most of the space in past games and voiced speech was always an issue because of the large, additional space it takes. But now you get games like this. Now they talk much more that they should. I also really hate this trend.
Basically, i'm saying that constrain is actually a good thing and it can help any creator to make a better product without extra fat. But there are no technical constrains anymore. It now only depends on someone having constrain themselves.
For decades, space was something they had to think about. They had to use it sufficiently. Add important features and remove stuff that maybe not worth wasting precious space. Optimize as much as possible and even compress as much as you can.
For a long time now though, this isn't a thing, at least for the main home consoles and PCs. Back in the day you would guess such idea should be a huge improvement with no negative side effects. Developers having as much space as they want to complete their vision? How can something like this have a single negative thing about it?
Turns out it does have a lot of negatives. Developers use the unlimited space they have with intense greed. They bloat their games and their code, they don't optimize, they don't compress, etc.
But the biggest problem is the audio. This (or FMVs) is the thing that used to take most of the space in past games and voiced speech was always an issue because of the large, additional space it takes. But now you get games like this. Now they talk much more that they should. I also really hate this trend.
Basically, i'm saying that constrain is actually a good thing and it can help any creator to make a better product without extra fat. But there are no technical constrains anymore. It now only depends on someone having constrain themselves.
Bekind
Neo Member
The more i saw how prevalent this "self-talking and having some sidekick/character who would never shut up" trend is in gaming space, the more i respect fromsoftware. Only Miyazaki and FROM have the balls to make its biggest game in history which does the polar opposite of what most modern gaming companies would do to their AAA handholding games. The risks they are taking are humongous, and i am so glad it pays off and becomes one of the all-time greatest. It's a wake-up call for modern gaming. Dont be afraid to take risks, respect your players.
Ulysses 31
Member
I'm watching DansGaming stream who put it on low and there's still a considerable amount of non story related banter during combat and collecting things in the world.
Neff
Member
GymWolf
Member
It is the description that you can read in the option menu for low.
I have it on normal so i didn't checked if it was correct.
In the demo the banter was pretty rare on low, maybe they tuned up the settings before launch.
zeomax
Member
It was not a bug it is a jump mechanic in Half-Life called crouch jump. You could do this in many games which used the HL engine.
NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
Ocarina of Time’s Navi was nothing compared to the incessant banter of modern games.
And the trend isn’t even that new. Anyone who played Puppeteer 10 years ago will know what I’m talking about.
And the trend isn’t even that new. Anyone who played Puppeteer 10 years ago will know what I’m talking about.
cinnamonandgravy
Member
it's for "accessibility", aka filthy casuals, who are a huge part of the market.
it's also a lot easier to develop a game where the game tells the player where to go/what to do.
reared it's ugly head in the x360/ps3 gen. never really went away.
That was my issue in GT7 and the Cafe and the other races. They kept having driver after driver after driver after drive babbling on and on and on and wouldn't shut the fuck up.
cash_longfellow
Gold Member
Yep, and it’s not just video games, it started with music getting dumbed down, then movies, and now video games.
sachos
Member
Haha its funny but it seems to be bugged no?
skyfall
Member
No. He is told and does it earlier in the playthrough
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ResurrectedContrarian
Suffers with mild autism
The thing about Navi is that she might be annoying in a few parts, particularly the beginning, but later the game gives you plenty of massive dungeons filled with complex intertwined puzzles, and Navi barely says a word through some of those. So there is plenty of challenge and faith in the player, just not at the very beginning.
fart town usa
Gold Member
I think it worked well in Ghostwire: Tokyo. Honestly can't remember if the guy possessing you pointed out solutions but the banter was nice considering you're literally the only person in Tokyo, lol
But yea, I hate when games solve puzzles for you. It can completely ruin the game.
But yea, I hate when games solve puzzles for you. It can completely ruin the game.
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AngelMuffin
Member
Hey, listen!!!
Handel
Member
Ambient dialogue in Dragon Age isn't spoiling puzzles or scenery, it's character relationship building between your party members. GotG are a proper crew/team, and it's much more organically worked into their banter that they talk about how to progress though I never felt that game was insulting my intelligence with hints like in GoW:R. Banter as a whole is not the problem, the problem is the bad execution in some recent AAA titles.
It depends on the execution, In GOW beside the puzzles, The interaction between the trio is fun and has its own great moments, But in Horizon FW ooh my god what they have done to Aloy characteristics made her horrible and intolerable.
These days I am play Chorus, the intractions between the main character and the AI of the plane is fun, entertaining and hilarious. Without it the game will be boring and not fun at all !
These days I am play Chorus, the intractions between the main character and the AI of the plane is fun, entertaining and hilarious. Without it the game will be boring and not fun at all !
Interfectum
Member
Atreus made me want to slap your mom too.
Drizzlehell
Banned
One of the reasons why I grew so tired of modern mainstream video games and why I started to skip on so many of them. These insipid, vaguely action adventure games that are primarily driven by their forgettable plots, where you spend most of the time either watching a cinematic or slowly walking and listening to more plot.
I genuinely struggle to think about something that would stand out about God of War Ragnarok's gameplay. 3 months after finishing that game and all I can remember is that I was mashing buttons in between the story beats. The gameplay feels so milquetoast and indistinct in most games like this, and there's barely anything about them that would make me go "oh yeah, it's that game where you could do this awesome thing". Usually it's the "game about this story or character".
This "cinematic" bullshit was cool when they first started doing it back in the PS3/360 days but the novelty of it has worn off considerably. Right now I just want something that will be a video game, first and foremost. I want to see new and interesting gameplay innovations, with maybe some kind of a plot in the background for context and nothing else. Not the other way around.
I genuinely struggle to think about something that would stand out about God of War Ragnarok's gameplay. 3 months after finishing that game and all I can remember is that I was mashing buttons in between the story beats. The gameplay feels so milquetoast and indistinct in most games like this, and there's barely anything about them that would make me go "oh yeah, it's that game where you could do this awesome thing". Usually it's the "game about this story or character".
This "cinematic" bullshit was cool when they first started doing it back in the PS3/360 days but the novelty of it has worn off considerably. Right now I just want something that will be a video game, first and foremost. I want to see new and interesting gameplay innovations, with maybe some kind of a plot in the background for context and nothing else. Not the other way around.
maybe it's not really a puzzle. why would the developers create a puzzle and then solve it for you? that's a lot of development time wasted
ComputerBlue
Member
I just started playing Horizon Forbidden West, I’m a few hours in and it reminded me of this thread so I had to search for it. Aloy does not shut the fuck up, if you have to figure something out, she says it before you even have a moment to examine the area, take down an enemy, she’ll blurt out the best strategy to do it, just shuuut the fuck up already bitch.
It’s killing my enjoyment and I’m about to give up on this game because of it, it is insufferable.
It’s killing my enjoyment and I’m about to give up on this game because of it, it is insufferable.
ShadyAcshuns
Member
Games have gotten easier each generation since inception. Nothing changes. War, war never changes.
Roni
Gold Member
No, just the audience is being stretched to include the most amount of non-gamers possible.
Magic Carpet
Member
Currently playing through Atomic Heart. There is a lot of talking plot between your character and Charles the Glove. But He doesn’t solve the puzzles for you. It’s not too bad if your trying to do all the areas but I suspect if you were to mainline only the main story it would get irritating.
Drizzlehell
Banned
Sure, that's why most of them take like 80 hours to complete.
