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[Scopa]

He has a background in reee++

You cheeky devil.

You made me spit my beer.

 

[Lanrutcon]

He has a background in reee++

You son of a bitch. I was going to try for post of the year, but now there's no point.

 

[plushyp]

"FaCtUaLlY CoRrEcT"

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

Considering Jason Schreier, just this last month (and I'm sure he has more gems betraying his expertise in gaming in his body of "work"):

• defended another article by Klepek where the latter argued with Regis Fils-Aime that Super Smash Bros Ultimate is an "enhanced port of the Wii U game with new stuff"
• engaged in impressive mental gymnastics about Diablo Immortal, a mobile game by a Chinese company who did already Diablo clones and the game itself was a reskin of one of these clones by the same Chinese company, and an unfinished one at that betraying its roots as a non-Diablo game, to claim that no, that game is a totally new thing and that the similarities are just inspiration

I don't know... something tells me the double-think is too unstable here to be remotely believable, let alone enforceable on the readership one "stupid fandom" call-out stealth PR article at a time. Jason can manage it because he doesn't have to worry about trifling matters such as intellectual integrity and moral consistency, but I am too inadequate for that intelligent, educated course of action.

 

[Grimmrobe]

Developer Defense Force

DDF

 

[Airbus Jr]

Bethesda should've use Unreal Engine 4

Unreal Engine 4 is the goat

 

[TheShadowLord]

Yep, and it shows. CoD as multi billion dollar franchise, one of the biggest in the industry, should get a new engine long time ago.

For all of its flaws, CoD WII, looks pretty good and they have been using that same engine since CoD 2

 

[Ballthyrm]

There is nothing wrong with using the same engine as long as they keep improving it.
The problem comes when they stop developpement and rest on their laurels.

The way i think about it is like a building.
The engine is the Fondation of a house. You can remake the house, add a new extension, repaint the windows.
But if you want to build a skyscrapper, you need to rebuild the fondations.

As long as you are happy making new houses, you shouldn't have any problems.
But if the market changes and everybody wants to live in skysrapper now, you are screwed.

 

[Skyn3t]

That's true. BO4 looks nice too, even the huge Battle Royal map. But I play on Xbox One X, things rather aren't as pretty on base Xbox and PS4.

 

[Von Hugh]

For all of its flaws, CoD WII, looks pretty good and they have been using that same engine since CoD 2

That just tells that the engine itself has been good. If the basis of an engine is crap, such as Gamebryo, you can't probably really improve upon its fundamentals that easily. That is the reason same damn bugs and flaws are kept from Morrowind to Oblivion and to Skyrim. Check out some Skyrim speedrunners, for example, they have been exploiting the same glitches since Morrowind. That certainly can't be an issue of incompetence on behalf of Bethesta to fix those bugs, it must be a flaw in the engine itself or what ever component or system there is that provides those bugs. Maybe it's the animation system, maybe it's the collision system, I don't know, but it is still the engine itself no matter what you call the root cause of it.

 

[Ragnaroz]

Maybe he is right. People might be making this a bigger issue than it really is.

In this case, both Jason and the people are right to some extent. Yes, staying on the same engine isn't necessarily a terrible thing, but on the other side, Bethesda's engine has been shown over the years to have a lot of functional faults. So, on one hand, yes, they might be able to finally fix those, but the cynic in me expects to run into the same bugs that were present in every ES and Fallout game so far.

 

[Inviusx]

People who spout nonsense like "just use a new engine" remind me of that old infomercial where the guy needed to just "tweak the graphics on level 2".

I get that Bethesda games are buggy but they are also as ambitious as hell and I'm sure that the Creation engine helps them create these worlds in a relatively efficient manner.

 

[Lanrutcon]

People who spout nonsense like "just use a new engine" remind me of that old infomercial where the guy needed to just "tweak the graphics on level 2".

I get that Bethesda games are buggy but they are also as ambitious as hell and I'm sure that the Creation engine helps them create these worlds in a relatively efficient manner.

Fallout 4 is about as ambitious as a McDonald's cheeseburger. It's the dimestore version of New Vegas. And 76 is 90% reused assets with no story and less content, but with all the same glitches.

It's been...what, seven years? since Bethesda have done anything but Skyrim cash-ins and leeching off the Fallout license.

 

[DonF]

People give shit to CoD for using the same engine, but you can tell they are constantly working on it, improving the tech, adding features and such. Every year CoD at least works, with close to steady 60 fps and no major bugs.

Bethesda games use the same engine, have the same flaws and even add more bugs and fatal errors (I've read that F76 hangs and Blue screens like crazy on pc and ps4)

Thats the big difference.

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

An engine isn't an engine. If you've been paying attention to the past 30 years, they aren't building these things from the ground up.

I'm not Jason Shreier although I find it interesting that you latched onto my extreme statement and it was offensive to you. Were you part of /r/incels? How about the Donald?

Are you indeed a glue eating mouth breather that breathes profusely through the mouth while typing with two fingers?

Let's find out.

You're already upset about what I said and I see that you're rocking an anime esque profile pic, so you're checking a lot of boxes considering.
It would be absolutely delicious if you called me a cuck or an NPC.

So here I was going to respond to you but I see you've been banned.

Wasn't gonna call you a cuck or NPC but I was gonna say talking with you is not worthwhile if you're gonna accuse me of being part of /r/incels or the Donald.

 

[JimmyRustler]

People who spout nonsense like "just use a new engine" remind me of that old infomercial where the guy needed to just "tweak the graphics on level 2".

I get that Bethesda games are buggy but they are also as ambitious as hell and I'm sure that the Creation engine helps them create these worlds in a relatively efficient manner.

Yeah, I agree with this. I always thought that an engine switch wasn't a big deal but after reading Masters of Doom and learning of just how only engine tweaks fucked up Romero's play for Daikatana I can understand Bethesda sticking to optimizing Gamebyro instead of using a new engine.

 

[Inviusx]

Fallout 4 is about as ambitious as a McDonald's cheeseburger. It's the dimestore version of New Vegas. And 76 is 90% reused assets with no story and less content, but with all the same glitches.

It's been...what, seven years? since Bethesda have done anything but Skyrim cash-ins and leeching off the Fallout license.

Well it sounds like your issues are with the games themselves rather than the engine.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Well it sounds like your issues are with the games themselves rather than the engine.

Do bethesda used the same creation engine for every game?

Doom and Doom Eternal look different and much prettier than Fallout and Elder Scroll

 

[Inviusx]

Do bethesda used the same creation engine for every game?

Doom and Doom Eternal look different and much prettier than Fallout and Elder Scroll

Bethesda have been using the Creation engine since Skyrim. The used Gamebryo prior to that for Morrowind/Oblivion. Creation is an upgraded version of Gamebryo.

DOOM/Wolfenstein run on idtech which is id's in house tech. Their games are published by Bethesda but are a completely seperate company.

 

[#Phonepunk#]

Access journalism at its finest

Where are the crunch horror stories about Bethesda? They must give better leads than Rockstar

 

[Blam]

Kotaku Post

"Blaming Bethesda’s “game engine” is misguided, however, because the word “engine” itself is a misnomer. An engine isn’t a single program or piece of technology—it’s a collection of software and tools that are changing constantly. To say that Starfield and Fallout 76 are using the “same engine” because they might share an editor and other common traits is like saying Indian and Chinese meals are identical because they both feature chicken and rice. "

Ooof, he's really pulling the analogies very thin. He's trying to kiss Bethesda's ass ever since he leaked Fallout 76.

Honestly he has done some good work but man he's being a fucking kiss ass recently and it's disgusting. But it's Kotaku so what could I expect differently

 

[Airbus Jr]

Bethesda have been using the Creation engine since Skyrim. The used Gamebryo prior to that for Morrowind/Oblivion. Creation is an upgraded version of Gamebryo.

DOOM/Wolfenstein run on idtech which is id's in house tech. Their games are published by Bethesda but are a completely seperate company.

Well can Bethesda at least borrow something from them or idtech offer some help on that?

Character movement and animation in the Doom game are so much better compared to anything I see in Fallout 4

 

[JimmyJones]

Isn't Kotaku blacklisted by Bethesda? This is nothing more than an arse kissing exercise.

 

[a multicultural team of v]

Developer Defense Force

DDF

If Bethesda just called on the EDF their games would be bug free.

 

[Revolutionary]

I'm not defending Bethesda, but I'm curious how people feel about RDR2 using their last-gen engine as well, which is an engine that also has clear limitations (bodies disappearing after moving 20 feet, etc.).

I don't know. I feel like Bethesda's engine clearly has its issues, but (like the Rage engine) it's also obvious why they still use it, and why they're likely to continue using it in the future. Especially if they embrace the settlement-building stuff even further.

Edit: oh wait I forgot about performance on consoles. Yeah.. my advice is to not play Bethesda games on consoles lol

 

[Inviusx]

Well can Bethesda at least borrow something from them or idtech offer some help on that?

Character movement and animation in the Doom game are so much better compared to anything I see in Fallout 4

I would love to know if idtech is flexible enough to handle a Bethesda RPG.

 

[Ozrimandias]

I do not care if they use the same engine 1, 2 or 6 generations in a row. What I do care about is that they deliver a satisfying gaming experience and Bethesda has not succeeded in this. The game experience in New Vegas, Skyrim and apparently Fallout 76 in almost all versions, is mediocre and full of flaws at least. It's time for Bethesda to figure this out and take notice of its fans.....

Like, Sony founded a new studio for Kojima in Japan, a studio with it's only purpose (as far as I know) to help Kojima with the Decima Engine.

Oh god no.....

not happy with destroying the finances of konami now looking for the same with Sony. Get rid of him.

 

[Agent_4Seven]

Would you kindly STFU and GTFO, Jason? The actual skeleton on which all of their games are based is this goddamn abomination called Gamebryo (formerly NetImmerse) which is almost 20 (!!!!) years old for crying out loud, even though the visual appeal of new games are changing (but still shit compared to what UE4 or CryEngine can do). Also, their goddamn outdated as fuck and lazy development process - "Fuck it, moders will fix everything and people will buy our games anyway, so why bother? Ye-e-e-e-a-a-a-ah! Fuck it, let's drink some beer!" is ruining their games for me (even though I liked Fallout games before Fallout 4) and that is such a problem for me that after Fallout 4 I won't be buying any Bethesda developed games using this god awful engine from now on cuz I'm sick of it and all they are doing with this shit of an engine (or rather not doing and don't give a fuck).

Fuckin' why do we have to install mods on PC to actually feel like we're playin' a proper PC version for which we've payed 60 bucks and without breaking our goddamn fingers and loosing a shit ton of time and nerves (which you can't get back) just trying to do anything and navigate through god awful console menus with the fuckin' keyboard keys!?!!!!

 

[Aintitcool]

Maybe he should defend his readers as a so called game journalist. Disgusting guy, disgusting website. If I ever browse Kotaku again, may the Lord strike me with thunder from heaven. Amen.

Goddmb @Horns, it's like you read in my mind. Some serious MGS Psycho Mantis shit going on here

Remember when Patrick Klepic worked there, good times, but the guy sold it for polygon which is so aweful.

 

[Plague Doctor]

I dunno about their site but we’re kept in the dark about ad stuff. It’s never something I take into account anyways and I don’t have a clue what will run on the site and certainly not YT. I think that’s the best way to do it - the ad team does their thing separately. It’s not like we could realistically post a positive assessment of FO76’s performance, after all. It’s in a bad state at the moment.

Thanks for the insight on how DF operates. Your YT is purely factual and provides video examples of your findings and I respect that greatly. You definitely provide a great service to the consumers when it comes to the tech performance of respective games and hardware.

 

[mckmas8808]

He is right, engines aren't a static thing either. They evolve and developers often use heavily modified engines of older engines.

Like I remember the spectacle when it was announced that Titanfall (and later Titanfall 2) were gonna use the Source engine. Of course people were outraged that Respawn would use such an old engine. Thing is, it was a heavily modified engine of the Source engine.

I don't think the majority of gamers knows much about game engines and how they work, neither do I.

Most here don't care about how games are really made though, if it gets in the way of riping another #SJW gaming journalist apart.

 

[DeliciousDoc]

Maybe modders can make a new engine for Bethesda. What do their coders do all day if they can't even implement community patches?

Sincr fallout 76 is online modders won't be able to save them this time which is why they announced it would be buggy.

 

[BANGS]

Most "gamers" complaining about "whaa whaa same engine!" have absolutely no fucking clue how a game engine even works, not to mention how it will effect the game. These bandwagoning filthy casuals are such a dumb lot. The NPCs of this hobby if you will...

 

[Lanrutcon]

Well it sounds like your issues are with the games themselves rather than the engine.

I didn't voice my issues, I just responded to you claiming Bethesda still made ambitious games.

 

[Ailike]

I enjoyed how my first page tried to to remain civil, with a couple people saying to discuss the actual topic, and it seemed like it would remain that way, but eventually, the ever so classy hur hur shill stuff took over. Glad to see there are in fact so many engine experts here. Can't wait to see to gaf developed game AAA game that will break all the records.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

So either Bethesda is too incapable/incompetent/lazy to fix what people have been asking for the past 16 years or the users are right and they truly need a new engine yet they're too cheap and too complacent to do so knowing that the disparity between their tech and their competitors is only going to grow exponentially.

It's one or the other and neither narrative looks particularly great for Bethesda.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Speaking of shills...

I enjoyed how my first page tried to to remain civil, with a couple people saying to discuss the actual topic, and it seemed like it would remain that way, but eventually, the ever so classy hur hur shill stuff took over. Glad to see there are in fact so many engine experts here. Can't wait to see to gaf developed game AAA game that will break all the records.

"Hurr hurr if you can't make a game then shut up about any flaws with them".

 

[andreutas]

Midtown Madness from 1999 and Red Dead Redemption 2 from 2018 is technically using the same engine, Rage.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

Most "gamers" complaining about "whaa whaa same engine!" have absolutely no fucking clue how a game engine even works, not to mention how it will effect the game. These bandwagoning filthy casuals are such a dumb lot. The NPCs of this hobby if you will...

You're right, most people don't know what they're talking about but they're bandwagoning off the general sentiment among modders and people who actually do know what they're talking about so I don't see the problem. Until Jason can explain why the same technical issues and lack of basic, expected functionality from a 2002 game are still issues in their 2015/2018 games, he can fuck off with his condescending article about tech I'm pretty sure he has no experience with on a professional or hobbyist level.

The latter can probably be attributed to the fact that every multiplatform release has been a terrible, barebones Xbox port and they've received a frankly unwarranted reputation on PC due to the work of modders but it does make me wonder if internally they truly can't implement the features we expect, optimize to the performance level we expect and design their games to the scale we expect out of them.

 

[Zewp]

Most "gamers" complaining about "whaa whaa same engine!" have absolutely no fucking clue how a game engine even works, not to mention how it will effect the game. These bandwagoning filthy casuals are such a dumb lot. The NPCs of this hobby if you will...

LOL at calling people" bandwagoning filthy casuals" for wanting an engine that can produce more than filthy casual games.

Bethesda "RPGs" set the standard for filthy casual RPGs and the garbage engine shares in the blame. Even modders are saying the engine needs to go.

 

[HaveButOneLife]

Probably one of the rare instances where I will agree with this hack.

Without Creation, we won't be able to mod their games to the point where we can now, and I don't have many complaints about Fallout 4/76 or ESO graphics-wise. But can we please stop with the notion that it NEEDS a new game engine to get rid of its most glaring issues?

 

[BANGS]

You're right, most people don't know what they're talking about but they're bandwagoning off the general sentiment among modders and people who actually do know what they're talking about so I don't see the problem. Until Jason can explain why the same issues from a 2002 game are still issues in their 2015/2018 games, he can fuck off with his condescending article about tech I'm pretty sure he has no experience with on a professional or hobbyist level.

The issues are there for a variety of reasons, not for simply "same engine duuuuurrr!". Mostly because Bethesda has become a shell of it's former self and puts less and less effort into each game they make, knowing modders will just fix it(with the same engine, mind you, modders still fix the problems)...

LOL at calling people" bandwagoning filthy casuals" for wanting an engine that can produce more than filthy casual games.

Bethesda "RPGs" set the standard for filthy casual RPGs and the garbage engine shares in the blame. Even modders are saying the engine needs to go.

The engine is the reason modders have such an easy time fixing the games and making them better. And yes, Bethesda has been casualizing the shit out of their games over the years, hence why their fans are such filthy casuals...

 

[Agent_4Seven]

Now that is pretty much sum it all up. Fuckin' quit makin' games, Bethesda, for the love of god.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

Probably one of the rare instances where I will agree with this hack.

Without Creation, we won't be able to mod their games to the point where we can now, and I don't have many complaints about Fallout 4/76 or ESO graphics-wise. But can we please stop with the notion that it NEEDS a new game engine to get rid of its most glaring issues?

Are they incompetent/incapable/too lazy/too complacent/too cheap to fix the issues that have been around since Morrowind or are the fans right that the engine is fundamentally flawed and requires a damn near rewrite/overhaul of the underlying foundation? Because it's one or the other and neither depict the situation in a positive light for their previous behavior, their constant PR spins on the subject at the expense of their users and future output.

They have literal tech wizards working under the Zenimax conglomerate, they're also the premiere, most profitable studio for the entire brand. I find it very difficult to believe that they couldn't fix the engine if they wanted to or even commission an engine that has similar functionality with the help of id Software or hell, even the guys at Avalanche who are a work for hire independent studio and I'm sure would gladly take the paycheck.

 

[BANGS]

Are they incompetent/incapable/too lazy/too complacent/too cheap to fix the issues that have been around since Morrowind or are the fans right that the engine is fundamentally flawed and requires a damn near rewrite/overhaul of the underlying foundation?

How could modders say the foundation needs an overhaul when modders can fix all the problems of each game in engine? Sounds like people are just bitching because they're all a bunch of basic bitches...

 

[Xenon]

I get why they use it, but why would anyone actually go out of their way to defend it. With all the time they have with ES:VI I hope they build a new engine around the game vs the other way around. I have to imagine that patching that shit for this many years has resulted in some major inefficiencies in all the separate tools they are using.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

How could modders say the foundation needs an overhaul when modders can fix all the problems of each game in engine? Sounds like people are just bitching because they're all a bunch of basic bitches...

They don't "fix" all the problems each game has. It's a bandage over a gunshot wound.

The only time the community has "fixed all the problems of each game in engine" is when they've literally replaced the engine (http://openmw.org / Daggerfall Unity)

 

[BANGS]

They don't "fix" all the problems each game has. It's a bandage over a gunshot wound.

The only time "modders" have "fixed all the problems of each game in engine" is when they've literally replaced the engine (http://openmw.org / Daggerfall Unity)

Yeah see, that just sounds like whining. If you still don't find the game perfectly playable after installing all kinds of mods which do indeed improve the gameplay and stability, then you're just crying for no reason and should play a different game. The engine isn't the problem, its how you use the engine and the improvements to it over time that make all the difference in each individual game. The engine improves pretty much with every game, granted not as much as it should, but now we're just beating up Bethesda, not their use of the "same engine!"

 

[Shmunter]

I loved Telltales non game engine, engine. And then they engined on outa here.

 

[manfestival]

For all of its flaws, CoD WII, looks pretty good and they have been using that same engine since CoD 2

It's the quake engine and they have been using it since CoD 1 FYI