• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

LTTP: FFVIIR | Not a fan

Meicyn

Gold Member
It's objectively far more common in the dub, That's just verifiable. I'd say in jp, its no more common that it is in Ippo.
And again the dub delivers what are literally just natural breaths that you don't even notice as actual stilted grunts. The japanese is just a totally average dub that's for the very least on par with XIV.


So again, not something I'd fault Nomura for.
Nah, there’s a lot more awkwardness in 7 Remake than Ippo. And I’m talking strictly JP voiceovers as Ippo’s dub is hot trash. Even if I did agree with you on how common it is, it doesn’t help that the two products have a very different… tone which further emphasizes the awkwardness. Hajime no Ippo has heart, but never takes itself too seriously. FF7 Remake on the other hand, does try to stay serious quite a lot. Mind you, I don’t mind moments of levity. The whole Cloud crossdressing dance number is an example of Nomura at his best, a fun sequence with incredible production value. It leans in hard and so it’s just flat out a great time. Wall Market was modernized extremely well in Remake and probably my favorite segment of the game. But then there is stuff like the sector 7 plate crashing down in what is supposed to be a horrifying moment, and the camera pans out to Cait freakin’ Sith looking down at the destruction below. Just… why? This is the moment you chose to reveal your cartoon cat character?

Tetsuya Nomura reminds me a lot of George Lucas, has some incredible ideas and there’s just so much cool shit he comes up with. And then there’s all the other stuff and it’s like dude... Someone needs to tell him no once in awhile.


bad voice acting
Never said this, or meant to infer this. At all.

I actively play Final Fantasy XIV, and it is another showcase of how writing and direction can make all the difference. I am not even talking about the jump from 1.0 to 2.0. A Realm Reborn is full of awkward moments, and it hits peak weird at the end of the core game where your character and their friends appear in front of the mothercrystal and everyone screams “aaaaaaaaaaaahhhh” and charges mister bad person. It’s terrible in Japanese, it’s extra terrible in English. It’s just not a good way to end the game.

The team made huge strides to change the tone of the game once they realized they had a true success on their hands. The writing got soooo much better. Cutscene direction significantly improved. The quality between A Realm Reborn and well, everything that came with Heavensward and after is monstrous. There are A Realm Reborn apologists out there, and I’m sure there is someone who’s all “here’s why the aaaaaaaahh scene is good, actually” somewhere.

The laughing scene is a bad scene. Just like the scene with Anakin and Padme in Episode 2. No amount of “it’s bad and awkward on PURPOSE” handwaving will change that. I’m not stupid, we watched the same cutscene. I played the game on my PS2 when it came out. It’s bad in context. I understand what they were going for with the scene, but it wasn’t constructed well.

Young people in love say some dumb things all the time and plenty of media have executed it well, in game and otherwise. I brought up Star Wars Episode 2 because it is another example of budding romance with awkwardness implemented poorly.


He wanted to be a cool kid and shit on FF like the rest of em, pay him no mind
Living vicariously through a FF8 character is really weird, dude.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
Awkward grunting and sighing isn’t universal in anime or Japanese games or even Final Fantasy games. What a stupid take.
Yea that ship won't fly. You were specifically talking about anime and "weebs" in general.

Never said this, or meant to infer this. At all.
You mentioned this example specifically because it's notorious. It's notorious because it is frequently cited as an example of supposedly bad voice acting. It's not notorious for anything else.
The laughing scene is a bad scene. Just like the scene with Anakin and Padme in Episode 2. No amount of “it’s bad and awkward on PURPOSE” handwaving will change that. I’m not stupid, we watched the same cutscene. I played the game on my PS2 when it came out. It’s bad in context. I understand what they were going for with the scene, but it wasn’t constructed well.

Young people in love say some dumb things all the time and plenty of media have executed it well, in game and otherwise. I brought up Star Wars Episode 2 because it is another example of budding romance with awkwardness implemented poorly.
This is just a whole bunch of nothing. "it's bad but I won't make any attempt to explain why I think it's bad"
 
Last edited:

Meicyn

Gold Member
Yea that ship won't fly. You were specifically talking about anime and "weebs" in general.


You mentioned this example specifically because it's notorious. It's notorious because it is frequently cited as an example of supposedly bad voice acting. It's not notorious for anything else.

This is just a whole bunch of nothing. "it's bad but I won't make any attempt to explain why I think it's bad"
This is just a whole bunch of nothing. “it’s good but I won’t make any attempt to explain why I think it’s good”
 

Filben

Member
Why is there a ridiculous squatting minigame ? Are they supposed to be hilarious? I've played 7 Yakuza games and never once seen something as dumb as this.
Yeah, this and, while not a minigame, that awkward high five thing Cloud and Aerith tried to do for like five times? The whole rescue Tifa thing from that needy, creepy fat fuck who wants some pussy?

I like ridiculous things if a) it's funny and b) suits the tone of the game. Neither applies to FFVIIR.

It's super serious at times and so melodramatic at others and then they go full ridiculousness and back again. This really puts me off.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
This is just a whole bunch of nothing. “it’s good but I won’t make any attempt to explain why I think it’s good”
I've posted a video on this scene in particular that explains both the context of the scene and why it works.
 

Meicyn

Gold Member
I've posted a video on this scene in particular that explains both the context of the scene and why it works.
Fair enough. But the context isn’t the problem. The core issue isn’t what it’s trying to convey. The problem is the distraction created by the scene itself.

Imagine being on a videogame forum and having someone tell you that you need to explain why this:


…is a bad scene.

I mean.

Why is this a bad scene?


I /really/ have to break things down?

Was there no other way to convey Yuna’s concern for Tidus’ wellbeing? There’s no other way to convey that Yuna wants her journey to be happy and fun? There’s no other way to convey that she’s faking it all? There’s no other way for Yuna to try and get Tidus out of his depression?

The repeated laughing and the way the scene is constructed is a distraction to the intent of the scene itself and the story it is trying to tell. The way the majority of the game’s audience has reacted to it says it all. The implication that we’re all just a bunch of idiots that don’t understand the scene is ridiculous. I can understand the intent behind a message, scene, or whatever else and still state that the way it’s told is poor.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
Fair enough. But the context isn’t the problem. The core issue isn’t what it’s trying to convey. The problem is the distraction created by the scene itself.

Imagine being on a videogame forum and having someone tell you that you need to explain why this:



…is a bad scene.

I mean.
That's typically how discussions on a message board works. You share an opinion on a subject and then you explain why you think that way so that a discussion can be had.
Why is this a bad scene?
Why the heck do you keep bringing up a Star Wars scene? What the heck does a completely unrelated scene from a completely unrelated movie in a completely different media format have to do with the laughing scene in a video game from 2002?
I /really/ have to break things down?
Yes.
Was there no other way to convey Yuna’s concern for Tidus’ wellbeing? There’s no other way to convey that Yuna wants her journey to be happy and fun? There’s no other way to convey that she’s faking it all? There’s no other way for Yuna to try and get Tidus out of his depression?
This is not saying anything. "Was there no other way?" Ofcourse there's another way. It's a creative medium, there are lots of ways to convey emotion, intention, or to progress character development. You're not at all answering the question why it HAS to be a in a different way and why this way is "So bad".
The repeated laughing and the way the scene is constructed is a distraction to the intent of the scene itself and the story it is trying to tell.
How so?
The way the majority of the game’s audience has reacted to it says it all.
You have no way to measure what the reaction was of the majority of the game's audience.
The implication that we’re all just a bunch of idiots that don’t understand the scene is ridiculous.
With all due respect, so far you're not doing a very good job of proving that this isn't the case. We're now 2 pages into this discussion and you've yet to describe what about the scene is so bad.
 

Graciaus

Member
Pick up the PC version for $6 and install the 7th Heaven mod manager. Tons of graphical mods and even difficulty rebalances.

Complete package, cheaper and better than what you played.
 

Meicyn

Gold Member
That's typically how discussions on a message board works. You share an opinion on a subject and then you explain why you think that way so that a discussion can be had.

Why the heck do you keep bringing up a Star Wars scene? What the heck does a completely unrelated scene from a completely unrelated movie in a completely different media format have to do with the laughing scene in a video game from 2002?

Yes.

This is not saying anything. "Was there no other way?" Ofcourse there's another way. It's a creative medium, there are lots of ways to convey emotion, intention, or to progress character development. You're not at all answering the question why it HAS to be a in a different way and why this way is "So bad".

How so?

You have no way to measure what the reaction was of the majority of the game's audience.

With all due respect, so far you're not doing a very good job of proving that this isn't the case. We're now 2 pages into this discussion and you've yet to describe what about the scene is so bad.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
So that's it? Your whole point is based on a description of a TV trope?

The trope doesn't even apply here because the scene isn't meant to be all that serious. The serious part happens in the scene BEFORE that. It's this one. The laughing scene in question comes right after that and it's intended to lighten up the mood.

It's pretty apparent that you do, in fact, not understand the scene.
 
Last edited:

Meicyn

Gold Member
So that's it? Your whole point is based on a description of a TV trope?

The trope doesn't even apply here because the scene isn't meant to be all that serious. The serious part happens in the scene BEFORE that. It's this one. The laughing scene in question comes right after that and it's intended to lighten up the mood.

It's pretty apparent that you do, in fact, not understand the scene.
Apparently you don’t understand the scene either. It is a moment to lighten the mood for Tidus, but it IS a serious moment with critical character development for two teenagers up shit creek, with one of them not knowing how to deal with their circumstances.

And yet, it is mechanically terrible. It is Star Wars prequel levels of bad. Author intent and context doesn’t matter when the audience receives it poorly. I mean, I get it. There’s a whole contingent who is hell bent on convincing the rest of the internet that the Star Wars prequels were good, actually. It’s cool. Cheers. I’ll derail the thread no further.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
Apparently you don’t understand the scene either. It is a moment to lighten the mood for Tidus, but it IS a serious moment with critical character development for two teenagers up shit creek, with one of them not knowing how to deal with their circumstances.
It is a moment to lighten up the mood for the player, which is exactly why the camera pans towards the remaining cast as they gaze upon the awkward and odd situation and why the scene ends with normal laughter and a joke from Yuna. It's palate cleanser after the serious revelation scene which comes right before that.
And yet, it is mechanically terrible. It is Star Wars prequel levels of bad. Author intent and context doesn’t matter when the audience receives it poorly. I mean, I get it. There’s a whole contingent who is hell bent on convincing the rest of the internet that the Star Wars prequels were good, actually. It’s cool. Cheers. I’ll derail the thread no further.
I think this is the core of the issue. You're so desperate to try to link this scene to a Star Wars scene despite them having nothing in common that you'll grasp at any straw to make the comparison work. Neither Star Wars not the scene in question have any relevance to the discussion. There is no sign of an audience "receiving it poorly" outside of people who are incapable of understanding very simplistic scenes, as you have demonstrated several times already.
 
Last edited:

RoboFu

One of the green rats
If you don’t like the combat then play it on easy. Going through it now on pc I choose easy because I’ve already beat it on ps4 but to my surprise the game is much much better on easy. Easy makes the horrible stagger system bearable so you don’t spend hours just chipping away at staggering enemies.
 

Go_Ly_Dow

Member
do you think there is room for improvement? what are some criticisms you have for the game?

Of course.

1. Poor sidequests
2. Too much bloat towards the middle-end part of the game
3. Graphical inconsistencies (fixed with intergrade/PS5)
4. The latter part of the Shinra building, toning down of the gore and the underground segment was a bit tedious in places
5. Map design in certain parts
 

Swift_Star

Member
When they say they don’t like anime, what they really mean is they hate awkward, stilted dialogue, padded further by incessant, unnecessary gasping and grunting.



Final Fantasy XIV is weeb as fuck, and I love it. Take for example, this:


In the first two minutes, you hear one single grunt. Just one. If Nomura were directing, there would have been at least ten, minimum.

The iconic opening train scene for FF7 Remake has 20+ gasps and grunts. It’s so awkward, and it really doesn’t need to be. Why does Barret’s first line in the game need to be a verbal “hhnnnnn” as he nods to Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge? Why can’t he just nod like a normal person would? Why does every character need to vocalize even the slightest movement in cutscenes?

Sometimes, less is more.
That’s what anime sounds like. If you don’t like that, you won’t like JRPGs. It’s just how this media is.
 

Swift_Star

Member
Priceless the haters want the media tropes to change because they dont like it and act like everyone should hate it.
Well, unfortunately for you, the fans like this and they don’t care if you dont.
You’re not special, go play something else and stop being annoying. Nobody cares.
 
That’s what anime sounds like. If you don’t like that, you won’t like JRPGs. It’s just how this media is.
Oh bullshit. FF XIV doesn’t sound like that. FF XII doesn’t sound like that. FF XVI probably won’t sound like that either.

Sorry buddy. If you want to defend it, you’re gonna have to come up with something better than “this is just what anime and JRPGs sound like, if you don’t like it then you don’t like JRPGs”. Really dumb take.
 

Swift_Star

Member
Oh bullshit. FF XIV doesn’t sound like that. FF XII doesn’t sound like that. FF XVI probably won’t sound like that either.

Sorry buddy. If you want to defend it, you’re gonna have to come up with something better than “this is just what anime and JRPGs sound like, if you don’t like it then you don’t like JRPGs”. Really dumb take.
But it is, your loss that you’ll get angry and annoyed every time you play these games.
It’s entirely a you problem and I don’t give two shits about you and anyone else that don’t like it.
You either deal with it or don’t play it.
They’re not changing because you don’t like it.
 
But it is, your loss that you’ll get angry and annoyed every time you play these games.
It’s entirely a you problem and I don’t give two shits about you and anyone else that don’t like it.
You either deal with it or don’t play it.
They’re not changing because you don’t like it.
Lol okay. You’re the one lying and making ridiculous paper thin arguments trying to deflect criticism away from this game. Maybe you shouldn’t come into a thread called “FFVIIR | Not a Fan” and lie to us saying “this is just what anime and JRPGS sound like” if you really “don’t care” so much about what others think.
 

Rykan

Gold Member
Yes, Rykan-sama, it’s those feeble-minded gaijin dudebros who can’t wrap their tiny brains around complex anime storytelling like FFX. That must be it. Please forgive their ignorance, they’ll never truly appreciate Japanese culture like you do.
It has nothing to do with cultural ignorance nor is the storytelling complex. It's just straight up baffling how you somehow manage to interpret a scene that is clearly about someone coping with the knowledge that he is stuck in a hopeless situation after just learning what happened to his father as "Hes trying to make a fool out of himself in public to impress his girlfriend".

It's mind boggling.
 
Last edited:

squallheart

Member
Good god... and FFVX is one of the worst games I finished in ps4 generation ... absolutely hated that game as a FF fan ... didnt have the heart to play 7R after that ... Im done with FF/square ... happy for the players that still enjoy their FF games, they are not for me anymore
This. I hated this final fantasy 7 kingdom hearts Edition. Don't get me wrong it's beautiful but that's all it has going for it and I found myself missing the random battle encounters. When it comes to 15 I hated that game as well granted I played it and finished it on launch and haven't gone back and it felt like an unfinished pile of garbage. If they would have delayed it and finished it properly maybe I would of enjoyed it more. With the new final fantasy 16 trailer I'm like meh on it as well. I've actually started playing mass effect andromeda and enjoying that even more than 7 remake xD
 

Calverz

Gold Member
It’s laughably bad and I agree with op on his points. The dialogue is atrocious. Maybe I am judging it harshly as I started it immediately after finishing tlou2. But I tried going back a while ago and it’s just so fucking boring.
 

Lethal01

Member
Nah, there’s a lot more awkwardness in 7 Remake than Ippo. And I’m talking strictly JP voiceovers as Ippo’s dub is hot trash. Even if I did agree with you on how common it is, it doesn’t help that the two products have a very different… tone which further emphasizes the awkwardness. Hajime no Ippo has heart, but never takes itself too seriously. FF7 Remake on the other hand, does try to stay serious quite a lot. Mind you, I don’t mind moments of levity. The whole Cloud crossdressing dance number is an example of Nomura at his best, a fun sequence with incredible production value. It leans in hard and so it’s just flat out a great time. Wall Market was modernized extremely well in Remake and probably my favorite segment of the game. But then there is stuff like the sector 7 plate crashing down in what is supposed to be a horrifying moment, and the camera pans out to Cait freakin’ Sith looking down at the destruction below. Just… why? This is the moment you chose to reveal your cartoon cat character?

Tetsuya Nomura reminds me a lot of George Lucas, has some incredible ideas and there’s just so much cool shit he comes up with. And then there’s all the other stuff and it’s like dude... Someone needs to tell him no once in awhile.

Like I said, it's silly to just Blame Nomura for all this stuff.

If anything it was Nomura who was holding back the George Lucases who wanted to make the game FAR crazier. But somehow Nomura is too blame for things like Sephiroth showing up too much when he was the one most noted for convincing the team to tone that down. Somehow "this ending reeks of Nomura" when he's the one who wanted something more subtle.

Anyway, I will say that outside of a handful of notable moments I thought the game was a perfect blend of serious and cartoony fun even though that random cait sith was indeed terrible.
 
Last edited:

German Hops

Gold Member
 

Lethal01

Member
do you think there is room for improvement? what are some criticisms you have for the game?

All my favorite games are always the one where I see the most need for improvement. I think Tetris is a flawless game but it's also a 6/10 for me.

Improvement comes in 2 flavors though, things I think are flaws~ and things I just think would be great+.

~The game's too easy on normal and doesn't force players to really learn to play leading to people saying it's button mashy.
You can't really interact with the environment, that's not a flaw, but I love the world and want to actually do things with it.
Game should let you use your abilities outside of battle on the environment.
~You should be able to skip the walk and talk sequences when you are replaying the game, same for that arm segment.
~You should be able to give basic, "Go here" and "stay here" commands to team mates.
~The audio mixing is bad at time especially in English.
~The English localization is constantly to inaccurate for no apparent reason.
~Needs better textures, lighting and shaders to be up to my standards, but that goes for every realistic game, would love if they had just went for something super stylized.
Combat could have a few more options even when you have no ATB.
Air combat just looks clunky and ugly, It's fine for Yuffie.
The game should take a page for Kingdom hearts air combat, Air attacks should home in more and swing you character around more, should do more knockback too.
They really should just add a jump button.
Game needs a wide open space where you can just explore and fight stuff, expecting that in part 2.
It ends when I wanna play it forever ^.-
 
Last edited:
Like I said, it's silly to just Blame Nomura for all this stuff.

If anything it was Nomura who was holding back the George Lucases who wanted to make the game FAR crazier. But somehow Nomura is too blame for things like Sephiroth showing up too much when he was the one most noted for convincing the team to tone that down. Somehow "this ending reeks of Nomura" when he's the one who wanted something more subtle.

Anyway, I will say that outside of a handful of notable moments I thought the game was a perfect blend of serious and cartoony fun even though that random cait sith was indeed terrible.
Somehow everything Nomura touches is loaded with cringe anime bullshit. Then the Nomura stans come out and try to shift the blame to everyone and everything except the dude who directed the damn game.

- other writers/producers/devs

- ignorant westerners who can’t understand it

- bad translation

- bad localization

- bad VA/direction

- bad audio engineering

- this is just how all anime and JRPGs are


I don’t buy it. The game is how it is because this is legitimately what Nomura wanted it to be. I blame him.
 
Last edited:

Lethal01

Member
Somehow everything Nomura touches is loaded with cringe anime bullshit. Then the Nomura stans come out and try to shift the blame to everyone and everything except the dude who directed the damn game.

- other writers/producers/devs

- ignorant westerners who can’t understand it

- bad translation

- bad localization

- bad VA/direction

- bad audio engineering

- this is just how all anime and JRPGs are


I don’t buy it. The game is how it is because this is legitimately what Nomura wanted it to be. I blame him.

Those things are indeed more to blame for what you dislike rather than the director who we know only oversaw very general direction.

it's extremely silly to go "Why are you blaming the writers for how this story was written, it's all Nomura's fault, Despite the fact that he was the one dissuading the team from exactly what I'm complaining about."
"Why are you blaming voice actors for how silly this sounds in English, It's Nomura who wrote and direct the English Dialog for sure"

Why would I be a Nomura stan anyway? I don't give him tons of credit for this game. I thought it was great and Congratulate the whole team for that. Nomura is a tiny piece of it.
 

Fbh

Member
I personally really enjoyed the game despite being flawed.

I agree on the linearity, it honestly almost feels like PSP game with how small the areas are (you just get a seamless forced walking loading instead of loading screen), and IMO japanese voices on most JRPG's are a must not only for authenticity but because the simple fact of not understanding the language diminishes the cringe factor of the writing.

Loved the combat though, it's one of the first real time combat systems I've played in a JRPG that still manages to nail the feeling of playing as your entire party, instead of just playing as one character with an AI party. Also loved the bosses which I think did a great job of being fun to fight while offering a lot of visual spectacle, which was specially nice after most bosses in FFXV turned out to be all style over substance.
 
Last edited:

TheInfamousKira

Reseterror Resettler
I'm glad someone did this. Great game but the excessive anime grunting was insufferable at times.

Half of this video is literally jumping. The counter raised when Cloud was doing squats. Squats, bruh. Physical movement and living requires respiration. That's what I mean by overblown. Beginning of chapter four, where they're all talking about seeing Jessie's mom, and the camera pans to each one of them individually and they all go "Mhmm!" "Hmph!" "Mmmm!" -THAT'S excessive and anime. Having someone grunt in a squat off is reaching.

But, as others have brought up with clear, irrefutable evidence delivered in a calm, entirely non-xenophobic way, this is all Nomura's fault. The Japanese dude who was on the original dev team, who was pushed into director spot, who rallied to not have the game go too off the deep end, yes. That evil man. He was responsible for the English voice direction. English VA being like five degrees of separation from overall direction of a Japanese product, but it's totally his onus to bear.

I'm just over here in my Sailor Moon jammies, eating pocky and Ramen while rewatching Code Geass R2 (subs, btw) before I have to shower and head to my kendo training, so DISREGARDU MY RAMBURINGU
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
Half of this video is literally jumping. The counter raised when Cloud was doing squats. Squats, bruh. Physical movement and living requires respiration. That's what I mean by overblown. Beginning of chapter four, where they're all talking about seeing Jessie's mom, and the camera pans to each one of them individually and they all go "Mhmm!" "Hmph!" "Mmmm!" -THAT'S excessive and anime. Having someone grunt in a squat off is reaching.

But, as others have brought up with clear, irrefutable evidence delivered in a calm, entirely non-xenophobic way, this is all Nomura's fault. The Japanese dude who was on the original dev team, who was pushed into director spot, who rallied to not have the game go too off the deep end, yes. That evil man. He was responsible for the English voice direction. English VA being like five degrees of separation from overall direction of a Japanese product, but it's totally his onus to bear.

I'm just over here in my Sailor Moon jammies, eating pocky and Ramen while rewatching Code Geass R2 (subs, btw) before I have to shower and head to my kendo training, so DISREGARDU MY RAMBURINGU

I don't know, there was an absolute shitton of inexplicable grunting and gasping in the very short time I spent with the game. It's there right from the start. If it gets even worse, oh my...
 
I don't know, there was an absolute shitton of inexplicable grunting and gasping in the very short time I spent with the game. It's there right from the start. If it gets even worse, oh my...
Isn’t it funny how this game’s supporters have to lie and gaslight instead of just saying “yeah it’s there but it didn’t bother me like it bothered you”

- “it’s just haters who jumped on the bandwagon months after release”

- “it’s mostly just them making noises when physically exerting themselves”

- “If you don’t like it that means you don’t like any anime or JRPGs”

- “you’re faulting the game for not being American enough”

- “don’t blame Nomura-san, it was rogue western audio engineers who betrayed his vision”
 
Technically it's very impressive, and it has some great style in certain moments, but it's aggressively dumb in its writing. I've played a lot of Japanese games, and this one stood out for how dumb it is.

My biggest gripe though is the combat. You just can not see what the fuck's going on. You never know when an enemy is attacking or what attack is coming, so there's just no flow to the combat at all.

But style and visual flair goes a long way with this game. It's nice to play something that really feels crafted and directed in almost every moment.
 
Last edited:

Neff

Member
Half of this video is literally jumping.

I mean you're not wrong but it's clearly there in the video despite it being overly generous with its definition of a grunt.

Having each character go 'nngh' or 'hhnh' or 'gnnh' in response to *every* *single* development, incident or occurrence is something which has no place in a piece of entertainment shipped to a western audience, because to us it's absolutely ridiculous.

But hey, I still really loved the game and I'm greatly looking forward to part 2.
 

TheInfamousKira

Reseterror Resettler
I mean you're not wrong but it's clearly there in the video despite it being overly generous with its definition of a grunt.

Having each character go 'nngh' or 'hhnh' or 'gnnh' in response to *every* *single* development, incident or occurrence is something which has no place in a piece of entertainment shipped to a western audience, because to us it's absolutely ridiculous.

But hey, I still really loved the game and I'm greatly looking forward to part 2.

I mean, yeah. I've even pointed to an example in game that I thought was egregious. No doubt there's a lot of it, but I maintain a lot of it would be more tolerable if the audio was mixed better. This *is* an issue with the game, make no mistake, I just feel that it ties into a much LARGER issue, which is badly optimized sound design.

And again, for the people that are hung up on Nomura. Game director =/= localization voice director. This is why you generally have better or worse localizations, or bizarre choices made in VO. The localization of Metal Gear Solid, which is pretty universally praised, was the way it was because the man translating the script made an effort to familiarize himself with military terminology and phrase things that directly translated awkwardly into a smoother flowing English line. It's also why there are less than stellar examples like Final Fantasy XIII where Georgia Van Cuylenberg was told to retake lines because she didn't sound sexualized enough. It's standard fare for voiceover work to entail grunting, wincing, moaning, yelling, etc because it's a general rule of thumb that the worst sin in voice work is to have a character, say, fight off five opponents and leap away and sound like they're having a casual conversation at the dinner table. Briana White, who voiced Aerith in Remake, told stories on her stream of how awkward it was when the voice directors told her to grimace or act like she was calling a character from ten yards away while inside of a recording booth. Like it, hate it, whatever. But acting like Nomura was behind the cast with a whip the whole time is silly.
 

AmuroChan

Member
If they had just taken out all the bloat and terrible side quests, I would've enjoyed this game so much more. I understand they needed to justify the $60 price, but the good parts were so good that I would've gladly paid the $60 for a tight 20 hour game minus all the bloat.
 

Lethal01

Member
I mean you're not wrong but it's clearly there in the video despite it being overly generous with its definition of a grunt.

Having each character go 'nngh' or 'hhnh' or 'gnnh' in response to *every* *single* development, incident or occurrence is something which has no place in a piece of entertainment shipped to a western audience, because to us it's absolutely ridiculous.

But hey, I still really loved the game and I'm greatly looking forward to part 2.

I agree, and it's weird that people try to write it off as a "Japanese thing" when they made it twice as frequent and as loud in the English version as opposed to the Japanese version.
 

Lethal01

Member
- “don’t blame Nomura-san, it was rogue western audio engineers who betrayed his vision”

Oh the audio mixing isn't just an issue for the grunting, it's extremely wonky for all the English Audio I was very surprised it didn't get fixed in intergrade.
We can agree that there is more grunting in this game that 14 while also not ignoring that there are very visible issues that make them worse which have nothing to do with Nomura or we might as well blame Yosuke Matsuda too..
 
Last edited:

TheInfamousKira

Reseterror Resettler
Oh the audio mixing isn't just an issue for the grunting, it's extremely wonky for all the English Audio I was very surprised it didn't get fixed in intergrade.
We can agree that there is more grunting in this game that 14 while also not ignoring that there are very visible issues that make them worse which have nothing to do with Nomura..

x 1,000,000

No one has said that they aren't there. I mean, how much of an issue it is lies squarely in the subjective territory, as to some, it's barely noticeable, and to others, it's a huge glaring issue. What's being argued the most here is the fact that Nomura has about as much say in the voice direction of separate regional dubs as he does in the composing of the sound track, or the German boxart, or the length of television promos. Yeah, he's the director of the project, but he's no Kojima. He's not the narrative director/director/producer/executive producer/composer/head of publicity/caterer/bus driver.
 

ClosBSAS

Member
very very overrated game the original...the remake is ok, trying to plough trhough it on PC but damn...that level linearity and shitty sidequest design..jesus
 
Never played the original but it have this weird dancing and cross dressing? The game basically stopped even trying to be serious and went into full ridiculousness. Almost dropped luckily I could just fail this crap.

And I played Ar tonelico qoga.
 
Never played the original but it have this weird dancing and cross dressing? The game basically stopped even trying to be serious and went into full ridiculousness. Almost dropped luckily I could just fail this crap.

And I played Ar tonelico qoga.
It had cross dressing but not a whole song and dance routine.

Everybody was worried Remake would take out all the silliness, instead they went all out. TBH that’s one thing I did like about it.
 
Top Bottom