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Media Create Sales: Week 19, 2016 (May 09 - May 15)

If only there was a game design model where it was possible to get through a game quickly, but there was also lots of optional content for those who wanted more. Maybe even one frequently used with RPGs.
And if only there was a game with that model that sold millions of units in Japan that they could look to for an example of how to do just that. Maybe it could even be called Yo-Kai Watch 2 just for the hell of it.
 

Oregano

Member
Another SO5 interview with Kobayashi, but this time he talks a bit about the game's reception on Japan:



With the sales numbers posted by Chris1964... I think they failed big time in Japan ;(

If only there was a game design model where it was possible to get through a game quickly, but there was also lots of optional content for those who wanted more. Maybe even one frequently used with RPGs.

I think there's also an element of publishers/developers trying to have their cake and eat it too in regards to platform choice as well. Star Ocean is historically a Playstation franchise but it's hard to take the idea that you're trying to attract a large(and younger audience) on the PS4 in Japan at face value. At some point they kind of need to accept that it's at odds with their desire to reach a bigger western audience.
 
If only there was a game design model where it was possible to get through a game quickly, but there was also lots of optional content for those who wanted more. Maybe even one frequently used with RPGs.

Welp. It's even more curious because seven years ago they released a game that had a bunch of problems for sure, but at the same time you could find a lot of side-content plus a main storyline with a bigger scope.

I think it was subtitled "The Last Hope" and its protagonist had an awful name just like mine.
 

Vena

Member
Welp. It's even more curious because seven years ago they released a game that had a bunch of problems for sure, but at the same time you could find a lot of side-content plus a main storyline with a bigger scope.

I think it was subtitled "The Last Hope" and its protagonist had an awful name just like mine.

No such game exists, last SO game had some subtitle about time and the main character was a bunch of fated lines of a god or something.
 

Wagram

Member
Everything about the time spent on the game is bullshit. Witcher 3 sold millions upon millions of copies and it's a 200+ hour game with all content. Star Ocean has a hard time selling because of lack of advertisement along with every other niche JRPG.

I honestly still can't believe developers are still making the same mistakes from 2008. Cater to those who made your franchise successful in the first place, believe in it, and change some things slightly to broaden the appeal. Don't change the entire fucking foundation or else you risk losing it all. Why is it so tough for these Japanese devs to understand?
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Or maybe it's just an unappealing product in 2016. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

When I looked at the first 30 minutes of the game, it looked like a mid-tier PS2 title in terms of game design. It's been a long time since that era.
 

horuhe

Member
Rakuten Books Sales Ranking (2016.05.19)

01./01. [3DS] Kirby: Planet Robobot <ACT> (Nintendo)
02./00. [PS4] Homefront: The Revolution <ACT> (Spike Chunsoft)
03./02. [PS4] Uncharted 4: A Thief's End <ADV> (Sony Computer Entertainment)
04./00. [PSV] Kenka Bancho Otome <ADV> (Spike Chunsoft)
05./08. [WiiU] Splatoon <ACT> (Nintendo)
06./05. [PS3] Jikkyou Powerful Pro Baseball 2016 <SPT> (Konami)
07./11. [3DS] Dragon Quest Monsters: Joker 3 <RPG> (Square Enix)
08./00. [PS4] Doom <ACT> (Bethesda Softworks)
09./03. [3DS] Yo-Kai Sangokushi <SLG> (Level 5)
10./00. [3DS] Boku no Hero Academia: Battle for All <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games)

Rakuten Books Pre-Orders Ranking (2016.05.19)

01./01. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes II <RPG> (Square Enix)
02./02. [3DS] Ace Attorney 6 <ADV> (Capcom)
03./06. [PS4] Overwatch: Origins Edition <ACT> (Square Enix)
04./05. [PSV] Dragon Quest Heroes II <RPG> (Square Enix)
05./04. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II <RPG> (Square Enix)

* Note: Games on the Rakuten Books Rankings are only based on sales at Rakuten Books and does not count games sold by other retailers at Rakuten.
 

Kastrioti

Persecution Complex
Age of the 3DS is slowly coming to an end

The age of everything is coming to an end!

The Japanese market is not what it used to be for consoles and handhelds with how smartphone games have taken a huge portion of the market.

But I think Nintendo will absolutely dominate whatever remains of the traditional console/handheld market with the NX when it launches and the PS4 will do better once heavy hitters like FFXV, Persona V, KH3 are launched along with a price cut.

Microsoft is selling on par with how they've always sold in Japan since the Xbox launched there way back when.

Nintendo getting a Monster Hunter game at, or around, launch for the NX would be absolutely huge for it right out of the gate. Given the success the franchise has had in Japan on Nintendo systems I think it's almost a lock Nintendo+Capcom have something in store.
 

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
01./00. [PS4] Uncharted 4: A Thief's End # <ADV> (Sony Computer Entertainment) {2016.05.10} (¥7.900) - 128.724 / NEW <75,55%>
___

21./11. [3DS] Disney Art Academy <HOB> (Nintendo) {2016.04.07} (¥3.700)
22./29. [3DS] Pokemon Omega Ruby / Alpha Sapphire <RPG> (Pokemon Co.) {2014.11.21} (¥4.571)
23./16. [WIU] Pokken Tournament # <FTG> (Pokemon Co.) {2016.03.18} (¥7.200)
24./19. [3DS] Terraria <ADV> (Spike Chunsoft) {2016.04.21} (¥3.800)
25./38. [PS4] Call of Duty: Black Ops III # <ACT> (Sony Computer Entertainment) {2015.11.06} (¥7.900)
26./22. [WIU] Mario Kart 8 # <RCE> (Nintendo) {2014.05.29} (¥5.700)
27./20. [3DS] Mario Kart 7 <RCE> (Nintendo) {2011.12.01} (¥4.571)
28./00. [PS4] Uncharted: The Nathan Drake Collection <Uncharted: Drake's Fortune \ Uncharted 2: Among Thieves \ Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception> <ADV> (Sony Computer Entertainment) {2015.10.08} (¥6.900)
29./28. [WIU] Super Smash Bros. for Wii U # <FTG> (Nintendo) {2014.12.06} (¥7.200)
30./21. [3DS] Ansatsu Kyoushitsu: Assassin Ikusei Keikaku!! <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games) {2016.03.24} (¥5.700)
31./26. [3DS] Yo-Kai Watch Busters: Red Cat Team / White Dog Squad <ACT> (Level 5) {2015.07.11} (¥4.600)
32./00. [PS4] Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Siege <ACT> (Ubisoft) {2015.12.10} (¥8.400)
33./36. [PSV] Bullet Girls 2 <ACT> (D3Publisher) {2016.04.21} (¥6.800)
34./24. [3DS] Tomodachi Life [Nintendo Selects] <ETC> (Nintendo) {2016.03.17} (¥2.700)
35./44. [3DS] Monster Hunter Generations # <ACT> (Capcom) {2015.11.28} (¥5.800)
36./37. [PS4] Far Cry Primal <ADV> (Ubisoft) {2016.04.07} (¥8.400)
37./31. [3DS] Disney Magic World 2 # <ETC> (Bandai Namco Games) {2015.11.05} (¥5.690)
38./34. [PS4] UEFA EURO 2016: Winning Eleven 2016 <SPT> (Konami) {2016.04.21} (¥3.800)
39./25. [WIU] Star Fox Zero <STG> (Nintendo) {2016.04.21} (¥5.700)
40./35. [3DS] Sumikko Gurashi: Omise Hajimerundesu <ETC> (Nippon Columbia) {2015.11.19} (¥4.800)
41./39. [3DS] Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS <FTG> (Nintendo) {2014.09.13} (¥5.200)
42./46. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes: The World Tree's Woe and the Blight Below [Ultimate Hits] <RPG> (Square Enix) {2016.04.28} (¥3.800)
43./30. [3DS] Animal Crossing: Happy Home Designer # <ETC> (Nintendo) {2015.07.30} (¥4.000)
44./48. [PS3] UEFA EURO 2016: Winning Eleven 2016 <SPT> (Konami) {2016.04.21} (¥3.800)
45./42. [PSV] Rose to Tasogare no Kojou # <ACT> (Nippon Ichi Software) {2016.04.26} (¥3.980)
46./32. [3DS] Rhythm Heaven Megamix <ACT> (Nintendo) {2015.06.11} (¥4.700)
47./43. [3DS] Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon [Nintendo Selects] <ACT> (Nintendo) {2016.03.17} (¥2.700)
48./33. [3DS] Monster Strike <RPG> (Mixi) {2015.12.17} (¥4.500)
49./00. [3DS] Harvest Moon 3D: A New Beginning [Nintendo Selects] <SLG> (Marvelous) {2016.03.17} (¥2.700)
50./00. [PS4] Phantasy Star Online 2 Episode 4: Deluxe Package <RPG> (Sega) {2016.04.20} (¥4.990)

Top 50

3DS - 21
PS4 - 14
WIU - 7
PSV - 5
PS3 - 3

SOFTWARE
Code:
+-------+------------+------------+------------+------------+------------+
|System |  This Week |  Last Week |  Last Year |     YTD    |  Last YTD  |
+-------+------------+------------+------------+------------+------------+
|  ALL  |    347.000 |    480.000 |    235.000 | 10.983.000 | 12.966.000 |
+-------+------------+------------+------------+------------+------------+
 

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
First day sellthough {2016.05.19}

[3DS] My Hero Academia: Battle for All <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games) (¥5.700) - 10%
[PSV] Kenka Bancho Otome <ADV> (Spike Chunsoft) (¥5.980) - 50%
[PS4] Battleborn <ACT> (Take-Two Interactive Japan) (¥7.700) - 30%
[PS4] Homefront: The Revolution <ACT> (Spike Chunsoft) (¥7.980) - 30%
[PS4] Doom <ACT> (Bethesda Softworks) (¥7.980) - 30%
 
First day sellthough {2016.05.19}

[3DS] My Hero Academia: Battle for All <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games) (¥5.700) - 10%
[PSV] Kenka Bancho Otome <ADV> (Spike Chunsoft) (¥5.980) - 50%
[PS4] Battleborn <ACT> (Take-Two Interactive Japan) (¥7.700) - 30%
[PS4] Homefront: The Revolution <ACT> (Spike Chunsoft) (¥7.980) - 30%
[PS4] Doom <ACT> (Bethesda Softworks) (¥7.980) - 30%

la bomba for all of em?
 

Takao

Banned

saichi

Member
Not sure why people have such high expectation for Overwatch in Japan. I don't think it's an attractive game to the market.

Will also sell less than SO5 (on PS4 only)!
 

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
If there are really high expectations for Overwatch in Japan they should lower a lot.

It looks like a <100k LTD game.
 

L~A

Member
Sorry for the double-post, but relevant news.

Dragon Ball Fusions out on August 4th. Getting a New 3DS bundle according to ANN. The scans do shows cover plates.

One Piece: Dai Kaizoku Colosseum confirmed, for the 3DS. No release date or developer mentioned.
 

Takao

Banned
I hope this doesn't discourage BnHA games in the future. If any fighter needed to be arena, it's this one. It just didn't look fun. Not surprised to see it underperformed.

Isn't the anime only going to be 13 episodes? Unless there's a second season and/or the game has legs, I imagine that could be a one and done.

Funny how it always seems like a reactionary move, made out of spite. "Nah, not gonna let you get exclusivity, even if nobody buys XB1 games!".

I don't think it's reactionary. The initial exclusivity reports come from Famitsu articles that are paid for by Sony created in collaboration with Sony.
 

Ryng_tolu

Banned
Rakuten Books Sales Ranking (2016.05.19)

05./08. [WiiU] Splatoon <ACT> (Nintendo)

Ok now, with two new release Splatoon increased by 3 postition, aka if was not for those 2 new release it could have raise by 5 position.

Now, or all games are massively dropping, or what the hell with Splatoon?
 

L~A

Member
^

Massively dropping.

DQH2 is... very far behind DQH. Oof.

451 vs. 123.

Identical, actually.

At 70 days both were at 34 points unless I am missing some SKUs.

Well there's two versions for Puzzle & Dragons, no idea how comgnet tracks them.

Only one for Monster Strike.

***

By the way, with the date for Dragon Ball Fusions now known, here's the Summer line-up for the 3DS (+ Taiko Drum Master and amiibo stuff).

June 16th

[3DS] Taiko Drum Master: Dokodon! Mystery Adventure

June 23rd

[3DS] Bokujou Monogatari 3tsu no Sato no Taisetsuna Tomodachi

June 30th

[3DS] Shovel Knight + Shovel Knight amiibo bundle
[3DS] Zero Time Dilemma
[amiibo] Shovel Knight

July 7th

[3DS] Culdcept Revolt
[amiibo] Callie and Marie
[amiibo] Callie and Marie (Dual-Pack)
[amiibo] Inkling Boy, Inkling Girl, Inkling Squid (alt. colour)

July 16th

[3DS] Yo-kai Watch 3: Sushi / Tempura

July 21st

[3DS] Sumikko Gurashi: Mura o Tsukurundesu

July 28th

[3DS] Puzzle & Dragons X

August 4th

[3DS] Etrian Odyssey V
[3DS] 12-sai ~Koisuru Diary~
[3DS] Dragon Ball Fusions
[3DS] Dragon Ball Fusions + New Nintendo 3DS + cover plates bundle

August 25th

[3DS] Metroid Prime: Federation Force
[3DS] Azure Striker Gunvolt &#8211; Striker Pack (Azure Striker Gunvolt + Azure Striker Gunvolt 2)
 

djtiesto

is beloved, despite what anyone might say
Or maybe it's just an unappealing product in 2016. ¯_(&#12484;)_/¯

When I looked at the first 30 minutes of the game, it looked like a mid-tier PS2 title in terms of game design. It's been a long time since that era.

What looked mid-tier PS2 in terms of game design to you? Smaller areas? No real open world 'feature creep', repetitive quests, DLCs, or multiplayer options or mobile-style hooks? Gameplay looks pretty tight from the videos I've seen, though the fact it's a much smaller and much less epic adventure disappoints me somewhat.

Honest question though, Nirolak... do you like any non-mobile games? :p
 

Vena

Member
Well there's two versions for Puzzle & Dragons, no idea how comgnet tracks them.

Only one for Monster Strike.

Indeed, and I simply added up the reported COMG numbers for the two versions. Its not a 1:1 due to that but its as close as I can provide at the moment. :D
 

L~A

Member
Did we ever get Media Create data for Code Name S.T.E.A.M?

I think I've found out how many units were sold.

This week, Media Create notes that total sales of new games for the Week 19 equivalent in 2015 (May 11-17) were ~25 000 units.

Now, three games came out that week:

01./00. [PS4] Final Fantasy X/X-2 HD Remaster <Final Fantasy X Final Fantasy X-2> <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.05.14} (¥7.344) - 15.913 / NEW
05./00. [PS4] Borderlands: The Handsome Collection <Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel! Borderlands 2> <RPG> (Take-Two Interactive Japan) {2015.05.14} (¥6.804) - 6.922 / NEW

So that gives roughly 2 165 for Code Name STEAM (well obviously it's not 100% accurate since the 25k number from Media Create is rounded). But Famitsu has 1.835 for FW, so that does fit.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
What looked mid-tier PS2 in terms of game design to you? Smaller areas? No real open world 'feature creep', repetitive quests, DLCs, or multiplayer options or mobile-style hooks? Gameplay looks pretty tight from the videos I've seen, though the fact it's a much smaller and much less epic adventure disappoints me somewhat.
I mean, to an extent yes. I'll cover this in a lot more detail soon, but first let me address the other part of the question.

Honest question though, Nirolak... do you like any non-mobile games? :p

So, here's the campaign based games I beat in 2015 and 2016 so far, in approximate order of completion. I've pulled out all mobile games, MMOs, and things like Hearthstone campaigns since I assume none of those count as real games.

I left in a couple of "non-games" like Her Story, and smaller puzzle games like Hexcells, though feel free to discount those if you prefer.

I also excluded games I didn't finish.

Captain Toad
Hexcells
Gauntlet
Metal Gear Rising
Watch_Dogs
Hotline Miami 2
Fire Emblem: Awakening
Hatsune Miku F 2nd
Grant Theft Auto V
Castle In The Darkness
Crypt of the Necrodancer
Terraria 1.3 Update/Expansion
Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate
Battleblock Theater
Metal Gear Solid V
Undertale
TIS-100
Broforce
The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim
Saints Row: The Third
Zelda: Wind Waker HD
Her Story
Hyrule Warriors
Wolfenstein: The New Order
Dr. Langeskov
Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel + DLC
Contraption Maker
Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen
Tales From The Borderlands
The Division
Card Hunter
Hand of Fate
Axiom Verge

If I had to box myself into a category, I'd consider myself to primarily be a multiplayer oriented PC gamer (the multiplayer, non-campaign based game list would be 50+ titles itself), so there's only ~40-ish titles here for the 18 month period, which I realize is probably a lot lower than many people in this thread.

However, let's wheel back around to Star Ocean using some of the things above.

Undertale is a game similar to Earthbound. On Steam, it has 1,466,419 ± 29,634 owners.
Citizens of Earth is also a game similar to Earthbound. On Steam, it has 90,961 ± 7,397 owners.

Undertale was self published.
Citizens of Earth was published by ATLUS, who has quite a few hits on Steam like Rock of Ages (443,930 ±16,332), Text Murphy: Tesla Effect (330,583 ±14,096), and Abyss Odyssey (271,623 ±12,779).

If these were both retail titles by major publishers, I think people would see the gap between Undertale and Citizens of Earth and start yelling to the roof about how clearly Citizens of Earth didn't have enough marketing.

However, in this scenario, we see that the game that *did* have a successful publisher and marketing was actually the one that did vastly worse, because the core issue is with the appeal of the products themselves.

Here is the first review that comes up for Citizens of Earth on Steam. It gives it a thumbs down: http://steamcommunity.com/id/aurumlamina/recommended/258910/

For some players, Citizens of Earth may be exactly what they've been looking for to scratch their nostalgia itch. For me, it started off strong but rapidly deteriorated into the opposite.

The vast majority of characters are extraordinarily one-dimensional and never evolve in any narrative way. The combat is old school, but in the way that it emphasizes everything that has been improved over the years as opposed to appealing to our rose colored glasses. The story itself, in my humble opinion, couldn't even begin to compete with the classic games that Citizens of Earth was inspired by and involved far too much grinding to progress.

It was enjoyable to collect characters, for the most part, and leveling them was exciting as far as abilities are concerned as each new ability tended to add something new role-wise that the character hadn't previously had access to.

I can't recommend this game for the Earthbound fans who are looking for an exciting modern version, but as an RPG-lite this may appeal to some who are looking for something that has the simple RPG feel of years long lost.

This doesn't address that the art style is also really ugly.

I feel he hits on a lot of the types of issues that can cause a throwback game to run aground instead of have notable success. The core gameplay hasn't evolved enough for modern times. The execution of other elements people loved about this type of game (the plot and characters for this example) was not very good. The pacing isn't great, which is something that can generate a lot of burnout among the initial buyers, causing word of mouth to stagnate. He actually even says that he thinks there's an audience for this product even though he doesn't personally recommend it. All of this is compounded by there being a much more notable game in the market around the same time that targets a similar audience, plus a plethora of other options to choose from.

Despite having an 83% positive rating on Steam, the core product wasn't strong enough to carry the title to high heights, even with a significantly more favorable publishing and marketing situation, since it couldn't generate the word of mouth for it to take off.

When I watched the Star Ocean V footage, I saw a game where you walk down a variety of connected hallways on a relatively simplistic map, run into some monster groups along the way, and slash at them for a while before moving on. You could also walk up next to glowing trees and press a button to grab some crafting materials. There was also a mix of traditional cutscenes and dialog that happened while you walked around. There was some amount of town walking, and of course you could make some modifications to your party's ability sets. There didn't seem to be much else in the game, even when the video skipped about halfway through the game. It's worth noting that things seemed pretty smooth in terms of saving the game or seamless battles or transitioning between areas. Maybe there's a lot more to the game I never saw, but barring someone showing me that, I'll go ahead with that assumption for the rest of the post.

So at this point, we're looking at the type of setup we saw with a traditional PS2 JRPG that wasn't on the scale of Final Fantasy XII, thus why I dubbed it a mid-tier title. There were a few modern conveniences poured on top of that, but not really much in terms of modern gameplay changes.

That's not to say this type of product can't succeed, but it needs to really nail the execution if it's not selling itself on interesting new features and ideas. Given the impressions people had of the game, it doesn't sound like they really did that. People didn't seem to be gushing about how great the gameplay or visuals or production values or plotline was, and most of the chatter I heard seemed to be about people being disappointed at how short the game was.

Now, let me compare this to Bravely Default. That game offered a new-ish feeling combat system (both in terms of how the turn system worked and the class blending) that people seemed to really like, some great boss design, a bunch of modern amenities like changing encounter rates and difficulties, voice acting for a lot of the content, and as far as the platform was concerned, the production values and visuals were very nice. There were also integrated social systems like the town building and summon aspect that helped generate additional word of mouth. People obviously got very upset about the later content in the game, but the initial appeal worked, and the game sold very well for what it was.

My opinion on Star Ocean 5 is that it was ultimately a product that didn't offer enough to really win over a mass of new customers. It gave people a more traditional game, but it wasn't the more traditional game they wanted, and it didn't seem to surprise them in new and exciting ways either. I suspect that, like Citizens of Earth, it will actually have an audience that as a whole rates it well and buys a non-trivial number of copies. However, I don't think it's the type of product geared for any breakout success even with its Western release, and it doesn't surprise me that it didn't do especially well in Japan where a lot of the series' old audience has grown too old to play console games given the constraints and tendencies of the local culture and lifestyle. The producer is totally right in that they need to appeal to younger audiences to thrive, but as far as I can tell they didn't really do anything to appeal to them outside of making the game shorter, which is a dubious modification toward that goal in the first place. I don't think that marketing (namely promotion and advertising) had any real impact on why the game had humble sales as opposed to the nature of the core product.

As for why I tend to talk about mobile in these threads given the games I play and that I can do long write-ups like these, frankly I just think the business side of the mobile industry is a lot more interesting than dedicated devices in Japan. On the dedicated device side, we see a bunch of publishers flailing around trying to figure out how to decline less quickly with a bunch of safe bets and low budget new (and sometimes old) ideas, with only a few standout products going against the curve. Over in mobile land, there's tons of investment and publishers (both new and old) are flooding the market with ideas trying to find paths to success and figure out where the quickly growing and evolving market is going. I think there's a lot more exciting (business) ideas to be seen on a frequent basis there as opposed to the dedicated industry where everything is ramping down and publishers are leaving (or at least culling down their domestic targeted investment).
 

Vena

Member
I will say this on SOV as a fan of the series (well, until after SOIV killed my love of the franchise with a blunt dagger), and that when I watched the trailers for V I felt a lot of the same emotion: "Well this reminds me an awful lot of SOIII." At one point,I was even feeling giddy to see what was effectively Cliff and Mirages moves but then, I realized something... I could just go and play SOIII. Moreover, a lot of the things they did change, when given a second look, were really just superficial changes to flow (combat transitions, for example) but the underlying things were the same to the point of the whole game just feeling like it came from the same era as SOIII. Now, keeping the core isn't actually a bad thing in and of itself, but the question comes in has anything else changed?

I can't complain about similarities in the core, I am a big fan of Dark Souls after all and FROM has farted out the same skeleton for half a decade now, but they put enough new paint, enough new mechanics, and enough new love to world building and fine-tuned mechanics that I don't care as much that I am playing the same farted out skeleton every time, even when they change the name.

But with SOV? I didn't really see anything much different. It presents a very similar introduction of "tech vs. medieval" of every game, the same kind of world (with uninspired textures and generic setting). Nothing wowed me, nothing really impressed me aside from some high quality character models and nice art. It just made me want to go play SOIII again, and punch god in the face while having Cliff spam Max Shockwave from a corner.


I can confirm Nirolak is a true hardcore gamer.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
I will say this on SOV as a fan of the series (well, until after SOIV killed my love of the franchise with a blunt dagger), and that when I watched the trailers for V I felt a lot of the same emotion: "Well this reminds me an awful lot of SOIII." At one point,I was even feeling giddy to see what was effectively Cliff and Mirages moves but then, I realized something... I could just go and play SOIII. Moreover, a lot of the things they did change, when given a second look, were really just superficial changes to flow (combat transitions, for example) but the underlying things were the same to the point of the whole game just feeling like it came from the same era as SOIII. Now, keeping the core isn't actually a bad thing in and of itself, but the question comes in has anything else changed?

I can't complain about similarities in the core, I am a big fan of Dark Souls after all and FROM has farted out the same skeleton for half a decade now, but they put enough new paint, enough new mechanics, and enough new love to world building and fine-tuned mechanics that I don't care as much that I am playing the same farted out skeleton every time, even when they change the name.

But with SOV? I didn't really see anything much different. It presents a very similar introduction of "tech vs. medieval" of every game, the same kind of world (with uninspired textures and generic setting). Nothing wowed me, nothing really impressed me aside from some high quality character models and nice art. It just made me want to go play SOIII again, and punch god in the face while having Cliff spam Max Shockwave from a corner.
This is a good example of the primary dilemma sequels have. They want to keep the essence of what people like, but also make significant changes and evolutions that really impress their audience.

I think we've reached the point where it's generally a far better idea to "change more" than "change less", especially if we're not having a discussion of turning old strategy games into bland first person shooters.

Of course, it always helps to call in people who like the games during the process and have them try it out to make sure you're heading down a good path, especially during the prototyping/pre-production phase when it's actually possible to make changes.

I can confirm Nirolak is a true hardcore gamer.
In that one I did everything except the Amiibo sticker hunt, and I only ever got up 36 of the 50 floors in the challenge level at the end. I stopped because stump said it took him 6-7 hours to beat it, despite him being very very good at games like this, and that didn't feel worthwhile.
 

Mory Dunz

Member
What looked mid-tier PS2 in terms of game design to you? Smaller areas? No real open world 'feature creep', repetitive quests, DLCs, or multiplayer options or mobile-style hooks? Gameplay looks pretty tight from the videos I've seen, though the fact it's a much smaller and much less epic adventure disappoints me somewhat.

personally, I watched the intro on youtube and it fell into that category for me. Or at least it felt cliched like those mid tier ps2 rpgs.

Start with a battle. Your friend gives some forced exposition that the player will figure out soon enough (a lot of JRPGs are guilty of this. You don't have to explain relationships between people in the first 10 seconds. Just chill and let it be figured it. Stating it outloud makes it...weird, forced).
See girl. some comment was made about her being 18 now I think. The intent to make her viable I guess. Then see some "suspicious" people 100 ft away. They're just...standing there. So they go to the elder or leader to talk about it. Instead of just going to check out the guys themselves.(?) And that elder of course mentions how the main character is special, etc, blah. Maybe someones dad is dead
 

L~A

Member
In that one I did everything except the Amiibo sticker hunt, and I only ever got up 36 of the 50 floors in the challenge level at the end. I stopped because stump said it took him 6-7 hours to beat it, despite him being very very good at games like this, and that didn't feel worthwhile.

Yeah, it's not really worth it. Not sure what they were thinking with that one, but at least it's just a little extra at the end.

You should definitely borrow someone's amiibo, cause the pixel toad hunt is really great. I was actually surprise by how fun it was to find that little bugger. Such a simple idea, but it works like a charm.

Err.... back on topic... er... Super Capitan Todd: La Grandiosa Adventura on NX at launch? ;)
 

Vena

Member
I'll second the sticker hunt having been a surprisingly good bit of fun.

This is a good example of the primary dilemma sequels have. They want to keep the essence of what people like, but also make significant changes and evolutions that really impress their audience.

I think we've reached the point where it's generally a far better idea to "change more" than "change less", especially if we're not having a discussion of turning old strategy games into bland first person shooters.

Of course, it always helps to call in people who like the games during the process and have them try it out to make sure you're heading down a good path, especially during the prototyping/pre-production phase when it's actually possible to make changes.

We can always take a look at Fire Emblem again which, while Fates/If did go about re-inventing the underlying mechanics to a large degree in terms of combat and map design, still the same SRPG grid-game its been since inception. The art has come a long way, story is still crap, but along the way they've added mechanics and functions, with some of those additions being next to irrelevant to the actual game. Or they've brought back old stuff and given it a new coat of paint that hasn't been in the series for ages.

The expansion of the relationship systems really helped the game grow, for example, and in Fates/If they cranked that up even further with even more extensive interactions with characters from the PoV of the player. And now, since Awakening, you are a central character... though I personally don't like Fates "YOU" are the central character and everything revolves around "YOU", I much preferred shared importance in Awakening.

Combat is still RPS with weapons but its now gotten even more depth and complexity and nuance to it.
Fucking Ninja maps on Lunatic.
But I can still see familiar critical animations and familiar nods to the old series but the difference is that the entirety of the game isn't relishing in the tropes of the past... to the point of just being a past-game in new clothes.

Of course, I think some of this just comes down to the source of the game. Whereas most publishers tend to prefer to keep to their audiences and safe comfort zones of success,Nintendo (who also does this with the mega brands) throws reason to the wind for better (Fire Emblem, Bayonetta) or worse (Metroid,STEAM) or bizarre (#FE) or... whatever lunacy made Sin and Punishment 2. Fire Emblem was facing an ultimatum of sorts as the story would go and they took a seemingly sizable budget and made Awakening. I think in general an ultimatum from other publishers would have been faced with the reverse of "here is no budget, let's see you keep this series alive" like, for instance, Bravely Second or... Star Ocean V.
 

Eolz

Member
The manga yes, the anime not really (the Bones curse)

The game? Lol no.

I see thankw. I really don't know anything about it, but some people I know seemed really hyped about this franchise when I never heard about it before.

So, here's the campaign based games I beat in 2015 and 2016 so far, in approximate order of completion. I've pulled out all mobile games, MMOs, and things like Hearthstone campaigns since I assume none of those count as real games.

I left in a couple of "non-games" like Her Story, and smaller puzzle games like Hexcells, though feel free to discount those if you prefer.

I also excluded games I didn't finish.

Off-topic but that's a nice and diverse list. Don't even have time to finish most games I buy anymore, but I'm fine with that since I come back to them later.
 

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
Even with NX loosing 2016 there are still possibilities this will be the first year after a very long time with Y-O-Y increase. Software is guaranteed to be up, hardware performance was a surprise last December, maybe something happens again this year and surpirises again.
 

L~A

Member
Yeah, with both YW3 and Pokémon SM this year, not to mention the rest of the 3DS line-up and the big PS4 titles, Software should be up.

Hardware will most likely depend on two things: how the 3DS will hold up, and how strong the impact of the big PS4 titles on PS4 sales.

PSV isn't going anywhere, PS3 is pretty much retired now, and XB1... well.

The problem comes from the Wii U. After May 28th, there's the increased baseline (+ strong holiday sales) from Splatoon for 2015. But for 2016, not only there's literally no games until October, but there's a grand total of 2 announced retail games for the rest of the year (3 if you count MN9). Not to mention Nintendo not interested in producing more units in order to meet the already low demand, and the NX out in March (with proper reveal coming out this year)...

Whatever happens, Wii U sales will be down significantly this year (they were already bound to be down, but factors above only make things worse). So for HW to be up YoY it'll be up to the 3DS and the PS4. Since there's no successor this year, 3DS sales should remain good.

Edit: as for the "surprise"... lots of demand for PSVR?
 

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
Week 21, 2016 (May 23 - May 29)

new releases

{2016.05.24}
[PS4] Overwatch <ACT> (Square Enix) (¥7.800)
[PS4] Overwatch (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <ACT> (Square Enix) (¥7.800)

{2016.05.25}
[3DS] Mysterious Stars 3D: Fairytale Edition _3DS Download Software_ |DL| <SLG> (Collavier) (¥740)
[WIU] Mario Kart DS _Wii U Virtual Console Version_ |DL| <RCE> (Nintendo) (¥879)
[WIU] Gradius II: Gofer no Yabou _Wii U Virtual Console Version_ |DL| <STG> (Konami) (¥762)
[WIU] Sonic Advance 3 _Wii U Virtual Console Version_ |DL| <ACT> (Sega) (¥650)
[PSV] The Last Blade 2 _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <FTG> (SNK Playmore) (¥925)
[PS4] The Last Blade 2 _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <FTG> (SNK Playmore) (¥925)

{2016.05.26}
[PSV] Cladun Sengoku <RPG> (Nippon Ichi Software) (¥4.800)
[PSV] Cladun Sengoku (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <RPG> (Nippon Ichi Software) (¥3.810)
[PSV] Sangoku Hime 4: Tenka Ryouran - Tenmei no Koi Emaki <SLG> (SystemSoft Alpha) (¥6.500)
[PSV] Sangoku Hime 4: Tenka Ryouran - Tenmei no Koi Emaki (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <SLG> (SystemSoft Alpha) (¥6.500)
[PSV] Kyoukai no Shirayuki # <ADV> (Idea Factory) (¥6.300)
[PSV] Kyoukai no Shirayuki (Limited Edition) <ADV> (Idea Factory) (¥8.300)
[PSV] Kyoukai no Shirayuki (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <ADV> (Idea Factory) (¥5.800)
[PSV] SA7: Silent Ability Seven # <ADV> (Future Tech Lab) (¥5.800)
[PSV] SA7: Silent Ability Seven (Limited Edition) <ADV> (Future Tech Lab) (¥7.800)
[PSV] SA7: Silent Ability Seven (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <ADV> (Future Tech Lab) (¥4.800)
[PS4] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator # <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥6.800)
[PS4] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator (Limited Edition) <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥9.800)
[PS4] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥5.800)
[PS4] Sangoku Hime 4: Tenka Ryouran - Tenmei no Koi Emaki <SLG> (SystemSoft Alpha) (¥7.500)
[PS4] Sangoku Hime 4: Tenka Ryouran - Tenmei no Koi Emaki (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <SLG> (SystemSoft Alpha) (¥7.500)
[PS4] Mega Man Legacy Collection <Mega Man \ Mega Man 2 \ Mega Man 3 \ Mega Man 4 \ Mega Man 5 \ Mega Man 6> _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <ACT> (Capcom) (¥2.315)
[XB1] Mega Man Legacy Collection <Mega Man \ Mega Man 2 \ Mega Man 3 \ Mega Man 4 \ Mega Man 5 \ Mega Man 6> _Download Version_ |DL| <ACT> (Capcom) (¥2.380)
[PS3] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator # <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥6.800)
[PS3] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator (Limited Edition) <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥9.800)
[PS3] Guilty Gear Xrd: Revelator (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <FTG> (Arc System Works) (¥5.800)

{2016.05.27}
[PSV] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥6.800)
[PSV] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥6.800)
[PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥7.800)
[PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥7.800)
[PS4] Arcade Archives: Formation Armed F _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <STG> (Hamster) (¥762)
[PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥6.800)
[PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari (&#949;) _PS Store Download Version_ |DL| <RPG> (Square Enix) (¥6.800)
___

YSO predictions

01. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 160k (average 135k)
02. [PSV] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 120k (average 100k)
03. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 70k (average 55k)
00. [PS4+PSV+PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 350k (average 290k)
00. [PS4] Overwatch < 50k (average 45k)
 

Vena

Member
Edit: as for the "surprise"... lots of demand for PSVR?

A big 3DS price-drop. Almost certain it won't be NA only, and I expect it to be large to help move stock out of warehouses and such. Especially with how low the 2DS is getting. Components have likely dropped a lot in price.

YSO predictions

01. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 160k (average 135k)
02. [PSV] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 120k (average 100k)
03. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 70k (average 55k)
00. [PS4+PSV+PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes II: Futago no Ou to Yogen no Owari < 350k (average 290k)
00. [PS4] Overwatch < 50k (average 45k)

For reference:
01./00. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥7.344) - 325.446 / NEW <92,25%>
02./00. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes # <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥8.424) - 269.303 / NEW <89,89%>

A massive drop.
 

Orgen

Member
In that one I did everything except the Amiibo sticker hunt, and I only ever got up 36 of the 50 floors in the challenge level at the end. I stopped because stump said it took him 6-7 hours to beat it, despite him being very very good at games like this, and that didn't feel worthwhile.

I was stuck on that stage for weeks until I read somewhere that you could freeze enemy's using the gamepad. Beat it on my second try using this so I suggest you to try it using this trick!

Seeing the predictions it seems that overwatch is not going to be the sleeper hit some users predicted. And yeah, DQII is going to see a steep decline :|
 

Sterok

Member
For reference:
01./00. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥7.344) - 325.446 / NEW <92,25%>
02./00. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes # <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥8.424) - 269.303 / NEW <89,89%>

A massive drop.

Has the second entry curse ever failed to hit?
 

Oregano

Member
I was stuck on that stage for weeks until I read somewhere that you could freeze enemy's using the gamepad. Beat it on my second try using this so I suggest you to try it using this trick!

Seeing the predictions it seems that overwatch is not going to be the sleeper hit some users predicted. And yeah, DQII is going to see a steep decline :|

Yokai Watch only sold 50k first week. Overwatch confirmed for next sensation.
 

horuhe

Member
Yeah, with both YW3 and Pokémon SM this year, not to mention the rest of the 3DS line-up and the big PS4 titles, Software should be up.

Hardware will most likely depend on two things: how the 3DS will hold up, and how strong the impact of the big PS4 titles on PS4 sales.

Yeah, I mostly agree with you. But, imo 3DS won't have any impact (or at least a smaller one) on the YoY comparison. PS4 should be the star this year, and as Vena said a price drop for 3DS in Japan will be the only way it could affect this variable.

For reference:
01./00. [PS3] Dragon Quest Heroes <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥7.344) - 325.446 / NEW <92,25%>
02./00. [PS4] Dragon Quest Heroes # <RPG> (Square Enix) {2015.02.26} (¥8.424) - 269.303 / NEW <89,89%>

A massive drop.

At least the PS4 version hasn't fallen too much as the PS3 version this time.

------------

By the way, this week, even though can't be the worst in history, it surely has numbers to be the worst of this year. There weren't too many "purchases" I think, and there were more pre-orders. Overwatch, Story of Seasons and Ace Attorney stands were really visited during this week at some stores.
 

Vena

Member
At least the PS4 version hasn't fallen too much as the PS3 version this time.

I mean, ya, most conditions look good next to a corpse. Losing, potentially, 100k sales on the newer,would-be 'healthy' platform while the old melts away like the Wicked Witch of the West, is not what I'd call encouraging.

Yeah, I mostly agree with you. But, imo 3DS won't have any impact (or at least a smaller one) on the YoY comparison. PS4 should be the star this year, and as Vena said a price drop for 3DS in Japan will be the only way it could affect this variable.

I still think the 3DS will remain the lead hardware platform this year, Pokemon is just too large of a juggernaut, especially if its paired with a price drop. Admittedly, I don't actually expect much in the way of sustained or major affects on hardware from Persona or Final Fantasy, they're too expected and established, and many who would buy hardware have long-since jumped in with other jRPGs.
 
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