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[Eddie-Griffin]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/26/technology/apple-augmented-reality-dissent.html

The company is expected to unveil an augmented reality headset in a few months. Some employees wonder if the device makes sense for Apple.

The video showed a man in a London taxi donning an augmented reality headset and calling his wife in San Francisco. “Would you like to come to London?” he asked, two people who saw the video said. Soon, the couple were sharing the sights of London through the husband’s eyes.

The video excited executives about the possibilities of Apple’s next business-altering device: a headset that would blend the digital world with the real one.

But now, as the company prepares to introduce the headset in June, enthusiasm at Apple has given way to skepticism, said eight current and former employees, who requested anonymity because of Apple’s policies against speaking about future products. There are concerns about the device’s roughly $3,000 price, doubts about its utility and worries about its unproven market.

That dissension has been a surprising change inside a company where employees have built devices — from the iPod to the Apple Watch — with the single-mindedness of a moon mission.

Some employees have defected from the project because of their doubts about its potential, three people with knowledge of the moves said. Others have been fired over the lack of progress with some aspects of the headset, including its use of Apple’s Siri voice assistant, one person said.

Even leaders at Apple have questioned the product’s prospects. It has been developed at a time when morale has been strained by a wave of departures from the company’s design team, including Mr. Ive, who left Apple in 2019 and stopped advising the company last year.

An Apple spokeswoman declined to comment on the company’s plans for future products.

Apple’s headset is considered a bellwether for virtual and augmented reality. For more than a decade, tech leaders have been hyping it as the next wave of computing after the smartphone. Apple’s chief executive, Tim Cook, told university students last year that in the near future “you’ll wonder how you lived your life without augmented reality, just like today you wonder: How did people like me grow up without the internet?”

But the road to deliver augmented reality has been littered with failures, false starts and disappointments, from Google Glass to Magic Leap and from Microsoft’s HoloLens to Meta’s Quest Pro. Apple is considered a potential savior because of its success combining new hardware and software to create revolutionary devices. Still, the challenges are daunting.

Unlike the iPhone, which incorporated many existing technologies, virtual reality is requiring Apple and others to design new chips and wearable displays, said Matthew Ball, author of “The Metaverse: And How It Will Revolutionize Everything.” “The difficulty of the problem has been far greater than anyone expected,” he added.

Uncertainty about the potential of Apple’s project has led some people who have worked on it to speculate that the company could delay its release, especially in light of the shaky economy, these people said. The company has postponed other new products in the past, including AirTags, the coin-size location tracking devices, which Apple withheld for more than a year as it addressed privacy issues. But at this point, headset manufacturing is underway for a planned reveal in June, the people said.

“Apple is always pretty good at coming into a market when the market is already established and changing that market,” said Carolina Milanesi, a consumer tech analyst for the research firm Creative Strategies. “This is not the case for Apple VR and XR. There’s still a lot of learning.”

Some internal skeptics have questioned if the new device is a solution in search of a problem. Unlike the iPod, which put digital songs in people’s pockets, and the iPhone, which combined the abilities of a music player and a phone, the headset hasn’t been driven by the same clarity, these people said.

The product is being birthed during a period of limbo. This year, Mr. Ive’s successor overseeing industrial design, Evans Hankey, departed. With design’s leadership in flux, Mike Rockwell, an engineer, has been leading development of the device.

The headset looks like ski goggles. It features a carbon fiber frame, a hip pack with battery support, outward cameras to capture the real world and two 4K displays that can render everything from applications to movies, two of the people said. Users can turn a “reality dial” on the device to increase or decrease real-time video from the world around them.

Because the headset won’t fit over glasses, the company has plans to sell prescription lenses for the displays to people who don’t wear contacts, a person familiar with the plan said.

During the device’s development, Apple has focused on making it excel for videoconferencing and spending time with others as avatars in a virtual world. The company has called the device’s signature application “copresence,” a word designed to capture the experience of sharing a real or virtual space with someone in another place. It is akin to what Mark Zuckerberg, Facebook’s founder, calls the “metaverse.”

The device will double as a tool for artists, designers and engineers, tracking them as they draw freely in space in image-editing applications and tracking hand gestures for the editing of virtual reality films. Lastly, it will function as a high-resolution TV with custom-made video content from Hollywood filmmakers such as Jon Favreau, the director of “Iron Man.”

Apple is expected to pitch its device as something different from those that Meta has introduced. During an interview last year with the Dutch publication Bright, Mr. Cook said he avoided using the term “metaverse” because it was foreign to the average person.

So the New York times was able to get current employees who were at the recent event, and former employees familiar with the VR headset plans, and have found out that there are several people within Apple who have been fired, left the company, or have had their voices unheard about their skepticism of pushing out this new headset this year. Including some that wanted a delay which lines up with the previous thread suggesting that very thing.

From the sounds of it, the fissure internally at Apple to move forward with the 2023 release of the headset has caused more internal disarray than expected.

This is also the 2nd reconfirmation fo the estimated $3000 price.

The firing of people who were not making progress on some features Tim and the operations team wanted makes it seem like they were putting their foot down on employees. The article mentions one of these features being Siri. Apple is actually supposed to be able to allow consumers to use the VR headset to create AR apps using Siri with no coding experience necessary. Which sounds rather questionable, but I'm assuming that's an example of a feature with slow progress people got fired over.

We did get some hints as to what the headset looks like (or at least the one shown in secret), it apparently looks like Ski Goggles with carbon fiber framing. Which would mean it looks something like this,

Now to be fair, if they actually have their headset to look like Ski Goggles with such a slim and more flexible form factor, I do think that would cause some excitement along with the tech specs. But Apple doesn't seem to have a clear vision with it as noted by the article, so they would need to explain how this will benefit the average consumer.

This is likely why Apple announced that the headset will have continuity and Hand-off features so that people in Apples Ecosystem can more easily come in, but they will also need the software.

Apple apparently is focusing on launching a social VR application like Zucker did with Horizon Worlds, but is planning to present it in an entirely different way, possibly with legs. I'm curious how that's going to work out.

 

[Fredrik]

lmao I won’t fit over glasses? What are they doing??

 

[Chupanibre]

lmao I won’t fit over glasses? What are they doing??

If history is anything to go by, I bet there's going to be an add-on to accommodate glasses for the low price of $699

 

[THE DUCK]

$3000 they should have concerns.......it's already an uphill battle to gain vr adoption, adding a hefty price Tag makes it even harder.
Can they sell a million? Maybe, but then what? The cost better drop fast.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

No Jobs nor Ives involved with this project potentially equates to Apple jumping the shark here, irrespective of this alpha dev release before the public product hits shelves. Historic commercial successes aside I haven't seen a product from Apple hit home like the iPhone/iPad revolution did, everything after that has just been iterations and spin offs really e.g. phones, watch, macbook, macpro. I'm not sure Apple has another golden egg to lay without competitors being right there alongside or exceeding them.

 

[DrFigs]

I know 3k is a lot. but for a company like apple to be releasing a new gadget that will only sell 1 mil sounds terrible. that sounds like a failure to me.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

No Jobs nor Ives involved with this project potentially equates to Apple jumping the shark here, irrespective of this alpha dev release before the public product hits shelves. Historic commercial successes aside I haven't seen a product from Apple hit home like the iPhone/iPad revolution did, everything after that has just been iterations and spin offs really e.g. phones, watch, macbook, macpro. I'm not sure Apple has another golden egg to lay without competitors being right there alongside or exceeding them.

AirPods. Apple still got it.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Sounds like a disaster tbh

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

AirPods. Apple still got it.

That's a good one alright but they were rumoured to be in development since like 2010 or something, well within Ives' tenure for release in 2016ish. Onkyo also had wireless headphones up and running before Apple did commercially. Here's hoping this headset is of similar success in terms of product quality and consumer benefit. Airpods aren't exactly as complicated as VR/AR/MR though and without Ives or Jobs I have to really question what the killer app or sell here is? A healthy dose of I'll believe it when I see it, the ones internally at Apple don't seem impressed at all. Ives exiting Apple and consulting altogether is a pretty big red flag, considering Jobs was quoted as saying "no Ives means no Apple".

 

[Unknown Soldier]

If Apple had the courage to make Sword Art Online, they would instantly win and have a billion sold by decade's end.

However Apple is as terrified of things people actually want from VR as Zuck is so I doubt they will allow gaming or porn on VR, the 2 things people actually want.

 

[Sony]

It'll succeed. Anything Apple shits out succeeds.

 

[midnightAI]

Haven't we had this thread already?

It's bonkers how many Apple threads there are and they aren't even a games company and all over a AR headset that hasn't even been announced.

 

[baphomet]

Haven't we had this thread already?

It's bonkers how many Apple threads there are and they aren't even a games company and all over a AR headset that hasn't even been announced.

It's the same poster googling them every day and making a thread on whatever garbage article he sees that mentions them.

 

[E-Cat]

If history is anything to go by, I bet there's going to be an add-on to accommodate glasses for the low price of $699

Compared to this, $3k for a headset is excellent value

 

[AJUMP23]

Why did the OP get banned?

 

[baphomet]

Why did the OP get banned?

Hopefully for shitting up the forum with these threads constantly.

 

[Faust]

Why did the OP get banned?

An alt of two previous banned accounts: Afro/Voost. Continuous shilling, instigation, antagonization, and ignoring moderation warnings repeatedly by spamming low effort threads.

 

[diffusionx]

This is why Tim Cook is paid the big bucks, to make decisions like this. I dunno why this is a big deal.

No Jobs nor Ives involved with this project potentially equates to Apple jumping the shark here, irrespective of this alpha dev release before the public product hits shelves. Historic commercial successes aside I haven't seen a product from Apple hit home like the iPhone/iPad revolution did, everything after that has just been iterations and spin offs really e.g. phones, watch, macbook, macpro. I'm not sure Apple has another golden egg to lay without competitors being right there alongside or exceeding them.

Ive had too much control in the post-Jobs era. It led to horrid shit like their obsession with thinness, butterfly keyboards, the touch bar, the UI issues with iOS7 and beyond, etc. It led to some of the worst and least usable laptops Apple *ever* made. I think Apple's stuff has gotten much better since he left, and getting rid of him when they did was the right call.

Apple is many times bigger and more influential than they were the day Jobs died. It's not like the rest of the industry is running circles around them the way it was in the late 80s and early 90s. They're still the top dog. Devices like the iPhone come around once a generation - you can't upend an industry every 3 years. That said, they managed to completely revolutionize the headphone category without breaking a sweat. On surveys, zoomers say that iPhone/blue bubble is the default and Android is a poverty device, thus meaning they're firmly a lifestyle brand now, and will be for the next 20-30 years.

 

[AJUMP23]

An alt of two previous banned accounts: Afro/Voost. Continuous shilling, instigation, antagonization, and ignoring moderation warnings repeatedly by spamming low effort threads.

Thank you sir.

 

[chromhound]

It'll succeed. Anything Apple shits out succeeds.

Apple Homepods would like a word with you

 

[StealthGoblin]

$3000 they should have concerns.......it's already an uphill battle to gain vr adoption, adding a hefty price Tag makes it even harder.
Can they sell a million? Maybe, but then what? The cost better drop fast.

It’ll be loss making at that price. I can’t imagine the cost dropping much.

 

[LordOfChaos]

lmao I won’t fit over glasses? What are they doing??

Selling you Apple lenses every time your prescription changes

Like seriously though

 

[Fredrik]

Selling you Apple lenses every time your prescription changes

Like seriously though

And everybody in the household and friends who want to try it needs their own lenses. I don’t understand products this badly planned.

 

[LordOfChaos]

And everybody in the household and friends who want to try it needs their own lenses. I don’t understand products this badly planned.

Oh it's planned. Why do you think you still can't just use your thumbprint to have multiple accounts on an iPad to switch between? They want everyone to buy their own iPad. They even support multi account but only locked down to the school setting.

Buy One! Heck, buy two! - Sergeant Major Avery J. Johnson and Timmy Apple

 

[THE DUCK]

It’ll be loss making at that price. I can’t imagine the cost dropping much.

Well then what's the road map to profit? Perhaps this is why there is division internally.....

 

[Maiden Voyage]

Why did the OP get banned?

No one doubts Tim Apple and survives. No one.

 

[AJUMP23]

No one doubts Tim Apple and survives. No one.

Tim Apple is legit king.

 

[FullMetalx117]

I’m glad they’re launching it, their end goal is to basically make these glasses someday, maybe contacts.

If there’s anyone that can push mass adoption it’s Apple. And yes even post cook/jobs. Prices won’t come down unless companies commit to mass production, this is necessary.

Apple can spin out the airpod business and it’d be valued at 100 billion+. USBC will become true standard once iPhones have it. Even the Apple wallet/Apple Pay has come in super handy - the card itself is pretty good.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Well then what's the road map to profit? Perhaps this is why there is division internally.....

I’d imagine it would make a significant loss for much or all of the first year, then make profit after that.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Even the Apple wallet/Apple Pay has come in super handy - the card itself is pretty good.

I did not take out my wallet in two years, every time I need to pay with a physical card I find it strange.

I’d imagine it would make a significant loss for much or all of the first year, then make profit after that.

Don’t forget all the money they will make on the ecosystem if they can make App Store for mixed reality apps a fraction as popular as the one for iPhone and iPads.

I think once we get real glasses that can also have corrective lenses in them we will never going back.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Selling you Apple lenses every time your prescription changes

Like seriously though

Do you have glasses? Because I had the same lenses for 20 years now. Might be a concern later in life but your glasses prescription is not changing every 2-3 years.

 

[THE DUCK]

I’d imagine it would make a significant loss for much or all of the first year, then make profit after that.

But at that kind of sales, a million units at zero profit, they generate 3 billion in sales and no profit. Even if it's successfully the first year and they make $500 a unit in year two, that's a paltry 500 million. That's pocket lint for Apple..........I'd like to know the long term road map to mass market and real money. Unless they think they can eventually get it down a lot more or start selling a lot more units.......

 

[MilkLizard]

$3000 for AR bullshit? Remember Google Glasses? This is going to be even a bigger flop.

 

[LordOfChaos]

Do you have glasses? Because I had the same lenses for 20 years now. Might be a concern later in life but your glasses prescription is not changing every 2-3 years.

Didn't say every 2-3 years, but also not everyone is the same age as you, and not everyone has a long settled period in their middle ages

Also different family members would have to keep swapping out prescription lenses. It's obviously going to generate some off to the side hardware revenue after the fact, Tim Apple loves that. $69 earcup replacements, their whole dongles and cables business is larger than most businesses on the planet, etc.

 

[Celcius]

I was going to call this doomed but then I remembered that I bought the $19 Apple screen polishing cloth. I can't complain lol.