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What's the controversy? That they aren't really RPGs? I fail to see the problem with that statement.Well I was trying to avoid controversy but yes lol.
What's the controversy? That they aren't really RPGs? I fail to see the problem with that statement.Well I was trying to avoid controversy but yes lol.
Absolutely age is a huge factor. If you were 5 years old in 1997 I wouldn’t expect you to be reading the EGMs and Gamelan magazines of the day scouring over previews months before the game release’s.I think a big difference is your age at the time and also how involved you were when it came to reading up on video games. Back then I was a little kid and happened to choose the game at a rental store. I played it and saw the credits without ever hearing about an inverted castle. I still thought it was a great game. Years later a friend told me about the inverted castle when the 360 version released. That was when I finally learned about it and experienced it for myself.
My game Grimfel is doing exactly this. Over 10 different endings so far based on choices and consequences. We are on Kickstarter right now. I'd send a link but not sure on rules.The thing that i appreciate the most in an rpg is when my choices matter and affect the story and very few rpgs actually do this most of them are doing it in a very shallow way , they either create the illusion of choice or just give you a couple of choices close to the ending of the game that will determine how the story ends
games like wasteland 3 , divinity original sin , fallout new vegas are doing this perfectly . What is the point of creating a character the way i want if there are no choices that let me use my personality in the game world , there is nothing more immersive than when the things happening in the story are happening because of my actions , not because someone forced those events down my throat
No, I'm personally dismissing how much impact other people felt those choices had on them when making their own impression of the game because they didn't transform my overall impression of the game in the same way. I'm committing the serious crime of thinking for myself and trusting my own senses.I feel like you are greatly underestimating how much choice has an impact on the game.
I disagree, because I don't think choosing between a good and a bad ending is a good choice. If he knows, nobody would choose to let Ciri dies.Actually getting the ending depending on how Geralt treats Ciri, and more importantly how Ciri perceives it was quite brilliant. Jeff Vogel had a good article about it.
First, I think that the world should be different based on your previous choices: is Henselt alive? Stannis? Where is Anaïs? There is many characters that has completely disappeared between The Witcher 2 and The Witcher 3, and it's really perturbing. If you want an example of the contrary, Mass Effect 3 is really good at bringing back every important character of the first two games.And yes, there is not a choice in TW3 that would result in almost half the game being different. But that's logical given that it is an open world game. You can still effect fates of shit ton of people and even entire countries based on your choices. And there are some very long separate sequences that branch out depending on your choices. Skellige or Toussaint come to mind, or Baron in Velen..
Absolutely age is a huge factor. If you were 5 years old in 1997 I wouldn’t expect you to be reading the EGMs and Gamelan magazines of the day scouring over previews months before the game release’s.
How old were you anyway if it took you 10years to figure that out?
No, I'm personally dismissing how much impact other people felt those choices had on them when making their own impression of the game because they didn't transform my overall impression of the game in the same way. I'm committing the serious crime of thinking for myself and trusting my own senses.
First, I think that the world should be different based on your previous choices: is Henselt alive? Stannis? Where is Anaïs? There is many characters that has completely disappeared between The Witcher 2 and The Witcher 3, and it's really perturbing. If you want an example of the contrary, Mass Effect 3 is really good at bringing back every important character of the first two games.
The Reason of State is the worst of all for me. Why would you kill Radovid, after two games about how witchers should stay neutral? And who would really choice Djikstra over Vernon Roche, your friend of the previous game?
You can't tell me it is a fact that I felt a certain way a game in a video game, when I know for a fact I did not feel that way. Branching was, so what? For me, it didn't make AP a success as a game, and it didn't make it feel like an RPG, just added a sort of "choose your own adventure" element which I felt was sporadically good. Like I say, there is not much feeling of gaining competence in this sort of decision-making. You just do whatever you feel like at the moment and have no real idea what consequences will occur.Your IMPRESSION of the game is feelings.
The FACT is that the choices were directly made to change numerous outcomes throughout the game at a high quantity. Which is what you want, even if you may personally not like AP itself, if you played it. However, that wouldn't change the fact the mechanic is there.
most rpg players disagree
It's usless and a waste of time. The only thing I care about is the game giving many choices to beat the level.
Should they say its JRPG then? i mean people refer to those as RPG too.When people say The Witcher 3 is an "RPG" unironically, you know the genre is fucked beyond belief.
Sow hat? So you were wrong about your claim from before. Your feelings are not relevant to what the game factually had that you said it didn't have.You can't tell me it is a fact that I felt a certain way a game in a video game, when I know for a fact I did not feel that way. Branching was, so what?
Agree. Take the story off the rails. Refuse to chase the plot and go fishing, or beat the other protagonists up and go furniture shopping. Oh wait, that's Star Wars Galaxies from 2003.The thing that i appreciate the most in an rpg is when my choices matter and affect the story and very few rpgs actually do this most of them are doing it in a very shallow way , they either create the illusion of choice or just give you a couple of choices close to the ending of the game that will determine how the story ends
games like wasteland 3 , divinity original sin , fallout new vegas are doing this perfectly . What is the point of creating a character the way i want if there are no choices that let me use my personality in the game world , there is nothing more immersive than when the things happening in the story are happening because of my actions , not because someone forced those events down my throat
No.Sow hat? So you were wrong about your claim from before. Your feelings are not relevant to what the game factually had that you said it didn't have.
No.
What I said is:
Which is nonsenseThe choices in it do add flavour and maybe some replayability, but they could easily have cut that and it would be largely the same game.
Which is basically trolling.Alpha Protocol is a linear espionage action adventure game that barely qualifies as an RPG just due to who made it and the flavour they added to it.
What is basically trolling is taking what I wrote out of context, where I made it very clear that I was talking about my personal opinion on how I value what the choices added to the game.Which is basically trolling.
What is basically trolling is taking what I wrote out of context, where I made it very clear that I was talking about my personal opinion on how I value what the choices added to the game.
i understand what you are saying , but it is doable , i would rather wait 4-5 years and play a good game than wait 1-2 years and play a mediocre game , ofc it all depends on how talanted are the devs , the game can be in development for 5+ years and still suckThe games already take too long to develop and you want them to spend more time to make the systems even more detailed and intricate??
Mate.....
Then why play RPG's at all? You're looking for adventure and action games, and there are tons of choices, but the whole point of an RPG is those choices and their consequences, as they really give weight to the role you're playing. It's fine to want zero choices in your games, but then why even play RPG's if you clearly don't like the genre when there are so many alternatives to engage with.Hard disagree for me. I want zero choices. The character isn't me and most of the time I don't agree with the choices options anyways. I would rather they spent that time and effort improving the game instead of alternate scenarios that mostly don't really matter anyways, since the permutations would get out of hand fast.
A well made character with their own personality, that is what I want.
All you are saying is that my personal opinions irritated you so much that they made you totally irrational and can't just let me have them or even have my own understanding of what my actual opinions are. I don't care. I'm not a person who never says what they actually think in order to avoid getting into some stupid and embarrassing slap fight with people who can't understand it or handle it.There is no opinion on "but they could easily have cut that and it would be largely the same game." when the choices and consequences literally make more than half the game happen. So you lose the majority of the game if it was taken out.
And then theres you saying it's not an rpg because you didn't like who made them? These aren't reasonable positions in any discourse.
You do know there are different RPGs out there, right? Choices and consequences does not fit in every type of stories.Then why play RPG's at all?
Yes, you're so smart.All you are saying is that my personal opinions irritated you so much that they made you totally irrational and can't just let me have them or even have my own understanding of what my actual opinions are. I don't care. I'm not a person who never says what they actually think in order to avoid getting into some stupid and embarrassing slap fight with people who can't understand it or handle it.
Finally, someone understands how smart I am.Yes, you're so smart.
i dont think that we will get real rpgs from big studios and the reason is that rpgs are very complicated compared to a 10-15 hour action adventure game and will require a lot of money , a big studio that invests alot of money also wants alot of money as profit from their product and an rpg is a very risky because most gamers these days dont like complicated games in which they have to ask themselves , where do i go , what kind of skills i need to use , why are the enemies to op , why doesnt the journal tell me exactly what to do next etc.Need more real RPG's firstly, that's why i liked The Outer World's a lot, New Vegas had the best choices and consequences, it was sadly lacking in Fallout 4, i agree with the OP, personally, hopefully Starfield will have it covered.
i dont think that we will get real rpgs from big studios and the reason is that rpgs are very complicated compared to a 10-15 hour action adventure game and will require a lot of money , a big studio that invests alot of money also wants alot of money as profit from their product and an rpg is a very risky because most gamers these days dont like complicated games in which they have to ask themselves , where do i go , what kind of skills i need to use , why are the enemies to op , why doesnt the journal tell me exactly what to do next etc.
real rpgs come from small devs that still make games because of passion and not money , just look at a game like divinity original sin 2 vs horizon forbidden west , ofc DOS2 is more of an rpg than horizon will ever be but DOS barely sold 2million copies and horizon will most likely surpass 20 million by the end of the gen because it has cutscenes , better graphics , its easy so it doesnt have frustrating moments , it doesnt matter if the game is made for braindead players with puzzles that even a 10 year old could solve and even if you cant solve it dont worry after a couple of minutes aloy will give you the solution herself
All you are saying is that my personal opinions
I'd settle for them having interesting loot. Outside of Elden Ring, rpg loot has been garbage in nearly every one I have played.
Oh, you flatter me. It isn't that big, really.you seem to have a massive boner
The shift from text based to voice based has completely stifled RPGs, particularly western RPGs, of their previous depth. A big reason RPGs of old has the depth they did was because you played as nameless characters you were forced to create a background for that didn't talk, but allowed you to choose decisions or dialogue via text. Fallout New Vegas is such a rich role playing experience by making the main character not have a backstory, not giving them a voice which limits their dialogue and therefore role playing options. In New Vegas you can be whatever, whomever. In Fallout 4, which has voiced main character the depth becomes as deep as a puddle because now they have to consider the MC's voice actor and not the text decisions.There are shit ton of choices and consequences in Witcher 3, both large and small. Same in first two games.
Are they as widely branching as top down games like Pathfinder 2? Not quite. But RPG genre is not limited to top down crpgs.
And obviously, AAA RPGs where you have to model every little thing and voice everything is always going to be more constrained in their possibility space than mostly text-driven top down games. Text can handle a lot.
And there's still clowns peddling fo4 is actually good because their box bought Bethesda.This is why New Vegas is one of the GOATs
And there's still clowns peddling fo4 is actually good because their box bought Bethesda.