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Business Sales-Age Sony Q2: 13.3M+ PS5s; Sales shatter industry records for sixth straight quarter

kingfey

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Lmao no. There's not a chance in hell it would need to sell 7 - 8 million just to start generating profit. That's just utter nonsense.

Just looking at the digital sales alone which were 2.8 million in 2 weeks netted them $160 million, and that's not even accounting for additional revenue generated w/ deluxe
That is still not profit.

It needs to make $300m.

Once you done paying all the budget cost of the game, you will also need to pay the employees bonus, the company which made the game, then sony and their investors.

$180m wont do shit.

Look at avatar movie. It made $1b sales, and its still not profitable.

It needs to pass the target sony put on it, to make it profitable.
 

kingfey

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So is the PS5 back to being the fastest selling console in history on pace for 200 million?
at this target, nope.

It needs 10 years to hit 140m-150m according to its trajectory. That is if there isnt any more shortages.

Their production is their limit as of now.
 

jroc74

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PS5 is a beast...


About TLoU 2 sales....seems like some ppl have to latch onto something hot take worthy, despite the actual charts and informed posts. And probably a lil persecution complex going on.....

When they release the massive numbers for the game, lets revisit this topic. Ppl already posted examples about God of War 2018. That 19.5 million was a legit shock to many ppl.

Hey, like some said...at least there is something to talk, debate about, even if its not the complete numbers.
 
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That is still not profit.

It needs to make $300m.

Once you done paying all the budget cost of the game, you will also need to pay the employees bonus, the company which made the game, then sony and their investors.

$180m wont do shit.

Look at avatar movie. It made $1b sales, and its still not profitable.

It needs to pass the target sony put on it, to make it profitable.

What kind of ass pulling of numbers is this?

If the LOU2 budget is in the ball part of 100 million, then they've covered the dev costs already with the $160 million, yes, Naughty Dog will get a bonus, but that's not costing them tens of millions of dollars lmao.

The rest of the money goes back into Sony as profit. Sony does not get "paid", nor do the investors get "paid". That's not how it works

I'm just going to ignore your comment about Avatar lmao
 
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kingfey

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PS5 is a beast...


About TLoU 2 sales....seems like some ppl have to latch onto something hot take worthy, despite the actual charts and informed posts. And probably a lil persecution complex going on.....

When they release the massive numbers for the game, lets revisit this topic. Ppl already posted examples about God of War 2018. That 19.5 million was a legit shock to many ppl.

Hey, like some said...at least there is something to talk, debate about, even if its not the complete numbers.
The game got hurt by the drama it had. Or else, it would have sold alot.

Then covid hit. most people didnt have enough money for it. Plus other great games dropped at that time too.
 

ethomaz

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Much of the discussion around this game is so damn evasive, so let's cut off the conversation. The game was a sucess. No more updates, they're remaking the first one, but we can rest assure.
Sales charts shows it was really a success.
But if you want hard numbers take Germany for example:

June: > 200k
December: > 500k

It at least doubled the copies sold in 6 months.
 
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kingfey

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What kind of ass pulling of numbers is this?

If the LOU2 budget is in the ball part of 100 million, then they've covered the dev costs already with the $160 million, yes, Naughty Dog will get a bonus, but that's not costing them tens of millions of dollars lmao.

The rest of the money goes back into Sony as profit. Sony does not get "paid", nor do the investors get "paid". That's not how it works
160m-100m is 60m. That isnt enough for big business. Especially when god of war made more money than that.

Gow sold 3.1m in 3 days. This game is less budget cost than tlou2.

for example gow3 cost them 44m. Gow4 would be about 60m. It made close 3x of the budget, if the budget is correct. This is what we call a profit.

Tlou2 havent even broke double the budget. That isnt a profit.

Sony gets paid. Ceo gets paid bonus. Investors gets paid. I have no idea, where you getting not paid.
 

FireFistAce

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Except it was constantly in the TOP seller in US… being at very good position in last 12 months charts (the best exclusive).
Plus it constantly in the UK, Germany, Spain, etc TOP sellers in the first year.
More it was always in a good position in the Digital PS4 top sellers across the 3 regions (US, EU and Japan).

I mean I have no ideia where you guys get TLOU2 stopped to sell just because Sony didn’t release more figures after launch lol
It sold 0.5M in the UK in 2020 and it was out of the top 10 by August in Germany. So we don’t know how much it sold.

Also, where did you get that I said that it stopped selling? It could have sold 10M for all we know.
 

ethomaz

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It sold 0.5M in the UK in 2020 and it was out of the top 10 by August in Germany. So we don’t know how much it sold.

Also, where did you get that I said that it stopped selling? It could have sold 10M for all we know.
It received the >500k award in December in German… so we know.
 
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160m-100m is 60m. That isnt enough for big business. Especially when god of war made more money than that.

Gow sold 3.1m in 3 days. This game is less budget cost than tlou2.

for example gow3 cost them 44m. Gow4 would be about 60m. It made close 3x of the budget, if the budget is correct. This is what we call a profit.

Tlou2 havent even broke double the budget. That isnt a profit.

Sony gets paid. Ceo gets paid bonus. Investors gets paid. I have no idea, where you getting not paid.

Are you trolling? Are you seriously increasing the games budget, based on the CEOs salary?

This is not how financials work

Investors get "paid" through dividends and capital gains, neither of which have anything to do with TLOU2
 
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kingfey

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Are you trolling? Are you seriously increasing the games budget, based on the CEOs salary?

This is not how financials work

Investors get "paid" through dividends and capital gains, neither of which have anything to do with TLOU2
Are you saying Jim wont get any bonuses from tlou2?

maybe i was little rush on investors part. But the company will want money from the game's sales.
 

DeepSpace5D

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Touch a nerve did I? I haven't partaken in all this TLOU2 drama, but I would have this view for any other high profile game.
Maybe if this was a financial report about total game sales, then I would understand not updating TLoU II’s numbers would look suspicious. But none of those games have been updated with total game sales, the closest to current sales date is God of War.

It would take alot more than that to strike a nerve with me my friend. Your assumptions just come off as wishful thinking. Let’s see what the next update for the game shows when Sony decides to reveal it, and we can come back to this if you like.
 
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Are you saying Jim wont get any bonuses from tlou2?

maybe i was little rush on investors part. But the company will want money from the game's sales.

No, Jim doesn't get a bonus based on the performance of a single game.

The remaining money after taxes and expenses IS the money the company gets. It goes back into the books.
 

kingfey

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No, Jim doesn't get a bonus based on the performance of a single game.

The remaining money after taxes and expenses IS the money the company gets. It goes back into the books.
I thought it was like the COD type of payment. after the budget, everyone gets the slice of the money, and ceo gets paid bonus from the game.
 
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ethomaz

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I thought it was like the COD type of payment. after the budget, everyone gets the slice of the money, and ceo gets paid bonus from the game.
The Naughty Dog CEO and employees get bonus based on sales. Not Jim… he only get bonus on results from the whole division.

BTW yes Naughty Dogs CEOs got a big bonus due TLOU2 sales success.
 
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BadBurger

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That is still not profit.

It needs to make $300m.

Once you done paying all the budget cost of the game, you will also need to pay the employees bonus, the company which made the game, then sony and their investors.

$180m wont do shit.

Look at avatar movie. It made $1b sales, and its still not profitable.

It needs to pass the target sony put on it, to make it profitable.

Hollywood financing is notorious for cooking the books so it looks like movies didn't make profit when they most obviously did (in the case of Avatar, fucking truckloads upon truckloads). It's to avoid paying people the points they're owed.

As to the video game finance stuff, you can't just produce arbitrary numbers and percentages and come to conclusions when you don't even have a full grasp of Sony's financials about a game's development, marketing, and distribution. I am inclined to believe the head of the studio rather than some guy on GAF.
 
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DForce

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That sounds weird, that can't be true, even if he said that there is no way they covered those costs with 2-3 million sold.

What kind of ass pulling of numbers is this?

If the LOU2 budget is in the ball part of 100 million, then they've covered the dev costs already with the $160 million, yes, Naughty Dog will get a bonus, but that's not costing them tens of millions of dollars lmao.

The rest of the money goes back into Sony as profit. Sony does not get "paid", nor do the investors get "paid". That's not how it works

I'm just going to ignore your comment about Avatar lmao


At that point you're wondering is this game ever going to come out? And if it does, is it even going to be successful? Just cause it felt all the noise was so negative around it. But then there was a nice turn, twist, you know to get the positive reviews that we got the game to be successful as it was, you know we were profitable from day one. And it felt like a moment of relief.

Starts at 10:50
 

ethomaz

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Something can sell a lot and still be a disappointment. Imagine it sold less than TLoU or even God of War. Or Spider-Man. TLoU2 was meant to be the biggest PS4 game at release.
I do believe it sold more than TLOU.
TLOU sold from June 2013 to March 2014 6 million units.
In June 2014 it crossed 7 million.

TLOU2 probably topped that in 2020 alone… sold 4m launch and from UK and Germany sales you can draw that it sold way more than 2 million until end of the year.

People need to remember that 17 million sold accounts for a very successful remaster for PS4.
 
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kyliethicc

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That sounds weird, that can't be true, even if he said that there is no way they covered those costs with 2-3 million sold.
4 million sold at launch is gross of around 250 million, then Sony takes like 200 million of that. That's probably enough to be profitable from the jump even for its high budget.

They get 100% of digital sales, but less of physical sales, etc.
Most copies were $60, but some were $70+ deluxe/collector editions.
 

DeepSpace5D

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Something can sell a lot and still be a disappointment. Imagine it sold less than TLoU or even God of War. Or Spider-Man. TLoU2 was meant to be the biggest PS4 game at release.
I can’t really envision a scenario where TLoU II isn’t outpacing TLoU when it took 13 months for TLoU to sell 7 million copies and the sequel sold 4 million in 3 days. Is it honestly realistic to think it didn’t sell another 3 million copies in 13 months?

TLoU II is still continually in the “popular games this week” category on PSNProfiles by the way even right now and you can check that. Every other game on that list is either brand new or released very recently. TLoU II is the only older game still in that category. There are also more total players for TLoU II on PSNP than Ghost of Tsushima + Ghost of Tsushima: Director’s Cut combined.

PSNProfiles is not hard sales data by any means, but by all accounts it has outsold Ghost of Tsushima and that game was at 6.5 million back in April.
 
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Topher

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160m-100m is 60m. That isnt enough for big business. Especially when god of war made more money than that.

Gow sold 3.1m in 3 days. This game is less budget cost than tlou2.

for example gow3 cost them 44m. Gow4 would be about 60m. It made close 3x of the budget, if the budget is correct. This is what we call a profit.

Tlou2 havent even broke double the budget. That isnt a profit.

Sony gets paid. Ceo gets paid bonus. Investors gets paid. I have no idea, where you getting not paid.

I'm sorry, but you are throwing out a lot of numbers as if they are facts. I don't see how you could possibly know any of this information on GOW or TLOU 2 budgets.
 
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kingfey

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Aren't you "concerned"
Why?

I enjoyed the game, because I never gave a crap about those drama.

Its just launch window was shit storm for the game. Fans fighting each other over it.

All these shits lost momentum for the game, especially, when animal crossing was doing 10m to 30m at the end of the year. That year was a great launch opportunity for the game, but ruined by the drama.
 

CitizenZ

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Really confusing, everyone here says they are not playing Cod, or havent played a CoD since MW2 or 3(cant keep up) and yet there it sits on top, every year for every console.
 
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S0ULZB0URNE

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All these shits lost momentum for the game, especially, when animal crossing was doing 10m to 30m at the end of the year. That year was a great launch opportunity for the game, but ruined by the drama.
Makes sense now..
 
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kingfey

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I'm sorry, but you are throwing out a lot of numbers as if they are facts. I don't see how you could possibly know any of this information on GOW or TLOU 2 budgets.
God of War sold 3.1 million copies in its first three days out, Sony announced Thursday, making it the fastest-selling PS4-exclusive game in the console's five-year history. Between April 20 and 22, God of War unseated Uncharted 4: A Thief's End, which hit 2.7 million in sales in its first week.

That is god of war launch window.

3.1m x 60=$186m in 3 days.

Sony: God Of War III budget is $44 million.Mar 9, 2010

This was God of war 3. With gow4 having graphic enhanced and start from scratch, the budget will be around 60m-80m.

Lou2 budget estimate according to journalist

The Last of Us 2 reportedly cost over $100 million to make, though actual figures have not been made public.Jul 2, 2020

That is more than 100m.

We already knew that Naughty Dog's The Last of Us Part 2 was 2020's biggest launch to date across both retail and digital sales, and PlayStation had already announced spectacular sales for The Last of Us Part 2, with Naughty Dog confirming the sequel had shifted four million copies during its opening weekend, making it ...Aug 16, 2020

That is week 1 sales.

4m x 60= 240m.

There is no actual lou2 budget. All we have is over 100m.
 
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DeepSpace5D

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Sony: God Of War III budget is $44 million.Mar 9, 2010

This was God of war 3. With gow4 having graphic enhanced and start from scratch, the budget will be around 60m-80m.
But isn’t this part just pure guesswork from you again?

If I think of the drastic changes that were made from God of War III to God of War on PS4, I have a hard time believing it was achieved for $16 million more than GoW III. Your low-end estimate of $60 mil seems…low.

I could give my own guess of 80-100 mil. Whose to say which one of us is more accurate?

But what we can say is that Shawn Layden recently said the big AAA first-party games on PS4 cost approximately $100 million each. I would certainly put God of War in the category of big AAA games for the console.
 

ethomaz

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Really confusing, everyone here says they are not playing Cod, or havent played a CoD since MW2 or 3(cant keep up) and yet there it sits on top, every year for every console.
A lot gamers play CoD… a lot only plays CoD and nothing else.
 
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Topher

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God of War sold 3.1 million copies in its first three days out, Sony announced Thursday, making it the fastest-selling PS4-exclusive game in the console's five-year history. Between April 20 and 22, God of War unseated Uncharted 4: A Thief's End, which hit 2.7 million in sales in its first week.

That is god of war launch window.

3.1m x 60=$186m in 3 days.

Sony: God Of War III budget is $44 million.Mar 9, 2010

This was God of war 3. With gow4 having graphic enhanced and start from scratch, the budget will be around 60m-80m.

Lou2 budget estimate according to journalist

The Last of Us 2 reportedly cost over $100 million to make, though actual figures have not been made public.Jul 2, 2020

That is more than 100m.

We already knew that Naughty Dog's The Last of Us Part 2 was 2020's biggest launch to date across both retail and digital sales, and PlayStation had already announced spectacular sales for The Last of Us Part 2, with Naughty Dog confirming the sequel had shifted four million copies during its opening weekend, making it ...Aug 16, 2020

That is week 1 sales.

4m x 60= 240m.

There is no actual lou2 budget. All we have is over 100m.

A "journalist" isn't going to know the budget any more than you do unless Sony actually reveals those numbers or he has a source. There is no real data here. Only supposition. I think you would do well to emphasize that posts with unsubstantiated data are simply you guessing and making assumptions.
 
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jroc74

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Who would have guessed that not releasing the current numbers for TLoU 2 would trigger some ppl into creating wild ass fantasy narratives. Its amazing that these financial results resulted in a ban and a scavenger hunt for something negative...

Imagine trying to mention profit as a negative....when Sony at least posts the actual numbers for profits..


At that point you're wondering is this game ever going to come out? And if it does, is it even going to be successful? Just cause it felt all the noise was so negative around it. But then there was a nice turn, twist, you know to get the positive reviews that we got the game to be successful as it was, you know we were profitable from day one. And it felt like a moment of relief.

Starts at 10:50

I would love to see the response to this.
 

kingfey

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A "journalist" isn't going to know the budget any more than you do unless Sony actually reveals those numbers or he has a source. There is no real data here. Only supposition. I think you would do well to emphasize that posts with unsubstantiated data are simply you guessing and making assumptions.
Development. Ghost of Tsushima had a budget of $60 million

that is 1 single search.

no way, God of War would be much higher than ghost of Tsushima in term of budget.

the problem with God of war was the camera. Most of the stuff was in their file assets.

Tlou2 is kinda different. Modern era, and the development time.

Spiderman costed somewhere around 224m to make.
 

Bragr

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?...well it sold more then 2 or 3 million.

It sold 4 million physical in 3 days, it sold 2.8 million digital on PSN opening month, not even the full month mind you so it like sold more in its first 4 weeks then what was reported by Sony.

Sooooo less then a month its at like 7 million.

I'm more then sure they covered that games development as 10 million is not the norm to even be fucking saying shit like "no way they covered" this or that when this game isn't even multiplatorm. Almost no AAA game can cover its sales using this odd ass logic as how much units do you really think was needed to cover a AAA game on 1 system?

So I don't know what to tell you, when even the person who made the fucking game is telling you its profitable and the publisher is happy about record sales, record awards etc yet "sounds weird, that can't be true", if not the person who made the game telling you this, then who? Who else would need to even tell you this information as you didn't even know it moved 4 million in 3 days... yet we doubt the very person that made the game though? We need a objective factual base here lol
Read what I replied to, day one. Not total.
 

Bragr

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4 million sold at launch is gross of around 250 million, then Sony takes like 200 million of that. That's probably enough to be profitable from the jump even for its high budget.

They get 100% of digital sales, but less of physical sales, etc.
Most copies were $60, but some were $70+ deluxe/collector editions.
We are talking day one though, not a week or 2, that's what I don't understand, day one must have been 1.5 maybe 2.5 million, that can't be enough to cover costs on such a game.

And how do you know that 4 million is gross 250 million? this game must have a development budget of well over 100 million, as well as a marketing budget even higher. How do you know what they get per digital and physical?
 
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Development. Ghost of Tsushima had a budget of $60 million

that is 1 single search.

no way, God of War would be much higher than ghost of Tsushima in term of budget.

the problem with God of war was the camera. Most of the stuff was in their file assets.

Tlou2 is kinda different. Modern era, and the development time.

Spiderman costed somewhere around 224m to make.

You need to stop chucking random numbers around. Baseless speculation you got from google are not facts.

I mean jesus christ where on earth did you even get such a ridiculous number for spiderman?
 
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IDKFA

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And yet, trying to find the Holy Grail is still easier than trying to get a PS5.

Incredible results.
 
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FrankWza

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In case of these APUs that is not the case.
No blame on S it's on all on MSFT.
Puts an asterisk on the sales “success” of the console. It’s basically the only option if you want to buy into their ecosystem. Or buy a pc. Combined with the proprietary storage expansion it gives a pretty rigid vibe to a new customer or a returning loyal customer to want to buy in.
 
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3M wont cover it. They need 5m to cover the entire cost. Then another 2-3m for profit.

The game will still incur cost, due to dlc, patches, and any sales issues.

You also need to account the % cost of the retails. There is also the cost of shipping and moving the physicals games. Unless they add all those on making the game cost.

At least six years in the making, with a crew of thousands and a budget likely in the neighborhood of $100 million, Sony's The Last of Us Part II could easily be confused with a big-screen action epic.Aug 28, 2020

That is just making the game. you need to account the marketing, and other budgets.

Dude...the game was profitable from day one.

It sold over 4M copies in 3 days. At 100% full price, with special editions and all. Even if all editions sold had been the standard and sold at $60/€60 (which it didn't) that would be $240M. This is if the game had been sold only for that weekend alone. Again, not counting special editions. I know not all money goes to Sony but still it's an incredible success and the biggest Sony release ever until now. Not even Spider-Man managed that revenue in its first 3 days.

The game was the 4th biggest seller in the USA alone in revenue for its first full year.

Naughty Dog is working as a TLOU machine right now with a TLOU remake and Factions was upgraded and it's now a much bigger scale than initially projected. Plus, the TV show that started filming way after the game debuted.

Sony would never have its top studio working 100% on an IP which its latest game had underperformed, lmao. Come on now. If anything, they couldn't be happier.
 

ethomaz

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We are talking day one though, not a week or 2, that's what I don't understand, day one must have been 1.5 maybe 2.5 million, that can't be enough to cover costs on such a game.

And how do you know that 4 million is gross 250 million? this game must have a development budget of well over 100 million, as well as a marketing budget even higher. How do you know what they get per digital and physical?
4 million x $60 = $240 million
But it is probably a bit more because EU is more than $60.

In any case Naughty Dogs confirmed they were profitable already with day one sales… so you don’t need to make assumptions about astronomical development budget to create a spin.
 
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Duchess

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Sony's internal database for tracking game sales:

select count(1) from game_sales where title = 'tlou2' and date <= '2020-06-21';

4000000

select count(1) from game_sales where title = 'tlou2' and date >= '2020-06-22';

0

Pretty obvious to me :)
 

ethomaz

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I just read more about the whole financials.

Seems like Mobile is finally getting up for Sony... it is really good news.
The Xperia phones was not bad at all.