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The Verge: Microsoft has discontinued all Xbox One consoles

Lognor

Banned
Jim Ryan will never live that quote down. Context IS important and that came on the heels of Phil defending his cross gen stance. He knew what he was doing. He also was extremely cagey about GOW, GT7, Horizon and Miles being cross gen. He was actually asked point blank at launch if GOW was cross gen like Horizon and Miles and he refused to answer the question.
So true. And people trying to explain what he meant was laughable. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing. He comes off as pretty scummy. I would not trust the guy's word going forward.
 
Because its captured using the ps5. Its form of market deception. They arent telling their audience the game is coming to ps4. Just a ps5 showcase. Make your mind with that.

No one is arguing about the omissions. They're saying it's not the same thing like they did with GT, where they litterally slapped PS5 exclusive on it and then backtracked
 
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Tripolygon

Member
Showing a ps5 footage, indicates its a ps5 exclusive game. You dont show one system, and hide the other. That is a marketing deception, since it would make your audience think, the game is ps5 exclusive.
That's not how that works, otherwise, every game that has been advertised using high-end hardware will be considered deception as my measly GTX 860m would cry if even play the youtube video at 4K. Lol
 

kingfey

Banned
No one is arguing about the omissions. They're saying it's not the same thing like they did with GT, where they litterally slapped PS5 exclusive on it and then backtracked
That GT one was clear. The problem with HFW is the market deception. The way the trailer was showcased. It showed the power of the ps5. At one point did they bother reporting the game was coming to ps4.
 
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Mr Moose

Member
Everyone knows its playstation exclusive. But what system? All we got was a ps5 showcase. no ps4 at all.
Because they were showing off the PS5 version not the PS4 version. The GT7 version says PS5 exclusive, not PlayStation exclusive, and they lied.
If it was PS5 exclusive, they would say so (like they did with GT7) and not just PlayStation exclusve.
 
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Lognor

Banned
He said what he said in full context, that you don't bother reading the entire paragraph, and instead run with a clickbait headline is on you.
Oh? When he went on to say:

"We do believe in generations, and whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used... we are thinking that it is time to give the PlayStation community something new, something different, that can really only be enjoyed on PS5."

Can HZD2 only be enjoyed on PS5? No. Can GOW 2? No. Can GT7? No.

So what is the context? Please explain the context where he meant that they believe in generations, so for the next several years the vast majority of the games they release will be available on last gen consoles. How is that believing in generations?
 

Mr Moose

Member
should they have clarified that it coming to ps4?
They kinda did? It says PlayStation exclusive.
Dark Souls, R & C and so on says PS5 exclusive, Horizon does not.
GT7 was a lie, not sure when they knew it wasn't going to be just a PS5 game but they lied either way.
 

Tripolygon

Member
should they have clarified that it coming to ps4?
I really don't understand this at all. Why does it matter to you when they choose to advertise the game on PS4? We see this all the time with timed exclusive games, we all know the game is coming to other platforms at some point but does it matter that the game is being advertised exclusively on one platform?
 
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Topher

Gold Member
Then, why did they showcased the ps5 gameplay? Why didnt they not announce the game was coming to ps4?

If you don't understand why Sony would want to market the PS5 footage of their upcoming PS5 console then no use discussing it further.

Oh? When he went on to say:



Can HZD2 only be enjoyed on PS5? No. Can GOW 2? No. Can GT7? No.

So what is the context? Please explain the context where he meant that they believe in generations, so for the next several years the vast majority of the games they release will be available on last gen consoles. How is that believing in generations?

Did you read the same sentence I did? What part of "whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used" did you not understand?
 
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kingfey

Banned
I really don't understand this at all. Why does it matter to you when they choose to advertise the game on PS4? We see this all the time with timed exclusive games, we all know the game is coming to other platforms at some point but does it matter that the game is being advertized exclusively on one platform?
Because that is what microsoft was grilled for. The fact that there games was coming to old gen. While PlayStation was doing whatever they can, to not show that ps4 logo. And guess what, people got pissed off, when they discovered it. We had an uproar here, when it was announced that those games were coming to ps4.
 

Mr Moose

Member
Oh? When he went on to say:



Can HZD2 only be enjoyed on PS5? No. Can GOW 2? No. Can GT7? No.

So what is the context? Please explain the context where he meant that they believe in generations, so for the next several years the vast majority of the games they release will be available on last gen consoles. How is that believing in generations?
Yeah, talking about features that are only available on PS5, not the PS4.
"We have always said that we believe in generations. We believe that when you go to all the trouble of creating a next-gen console, that it should include features and benefits that the previous generation does not include. And that, in our view, people should make games that can make the most of those features.

"We do believe in generations, and whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used... we are thinking that it is time to give the PlayStation community something new, something different, that can really only be enjoyed on PS5."
 

leo-j

Member
This i typical of microsoft tho? They kill off their last gen console year of the new console release. Sony keeps the system on the market for a couple years after the new gen.
 

kingfey

Banned
If you don't understand why Sony would want to market the PS5 footage of their upcoming PS5 console then no use discussing it further.
again, no one is arguing about that. They showed the power of ps5, and kudos to them. But that doesn't change the fact, that they havent announced it for the ps4, during the showcase.
 

Lognor

Banned
Yes? Those features can really only be enjoyed on PS5. Is that hard to understand?
That's what your going with? That's the context you're using? LOL....interesting

So you read it as him saying that yes, almost every PS5 game will also be available on the PS4 for the next 2-3 years, but if you do buy the PS5 version you get a couple of additional novel features? Really? That's your reading of it. hmmmm...
 

Lognor

Banned
Yeah, talking about features that are only available on PS5, not the PS4.
So he is saying these cross gen games can be played, but they can't be enjoyed, on the PS4? He said, thos games "can really only be enjoyed on PS5". So where does that leave the PS4 version of all those cross gen games? Unenjoyable? That's the meaning of his words? I gotta say, that isn't helping your argument!
 

Mr Moose

Member
So he is saying these cross gen games can be played, but they can't be enjoyed, on the PS4? He said, thos games "can really only be enjoyed on PS5". So where does that leave the PS4 version of all those cross gen games? Unenjoyable? That's the meaning of his words? I gotta say, that isn't helping your argument!
Is English not your first language?
The features can only be enjoyed on the PS5, they aren't on the PS4.

Or are you deliberately taking things out of context?
"We do believe in generations, and whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used... we are thinking that it is time to give the PlayStation community something new, something different, that can really only be enjoyed on PS5."
 
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Concern

Member
So Sony is producing a million Ps4s to help with demand and MS cutting the One to try focusing on more Series consoles lol.

They're both going in completely different directions dealing with the constraints. This gen is going to be interesting.
 

Topher

Gold Member
So where does that leave the PS4 version of all those cross gen games? Unenjoyable?

Ice Cube Reaction GIF
 

Tripolygon

Member
Because that is what microsoft was grilled for. The fact that there games was coming to old gen. While PlayStation was doing whatever they can, to not show that ps4 logo. And guess what, people got pissed off, when they discovered it. We had an uproar here, when it was announced that those games were coming to ps4.
That is not what Microsoft was grilled for. Microsoft was grilled by some gaming media and audiences for not committing to providing any exclusives for their next-gen system. There was no first-party exclusive at launch for Xbox Series X/S and they committed to making most of their releases for the next 2 to 3 years on both last-gen and current-gen. As we can see, most of their games were 2 to 4 years out except for the usual Horizon, Halo. Hellblade 2 is said to be cross-gen but only advertized for Xbox Series X/S, is anyone complaining?

Sony did not make any such promises. They committed to providing some exclusives which they did and some cross-gen stuff. GOW was always cross-gen for example, Horizon was always cross-gen but the PS4 version was revealed ~2 months after the PS5 version, GT7 based on what some "insiders" say was a late port to PS4. Games like Spiderman 2 is said to be next-gen only.
 
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SlimySnake

Member
Rent-free in people's heads while in the real world he is focusing on creating amazing gaming experiences, announcing VR at CES, and anticipating the launch of PSVR 2.

This is not the first Jim Ryan quote taken out of context and I'm sure it won't be the last.
Eh. I thought 2021 was the worst year for PS first party in almost a decade.

And what does he have lined up for next year? Three last gen games? Hardly amazing.
 

Lognor

Banned
Is English not your first language?
The features can only be enjoyed on the PS5, they aren't on the PS4.

Or are you deliberately taking things out of context?
"We do believe in generations, and whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used... we are thinking that it is time to give the PlayStation community something new, something different, that can really only be enjoyed on PS5."
So defensive! Is English not your first language?

Where does he say features? He says it is time to give the PS community something...you're saying that something is features?

You are wrong.

Go back and read that article. Jim Ryan gave an interview to Christopher Dring. Dring writes:

One way to keep PS4 users engaged would be to make upcoming PS5 games playable on the older machine, just like Microsoft is proposing with its Xbox Series X games being playable on Xbox One. Yet Ryan says that's not something PlayStation is interested in doing.

"We have always said that we believe in generations. We believe that when you go to all the trouble of creating a next-gen console, that it should include features and benefits that the previous generation does not include. And that, in our view, people should make games that can make the most of those features.

Notice the paragraph prior to Ryan's quote. Dring interviewed him. His impression was that Ryan meant when he said they believe in generations that they were not going to be doing cross gen games. "It's not something PlayStation is interested in doing."

Maybe you need to read the article or study up on your English because you're failing left and right.

If you have video of the interview show it. Otherwise we need to rely on Dring's interview. Ryan said what he said and it's very clear what his intent was. No need for you to defend him so vehemently.
 

Mr Moose

Member
So defensive! Is English not your first language?

Where does he say features? He says it is time to give the PS community something...you're saying that something is features?

You are wrong.
Well, yes, I am English.
Are you serious? Where does it say features?
"We have always said that we believe in generations. We believe that when you go to all the trouble of creating a next-gen console, that it should include features and benefits that the previous generation does not include. And that, in our view, people should make games that can make the most of those features.
Oh look here, he talks about those features.
"We do believe in generations, and whether it's the DualSense controller, whether it's the 3D audio, whether it's the multiple ways that the SSD can be used... we are thinking that it is time to give the PlayStation community something new, something different, that can really only be enjoyed on PS5."
 

DaGwaphics

Member
Does anyone here really think that Sony's initial talk about "believing in generations" was not meant to insinuate that first-party titles were going to be PS5 only going forward? There are threads from the time that we can check. 🤭

Doesn't make much difference at the end of the day I guess. HFW looks amazing as did FH5, talent can make cross-gen work.
 

Ozriel

Member
I wish Ryan had pointed out that error, but he probably isn't worried about correcting things for the sake of console warrior debates, which is the only place this stuff is even repeated. Factually, he and Lempel in the interview I linked previously talk about continuing to support PS4 even as gamers move toward PS5. Why would they continue to say those things over and over if they were not planning on supporting PS4?


The general, overwhelming interpretation of that ‘believe in generations’ article was that Sony was planning to keep their AAA titles next-gen exclusive. We had a series of articles about this, contrasting it with Xbox at the time.
Here's the GAF thread following that interview. Not a single one of you argued against that interpretation


The thread was even titled "Cross-gen games risk stifling innovation"!

Not only did Sony not correct this impression, they hid the fact that Miles Morales and Horizon FW were also going to be on PS4 until September 2020. Months after reveal. And then hid the cross gen status for GT7 and GOW Ragnarok until June 2021.

Maybe if people learned to read past the headlines we wouldn't be talking about this shit still.

Nothing needs to be corrected, clearly talking about the differences the new generation brings, features PS5 has over PS4.
Also, it's from an Edge interview in 2020, where are you getting August 2021 from?

The quote in your previous post was from August 2021. Scroll up.
 

Mr Moose

Member
The quote in your previous post was from August 2021. Scroll up.
No, it wasn't.
Friday, December 04, 2020
Ryan’s statement comes from the latest issue of Edge Magazine, where he talked about the company’s obligations to the 100+ million PS4 owners out there. “We do feel that we have a responsibility to that very large community, and an opportunity to carry on making great PS4 games for as long as the need is there,” Ryan stated. “And I think that is the right thing to do, it’s the rational thing to do, and I think you will see a tail with PS4 that you did not see with PS3. But that said, as time passes, you’re going to see more and more emphasis on PS5 development and the PS5 SKU will be the lead SKU.
It's from Edge magazine in 2020.
 

Lognor

Banned
Well, yes, I am English.
Are you serious? Where does it say features?

Oh look here, he talks about those features.
I like how you conveniently left out the context in which Dring used Ryan's quote. How can you explain this? Do you have a rebuttal from Dring on this? Did he make a mistake? Did he assume that? Or (more likely) was that the context of the discussion at that point?

Here it is again for you:

One way to keep PS4 users engaged would be to make upcoming PS5 games playable on the older machine, just like Microsoft is proposing with its Xbox Series X games being playable on Xbox One. Yet Ryan says that's not something PlayStation is interested in doing.
 

Mr Moose

Member
I like how you conveniently left out the context in which Dring used Ryan's quote. How can you explain this? Do you have a rebuttal from Dring on this? Did he make a mistake? Did he assume that? Or (more likely) was that the context of the discussion at that point?

Here it is again for you:
Why would I give a shit about what Dring's impression of it was when we have the whole quote right there? Where does the generations part mention no cross-gen? Show me, please!

Anyway why are we still going on about this generations stuff now? This is a Xbox One thread about the console being discontinued. If we keep going around in circles, then the title needs changing.
 
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Topher

Gold Member
The general, overwhelming interpretation of that ‘believe in generations’ article was that Sony was planning to keep their AAA titles next-gen exclusive. We had a series of articles about this, contrasting it with Xbox at the time.
Here's the GAF thread following that interview. Not a single one of you argued against that interpretation

It would be pretty hard for me to argue anything since I wasn't even a member of GAF at that point. I will say that I have argued in the past that the "we believe in generations" line was stupid PR, but I too had fallen in that trap of not reading the entire quote. When others pointed out how badly out of context that line was then I corrected my stance. Factually, at no point did Jim Ryan say there would be no more first party games. That some interpreted it that way, including myself for a while, doesn't change anything about that fact.
 

Tripolygon

Member
I like how you conveniently left out the context in which Dring used Ryan's quote. How can you explain this? Do you have a rebuttal from Dring on this? Did he make a mistake? Did he assume that? Or (more likely) was that the context of the discussion at that point?

Here it is again for you:
That statement is factual. They have games like Demon's Souls remake, Returnal, Ratchet & Clank RA, etc which are PS5 exclusive games.
 
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Mr Moose

Member
It would be pretty hard for me to argue anything since I wasn't even a member of GAF at that point. I will say that I have argued in the past that the "we believe in generations" line was stupid PR, but I too had fallen in that trap of not reading the entire quote. When others pointed out how badly out of context that line was then I corrected my stance. Factually, at no point did Jim Ryan say there would be no more first party games. That some interpreted it that way, including myself for a while, doesn't change anything about that fact.
Everyone wanted to believe it to be true because who wants to be tied the shitty CPU in PS4/Xbox One?
It would be better if it was meant that way, but yeah it was about features.
 
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Topher

Gold Member
That statement is factual. They had games like Demon's Souls remake Ratchet and Clank RA which they intend to keep as PS5 exclusives and they don't want to bring it to PS4.

And that was reiterated by Lempel in the Keighley interview when discussing the DualSense. As well as the fact that PS4 had more content on the way. This whole ordeal is an exercise in selective reading.
 

kingfey

Banned
That is not what Microsoft was grilled for. Microsoft was grilled by some gaming media and audiences for not committing to providing any exclusives for their next-gen system. There was no first-party exclusive at launch for Xbox Series X/S and they committed to making most of their releases for the next 2 to 3 years on both last-gen and current-gen. As we can see, most of their games were 2 to 4 years out except for the usual Horizon, Halo. Hellblade 2 is said to be cross-gen but only advertized for Xbox Series X/S, is anyone complaining?

Sony did not make any such promises. They committed to providing some exclusives which they did and some cross-gen stuff. GOW was always cross-gen for example, Horizon was always cross-gen but the PS4 version was revealed ~2 months after the PS5 version, GT7 based on what some "insiders" say was a late port to PS4. Games like Spiderman 2 is said to be next-gen only.
MS was clear as day, about their games. They were grilled by the media, and everyone here. At least, they were upfront on their e3.

Sony weren't. Stop trying to make the excuse for them. They literally haven't announced for the old gen. They were all in for the next gen. It was clear as day. They committed Market deception. And tried to increase the hype of the ps5, before going back and and announcing that it was coming on the other console.

I dont why you are trying to change the narrative there. We literally had people get angry about it here. Social media exploded about it.

If you dont believe me, you can search it on this website, and tell me if I am wrong.
 

Lognor

Banned
Why would I give a shit about what Dring's impression of it was when we have the whole quote right there? Where does the generations part mention no cross-gen? Show me, please!

Anyway why are we still going on about this generations stuff now? This is a Xbox One thread about the console being discontinued. If we keep going around in circles, then the title needs changing.
You should care because DRING WAS INTERVIEWING HIM! Anything can be taken out of context, so unless you have video we have to rely on the context given by the interviewer. It's not that hard to understand. Dring's impression means a hell of a lot more than yours, no offense. After all he was the one talking to him and he was the one that drafted the article. And you're saying why would you give a shit about his impression? LOL. I can't with you.

And you're right. You should end the argument. You realize you've lost.
 

Tripolygon

Member
And that was reiterated by Lempel in the Keighley interview when discussing the DualSense. As well as the fact that PS4 had more content on the way. This whole ordeal is an exercise in selective reading.
Yup, people like to think it's all or nothing even though there is a whole middle ground where you can have both exclusives as well as cross-gen stuff.
 

Mr Moose

Member
You should care because DRING WAS INTERVIEWING HIM! Anything can be taken out of context, so unless you have video we have to rely on the context given by the interviewer. It's not that hard to understand. Dring's impression means a hell of a lot more than yours, no offense. After all he was the one talking to him and he was the one that drafted the article. And you're saying why would you give a shit about his impression? LOL. I can't with you.

And you're right. You should end the argument. You realize you've lost.
The only thing I've lost is brain cells talking to you about this.
The quotes are right there, you can read "HA HE SAID NO CROSS-GEN!" all you want, people with eyes can read what was actually said by Jim.
 
series s is cheaper than a Switch :messenger_tears_of_joy: not including the Lite of course. prices here:

Switch Lite - £180-200
Series S - £240-250
Switch (2019) - £260
Switch OLED - £310.

The part that bugs me about Nintendo is the additional costs. When you're looking at controllers and retail games costs beyond the initial hardware it's way over double or triple the cost day one. You buy a Series S + Gamepass and you're into a library so large and diverse it's insane.
 

Tripolygon

Member
MS was clear as day, about their games. They were grilled by the media, and everyone here. At least, they were upfront on their e3.

Sony weren't. Stop trying to make the excuse for them. They literally haven't announced for the old gen. They were all in for the next gen. It was clear as day. They committed Market deception. And tried to increase the hype of the ps5, before going back and and announcing that it was coming on the other console.

I dont why you are trying to change the narrative there. We literally had people get angry about it here. Social media exploded about it.

If you dont believe me, you can search it on this website, and tell me if I am wrong.
You are wrong, you fell for a media clickbait headline as many people are prone to do. Choosing to focus marketing on high-end hardware is not marketing deception unless you are willing to say Hellblade 2 is marketing deception as only the Xbox Series X version, not even the S version is being advertised.
 

Hawking Radiation

Gold Member
Eh. I thought 2021 was the worst year for PS first party in almost a decade.

And what does he have lined up for next year? Three last gen games? Hardly amazing.
??

Gran Turismo - PS highest selling racing franchise with 80.04 million units worldwide as of 2019.
Horizon FW - quickly established itself as an elite franchise off a successful first entry and having scooped up some awards along the way.
God Of War - fresh off a Game of the Year award.

And what's even better is that both the PS4 and PS5 community gets to enjoy these games this year.

And you call that hardly amazing. Would like to know what's amazing to you.
 
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Kagey K

Member
I remember getting dog plied back then for having the audacity to say GoT wouldn't be the last Sony game on PS4, now everybody claims it was obvious and that quote was taken out of context.

You can't make this shit up. 😅
 

kingfey

Banned
You are wrong, you fell for a media clickbait headline as many people are prone to do. Choosing to focus marketing on high-end hardware is not marketing deception unless you are willing to say Hellblade 2 is marketing deception as only the Xbox Series X version, not even the S version is being advertised.
Let me ask you this question. Did Sony announced these games for ps4, during their show case in 2020?
 

Tripolygon

Member
Let me ask you this question. Did Sony announced these games for ps4, during their show case in 2020?
You didn't answer my question. Is Microsoft committing marketing deception by not advertising the Xbox Series S and Xbox One version of Hellblade 2?
 
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