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Tomb Raider Review Thread!

Amir0x

Banned
I have another way of approaching the series, I don't play it :) This will be my first TR in a long time (maybe since the TR 3 or around there). Basically because of what you described the series being about. I really don't enjoy the part of the game where you have to spend a good chunk of time looking at an environment wondering how the hell it all fits together and what you need to do to get past it. I even got frustrated with that stuff in Uncharted 2 (big statue puzzle) and Darksiders (where you are first introduced to firebombs). I'll make myself clear, neither of those were beyond me in terms of figuring them out, I am just not willing to spend 30 minutes looking at a puzzle in an effort to solve it (in most cases) and especially hate where a lot of traversal is involved (climbing over stuff, pulling a lever, moving to the next lever, going back to previous lever, etc).

Actually a lot of games have that sort of stuff these days and I don't enjoy it. I do however enjoy the puzzle aspect of things like Dishonored (trying to get past the assassins without getting caught using only the basic blink in the Flooded District for example) and the combat puzzles in Mass Effect (fighting waves of enemies on the hexagonal platforms in the Collector ship).

I would say that all in all I am not prone to liking puzzles but weird things grab me (Are they really puzzles? Maybe combat puzzles as you put them are actually strategy and tactics problems). It might be down to how easily I can reset back to trying again (very fast in Dishonored) as I really hate having to replay chunks of stuff, or maybe it is up to how many options I feel that I have available as I really don't like traditional puzzles that only offer one set solution, as opposed to my Dishonored example which offers a wide range of possible movement paths through the guards who themselves are moving.

Yeah that's perfectly reasonable, that basically amounts to someone having specific genre preferences. And I can totally understand those who never liked the series and now find something to love in this one: it's completely different than past TR titles, so naturally it'd appeal to lots of new folk as well.

I enjoy the good rub of sitting there staring at a particularly difficult problem, wondering aloud what I haven't tried yet, and then having that sudden "eureka!" moment wherein I rush in joy to finalize a solution that was so obvious I can't believe I never thought of it before!

Ah that feel is #secondtonone

#icant with the dialogue in this game.

Weapon Spoiler:

Enemy: "OMG She's got a
Grenade Launcher
!"

Lara: "
That's right bastards! I'm coming for you all!
!"

I'm surprised she doesn't lick the pick axe she gets and mumble to herself over how many ways she is going to slice up the bodies of her victims.

That said, of all the problems this game has, a shitty story is so far down my priority list. Almost all game stories are shitty, I include all Tomb Raider games in that sphere, and I expected no change in this latest attempt at narrative, particularly as it's married to dudebro nonsense. These motherfuckers just have no idea what to do with game stories.
 
I have another way of approaching the series, I don't play it :) This will be my first TR in a long time (maybe since the TR 3 or around there). Basically because of what you described the series being about. I really don't enjoy the part of the game where you have to spend a good chunk of time looking at an environment wondering how the hell it all fits together and what you need to do to get past it. I even got frustrated with that stuff in Uncharted 2 (big statue puzzle) and Darksiders (where you are first introduced to firebombs). I'll make myself clear, neither of those were beyond me in terms of figuring them out, I am just not willing to spend 30 minutes looking at a puzzle in an effort to solve it (in most cases) and especially hate where a lot of traversal is involved (climbing over stuff, pulling a lever, moving to the next lever, going back to previous lever, etc).

Actually a lot of games have that sort of stuff these days and I don't enjoy it. I do however enjoy the puzzle aspect of things like Dishonored (trying to get past the assassins without getting caught using only the basic blink in the Flooded District for example) and the combat puzzles in Mass Effect (fighting waves of enemies on the hexagonal platforms in the Collector ship).

I would say that all in all I am not prone to liking puzzles but weird things grab me (Are they really puzzles? Maybe combat puzzles as you put them are actually strategy and tactics problems). It might be down to how easily I can reset back to trying again (very fast in Dishonored) as I really hate having to replay chunks of stuff, or maybe it is up to how many options I feel that I have available as I really don't like traditional puzzles that only offer one set solution, as opposed to my Dishonored example which offers a wide range of possible movement paths through the guards who themselves are moving.

I wish I could express my sentiments so well.
 

MjFrancis

Member
I'm going to approach this game with cautious optimism. I'm going to bite.

It's a third-person shooter (hooray!) with cinematic set pieces (meh) and some exploration (neat). Tomb Raider looks like it might quench my thirst for a new TPS viewed in a different light.

I heard Resident Evil 4 and my interest was piqued. It may be likened to that game in only the most superficial of comparisons (death scenes, QTEs, etc) but if you're going to borrow from a TPS it may as well be from one of the best.

Also,

Having to figure out where to go is the point?
Precisely. If I want explore in what one might call an adventure game, I'll close the on-screen maps and use the environment to find my way. See: Assassin's Creed. The game was designed to be traversed without the minimap, and it was well executed in that way.

What I'm hoping to find with Tomb Raider is that there will be some sort of difficulty setting that doesn't just make the enemies bullet sponges or alternative more difficult ways to go about beating the game. I don't know if I'll find that in this game but I'm hoping so.
 

mujun

Member
I wish I could express my sentiments so well.

Color me surprised!

I often feel just shy of illiterate posting on this site. I think it is because I didn't go to university till I was 26 and even then got by on humanities subjects that didn't require much essay writing. I often don't pull the trigger on posts as I feel like I'd stand out (in a bad way) compared to most of the other posters in a thread.
 

nel e nel

Member
You seem to be reading a lot of this "objectivity vs. subjectivity of opinions"-topic into this thread. sonicmj1 was talking about how some people react differently to violence in games, not whether or not some opinions are "better" than others.

In any case, I already provided a response to the problem you're having with the position that some reviews provide less knowledge than others (i.e. some are better than others), in case you wanted an elaboration on your issue with some people's positions.

Besides, nel e nel, on a more general note, your position moves into extreme relativity if you state that all statements are equally valid. This is not only a counter-intuitive position to take, but it also contradicts itself (unless you choose to deny the principle of non-contradiction, which doesn't make sense). I would recommend to check out Paul Boghossian's little book called 'Fear of Knowledge' on the problem of equal validity.

I'm reading alot of objectivity vs subjectivity in this thread, because there is a cubic butt-load of it going on. People are stating their subjective opinions ("This game sucks because ABC" "This game is great because ABC") as facts, and trying to convince each other that their opinion is right.

This isn't some graduate school level debate about philosophical doctrines, it's about people liking/not liking games reviews as an indicator of whether or not they will enjoy a video game. It's not like we're both looking at a tree and you're saying "That's a tree" and I'm saying "No it's a cat." Of course that latter statement isn't valid. In the case of the reaction to violence, one person going "Ew, gross!" and another person going "Whoa, awesome!" are both equally valid in my opinion. Almost all of the reviews for Tomb Raider acknowledge the narrative dissonance and the departure in gameplay from the previous entries, but we have variance in the scores. Granted, not a lot of variance, but it's there nonetheless.

Honestly, I agree with you that most reviews don't tackle the Big Questions (like how they make one feel when you're playing it). My response to that is "so what?" I don't think it's that big of an issue. Most people don't really want to know if a game evokes ludonarrative dissonance or not (and let's be frank, the lion's share of games all have ludonarrative dissonance; it's a running gag at this point), they just want to know if it's fun (or challenging, or pretty). And that's the role that reviews fill.

If one wants a really in-depth philosophical discussion of a game, you'd have to reveal the whole plot in order to have any sort of meaningful debate about it. And then you'd have a whole thread of "GODDAMMITYOUSPOILEDITYOUFUCKERTHANKSALOT." I also think one needs time to mull the experience over and reflect. Reviewers have to power through a game in less than a week and have a write up before the game is even out. Because of that, I don't think reviews are the best forum for those kinds of talks. That's what post-mortems, discussion boards and the like are for.

The reason most reviews don't tackle these subjects, is because most video games don't tackle these subjects. I mean, what's the Deep Meaning behind Gears of War or Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto?

I think it's great that writers, gamers, developers et al are starting to ask these questions of games, because it shows that the medium is starting to mature beyond "you're on Team Red, here's a gun, go shoot Team Blue." I think in many ways we're on the cusp of a paradigm shift in gaming, and these types of discussions are a reflection of the growing pains.
 

RagnarokX

Member
You have got to be fucking kidding me. You have got to be kidding me. Sigh.

No.

(Plot spoilers)
You find out kinda early that everyone is trapped on the island, but you start hearing the cult members talking about how they just want to leave the island (before you kill them). They capture Lara's friends because one of them might be the key to a ritual that might allow everyone to leave. For being a supposedly savage cult, which has dead bodies ritualistically strewn all over, they only really try to kill Lara during gameplay. In plot they had captured her without killing her like 4 times by the point where I stopped watching. Hell, she's the first person in the game to kill a person.
 

Lombax

Banned
IGN on Tomb Raider - How To Tell If You'll Love Tomb Raider


So if you like videogames you will like this videogame...
 

RagnarokX

Member
I'm nearing the end of the game now. But I wouldn't say the open world is very Batman: Arkham City like. The island contains of a lot of 'corridors' and some bigger places that you can explore, but it's not the same thing imo.

But mostly I do agree with that image. Tomb Raider is actually a lot of these mentioned games together.

It's more like Arkham Asylum.
 
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