Support NeoGAF

[feynoob]

They care about growth and profitability.

When ever this part is brought out alot, it means things will get shaken a bit.
Whatever their decision would be, would not be great in the long term if their aim is profit. That word would change how they operate.

 

[jm89]

Does Microsoft even care? They are certainly growing their PC and cloud streaming business via Game Pass.

Gamepass has stagnated.

They didn't even mentioning growth anymore in their financials.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

When ever this part is brought out alot, it means things will get shaken a bit.
Whatever their decision would be, would not be great in the long term if their aim is profit. That word would change how they operate.

Spoiler for you, Sony has always cared about long term profit...

 

[feynoob]

Spoiler for you, Sony has always cared about long term profit...

times change. all it takes is 1 person to ruin it.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Gamepass has stagnated.

They didn't even mentioning growth anymore in their financials.

I've noticed how people don't even really talk about GamePass anymore.

All the "best deal in gaming" talk has died out.

 

[JerryinSoCal]

I've noticed how people don't even really talk about GamePass anymore.

All the "best deal in gaming" talk has died out.

Mainly because all of the talking points have been proven false, it clearly does impact game sales negatively unless you are some small indie game that nobody would have heard of otherwise. The value is subjective based on if you actually find games on the service that you haven't already played but want to and it costs a fortune to support a service like that with new content. They've spent nearly $100 billion just buying studios/publishers to make content in the last 6 years and they've only been able to release a few new AAA titles in that time. The fact that they are starting to release games on other consoles that didn't have a history as multiplatform games shows that their business model isn't sustainable either and most importantly demand for the brand is at its lowest point since the original xbox.

 

[feynoob]

I've noticed how people don't even really talk about GamePass anymore.

All the "best deal in gaming" talk has died out.

Gamepass is still the best deal. Cheap entry for a lot of games.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Gamepass is still the best deal. Cheap entry for a lot of games.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

You will keep hoping for that.
I actually want Apple to try, but if It's gonna be essentially a Xbox Series 2, don't bother.

On a side note, oh well, it looks like PlayStation only for me next gen as well. I won't be buying a Switch 2.

With the way the direction's been the past couple years, unless there's some big shakeups with SIE that seem like they're really prioritizing the console again and get a better flow of 1P AAA & AA games (and with more IP variety, not just the same TLOU/GOW/Spidermans and not just a lot of Western licensed games), I might end up going with Nintendo ahead of a PlayStation.

Like I might still consider a PS6 a few years post-launch but the recent mix of decisions and trends with SIE the past couple of years increase the chances I would not want to be an early adopter at all. Ironically the only thing that might still prevent me from just going PC even if Day 1 were to become a thing for 1P, are horror stories like the Vanguard anti-cheat fiasco with Riot Games.

Chances of SIE or other companies using potential system-bricking or screwy kernel-level trash for PC ports isn't non-zero, and I wouldn't tolerate it whatsoever.

So like 200 dollars less than a phone now?


All we hear about on here is that revenue doesn't matter and profit is what matters. What is it?


Wasn't there data showing that Sonys margins are low/pretty dang bad?

That and Sony themselves saying they are trying to find ways to improve their margins.

This generation has been bad for them in profitability. We've seen the data on here. They are working to turn it around l now though.

Xbox is just a mess, no one knows what's going on there lol

I'd imagine R&D and production expenses for PSVR2 and PS Portal, licensing costs for PS+ 3P content, licensing costs for IP like Spiderman and Wolverine, fluctuations with component pricing and weakening on the yen would've all contributed to reduced profit margins for SIE. But also other things like budget bloat from over-hiring of Hollywood talent, redundant consultancy agencies (SBI, etc.), and having a lot of Western talent in expensive states like California.

None of that's the problem of actual games underperforming in sales. Quite the opposite. It's mainly BTS shit that SIE need to clean up.

That's 6 games in 3.5 years and only one truly next-gen game. Minecraft and Sea of Thieves are also from the Xbox One era and before. Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment, and Sea of Thieves are on PS5 as well, effectively leaving you with 1 game you cannot play on PS5 and that's a simulation game.

I would not call this a wide selection against: Rift Apart, Returnal, FF XVI, FF VII Rebirth, Spider-Man 2, Ragnarok, Forbidden West, Demon's Souls, The Last of Us Part I, Stellar Blade, Rise of the Ronin and a few more that I can't be bothered to list because I think I got the point across.

There is almost no reason to own a Series X over a PS5 right now. These are the most lopsided libraries we've seen in favor of the Playstation since the original Xbox era.

Oh I wasn't bringing up those games to imply they were on the level of what SIE has mostly been offering in the same time period. I just mentioned them to say, Microsoft do have some good games. I've always said this, actually. If all their games were garbage, they would've left the industry ages ago.

I think their bigger problem the past several years has been, lack of consistent heavy-hitting zeitgeist-level AAA releases, no super mass-market IP strongly associated with their brand, and no actual exclusives whatsoever. A trifecta of problems that have helped to basically kill off the vast majority of demand for their consoles.

That was the most self sabotage moment in the history.

Nope. SEGA Saturn's surprise US launch is still easily worst. Atari cancelling the Panther for the Jaguar, then having a severe lack of units for Jaguar's launch in Europe, is probably ahead of the XBO debacle as well.

Hell RROD for 360 was worst, only saved by MS taking a hit in all the costs for lifetime warranties to repair any broken system. But XBO reveal is likely in the Top 5 for worst gaming moments ever.

Yeah during the 360 generation they had a 15 million sales lead in the US, that changed with the xbox one and while they were more competitive her than most places they were still outsold by the PS4 and now you have this generation going worse for them than the last one all while having the cheapest option available.

MS made the gamble that people valued price over exclusivity, content, performance, and user experience. That's why they banked on Series S to get so many of the casuals & mainstream who usually wait 'till later in the gen.

They lost that bet. Horribly.

 

[mayham2199]

Gamepass is still the best deal. Cheap entry for a lot of games.

I agree it's without a doubt the best deal in gaming. Just turns out people don't care. I never knew how a sub service would work in gaming and if it be viable the way it is in music and TV. I think we have our answer now though. Gamers just don't operate the same.

Jaffee thinks that if Sony would have done it, it would have worked but I just disagree with him. It maybe would have "worked" in the sense that Sony would still make money but it would overall lead to Sony making less money IMO.

 

[RyanEvans21]

Gamepass is still the best deal. Cheap entry for a lot of games.

Only selected games. It's cheaper just buy it.

 

[nial]

and with more IP variety, not just the same TLOU/GOW/Spidermans and not just a lot of Western licensed games

I don't get this sentiment, we've had 2 GOW games in 6 years, and somehow it's an issue for Sony to heavily invest in their best performing series, when that's literally what Nintendo does.
"but Nintendo also publishes more than Mario and Zelda!"
And Sony does too? It's getting more and more tiring seeing people on social media pretending that TLOU2 Remastered was all Sony released this year, when they've also published Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, and are looking to release stuff like Lost Soul Aside and Concord later this year. Where are the 'same 3 IPs' people always talk about?

 

[Klayzer]

I don't get this sentiment, we've had 2 GOW games in 6 years, and somehow it's an issue for Sony to heavily invest in their biggest performing IPs, when that's literally what Nintendo does.
"but Nintendo also publishes more than Mario and Zelda!"
And Sony does too? It's getting more and more tiring seeing people on social media pretending that TLOU2 Remastered was all Sony released this year, when they've also published Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, and are looking to release stuff like Lost Soul Aside and Concord later this year. Where are the 'same 3 IPs' people always talk about?

It's crazy, isn't it. A certain segment complains about cinematic style games, Sony publishes some gameplay heavy games, and people still complain. Now, the narrative is, "but those aren't developed by Sony, so they don't count"

All I know is, its been nonstop releases this first half of the year for me.

 

[feynoob]

Only selected games. It's cheaper just buy it.

Not really. Its cheaper to rent them out.

A: Most gamers dont replay the games they bought. So quick play session for those games makes sense when you a sub service.

B: The overall cost of buying games is still expensive. If you are a monthly person, having a sub is a life safer.

Lastly, I get to play older games which I havent heard about. Too many get released every year and you can only only buy handful of them.

If you have the means to buy, a sub service is useless to you. But if you cant spend 720$ on games every year, then a sub service is ideal.

 

[feynoob]

2 girls 1 cup icecream

 

[RyanEvans21]

Not really. Its cheaper to rent them out.

A: Most gamers dont replay the games they bought. So quick play session for those games makes sense when you a sub service.

B: The overall cost of buying games is still expensive. If you are a monthly person, having a sub is a life safer.

Lastly, I get to play older games which I havent heard about. Too many get released every year and you can only only buy handful of them.

If you have the means to buy, a sub service is useless to you. But if you cant spend 720$ on games every year, then a sub service is ideal.

It depends though... I just buy the game i really like to play! The rest wait for the sale.... (Most games get discount after 3 or 6 months,Except for Switch games).

Why not save $10 or $20 bucks for every paycheck? It's like paying monthly for services you dont use.

 

[feynoob]

It depends though... I just buy the game i really like to play! The rest wait for the sale.... (Most games get discount after 3 or 6 months,Except for Switch games).

Why not save $10 or $20 bucks for every paycheck? It's like paying monthly for services you dont use.

Except you are only buying 1 or 2 games.

Lets say a game is on sale for 20$. You see that game on PS+ premium. You spend that 20$ on the premium sub for 1 month and save the rest. You now have 1 month to play that game and other games on the library.

With that logic, the 1 month sub is a better value, than just buying the 20$ game. That is the value of sub service.,

 

[CosmicComet]

Xbox irrelevant in its strongest market. Damn.

 

[RyanEvans21]

Except you are only buying 1 or 2 games.

Lets say a game is on sale for 20$. You see that game on PS+ premium. You spend that 20$ on the premium sub for 1 month and save the rest. You now have 1 month to play that game and other games on the library.

With that logic, the 1 month sub is a better value, than just buying the 20$ game. That is the value of sub service.,

Like i said i just buy games i really want to play badly... So far only bought 3 games this year!

Plus i dont play a lot like before....

Subscription or Renting is good! If you have lot of time playing games...

 

[feynoob]

Subscription or Renting is good! If you have lot of time playing games...

Been gamepass free for 3 months, because I dont have time for gaming these days.

 

[Humdinger]

I've noticed how people don't even really talk about GamePass anymore.

All the "best deal in gaming" talk has died out.

Xbox fans are subdued in general lately. They don't have a lot to celebrate. I think that's part of it.

The well-informed Xbox fans also know that GP is part of the reason Xbox is sending their games to Playstation. And as others have pointed out, GP growth has stalled, far short of MS's hopes. They may still enjoy GP on an individual level (no doubt it saves some people some money), but it's hard to sing its praises from the rooftops when you understand the broader context.

 

[demigod]

Gamepass is still the best deal. Cheap entry for a lot of games.

Best deal? Gamefly is better. You’re not bound by ms’s lackluster output of 1st party games.

 

[feynoob]

Best deal? Gamefly is better. You’re not bound by ms’s lackluster output of 1st party games.

I really dont care about their games. Just the 3rd party games and free EA games.

 

[DaGwaphics]

Well.....to be fair a GTA current gen game hasn't been released yet. And we've had no price cuts on the consoles.

The point about the price cuts is fair. A current gen GTA never existed for the entirety of the PS4/X1 era, just a port of the ps360 game with upgrades for the hardware (which the current gen systems also have).

 

[nial]

The point about the price cuts is fair. A current gen GTA never existed for the entirety of the PS4/X1 era, just a port of the ps360 game with upgrades for the hardware (which the current gen systems also have).

The current gen port of GTAV hasn't even made 5% of the impact of the previous gen remaster. Not a good comparison.
PS4 wasn't BC and it was a much newer game, remember?

 

[Shubh_C63]

This is only in the US.

Yup. that makes sense now.

5 years?

Wait why did I write 5 Years. Was I high ? lol

 

[Woopah]

so 6 million difference. It's not two to one or three to one in the US?
- I thought it was that bad tbh.

What I find interesting is that the TAM is not growing at all, it's just 2 million people decided to buy the PS5 instead of the Series consoles. It's actually shrinking and that's with Covid boom demand.

This is certainly concerning to 3rd parties, IMO, and of course to MS first parties.

What's crazy is how static the numbers are LTD. Basically no growth at all between the generations, just a rearrangement of the numbers. Despite the fact that the population has still been growing.

A lot of the growth has come from the Switch doing better than the Wii U and 3DS. So ideally third parties will not miss out on the early years of Switch 2 like they missed out on the early years of Switch.

Cross gen and most games being multiplatform are absolutely a factor. Why buy two devices just to play Fortnite?



I just question it overall. I think some people go to PC for sure. I think some people have gone to Switch and that's just not considered as much as a possibility. I think a lot of households just bought a Switch and that was that for the generation. We don't see the Switch as a direct competitor, but in a lot of ways it is. It's a massive competitor when it comes to time. If someone is playing Zelda or Animal Crossing they aren't spending that time playing Horizon or Spider-Man.

One thing Sony and Microsoft have given up on is family oriented titles and kid oriented titles. And maybe these games won't sell well right away, but overtime and with investment that could grow.

I think that might be part of Sony's thinking in buying Paramount and utilizing Nickelodeon franchises to attract a younger audience.

Having those IPs would help, then Sony would then need to work out which studios could work on high quality games with those IP.

"PS5 adoption has skyrocketed over the last 18 months°


that's the correlation, right? I wonder if Sony's projections accounted for this. and then the biggest factor for PS5 to fall short of those was the price point.

one should expect after the business update + strong first quarter of PS5 games and Xbox's lack of output for PS5 momentum to go upwards, right?

I think those benefits will be offset by age. PS5 will soon enter the second half of its life, so hardware sales will gradually slow down.

I don't get this sentiment, we've had 2 GOW games in 6 years, and somehow it's an issue for Sony to heavily invest in their best performing series, when that's literally what Nintendo does.
"but Nintendo also publishes more than Mario and Zelda!"
And Sony does too? It's getting more and more tiring seeing people on social media pretending that TLOU2 Remastered was all Sony released this year, when they've also published Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, and are looking to release stuff like Lost Soul Aside and Concord later this year. Where are the 'same 3 IPs' people always talk about?

Exactly. You could make that arguement about Sony's output in 2023, but not in 2024.

Meanwhile Nintendo's output in 2024 (so far) pales in comparison to what they did in 2022 and 2023.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

I don't get this sentiment, we've had 2 GOW games in 6 years, and somehow it's an issue for Sony to heavily invest in their best performing series, when that's literally what Nintendo does.
"but Nintendo also publishes more than Mario and Zelda!"
And Sony does too? It's getting more and more tiring seeing people on social media pretending that TLOU2 Remastered was all Sony released this year, when they've also published Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, and are looking to release stuff like Lost Soul Aside and Concord later this year. Where are the 'same 3 IPs' people always talk about?

Preach!

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I don't get this sentiment, we've had 2 GOW games in 6 years, and somehow it's an issue for Sony to heavily invest in their best performing series, when that's literally what Nintendo does.
"but Nintendo also publishes more than Mario and Zelda!"
And Sony does too? It's getting more and more tiring seeing people on social media pretending that TLOU2 Remastered was all Sony released this year, when they've also published Helldivers 2, Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, and are looking to release stuff like Lost Soul Aside and Concord later this year. Where are the 'same 3 IPs' people always talk about?

Well for me, I mean specifically in terms of more AA and Japanese-style games, from internal 1P teams. On that front, SIE have definitely cut back or completely eliminated them. Consider their internal teams for example: the only Japanese output we've seen from them this gen so far is Gran Turismo 7 (Polyphony Digital), and Astro's PlayRoom (Team Asobi). And Astro's PlayRoom is more of a demo.

I'm glad SIE are supporting things like Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade, but those are both 3P games and SIE don't own either IP. I only mention that because, personally, I'm increasingly worried they are going to go Day 1 on PC for non-GAAS titles sooner rather than later. And, once they do that, the 3P exclusives will dry out, too. Because at that point, why would a 3P hinder their own game's sales performance by skipping PC Day 1 if SIE aren't doing that with their own games? Would seem kind of messed up to ask of 3P to do, unless it were an IP SIE owned...and in that scenario you'd still get PC Day 1 if their strat shifts to Day 1 for all games (not just GAAS).

And well, I just have that increasing sense that Day 1 is the direction SIE are trending towards, for all output. It'd take something major & official stated by them to convince me otherwise.

It's crazy, isn't it. A certain segment complains about cinematic style games, Sony publishes some gameplay heavy games, and people still complain. Now, the narrative is, "but those aren't developed by Sony, so they don't count"

All I know is, its been nonstop releases this first half of the year for me.

Read what I posted above. For me personally, what you're saying is not what I'm saying. Far from it.

Exactly. You could make that arguement about Sony's output in 2023, but not in 2024.

Meanwhile Nintendo's output in 2024 (so far) pales in comparison to what they did in 2022 and 2023.

Maybe that's because they're winding up for a new Switch later this year/early 2025?

Like a lot of you are missing the point of what I meant with that post in the first place, but it's kinda silly IMO to use SIE's output this year against Nintendo's when the Switch is at the very end of its lifecycle. Of course 1P output would be low at this point, that's always been the case.

PS5 is only midway through its lifecycle so I wouldn't say the output this year is shocking. It should be expected, honestly. They're doing what they're supposed to be doing.

 

[nial]

Consider their internal teams for example: the only Japanese output we've seen from them this gen so far is Gran Turismo 7 (Polyphony Digital), and Astro's PlayRoom (Team Asobi). And Astro's PlayRoom is more of a demo.

You left out Demon's Souls (look up the creative director), and by this point in past generations you only had Knack, The Last Guardian and Gravity Rush 2 on PS4, and The Eye of Judgement, Siren: New Translation and The Last Guy on PS3. Is that really a big difference?

I'm increasingly worried they are going to go Day 1 on PC for non-GAAS titles sooner rather than later. And, once they do that, the 3P exclusives will dry out, too. Because at that point, why would a 3P hinder their own game's sales performance by skipping PC Day 1

First of all, if would be great if you stop being worried over nothing and start judging actual results. And second, externally-developed projects would still happen anyway because developers always look out for production cooperation and planning. Your whole idea is flawed in itself, if SIE is going day 1 on PC, why would XDEV projects be exceptions? For the love of god, I don't know how many times I'm gonna have to tell people that those are not Final Fantasy VII Rebirth situations at all.

Like a lot of you are missing the point of what I meant with that post in the first place, but it's kinda silly IMO to use SIE's output this year against Nintendo's when the Switch is at the very end of its lifecycle.

This would make sense if SIE's output this year was at the same low level of Nintendo's 2024, it's not and that's what Woopah was talking about.

BTW, you were very clear with the 'same 3 IPs' part, I don't know where we would gather that you were talking about internally-developed Japanese games all along. It's not like SIE has ever had ton of those.
And that's ignoring the whole restructuring that happened in 2021, and some talent leaving the company from 2011 to 2020. Where you expecting new Ueda and Toyama games or anything?

 

[kiphalfton]

Xbox sales numbers are likely so high in the first couple years because scalpers bought out anything they can turn a profit on.

Blame equally stupid scalpers and those who bought from them.

 

[Fredrik]

Huh? Thought it was 2 to 1 or even worse in the US. Combined with PC players Microsoft probably have a fairly okay userbase for their day 1 releases tbh.

 

[DaGwaphics]

The current gen port of GTAV hasn't even made 5% of the impact of the previous gen remaster. Not a good comparison.
PS4 wasn't BC and it was a much newer game, remember?

I don't know how you are judging the impact of GTAV. The game has been one of the most played titles on the current-gen systems (patch or no). But sure it was newer in 14 than it is in 24.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Xbox fans are subdued in general lately. They don't have a lot to celebrate. I think that's part of it.

The well-informed Xbox fans also know that GP is part of the reason Xbox is sending their games to Playstation. And as others have pointed out, GP growth has stalled, far short of MS's hopes. They may still enjoy GP on an individual level (no doubt it saves some people some money), but it's hard to sing its praises from the rooftops when you understand the broader context.

There is also too much coming out now that doesn't hit GP to begin with. The most popular games of the first 4 months were likely Infinite Wealth, Tekken 8 and Dragons Dogma 2. Not counting the recent PS5 exclusives. GP is a hard sell if you want to play any of these.

 

[nial]

The game has been one of the most played titles on the current-gen systems (patch or no).

Ok, fine, less than 5% was definitely not it, but it's still nowhere close to the boom that was the 2014 remaster, which is still at the top charts.

 

[buenoblue]

Better than I thought to be honest. Selling reasonably well in your home market is not to bad.

 

[JerryinSoCal]

Better than I thought to be honest. Selling reasonably well in your home market is not to bad.

It is when you are a global business and you are down in market share two generations in a row. They were far more competitive in the US last gen than they are now. When you look at total sales in the US 6 million down is a pretty high percentage when you've only sold 14 million total in that market. Six million is roughly 42% of their total sales in the US and the trends are looking like things are getting much worse.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

It is when you are a global business and you are down in market share two generations in a row. They were far more competitive in the US last gen than they are now. When you look at total sales in the US 6 million down is a pretty high percentage when you've only sold 14 million total in that market. Six million is roughly 42% of their total sales in the US and the trends are looking like things are getting much worse.

Crazy how some here just continue to ignore context. There is nothing good about being soundly beaten in your top territory when everywhere else is not even worth a discussion. How one can look at where we are vs the 360 era and honestly think "it's not so bad" is a reminder of just how far removed the Xbox brand is from societal consciousness as any sort of threat to PlayStation or staying power in this industry. It's 6 million now with it only going to get much, much worse. Yet, "it's not so bad". "It's selling reasonably well". With such a degradation from the 360, no, this isn't selling reasonably well at all.

 

[Woopah]

Well for me, I mean specifically in terms of more AA and Japanese-style games, from internal 1P teams. On that front, SIE have definitely cut back or completely eliminated them. Consider their internal teams for example: the only Japanese output we've seen from them this gen so far is Gran Turismo 7 (Polyphony Digital), and Astro's PlayRoom (Team Asobi). And Astro's PlayRoom is more of a demo.

I'm glad SIE are supporting things like Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade, but those are both 3P games and SIE don't own either IP. I only mention that because, personally, I'm increasingly worried they are going to go Day 1 on PC for non-GAAS titles sooner rather than later. And, once they do that, the 3P exclusives will dry out, too. Because at that point, why would a 3P hinder their own game's sales performance by skipping PC Day 1 if SIE aren't doing that with their own games? Would seem kind of messed up to ask of 3P to do, unless it were an IP SIE owned...and in that scenario you'd still get PC Day 1 if their strat shifts to Day 1 for all games (not just GAAS).

Rise of Ronin and Stellar Blade are still Sony published games. Just like how Spiderman PS4 was a Sony first party game, even though Sony didn't own the IP or (at the time) the developer. Or how Smash Bros are first party Nintendo games even though they have never been developed internally and HAL Laboratory has a trademark.

I always think its best to judge a publisher on its whole output.

For example, I would judge Nintendo's 2023 on all 13 games they published. If I brought in restrictions on IP ownership or internal studio involvement, that number drops to 5.

Maybe that's because they're winding up for a new Switch later this year/early 2025?

Like a lot of you are missing the point of what I meant with that post in the first place, but it's kinda silly IMO to use SIE's output this year against Nintendo's when the Switch is at the very end of its lifecycle. Of course 1P output would be low at this point, that's always been the case.

I do think Switch 2 is the reason Switch is having a filler year this year. But of course that could all change when Nintendo actually tells us what their H2 2024 lineup is.

 

[demigod]

There is also too much coming out now that doesn't hit GP to begin with. The most popular games of the first 4 months were likely Infinite Wealth, Tekken 8 and Dragons Dogma 2. Not counting the recent PS5 exclusives. GP is a hard sell if you want to play any of these.

You can rent those on Gamefly. Why anyone would limit themselves to what gamepass outputs is beyond me for a rental service. Like you have to be really lazy to go out to your mailbox. So much for best value in gaming when you can’t even rent those 2 games.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

Source of these numbers? Seem to be just VGchartz-like user fan guesses

Years 4 and 5 are estimations from installbase (likely to be very accurate because of Matt Piscatella giving out PS5 v PS4 and XBS v XBO percentages comparisons every few momths) but the other data is official, here is the official data from 2012 to 2022 from CESA.

 

[Humdinger]

There is also too much coming out now that doesn't hit GP to begin with. The most popular games of the first 4 months were likely Infinite Wealth, Tekken 8 and Dragons Dogma 2. Not counting the recent PS5 exclusives. GP is a hard sell if you want to play any of these.

Right, I didn't think about that. I play through games pretty slowly. If I were a GP customer and I also wanted to play those games (e.g., DD2), I would either have to suspend my GP sub for a couple months and then reactivate it, which is kind of a hassle (and that assumes I'm paying by the month), or else let the sub run without using it, which is a waste of money.

That's different than with movies, where you can pop in a new movie you want to see (one that's not on Netflix, for instance) without fussing about suspending and then reactivating your Netflix subscription, or else waste money on a sub you're not using. Movies are short; games are long.

(To be clear, I don't sub to either GP or Netflix, so this is just hypothetical.)

 

[yurinka]

Years 4 and 5 are estimations from installbase (likely to be very accurate because of Matt Piscatella giving out PS5 v PS4 and XBS v XBO percentages comparisons every few momths) but the other data is official, here is the official data from 2012 to 2022 from CESA.

Ok, thanks for sharing.

So we have proper yearly data until 2022 so newer yearly data are guesses, and regardly monthly data we don't have proper monthly numbers (only percentage change of percentage change of percentage changes etc.) so they are guesses too.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

From InstallBase



PS5 as of March 2024 is 19.91m when using +7% over PS4 (18.60m).

It is 20.05m If using +66% over PS3 (12.08m).

It appears estimates for PS5 are a little too high, but not by much.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

Ok, thanks for sharing.

So we have proper yearly data until 2022 so newer yearly data are guesses, and regardly monthly data we don't have proper monthly numbers (only percentage change of percentage change of percentage changes etc.) so they are guesses too.

Yes they are guesses for 2023 and 2024 YTD, however with today's post by Mat Piscatella (see above) we know that the PS5 is around 20 million.

 

[TheGodfather07]

So where would xbox series be at worldwide if the US is at 14m? I think anywhere from 25m-27m. Looks like xbox could struggle to push 35m units lifetime.

 

[thismeinteil]

So where would xbox series be at worldwide if the US is at 14m? I think anywhere from 25m-27m. Looks like xbox could struggle to push 35m units lifetime.

Yea, I would estimate 25M. Granted, that's if ~55% of its sales still come from the US, like the 360. The ratio could be even more in the US's favor this gen, and it may only be at 22M-23M.