Support NeoGAF

[onnextflix5]

After the phill Spencer comments and the end of the abk deal, hardware decline, gamepass stagnation. What dose ms need to do to not end up like Sega,

what I think they need to do is keep buying promising studios, and sell or let go of studios that keep failing. They need to bring back third party exclusives, as Sony is slaughtering them on that front, killing emulators on ur System, to protect Nintendo, is not doing them any favours,

Next gen if the games are there, they need go early like they did with the 360, even 6 months will make a big difference.

 

[skit_data]

 

[sono]

A dose of good gamez

 

[DenchDeckard]

Get games out.

...get some serious bangers out and release dates on other stuff and then that's all they need.

Consoles will stay in third place but they will see strong growth and profits from the key pillars of the business they are focusing on.

 

[graywolf323]

art = games in this case

 

[X-Wing]

How many more threads on the same subject do we need?

 

[Xtib81]

They need big AAA games that will rival Tlou, God of War..

 

[mrmustard]

They need big AAA games that will rival Tlou, God of War..

Hell no, not cinematics. They need games that make people subscribe longer to Game Pass. Cinematics are play and forget games, no replay value and no long-term motivation. If it has to be singpleplayer only make big RPGs. People are still playing Skyirm or Fallout.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Focus on making fun games that don’t suffer from performance issues.

Can’t believe I even have to say such a thing, but gaming (overall, not just Microsoft) truly has gotten so much worse recently.

They also need to go back to the Xbox 360 days of being super aggressive with timed exclusives.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

I think Microsoft might have outlawed crunch periods at the end of game development.

So they should get their games made by 3rd parties who really know how to crack the whip.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Manage their studios properly. Their strategy is good but they can't properly manage game development for shit, they need some serious reestructing.

 

[fermcr]

The 1st thing they need to do is get rid of Phil and hire someone that actually understand the gaming business.

 

[Dick Jones]

Microsoft are more than fine and to be honest Xbox are doing better financially than the effort they put in.

 

[Wildebeest]

Well I asked a chat AI and the answer is to make games that are more affordable, social, and educational. Then to build partnerships with new developers in emerging markets to produce content more culturally appealing in local markets.

 

[sono]

Microsoft are more than fine

Agreed they have sold millions of consoles and games and they are a recognised force in the industry. Folk seem to be using terms like succeed and defeat when they perhaps they really mean overtake PlayStation

 

[Flutta]

How many more threads on the same subject do we need?

 

[Daneel Elijah]

They need to do what Nintendo did when the Gamecube didn't work and their eternal CEO Yamauchi after 50 years of leadership let someone else take his place. Do a year long analysis to better know the gaming market. And not just the US market, but the world. And make games too. This is what they should do. I think that Microsoft culture make this hard to do as they are not suited to entertainment like Sony and Nintendo are. They are there to control the gaming market, not just be good at it like their competitors are. And this is their problem too. Instead of being always going for the all in they need to go slowly, one step at a time. Not going against Sony/ Nintendo/ whatever company they don't like( Amazon,Google...) but look at themselves and be better.

How many more threads on the same subject do we need?

As many as we can have until they get better? This is a gaming forum and I understand that for some people it is better to make a new thread than going in another that have a slightly different focus. If you found that the subject already had a good answer please make your own thread and either give us your opinion on it( Go to meta gaf if you believe that this is a members issue instead of a Xbox bad month one) or give us the posts that are the most relevant for you.

After the phill Spencer comments and the end of the abk deal, hardware decline, gamepass stagnation. What dose ms need to do to not end up like Sega,

what I think they need to do is keep buying promising studios, and sell or let go of studios that keep failing. They need to bring back third party exclusives, as Sony is slaughtering them on that front, killing emulators on ur System, to protect Nintendo, is not doing them any favours,

Next gen if the games are there, they need go early like they did with the 360, even 6 months will make a big difference.

Buying mores studios will not work if this is a culture issue and/ or a management one. Third parties exclusives are needed, but not because of Sony. Because good games are what a console need. And partnering with studios to make more games is always good. Indies like Sifu and Stray can easily be made by Xbox. They just need to take a risk. Sony beat them easily because they keep making Gamepass the only way to work with studios, and this make them not only dangerous to Sony business model, but also easy for them to counter as they do not need to basically pay ufront like Xbox does if you see what I mean by that. If they stop that and allow some games to be outside of Gamepass some studios that are not tempted may accept. They are a little like a sport team that got a lot of money but not the prestige that got with it. So they have to overpay each time. Not sustainable in the long run, make it even harder to work out relationship with partners as they will treat them like subcontractors and be treated like money machines in return. Emulators is a legal issue. For next gen I would love to see them go early. But this would see them destroyed by Sony if Sony decide to use that extra time to make a way better console. Tech is evolving slower than it was in the past, so going early with the same hardware is harder than ever.

Microsoft are more than fine and to be honest Xbox are doing better financially than the effort they put in.

Agreed they have sold millions of consoles and games and they are a recognised force in the industry. Folk seem to be using terms like succeed and defeat when they perhaps they really mean overtake PlayStation

Depends on how you see it. Do they make money? Yes. Do they make enough money that the division is good without Microsoft backing them? I do not think so. But this is another discussion.

 

[Spukc]

Make dreamcast 2

 

[Eotheod]

Microsoft clearly broke GAF, it is on repeat ad nauseam.

As many as we can have until they get better? This is a gaming forum and I understand that for some people it is better to make a new thread than going in another that have a slightly different focus. If you found that the subject already had a good answer please make your own thread and either give us your opinion on it( Go to meta gaf if you believe that this is a members issue instead of a Xbox bad month one) or give us the posts that are the most relevant for you.

The repetitive threads add nothing of value when they continue to address the same discussion points without differing in delivery or user responses. Quite literally there are at least another two of these threads on the front page that are within the same context of "Phil Spencer said shit" or "how can Xbox win or do they need to sell?" It also makes no sense for a user to simply create a new thread on the same discussion point because they think it has a slightly different focus. Just add your point to the already existing thread so that discussions are relevant and can ultimately create interesting commentary.

We are just beating a dead horse with all these threads on the actually literal same topic.

 

[Needlecrash]

Better leadership, a more defined strategy and roadmap for their game releases, MORE TIME FOR DEVELOPMENT, and focus groups to see how their games will be perceived to the market. If they can get back to how they were in the 360 era, I feel they will be back on track. Most importantly, GET GAMES OUT.

 

[German Hops]

 

[Badlucktroll]

If Starfield is all fucked up and buggy and becomes a Redfall/Cyberpunk situation i think thats it for Xbox

 

[Daneel Elijah]

Microsoft clearly broke GAF, it is on repeat ad nauseam.

The repetitive threads add nothing of value when they continue to address the same discussion points without differing in delivery or user responses. Quite literally there are at least another two of these threads on the front page that are within the same context of "Phil Spencer said shit" or "how can Xbox win or do they need to sell?" It also makes no sense for a user to simply create a new thread on the same discussion point because they think it has a slightly different focus. Just add your point to the already existing thread so that discussions are relevant and can ultimately create interesting commentary.

We are just beating a dead horse with all these threads on the actually literal same topic.

I am 50/50 on the matter. A forum is not Reddit, but it is still a place for people to talk with other people. I prefer that someone make another thread and say what they want to say than just doing nothing. And big thread make it hard to follow discussions. I understand that too much is too much but you do not have to look at those thread if they do not interest you. The "Phil admit defeat" thread is 34 pages long and and I refused to look at it as I do not consider what he said to be what was said in the thread title, even if I have a opinion that I would like to share on this matter. And there is a lot to say about what happened in the last few weeks. Each opinion has its value, even if it seems to be the same for you. The Xbox showcase will be in a month right? In the meantime we can discuss what is gaming news. And I disagree about this:

It also makes no sense for a user to simply create a new thread on the same discussion point because they think it has a slightly different focus. Just add your point to the already existing thread so that discussions are relevant and can ultimately create interesting commentary

A thread is not just a title and a first post. They take a life of their own then. Instead of being against the consensus there, why not make your own, as long as it is not the same exact thread? And a few days can change our vision of what is happening. If in a week Redfall make a 60 fps patch you can bet that someone will make a Redfall redemption story begins now ? And I would not be against in even if we already have something like it. The mods made a Gamepass thread that is supposed to be the place to talk about it. If they make the same thing, but for Microsoft perception, I would then agree with you. In the meantime, we will see what this thread will become. And once again, I am 50/50 on this. Just that if I find threads that do not interest me, I do not look at it. And this will pass soon, or at least I hope so.

If Starfield is all fucked up and buggy and becomes a Redfall/Cyberpunk situation i think thats it for Xbox

GAF will explode and I do not think that Xbox will loose that much paradoxically. People will be dumb to the pain if it get to that point. Halo at the end of 2021, Redfall now, and Starfield in 5 months? Come on, Xbox can't do this. Please. Please do not fuck up Starfield.

 

[Cornbread78]

Hello no, not cinematics. They need games that make people subscribe longer to Game Pass. Cinematics are play and forget games, no replay value and no long-term motivation. If it has to be singpleplayer only make big RPGs. People are still playing Skyirm or Fallout.

Those are what people want tho..

People want games that are pretty, perform well, have a decent story and are engaging. Why wouldn't they want their own strong narrative games? Games that grab your attention & make you think like TLoU or games that pull out adventure & fun like Uncharted (as a side note, it was a huge miss by MS not buying the western SE IPs) or games that bring out action, adventure, challenge & fun like GoW. Narrative as in a good story not the only thing that draws people to those games, it's the full package & tone to them. Right now MS does not have a single IP to compete with that, rn. Blame 343 for making Halo so convoluted, but the world, lore, & fun of Halo (blessed Bungie) that drew people into it..


- Do a better job of identify studios to make great games and balance corporate needs with creative vision. You know, manage your studios.....

 

[Moriarty1889]

Go full speed ahead with investing and producing good AAA games.

 

[rhodesianshepard]

Create a network of support studios that can assist all of their premiere studios. Seriously, that is why Sony's first party games are so well polished and release in a timely manner. Microsoft seemingly wants to just buy up studios and let them sink or swim on their own. Microsoft don't have the infrastructure. This is something that takes time to build, so hopefully Microsoft can be patient

 

[winjer]

Improve their software. A lot.

 

[Sorcerer]

I'm gathering Microsoft's intention is to make money just by being accessible everywhere to anyone. I guess they figure if they can make it easy and cheap to play, they can exist in that space on their own just fine. Quality of games is not a priority, (Sony and Nintendo wipe they floor with them in that area), just as long as there is a large library number they can wow people with before the illusion wears off once you start exploring the eco-system.
They may reach the ultra casual gamer but they may be a lost cause with the more hardcore. I think the writing is on the wall there won't be an Xbox to go along with Sony or Nintendo's new offerings in the upcoming years.

It seems the attitude is lets get this crap out to increase the gamepass library and that will be enough. Refinement is not a concept MS is into.

Even how they are going controller crazy lately, (without even hinting at an elite 3) is sending a signal (at least to me) that they are ramping up for a future where they will be on the cloud and are prepared to sell those gamers controllers and accessories (and Xbox shoes and Xbox waffle makers) for that service. But that might just me looking too hard at things.

 

[Eotheod]

I am 50/50 on the matter. A forum is not Reddit, but it is still a place for people to talk with other people. I prefer that someone make another thread and say what they want to say than just doing nothing. And big thread make it hard to follow discussions. I understand that too much is too much but you do not have to look at those thread if they do not interest you. The "Phil admit defeat" thread is 34 pages long and and I refused to look at it as I do not consider what he said to be what was said in the thread title, even if I have a opinion that I would like to share on this matter. And there is a lot to say about what happened in the last few weeks. Each opinion has its value, even if it seems to be the same for you. The Xbox showcase will be in a month right? In the meantime we can discuss what is gaming news. And I disagree about this:

A thread is not just a title and a first post. They take a life of their own then. Instead of being against the consensus there, why not make your own, as long as it is not the same exact thread? And a few days can change our vision of what is happening. If in a week Redfall make a 60 fps patch you can bet that someone will make a Redfall redemption story begins now ? And I would not be against in even if we already have something like it. The mods made a Gamepass thread that is supposed to be the place to talk about it. If they make the same thing, but for Microsoft perception, I would then agree with you. In the meantime, we will see what this thread will become. And once again, I am 50/50 on this. Just that if I find threads that do not interest me, I do not look at it. And this will pass soon, or at least I hope so.

GAF will explode and I do not think that Xbox will loose that much paradoxically. People will be dumb to the pain if it get to that point. Halo at the end of 2021, Redfall now, and Starfield in 5 months? Come on, Xbox can't do this. Please. Please do not fuck up Starfield.

But the issue is, as is being showcased with the posts so far in this thread, they share the exact same mentalities as the previous thread. Of course, I would not want ALL discussions to be shared in one thread for each category/discussion point and it can never be discussed elsewhere, because discussions shift and change over time. Some threads simply can not contain all the information on that discussion because the original point of commentary may have changed over time, and thus requires a new thread for forking discussions.

Though that is the issue with any forum, in that if the thread is too long or the OP not descriptive/too descriptive, than the thread becomes difficult to read after X number of pages. I feel that just as much as you do, however I do try to throw in my two cents in order to expand potential commentary. I feel that even though the discussion has evolved from the OP, the content being discussed is still relevant to the collective thread ethos.

I just have a different view on what a thread should constitute, and that the same core question being asked over and over will only illicit the same discussions over and over. In this case it is going to be one of the following: Microsoft should throw money at developers; Microsoft should quite the industry because I don't like Microsoft anymore; Microsoft should make games like the 360 era; Microsoft should fire Phil Spencer; Microsoft should kill PC support and remove first party games from Game Pass; Microsoft should just stick with what they are doing because they are still selling content quite well despite lack of hardware sales; and finally, Microsoft should Microsoft.

Oh, wait, I forgot the one about how Microsoft should just copy everything Sony and Nintendo are doing which will somehow make them be good again and this should happen instantly so as to appease the people who don't even own the console but want to make sure they feel happy knowing that their purchase is better because of superiority complexes while also ignoring the fact games take literally years to make even at an indie level and that they actually want them to be AAA level because then that means they are good or something and not put it on Game Pass because Game Pass is shit and PC is shit and everything sucks and they don't even really play games anymore.

 

[Topher]

And Fable and Perfect Dark and Avowed and so on. These games need to be great.

Hello no, not cinematics. They need games that make people subscribe longer to Game Pass. Cinematics are play and forget games, no replay value and no long-term motivation. If it has to be singpleplayer only make big RPGs. People are still playing Skyirm or Fallout.

No, if you are going to have a subscription service like Game Pass then you need to appeal to a broader audience of gamer. Just because you don't care for that type of game doesn't mean it isn't popular and adds value to your platform's game library. Games like God of War absolutely does that.

And.....game sales still matter. Only ~10-15% of Xbox content revenue is from Game Pass.

 

[RCU005]

A dose of good gamez

This won’t happen because Phil just said it doesn’t matter how many games they make, they won’t win.

 

[Jaybe]

Buy Valve

 

[Topher]

Buy Valve

 

[jshaver488]

This won’t happen because Phil just said it doesn’t matter how many games they make, they won’t win.

Why does succeeding mean “have to sell more boxes than ps5”. Why do you all see this as a zero sum game

 

[Sorcerer]

Buy Valve

This would be the saddest day if that happens. I figure it will never happen under Gabe, but if he leaves, I have some fear for the future of Valve under more corporate type of leadership.

 

[ReBurn]

This would be the saddest day if that happens. I figure it will never happen under Gabe, but if he leaves, I have some fear for the future of Valve under more corporate type of leadership.

He's going to die from a heart attack before he retires.

 

[killatopak]

Drastic times calls for drastic measures.

Bring in Ken Kutaragi.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

But the issue is, as is being showcased with the posts so far in this thread, they share the exact same mentalities as the previous thread. Of course, I would not want ALL discussions to be shared in one thread for each category/discussion point and it can never be discussed elsewhere, because discussions shift and change over time. Some threads simply can not contain all the information on that discussion because the original point of commentary may have changed over time, and thus requires a new thread for forking discussions.

Though that is the issue with any forum, in that if the thread is too long or the OP not descriptive/too descriptive, than the thread becomes difficult to read after X number of pages. I feel that just as much as you do, however I do try to throw in my two cents in order to expand potential commentary. I feel that even though the discussion has evolved from the OP, the content being discussed is still relevant to the collective thread ethos.

I just have a different view on what a thread should constitute, and that the same core question being asked over and over will only illicit the same discussions over and over. In this case it is going to be one of the following: Microsoft should throw money at developers; Microsoft should quite the industry because I don't like Microsoft anymore; Microsoft should make games like the 360 era; Microsoft should fire Phil Spencer; Microsoft should kill PC support and remove first party games from Game Pass; Microsoft should just stick with what they are doing because they are still selling content quite well despite lack of hardware sales; and finally, Microsoft should Microsoft.

Oh, wait, I forgot the one about how Microsoft should just copy everything Sony and Nintendo are doing which will somehow make them be good again and this should happen instantly so as to appease the people who don't even own the console but want to make sure they feel happy knowing that their purchase is better because of superiority complexes while also ignoring the fact games take literally years to make even at an indie level and that they actually want them to be AAA level because then that means they are good or something and not put it on Game Pass because Game Pass is shit and PC is shit and everything sucks and they don't even really play games anymore.

Great answer. And I can agree with you on almost all of it. Except that part:

the same core question being asked over and over will only illicit the same discussions over and over

Even if it is mostly true. The people that will say those things are not the same. So they can have the same fun that others got to have a few weeks/months/ years ago. For this alone a new thread may be worth it for those that will be there. But you are mostly right and I try to follow the same principles too. That is why even if I am on Neogaf since 2020 I have yet to make a single thread yet. And have relatively few posts compared to most. But I prefer that people make a thread that I find redundant than no thread at all, as in the long term it will make people leave the forum. Of course bias are a part of it. The PSVR 2 launch period had a certain number of threads that were mostly negative and I did find it unnerving. I consider the present period special as it is unpredecented how low the Xbox perception is. So people are talking about it even if it is just to repeat what had already been said. It will pass. In the meantime I wait for a thicc_girls_are_teh_best huge wall of text. Those always are fun to read for me.

 

[Fredrik]

Stop chasing Call of Duty and team up with some japanese devs like SEGA, Bandai Namco, FROM, Capcom and Team Ninja instead, and launch XDreamBox or whatever and pay 70 billion to have a super-slick 2.5D Shinobi 3 Remastered, a side-scrolling Final Fight in SF6 engine, Virtua Fighter 6, Soul Calibur 7, Ridge Racer 8, Ninja Gaiden 4, DOA7, Elden Ring 2 as exclusives titles.
I’ll buy 2 day 1.

 

[Sorcerer]

He's going to die from a heart attack before he retires.

Either way it's going to be sad, sad, day. On multiple levels.

 

[FunkMiller]

Fucking hell, lads. How much do we need to skirt around the central problem to save Phil Spencer‘s face?

MAKE GOOD EXCLUSIVE GAMES.

That is all that matters.

 

[Topher]

Fucking hell, lads. How much do we need to skirt around the central problem to save Phil Spencer face?

MAKE GOOD EXCLUSIVE GAMES.

That is all that matters.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

1. Get out of the hardware business. It's a fool's game.
2. Become streaming hub on all possible platforms including mobile, TV, PlayStation etc.
3. Get your shit together managing the studios, make great exclusive games for Xbox
4. Profit?

 

[mrmustard]

No, if you are going to have a subscription service like Game Pass then you need to appeal to a broader audience of gamer. Just because you don't care for that type of game doesn't mean it isn't popular and adds value to your platform's game library. Games like God of War absolutely does that.

And.....game sales still matter. Only ~10-15% of Xbox content revenue is from Game Pass.

Yeah maybe my personal dislike influenced my opinion. But they already got a potential walking sim named Hellblade 2. Another problem with MS is that they almost don't market their games. Sony markets like there is no tomorrow.
For example Grounded. Absolutely beautiful, great gameplay, great singleplayer, great coop, easily 100 hours of fun. 0 Marketing, nothing, nada. The game with Sony marketing could be really popular.

I think they just can't market that much, because their main goal is Game Pass and not selling consoles.

 

[Havoc2049]

Finish strong this gen with some great games and launch next gen with a great Halo game, Elder Scrolls 6 and AAA Japanese exclusive. Make sure there is enough supply to meet demand, to take advantage of a killer launch line-up.

 

[LordOfChaos]

About 600mg, thrice a day



Rectally

*Title said dose at first silly mods lol

 

[onnextflix5]

Fucking hell, lads. How much do we need to skirt around the central problem to save Phil Spencer‘s face?

MAKE GOOD EXCLUSIVE GAMES.

That is all that matters.

Everyone is saying better games, but if head of Xbox is saying it won’t move the needle in terms of market share. They are screwed, sooner or later they are gonna give up, how long can they go on for without making any inroads in terms of market share.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Microsoft doesn't have to outsell Sony but they also can't be far behind. I would say their primary objective should be to close the gap by a lot not necessarily outsell the competition.

 

[FunkMiller]

Everyone is saying better games, but if head of Xbox is saying it won’t move the needle in terms of market share. They are screwed, sooner or later they are gonna give up, how long can they go on for without making any inroads in terms of market share.

Yes. He’s wrong.

This is the whole problem.

 

[Bartski]

16 times the dose