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[QisTopTier]

I know you were, just sayin'. Every time we have one of these threads "space marines" gets brought up. Different problem.

Ah yeah it does and it is. Like I said earlier today a lot of people that try to talk on the subject really don't know jack shit about either end of the spectrum of things and just coming in these threads yelling and screaming their viewpoint always fucks up the conversations so god damn much.

I don't find it good to compare the situation of either sex to one another in this situation but I can't say the overuse of muscular men doesn't effect a boy at all.
I find it offensive now how much being an example of your traditional gender role is considered a male power fantasy now, but I suppose if you are to be against one traditional gender might as well be against the other.

But you see not all boys look up to the typical RAWR STRONG POWER FANTASTY type stuff. I mean shit I never did I always looked up to the smart characters in things.

 

[casabolg]

I wouldn't say that, actually I didn't believe the game was racist at all. Until that outfit. Japan tends to get off the " we do not understand other types of people excuse" but in this day in age, you can talk to people and visit places. So that isn't a thing anymore.

Honestly, what's so racist about a person from Africa wearing a very stereotypical garb from the tribes there? The tribes are a big part of their culture.
I don't mean to cause a fuss but I never saw the truth in the complaints.

 

[casabolg]

Ah - both main characters are essentially weak and vapid. Bella allows men to do pretty much everything for her, is absurdly indecisive and her situation can be categorized as emotionally abusive.

50 Shades... I guess changing a man... making them normal is something women aspire to... if they're attracted to abusive relationships, anyways.

Ah hell, how do people like that sort of stuff.

 

[Village]

Honestly, what's so racist about a person from Africa wearing a very stereotypical garb from the tribes there? The tribes are a big part of their culture.
I don't mean to cause a fuss but I never saw the truth in the complaints.

One, oh god no its not, it is what people think its.

Dos, because none of the white people had to wear an out fit that signified where their ancestors came from.

Edit: Also do you think Africa is a single entity?

 

[casabolg]

But you see not all boys look up to the typical RAWR STRONG POWER FANTASTY type stuff. I mean shit I never did I always looked up to the smart characters in things.

Not all girls want to be pretty princesses either but I don't judge them any differently for wanting to take part.

 

[Devolution]

Next time have Chris wear this too Japan:

[

 

[Karsticles]

Arnold isn't even on the level of hulked out dudes in games. I like muscles too but let's be realistic here.

You don't think this is roughly on par with RE5 Chris?

 

[Devolution]

I don't see Arnold punching boulders.

 

[Mory Dunz]

But you see not all boys look up to the typical RAWR STRONG POWER FANTASTY type stuff. I mean shit I never did I always looked up to the smart characters in things.

That's kinda what I'm saying. What is a male power fantasy?
Personally I don't care or get anything out of strong guys killing a lot of people in video games. I think it's fun, but I don't think I fantasize.

Shoot, I probably get more of out FIFA if I'm controlling Ronaldo and I dribble past a bunch of guys and score. Cause it's something I think would be cool, but can't do in real life.

Is FIFA my male power fantasy? No muscles involved?

 

[zoukka]

You don't think this is roughly on par with RE5 Chris?

We already have pics showing them both from the same angle.

Is FIFA my male power fantasy? No muscles involved?

Why not. A high level professional is in peak physical condition and enjoys the respect of the world.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

I really think people sometimes look too deep into how characters are portrayal of characters. I think developers have the rights to make whatever type of characters they want and if people are offended by them, then don't support and speak with your wallet. I do think things can get blown out of proportion.

 

[thebaroness]

Eww....

Pick someone else.

Wait, there exist people who don't find big boss sexy?

Hmmm TIME TO THREAD DERAIL


UNTS UNTS UNTS UNTS

UNTS UNTS UNTS UNTS

OHGODKOJIMA I NEED THIS SHIRT

 

[sleepykyo]

You totally didn't just put Chris and Drake in the same category did you? :lol

Early Chris was comparable. It wasn't until RE5, that Chris got the Gears proportion as part of the westernize the franchise (even RE already appealed to the west) initiative. Man, those early documents with those Team Fortress arms and Jill getting killed off.

That one didn't go over well, this game was already accused of being racist, and that made it far FAR worse. That was a horrible shit storm, and probably solidified no more black people in RE.

Not necessarily. It just means back to whites and Asians for villains. Remember Me looks to star a mixed female.

Next time have Chris wear this too Japan:

[

Capcom already gave that to Balrog.

 

[Village]

Early Chris was comparable. It wasn't until RE5, that Chris got the Gears proportion as part of the westernize the franchise (even RE already appealed to the west) initiative. Man, those early documents with those Team Fortress arms and Jill getting killed off.



Not necessarily. It just means back to whites and Asians for villains. Remember Me looks to star a mulatto (?) female.

There are no black people in RE, like none.

Wait, there exist people who don't find big boss sexy?

I understand why you would find him sexy, its just that...

well let me give my example.

Matoko is one of my favorite anime characters ever. Ghost in the shell , the series ( especially the stand alone complex and 2nd gig) might be my favorite anime series of all time. And she is an attractive woman, she is just too.. mom. I just cannot be attracted to a character that comes off as parent.

 

[Karsticles]

I don't see Arnold punching boulders.

What about camels?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7tOWoDVQLU

And he lifted a car in Twins!

 

[John Rabbit]

I find it offensive now how much being an example of your traditional gender role is considered a male power fantasy now

other than his implicit heterosexuality chris does not represent a traditional male. everything about him is hyperreal and exaggerated; which again i thought was kind of the point of his entire existence in RE5, specifically.

 

[zoukka]

E
Remember Me looks to star a mulatto (?) female.

I don't think you should use that word.

 

[thebaroness]

What about camels?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7tOWoDVQLU

And he lifted a car in Twins!

THERE'S TOTALLY A DUDE FUCKING A LAMA IN THAT SCENE.

It's the greatest film scene ever shot.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

50 Shades of Gray and Twilight sell predominantley to women and do more to set back gender equality than any game ever has. This is PC outrage bullshit of the grandest scale which completely ignores plenty of great female characters and plenty of stereotypical male archetypes in favor of idiotic outrage and hyperbole.

 

[Devolution]

50 Shades of Gray and Twilight sell predominantley to women and do more to set back gender equality than any game ever has. This is PC outrage bullshit of the grandest scale which completely ignores plenty of great female characters and plenty of stereotypical male archetypes in favor of idiotic outrage and hyperbole.

lol

 

[Karsticles]

THERE'S TOTALLY A DUDE FUCKING A LAMA IN THAT SCENE.

It's the greatest film scene ever shot.

I...never noticed that before. Reminds me of the donkey fucking documentary I saw.

 

[zoukka]

50 Shades of Gray and Twilight sell predominantley to women and do more to set back gender equality than any game ever has. This is PC outrage bullshit of the grandest scale which completely ignores plenty of great female characters and plenty of stereotypical male archetypes in favor of idiotic outrage and hyperbole.

So all is well and balanced?

 

[Risette]

since we're on the topic of MGS3, here's how some male gamers react to female characters in videogames: http://youtu.be/NSH39aiTx2A?t=11m45s

 

[casabolg]

One, oh god no its not, it is what people think its.

Dos, because none of the white people had to wear an out fit that signified where their ancestors came from.

Fair enough. It is sexualizing her using ideas from African culture. Regardless, that is an example of cultural appropriation. Not racism.

And to your last remark. I wouldn't find Leon having a kilt and flannel in an outfit (Kennedy is a scotch/irish name) be considered racist. I guess it's just me.

 

[Devolution]

Fair enough. It is sexualizing her using ideas from African culture. Regardless, that is an example of cultural appropriation. Not racism.

And to your last remark. I wouldn't find Leon having a kilt and flannel in an outfit (Kennedy is a scotch/irish name) be considered racist. I guess it's just me.

African culture? It's a continent dude.

 

[thebaroness]

Honestly, I always though 50 shades was popular because it opened a lot of women to a side of sexuality they were unaware or afraid of (BDSM).

But that begs the question to society, is it really harmful to create media that appeal to just one gender? I don't really see a problem with it existing as long as there's also an equal balance of diverse, well written media. I may not like certain things, but I feel strongly that everyone is allowed their guilty pleasures.

 

[Village]

Fair enough. It is sexualizing her using ideas from African culture. Regardless, that is an example of cultural appropriation. Not racism.

And to your last remark. I wouldn't find Leon having a kilt and flannel in an outfit (Kennedy is a scotch/irish name) be considered racist. I guess it's just me.

It wouldn't be racist, if everyone did it and they researched the garb.

Also Africa is made of many cultures.

 

[sleepykyo]

I don't think you should use that word.

Changed not that matters when you quoted it. What is the accepted term for that composition?

 

[Devolution]

Honestly, I always though 50 shades was popular because it opened a lot of women to a side of sexuality they were unaware or afraid of (BDSM).

But that begs the question to society, is it really harmful to create media that appeal to just one gender? I don't really see a problem with it existing as long as there's also an equal balance of diverse, well written media. I may not like certain things, but I feel strongly that everyone is allowed their guilty pleasures.

Yeah, like I said, just introduce people to better BDSM smut.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

So all is well and balanced?

At the end of the day every medium will have its smut and its great works. The intelligent stuff tends to get recognized and praised and the guilty pleasures can remain in their low-culture role. It's no surprise that a lot of games over the years were crafted to suit their audience, just like Twilight or whatever else appeals to its consumer base.

 

[casabolg]

other than his implicit heterosexuality chris does not represent a traditional male. everything about him is hyperreal and exaggerated; which again i thought was kind of the point of his entire existence in RE5, specifically.

I didn't say traditional male. I said an "example of your traditional gender role".

African culture? It's a continent dude.

I know. There is just a lot of elements put into the outfit and it can't be placed down to one culture inparticular.

 

[Devolution]

I know. There is just a lot of elements put into the outfit and it can't be placed down to one culture inparticular.

No dude, just, you're exemplifying the problem here.

 

[casabolg]

It wouldn't be racist, if everyone did it and they researched the garb.

Also Africa is made of many cultures.

So you're saying the racism in it is the outfit the person is wearing is not close to representative of what it really is but rather is stereotypes or appropriation of those styles adopted to a more westernized outfit.

Well that's a fine complaint but I won't say that's racism to me at all.
We can agree to disagree, Village. We cool.

 

[QisTopTier]

Yeah, like I said, just introduce people to better BDSM smut.

NANA TO KAORU?

lolololol

 

[Village]

So you're saying the racism in it is the outfit the person is wearing is not close to representative of what it really is but rather is stereotypes or appropriation of those styles adopted to a more westernized outfit.

Well that's a fine complaint but I won't say that's racism to me at all.
We can agree to disagree, Village. We cool.

How is what you said, not racist? I am curious now.

 

[Mory Dunz]

I know. There is just a lot of elements put into the outfit and it can't be placed down to one culture inparticular.

People are kind of bashing you, but I see what you were saying. You weren't doing "all Africa is the same" I think.

Africans fight a good amount amongst themselves (like everybody else in the world, haha).
However, when it comes to perception from other countries and cultures, Africans do actually tend to unify. Moreso, than Europe and other places I suppose.

For instance you may see "African Shows" with performances that span many countries and cultures but are placed under one label. It'd be weird to see a "European Show".

Also, in sporting events and similar things, if there is an African team or person playing, other Africans will root for that person just because their African. (I guess I'm talking mostly about "black" Africa to be honest). Like in the World Cup, Africans rooted for Ghana at the end just cause. I doubt you would see Spain rooting for Germany or Netherlands or whatever.

That's why I understand your identification as "African garb" rather than a sepcific country. It may be an overgeneralization, but I see where you got the idea. My school did an African Runway, and didn't dedicate each performance or clothing to a specific area. It was all just under the label of "Africa".

 

[zoukka]

At the end of the day every medium will have its smut and its great works. The intelligent stuff tends to get recognized and praised and the guilty pleasures can remain in their low-culture role. It's no surprise that a lot of games over the years were crafted to suit their audience, just like Twilight or whatever else appeals to its consumer base.

How does any of that make this discussion some made up hyperbole though? All storytelling mediums have suffered from declines in content and production and have been criticized for it deservingly, helping them to bounce back up. If this "outrage" gets sparked increasingly often it must mean that people are interested in the subject and are after some sort of change perhaps.

Keep in mind, I've been discussing about the subject of sexualization and the inbalance of it in general. I'm not very interested in analyzing Dragons Crown specifically, because I view it as fairly harmless.

 

[Village]

People are kind of bashing you, but I see what you were saying. You weren't doing "all Africa is the same" I think.

Africans fight a good amount amongst themselves (like everybody else in the world, haha).
However, when it comes to perception from other countries and cultures, Africans do actually tend to unify. Moreso, than Europe and other places I suppose.

For instance you may see "African Shows" with performances that span many countries and cultures but are placed under one label. It'd be weird to see a "European Show".

Also, in sporting events and similar things, if there is an African team or person playing, other Africans will root for that person just because their African. (I guess I'm talking mostly about "black" Africa to be honest). Like in the World Cup, Africans rooted for Ghana at the end just cause. I doubt you would see Spain rooting for Germany or Netherlands or whatever.

That's why I understand your identification as "African garb" rather than a sepcific country. It may be an overgeneralization, but I see where you got the idea. My school did an African Runway, and didn't dedicate each performance or clothing to a specific area. It was all just under the label of "Africa".

Kinda seems like a lack of willingness to try and investigate if anythng.

I do not lump things from France as " European shit" it is from France.

 

[zoukka]

Japanese developers are notorious for their extremely awkward racial profiles in anime and games. I'm not defending it, but for some reason there doesn't seem to be any initiative to investigate these matters back there.

 

[Mory Dunz]

Kinda seems like a lack of willingness to try and investigate if anythng.

I do not lump things from France as " European shit" it is from France.

That's what I'm saying. In comparison to Europe, Africans tend to unify and associate more under the label of "Africa" and it's acceptable, in most situations.

The event was put together by African students and African and Multicultural Student Orgs anyway, so if anyone was going to be offended.....it'd be themselves.

 

[Village]

That's what I'm saying. In comparison to Europe, Africans tend to unify and associate more under the label of "Africa" and it's acceptable, in most situations.

The event was put together by African students and African and Multicultural Student Orgs anyway, so if anyone was going to be offended.....it'd be themselves.

That's kinda sad.

Japanese developers are notorious for their extremely awkward racial profiles in anime and games. I'm not defending it, but for some reason there doesn't seem to be any initiative to investigate these matters back there.

There are many reasons for this, but that ... that thread is... we lack the badges.

That is to powerful to tackle right now, maybe in another thread.

 

[casabolg]

How is what you said, not racist? I am curious now.

I define racism as discrimination against one or a group based on their race or promoting the idea of discrimination against one or a group based on their race.

I describe discrimination as prejudicial treatment of one or a group based on traits.

I just checked Oxford Dictionaries for both. They're very close.

I don't find not fully understanding a culture, generalizing a culture, or appropriating certain aspects of that culture into your own as racism. There is a complaint to all of them but I wouldn't call them racism by a long shot.

Hell, if I cared about appropriation a lot I'd tell women to stop wearing high heeled shoes and have more reason to never wear a tie.

 

[casabolg]

Betting now that I'll regret typing that last sentence in my last post.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

How does any of that make this discussion some made up hyperbole though? All storytelling mediums have suffered from declines in content and production and have been criticized for it deservingly, helping them to bounce back up. If this "outrage" gets sparked increasingly often it must mean that people are interested in the subject and are after some sort of change perhaps.

Keep in mind, I've been discussing about the subject of sexualization and the inbalance of it in general. I'm not very interested in analyzing Dragons Crown specifically, because I view it as fairly harmless.

This outrage seems to exist in an online bubble. I've never heard a person, male or female ever express any opinion whatsoever about this in real life. Yes of course its anectodtal evidence but even in the case of other media that has been publicly scrutinized, what has it accomplished? We got token black characters for the sake of "diversity" now we have token gay characters to teach us that homosexuals are normal people and the wheelchair bound Glee characters of the world. When you force creators to impose political correctness all you seem to get is a checklist they feel forced to check off while the aforementioned high-culture works already make interesting characters pf their own volition. I guess what I mean is that this outrage is akin to expecting Jersey Shore to turn into The Wire. It will never happen, but that doesn't mean that they both can't exist.

Posting from my phone, excuse the typos.

 

[Village]

I define racism as discrimination against one or a group based on their race or promoting the idea of discrimination against one or a group based on their race.

I describe discrimination as prejudicial treatment of one or a group based on traits.

I just checked Oxford Dictionaries for both. They're very close.

I don't find not fully understanding a culture, generalizing a culture, or appropriating certain aspects of that culture into your own as racism. There is a complaint to all of them but I wouldn't call them racism by a long shot.

Hell, if I cared about appropriation a lot I'd tell women to stop wearing high heeled shoes and have more reason to never wear a tie.

I'm am going to have to disagree with you. Especially when one doesn't take the time to even learn about the cultures in the first place. Like the clear examples in RE5.

or other examples

 

[Risette]

 

[PdotMichael]

I'm am going to have to disagree with you. Especially when one doesn't take the time to even learn about the cultures in the first place. Like the clear examples in RE5.

or other examples

http://www.mahq.net/mecha/gundam/g/gf13-020nk.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]

What's your opinion of Nether Gundam?

[IMG]http://abload.de/img/gf13-066noqossl.jpg

 

[casabolg]

"this is not who I am"
No shit

 

[suzu]

Oh god, those Gundams. lol

 

[Vermillion]

Japanese developers are notorious for their extremely awkward racial profiles in anime and games. I'm not defending it, but for some reason there doesn't seem to be any initiative to investigate these matters back there.

Hm. It's noticed, but I don't know many people who care. Killer Bee in Naruto, Panther in Eyeshield 21. It's an odd situation, and I guess now I'm wondering why I don't care so much...?