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[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Like DLSS , XeSS aims to offer upscaled image clarity by leveraging Machine Learning.

The key difference however is Intels solution will be open source.

Luckily for (Series gamers) it looks like this technology will be supported by the Series consoles due to hardware support for Int-4 dot operations.

Theoretically supported hardware located in third pic.

Source :

 

[Schmick]

Why isnt the nVidia 1070GTX listed?

 

[Magic Carpet]

My Gtx 1080 has some life left?

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Why isnt the nVidia 1070GTX listed?

Not sure bro, does it support int-4? Ive never owned a 1070 so I’m not sure.

 

[nightmare-slain]

nice. a lot of people will come in hating on Nvidia because DLSS is restricted to Nvidia RTX cards but somehow i don't think we'd be seeing AMD or Intel coming out with their own solutions if it weren't for Nvidia. Also, how many people gave a shit about Raytracing or even know what it was before Nvidia put out RTX? They aren't out to create a standard that everyone uses. They are pushing new tech in the hopes others will try compete and then come up with a better solution. I know DLSS/RTX sells Nvidia's products but I'm sure Nvidia will be happy that others are doing their own thing. Competition is good.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

nice. a lot of people will come in hating on Nvidia because DLSS is restricted to Nvidia RTX cards but somehow i don't think we'd be seeing AMD or Intel coming out with their own solutions if it weren't for Nvidia. Also, how many people gave a shit about Raytracing or even know what it was before Nvidia put out RTX? They aren't out to create a standard that everyone uses. They are pushing new tech in the hopes others will try compete and then come up with a better solution. I know DLSS/RTX sells Nvidia's products but I'm sure Nvidia will be happy that others are doing their own thing. Competition is good.

I agree mostly. NV pioneered the tech. But intel will help democratize it. ML is going to be extremely important moving forward.

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

I agree mostly. NV pioneered the tech. But intel will help democratize it. ML is going to be extremely important moving forward.

I'm honestly not that sure about "democratization", as Intel's model still needs proper dedicated hardware to work at full power (i.e. providing useful performance or quality increase). It's the same with Nvidia - they could make DLSS open-source tomorrow and it won't change a thing, the performance hit from running DLSS without matrix-multiplication processors like Tensor cores will make the tech all but worthless unless you already have ridiculously strong hardware. Or some other type of dedicated ML accelerator, which is probably not going to be as good a solution either.

 

[DenchDeckard]

So ps5 too?

 

[EdGalTBR]

So ps5 too?

No.

 

[mrBarrelNut]

Lets see if the XeSS will become part of the Xbox game development kit just like AMD's FSR did. I think Intel promised to release their new tools for wider audiences already this year?

 

[Riky]

So will this be another advantage because they waited for the full RDNA2 feature set?

 

[Loxus]

No.

In the tweet it says, "In general all RDNA 2".

More information has surfaced since the RDNA 2 die shot.


So much points to the PS5 also supporting INT4/8 instructions and zero to say it doesn't.

But if you meant Intel's solution in general, then you'd be correct as Sony uses only their own solutions.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

This list doesn't seem right. Desktop Pascal GPUs don't support FP16 rapid packed math, let alone INT8 or INT4. They even needed to get a single FP16 unit with ridiculously low performance just to get some IEEE compliance.

They can probably still run these algorythms by promoting all variables to FP32 on the driver level, but in that case virtually every DX11 and later GPU could run XeSS (with varying levels of efficiency of course).


Lastly, I'm not sure what the point of this thread is. If XeSS on DP4a is open source then every modern GPU can run it. Series, XBOne S/X, PS4/PS5, Switch, etc.
DP4a is a hardware feature to accelerate calculations using smaller variables, but GPUs can promote these variables up to 16 or 32bit and run the same calculations.

 

[Loxus]

So will this be another advantage because they waited for the full RDNA2 feature set?

XBSX doesn't look anything like RDNA 2 to be called full RDNA 2.

 

[aries_71]

Lets see if the XeSS will become part of the Xbox game development kit just like AMD's FSR did. I think Intel promised to release their new tools for wider audiences already this year?

There's not much left to this year.

This looks early stage. I hope it doesn't take years to be supported in the real world.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

This list doesn't seem right. Desktop Pascal GPUs don't support FP16 rapid packed math, let alone INT8 or INT4. They even needed to get a single FP16 unit with ridiculously low performance just to get some IEEE compliance.

They can probably still run these algorythms by promoting all variables to FP32 on the driver level, but in that case virtually every DX11 and later GPU could run XeSS (with varying levels of efficiency of course).


Lastly, I'm not sure what the point of this thread is. If XeSS on DP4a is open source then every modern GPU can run it. Series, XBOne S/X, PS4/PS5, Switch, etc.
DP4a is a hardware feature to accelerate calculations using smaller variables, but GPUs can promote these variables up to 16 or 32bit and run the same calculations.

I’m going off of the information provided. If you can locate why certain GPUs are missing that’s your quest. As it stands now here’s whTs supported take it up with the posters or intel ?

 

[ToTTenTranz]

XBSX doesn't look anything like RDNA 2 to be called full RDNA 2.

Microsoft also didn't wait for full RDNA2 anymore than Sony considering all consoles released the same week, but it'll take years before this kind of misinformation spread by windows central, xboxera and their discord armies gets dispelled.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

XBSX doesn't look anything like RDNA 2 to be called full RDNA 2.

Doesn’t matter what you say , it’s been confirmed officially By Microsoft and AMD directly not much speculation to be had. It’s literally written in black and white.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Microsoft also didn't wait for full RDNA2 anymore than Sony considering all consoles released the same week, but it'll take years before this kind of misinformation spread by windows central, xboxera and their discord armies gets dispelled.

Nothing misinformation about it. Just because you don’t like the information has no effect on its validity. Deny deny deny , is all you’ve done when the literal evidence is available.

You claim disinformation yet every rebuttal you’ve presented has no documented evidence.

Ironic.

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

Doesn’t matter what you say , it’s been confirmed officially By Microsoft and AMD directly not much speculation to be had. It’s literally written in black and white.

Heh, kind of curious now if the RDNA2 GPU in the Deck supports the same things...

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Heh, kind of curious now if the RDNA2 GPU in the Deck supports the same things...

You mean steam deck ? Why wouldn’t it ? But its not out yet. Steam deck def supports all these features. It’s coming with an RDNA2 GPU, there are up coming mobile phones that support these features so does the new iPhone and MacBook Pros.

 

[Zathalus]

Microsoft also didn't wait for full RDNA2 anymore than Sony considering all consoles released the same week, but it'll take years before this kind of misinformation spread by windows central, xboxera and their discord armies gets dispelled.

Microsoft literally said that is the case that they waited for the full RDNA2 feature set.

A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the...

news.xbox.com

Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD showcased today.

To deliver on this vision we wanted to leverage the full capabilities of RDNA 2 in hardware from day one.

In our quest to put gamers and developers first we chose to wait for the most advanced technology from our partners at AMD before finalizing our architecture

 

[ToTTenTranz]

I’m going off of the information provided. If you can locate why certain GPUs are missing that’s your quest. As it stands now here’s whTs supported take it up with the posters or intel ?

I don't use twitter but some people called out Locuza for that list already.
Regardless, the biggest difference between Locuza's info and the thread you created is the former didn't try to use that info to make a console warring thread.

Nothing misinformation about it. Just because you don’t like the information has no effect on its validity. Deny deny deny , is all you’ve done when the literal evidence is available.

You claim disinformation yet every rebuttal you’ve presented has no documented evidence.

Ironic.

You need evidence for what exactly in the post you quoted? That the xbox series released November 10 2020 and ps5 released November 12 2020? Do you need help finding that info on the internet?

Microsoft literally said that is the case that they waited for the full RDNA2 feature set.

A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the...

news.xbox.com

The post you quoted says "they didn't wait more than Sony. Where does the page you linked say they waited longer than Sony to get more features?

 

[Boy bawang]

I'll probably buy through my job an xps13 with a 12th generation Intel processor, whenever those release. I wonder if this XeSS thing would allow me to actually play modern games in decent-ish conditions.

 

[Ozriel]

Microsoft also didn't wait for full RDNA2 anymore than Sony considering all consoles released the same week, but it'll take years before this kind of misinformation spread by windows central, xboxera and their discord armies gets dispelled.

Microsoft has a xbox blog post and a tweet stating that they’re the only next gen console with the full RDNA2 hardware feature set, and they specifically state that they waited for that.

A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the...

news.xbox.com

You’re the one spreading misinformation here.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Microsoft has a xbox blog post and a tweet stating that they’re the only next gen console with the full RDNA2 hardware feature set, and they specifically state that they waited for that.

A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture - Xbox Wire

We here at Team Xbox would like to congratulate and celebrate our amazing partners at AMD on today’s announcement of the Radeon RX 6000 Series of RDNA 2 GPUs. It was incredible to see AMD demonstrate the power and potential that the new AMD RDNA 2 architecture can deliver to gamers around the...

news.xbox.com

You’re the one spreading misinformation here.

Guy is living in his own self-made world.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

I don't use twitter but some people called out Locuza for that list already.
Regardless, the biggest difference between Locuza's info and the thread you created is the former didn't try to use that info to make a console warring thread.


You need evidence for what exactly in the post you quoted? That the xbox series released November 10 2020 and ps5 released November 12 2020? Do you need help finding that info on the internet?

The fact that the anchor of your premises is release dates shows me that you’re woefully unqualified to have this discussion.

 

[Ozriel]

You need evidence for what exactly in the post you quoted? That the xbox series released November 10 2020 and ps5 released November 12 2020? Do you need help finding that info on the internet?

this is illogical stuff, and I’m surprised you’re doubling down on it. The release date has nothing to do with their claim of waiting. What it probably means in that context is that they held off locking in their SoC until the full RDNA2 hardware was finalized. And that would also align with their inability to produce anything close to as many units as Sony has produced.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

this is illogical stuff, and I’m surprised you’re doubling down on it. The release date has nothing to do with their claim of waiting. What it probably means in that context is that they held off locking in their SoC until the full RDNA2 hardware was finalized. And that would also align with their inability to produce anything close to as many units as Sony has produced.

Wait.. it can’t be true real life (obvious) implications of waiting ? But but but they released at the same time !!!!!

 

[Zathalus]

The post you quoted says "they didn't wait more than Sony. Where does the page you linked say they waited longer than Sony to get more features?

Choosing to wait for features that your competitor lacks clearly indicates they waited longer. Not sure how else you can read into that.

 

[TrueLegend]

Steam Deck and Series S will be the biggest winners.

 

[Chukhopops]

As a reminder:



So far this has never been disproved or debunked in any way.

 

[kirby007]

lets just wait untill we see how fast its actually implemented, shall we?

 

[ToTTenTranz]

Choosing to wait for features that your competitor lacks clearly indicates they waited longer. Not sure how else you can read into that.

I'm not the one reading two separate sentences in separate paragraphs - "waiting to get full RDNA2" and "we're the only ones with DX12 Ultimate features (duh)" - and thinking they waited longer than Sony but then released 2 days later.
Boy, those must have been some seriously productive 2 days over at AMD to make such progress.


I could also make the point that Sony was the one waiting to get RDNA2's electrical/physical optimizations from the Zen CPU teams to reach higher GPU clocks, but I know that's nonsensical because they released within 2 days.


Regardless, I can tell I triggered a certain group of people too much so I'm done feeding this console warring thread.

 

[Zathalus]

I'm not the one reading two separate sentences in separate paragraphs - "waiting to get full RDNA2" and "we're the only ones with DX12 Ultimate features (duh)" - and thinking they waited longer than Sony but then released 2 days later.
Boy, those must have been some seriously productive 2 days over at AMD to make such progress.


I could also make the point that Sony was the one waiting to get RDNA2's electrical/physical optimizations from the Zen CPU teams to reach higher GPU clocks, but I know that's nonsensical because they released within 2 days.


Regardless, I can tell I triggered a certain group of people too much so I'm done feeding this console warring thread.

Releasing within 2 days of each other does not mean each consoles SoC design was finalised at the same time. We know Xbox started production over a month later than Playstation and we also know Xbox development kits were sent out much later, with the finalisation of the GDK only occurring mid 2020. These factors, when combined with the fact that Playstation does not have certain RDNA2 features, such as SFS and VRS, clearly indicate that Xbox waited longer to finalise the SoC design.

 

[oldergamer]

I knew the conversation would change direction as soon as someone asked if ps5 supports the feature (it doesn't). Ms did wait longer to mass produce chips for xsx and its why they were late with devkits. Xsx has many gpu features that ps5 doesn't have.

Next im expecting someone to say ps5 can support it in software. which defeats the purpose of a cpu company developing a hardware accelerated approach to a feature.

 

[oldergamer]

I'm not the one reading two separate sentences in separate paragraphs - "waiting to get full RDNA2" and "we're the only ones with DX12 Ultimate features (duh)" - and thinking they waited longer than Sony but then released 2 days later.
Boy, those must have been some seriously productive 2 days over at AMD to make such progress.


I could also make the point that Sony was the one waiting to get RDNA2's electrical/physical optimizations from the Zen CPU
teams to reach higher GPU clocks, but I know that's nonsensical because they released within 2 days.


Regardless, I can tell I triggered a certain group of people too much so I'm done feeding this console warring thread.

Sony had ps5 dev kits with final hardware almost 6 months before xbox. There is more that goes into release dates then you are considering.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Releasing within 2 days of each other does not mean each consoles SoC design was finalised at the same time. We know Xbox started production over a month later than Playstation and we also know Xbox development kits were sent out much later, with the finalisation of the GDK only occurring mid 2020. These factors, when combined with the fact that Playstation does not have certain RDNA2 features, such as SFS and VRS, clearly indicate that Xbox waited longer to finalise the SoC design.

Man thinks they just chose to produce fewer consoles and send their dev kits out later to be nice to Sony.

 

[Holammer]

My Gtx 1080 has some life left?

Without the dedicated HW on chip to do the job, I presume the feature will draw a lot of juice? Still, I really want to see how it works as an AA solution

 

[Sosokrates]

If true it could give series consoles added performance/visuals.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

For those who are interested , I was able to ask Jason Ronald about ML directly as he was recently on a live pod cast.

My question was “What informed the decision to support machine learning on an Hardware Level”

I will find that pod cast and post a time stamp if people are interested.

 

[Calverz]

If this gets working on Xbox series s/x it could create a huge gulf. Think games 120fps on series consoles versus 60fps on competing consoles.
potentially another one??

 

[Sosokrates]

For those who are interested , I was able to ask Jason Ronald about ML directly as he was recently on a live pod cast.

My question was “What informed the decision to support machine learning on an Hardware Level”

I will find that pod cast and post a time stamp if people are interested.

Yes please.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Yes please.

Here you go :

Should Start @ ~40:28

 

[Dream-Knife]

Open source is the way forward. Nvidia needs to pay attention.

 

[Closer]

Just because it is supported doesn't mean it will be used. Sadly that's how it goes when you're not the market leader.

 

[Draugoth]

Hopefully this means better prices for Nvidia and AMD cards

 

[mrBarrelNut]

If true it could give series consoles added performance/visuals.

Especially this could enable more elaborate Ray Tracing effects while still maintaining 60 fps and 4K level quality.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

Just because it is supported doesn't mean it will be used. Sadly that's how it goes when you're not the market leader.

LoL @ “Market Leader” sir this tech is an industry wide paradigm shift that’ll be open source.

Also Microsoft is surely going to implement this as they’ve been a force in ML development.

Tell me you know nothing about the industry without telling me.

lol btw Microsoft is the most valuable company in the world. I think that’s about as market leader as you can get

 

[Panajev2001a]

I knew the conversation would change direction as soon as someone asked if ps5 supports the feature (it doesn't)

What is the proof it does not support INT8/INT4 quad and octa rate math (available in RDNA1 already, optional on that arch, default on RDNA2) as it does double rate FP16? The old “if it did they would have said” “Sony Principal Eng tweet” proofs, right ?

I see the thread already took a “omg, this could mean a gulf of performance” “trump card” material kind of turn .