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You Can't Beat 'Trails' For Lore

Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
I still believe the Trails series has the deepest lore of any Japanese role-playing game and maybe any Western role playing game.

I'm still in awe regarding the amount of detail they put into the series. How much background and how rich the setting is.

Minor NPCs even have recurring appearances in other games and stories behind them. They're not just some random person you talk to and go on your way. Everybody seems to have a story.

There's already 12 games in the series, all taking place in the same world and all interconnected. The first game is over 15 years old already.

According to the developer, the series is only about 60% finished. They still have one or two more "arcs" at least before the series is finished and I wouldn't be surprised they continue with a new series in the same world, a prequel series or even an MMO.

No Japanese role-playing game comes close but as for Western gaming which is pretty good about consistent lore and interconnected games, I would say the Elder Scrolls games are very similar.

Now there are worlds even more detailed than the trails games like the Forgotten Realms from Dungeons & Dragons but that started off as a tabletop game so I'm not going to count that. Same goes for Warhammer 40,000, another series I really love but that started off as a tabletop game as well.

I can't recommend another series if you're looking for a very deep and richly detailed world and backstory as well as an ongoing story that's epic in scope.
 
Eddie-Griffin

Eddie-Griffin

Banned
I don't consider amount of story to mean that there's good lore or actual depth, it seems to be quantity over quality imo. Especially if the gameplay across the games isn't equally consistent or accessible, it would impact how much a person gets of the lore anyway.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
On another note, I wonder why so many Japanese role-playing games have sequels that are not connected like Final Fantasy. It seems like Japanese RPG developers were never interested in making interconnected games because a lot of the games in their respective series are not connected with some exceptions.

Trails is really underappreciated in this regards to what they have done.

I hope that in the future, more Japanese role playing games will have interconnected games like the Trails series or say, Star Ocean. However, the latter was really ruined in my opinion by the ending reveal of the third game. Which is a shame.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
Eddie-Griffin said:
I don't consider amount of story to mean that there's good lore or actual depth, it seems to be quantity over quality imo. Especially if the gameplay across the games isn't equally consistent or accessible, it would impact how much a person gets of the lore anyway.
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There is a lot of world building outside the story. There's a lot of lore outside the story. It is a really fleshed-out world. And as I mentioned above, even minor NPCs are flushed out.

For me the quality has been pretty consistent with the series.
 
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Eddie-Griffin

Eddie-Griffin

Banned
Darkmakaimura said:
On another note, I wonder why so many Japanese role-playing games have sequels that are not connected like Final Fantasy. It seems like Japanese RPG developers were never interested in making interconnected games because a lot of the games in their respective series are not connected with some exceptions.

Trails is really underappreciated in this regards to what they have done.

I hope that in the future, more Japanese role playing games will have interconnected games like the Trails series or say, Star Ocean. However, the latter was really ruined in my opinion by the ending reveal of the third game. Which is a shame.
Click to expand...

Most rpgs aren't interconnected, usually if they are it's 2-4 games and then the devs move on to new worlds, or radical change the current one so that it's somewhat familiar but not the same. That's been Rpg games from the early days.

Some major franchises that were interconnected, more than half of them were already planned to have games take place in multiple parts of the game world anyway, Elder Scrolls would be a major example of this. Which is why Starfield is Bethesdas first new IP in 25 years, before that they had their hands on Terminator and a bunch of other stuff. But Elder Scrolls was always planned to have games take place in the game world under different circumstances.

Final Fantasy on the other hand was supposed to be the last send off game, and the sequels to it were made off the hip.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
Labadal said:
I find it to be all over the place, and there are lot of contradictions.

Still a fan of the series.
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It is confusing and convoluted at times I agree. Unfortunately, that's the case with a lot of things that have that kind of depth.

My other complaint is there still too many unanswered questions which should be answered already. I'm thinking some of these unanswered questions will never get answered too.
 
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Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
I would actually compare the series to American media such as the Marvel Cinematic Universe or Star Wars even.

I don't think there's any Japanese role-playing game out there that has a continuing story on this scale.

I'm not sure what it is with Japanese role playing game developers but sequels usually take place in other worlds that are disconnected from the previous entries. rarely do you get an ongoing continuous universe or world. I guess the Suikoden might be the closest thing we have although it didn't have as many entries as the Trails games and it's not as thorough.

I would love to see more Japanese role playing games that have a continuous universe or world. It doesn't need to have an ongoing story but it would be nice to have different stories set in the same universe the world, similar to how the Elder Scrolls series is.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
So, the series is about 70% finished when you account for Kuro no Kiseki II or III.

I wonder what they're going to do once they actually do complete the entire story? Will it be the end of the series or do you think they'll still expand it and to possibly an MMO or prequels or whatever?
 
SlimeGooGoo

SlimeGooGoo

Party Gooper
Darkmakaimura said:
So, the series is about 70% finished when you account for Kuro no Kiseki II or III.

I wonder what they're going to do once they actually do complete the entire story? Will it be the end of the series or do you think they'll still expand it and to possibly an MMO or prequels or whatever?
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The milking will continue

They will probably remake Trails in the Sky
 
pleaseinsertdisctwo

pleaseinsertdisctwo

Member
These games are the definition of quantity over quality.

Maybe Falcom would see an actually substantial increase in sales if they stopped treating Trails like a McDonalds factory. It’s also an obviously bad business idea to have a 12+ part series of games (all of which are very long and very low budget) that are interconnected.

But this is also the same company that named another IP “Ys.”
 
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pleaseinsertdisctwo

pleaseinsertdisctwo

Member
SlimeGooGoo said:
Bonus video



But Trails in the Sky is ok
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1504461990307xusc1.jpg
 
TintoConCasera

TintoConCasera

I bought a sex doll, but I keep it inflated 100% of the time and use it like a regular wife
Tried the first game for a few hours, and it wasn't for me. Felt more like a VN than an actual JRPG, and this is coming from someone that likes Persona games.

I don't mind a lot of dialog, but the pacing was just too slow and not only story wise but also gameplay wise.
 
Meicyn

Meicyn

Gold Member
Trails is full on shonen anime, but it constantly lobs paragraphs at you. Don’t get me wrong, there is a lot of worldbuilding and everything is explained in excruciating detail. Like, Trails will have you visit a town, and they’ll explain where they sourced their fruits and vegetables.

The problem is that all of this lore stuff is squandered. You have political factions, countries with set goals, characters who have backstabbing agendas, and so on. But then the game goes and does shonen anime power creep, and you have characters running around that are walking TNT. The stakes are supposedly high, and the games go to great lengths to tell you that so much bad stuff is happening, but you never really see or feel it.

Jesus Christ, this series has so many fake out deaths and misdirection, it’s hard to take any dramatic moment seriously. My default state for Trails is “oh, a character died… they’ll probably return in the next game”.

I enjoy these games for what they are, but Trails needs some serious editing and some character culling. Worldbuilding is strong, but the storytelling and pacing is mid at best, awful most of the time.
 
pleaseinsertdisctwo

pleaseinsertdisctwo

Member
I’d also like to point out that my short experience with ToCS consisted of probably the WORST expository dialogue I’ve ever experienced.

Party member A: Hmph. Well if it isn’t Meanie Von Guggenworth XXVII, the son of the famous Famous Von Guggenworth who helped our nation win the Great War 10 years ago.
Meanie: hmph. Seems like you know me quite well, Party Member A, whose family bought out Region A’s wealthiest city and is now closely involved with the politics surrounding Region A, who are rumored to be preparing for a war with Region B.
Party Member A: hmph….


Next scene

Party Member B: wow guys, look at that tree next to us. The ugliest texture on that tree branch at the top is what lets me know that this is an Irrelevant Tree. After the Irrelevant War of 25 years ago, X NPC forced Y NPC to hand over all their Irrelevant Tree seeds because X NPC had an obsession with trees, which stemmed from the abuse he received during childhood. And now these Irrelevant Trees bring this region great profit, and that’s how we’ve been able to repair our relationship with Region D after the Original Great War 50 years ago, where we bombed their capital city, which actually was done accidentally, because the soldiers on that day were mostly drafted, since the region had very little money for training at the time, they were ill-equipped for proper combat.



Obviously exaggeration but lol
 
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Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
If I knew there was this much hate for this game I might have refrain from posting this in the first place.

The games definitely have their issues but I didn't realize it was this disliked here. Bummer.
 
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jshackles

jshackles

Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
Darkmakaimura said:
If I knew there was this much hate for this game I might have refrain from posting this in the first place.

The games definitely have their issues but I didn't realize it was this disliked here. Bummer.
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Don't let the haters get you frazzled. The games are definitely slow-burn and story-heavy, but some people (like me) really love that about them. Sure there are wacky portions of the games, but that's bound to happen when each is over 40 hours of content and there are like 10 of them.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
jshackles said:
Don't let the haters get you frazzled. The games are definitely slow-burn and story-heavy, but some people (like me) really love that about them. Sure there are wacky portions of the games, but that's bound to happen when each is over 40 hours of content and there are like 10 of them.
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Some of the criticisms above I do agree with. Like the person who said that characters don't seem to die and just come back. That is one thing that's always bothering me with it.
 
saintjules

saintjules

Member
The series takes a lot of dedication to get through. Dare I say more than a Yakuza game. They're good, but with the time I have these days it would take a century to finish these games.
 
Sub_Level

Sub_Level

wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Darkmakaimura said:
If I knew there was this much hate for this game I might have refrain from posting this in the first place.

The games definitely have their issues but I didn't realize it was this disliked here. Bummer.
Click to expand...

I loved my time with Cold Steel I & II so much. But it absolutely is anime trash lol. Its ok to like trashy stuff. A lot of the supposedly well written RPG masterpieces like Xenogears, Planescape Torment, or FF Tactics didn’t do much of anything for me. I’d take slicing monsters with Rean’s 1000x folded blade & romancing big titty bitches any day of the week. And like you said in the op, its cool that there’s so much worldbuilding along the way.
 
Meicyn

Meicyn

Gold Member
Darkmakaimura said:
If I knew there was this much hate for this game I might have refrain from posting this in the first place.

The games definitely have their issues but I didn't realize it was this disliked here. Bummer.
Click to expand...
I wouldn’t describe it as hate, at least for me. It’s more disappointment in execution. At a minimum, the combat is incredibly satisfying, especially since they give you the tools to break it. And the soundtracks are always bangers.

I hope they improve, I really do.
 
RavageX

RavageX

Member
To keep it simple, I ain't got that kinda time.

Different job/life where I have more free time, possibly. I own a couple of the games but whenever I start it just takes too long to get moving.

I appreciate the detail, but there are too many games and not enough time. I like my RPGs, but theres too much "typical anime stuffs" for me with this.

I have spent a lot of time on a couple tales games and xenoblade 1 and 2 to compare.
 
T

TwinB242

Member
Trails from Zero is a good starting point for this series. I enjoyed that and will also play the sequel thats releasing this year (Trails to Azure). Those 2 games apparently make up the beginning arc of the entire story and appear to be mostly self contained. So I think they will be a good way to experience the series without feeling like you're missing something if you don't play the other dozen or so games.
 
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PonyStation4

PonyStation4

Member
TwinB242 said:
Trails from Zero is a good starting point for this series. I enjoyed that and will also play the sequel thats releasing this year (Trails to Azure). Those 2 games apparently make up the beginning arc of the entire story and appear to be mostly self contained. So I think they will be a good way to experience the series without feeling like you're missing something if you don't play the other dozen or so games.
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They're not self contained, the 1st game is always world building. You can play Zero, Cold Steel 1 and Before Dawn 1 by just jumping in. The issue starts with the 2nd games in a set. It becomes more clear when you look at the timeline by month and year.

"-" same time
">" = before > after

1202 = Sky 1st > Sky 2nd
1203 = Sky 2nd > Sky 3rd
1204 = (Zero - CS1) > Azure > At Dawn > (Azure - CS2)
1205 = (CS2-CS3 1st part) > CS3
1206 = CS4 > Reverie
1207 = Reverie
1208 = Before Dawn
1209 = Before Dawn 2

Starting from Cold Steel 2 in the later half of the 1204 year, the series assumes you've played all the previous games including Sky. The overarching story is about events before 1202 that's only ever explained in Trails 1-3.
 
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yet_another_alt

yet_another_alt

Member
Darkmakaimura said:
If I knew there was this much hate for this game I might have refrain from posting this in the first place.

The games definitely have their issues but I didn't realize it was this disliked here. Bummer.
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Your mistake was opening with discussion instead of waifus.

To actually contribute to said topic, the west does have Ultima, Wizardry, and Might & Magic. They don't have the same focus on non-major NPCs as trails does but they do have extensive lore.
Actually if we're talking about interactions with non-major NPCs the only game that I've played that comes close is probably The Last Sovereign but that game scares off a lot of people for a lot of reasons.


Also it's back. And it's still glorious.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
yet_another_alt said:
Your mistake was opening with discussion instead of waifus.

To actually contribute to said topic, the west does have Ultima, Wizardry, and Might & Magic. They don't have the same focus on non-major NPCs as trails does but they do have extensive lore.
Actually if we're talking about interactions with non-major NPCs the only game that I've played that comes close is probably The Last Sovereign but that game scares off a lot of people for a lot of reasons.


Also it's back. And it's still glorious.
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Wizardry games aren't all interconnected and take place in different worlds, generally. Ultima it always take place in one world but wasn't as detailed as the Trails games.

I would say Elder Scrolls is pretty detailed and is rich and lore and background. Western games are definitely better at doing it than Japanese games.
 
SlimeGooGoo

SlimeGooGoo

Party Gooper
Darkmakaimura said:
I would say Elder Scrolls is pretty detailed and is rich and lore and background. Western games are definitely better at doing it than Japanese games.
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Eh, I would say they're about the same.
Most video game "lore" is just a bunch of crap written by nerds and when it gets big enough -- that even *they* lose track of what was written -- it becomes "deep".

I'd rather developers take the SquareSoft approach and create an entire world from scratch for each game and then dispose of it for the next. Easier to keep things consistent, and no need to write more than you need.

ChVd3_FUYAEoWAg
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
I would love if they did spin-off games someday. All the entries are part of the same main line series but I think a dungeon crawler or an RTS game would be an interesting addition.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Member
SlimeGooGoo said:
Yeah, I exchanged PMs with him once, unless he changed his settings.

There was also Rean no Kiseki Rean no Kiseki that liked Trails, but he quit some time ago.
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I can't send PMs either to him but that's just because he limits who can see his profile. I'm guessing it's only people he follows and follows him back so you may not actually be blocked.

Yeah, I remember Rean from here too.
 
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