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[Shelookdlvl18]

Although I would agree this is annoying and a bad design choice I don't think it's accurate to consider it as a hardware problem. This is something you can easily fix in software - if the trusted clock is not set then just warn the user that certain features won't work until the unit is connected to the network at least once. IMO, this is what they should have done initially - entirely disabling the system is a lazy cop-out.

Correct. Sony could fix this by simply issuing an update to no longer require the synchronization check after a certain date.

But why would Sony even care to bother. Just look at all the shills here defending it, instead of seeking an explanation and solution. They're horses that have been lead to water, and yet all they do is hee and haw about conspiracy theories.

 

[StateofMajora]

Of course you're not going to debate that. You already know which one is worse.

However this thread isn't about Xbox. It's about Playstation, and out of all the defending going on you singled me out.

You've got nothing bud. So have a seat.

That's why I used the word "shills" in my other post. As in anyone defending this. As in plural.

But no, just like PS, Xbox has a built in feature that makes it so you can't use it without internet at some point. Only fanboys will argue which one is worse. They're both dictating that you have internet at some point, or else you have a brick.

Suck that corporate pole though.

 

[reinking]

• In the future, when the cmos battery dies inside your PS5. (And it will die) You can replace the battery, at which point your PS5 will require an online connection to function properly. Same goes with both the PS4 and PS3.

Isn't this a one time thing after the battery replacement? You keep making it sound like it will be required to stay online.

 

[packy34]

This is not a "hardware flaw". This is just how cmos batteries work. You can fix it by replacing the battery when it dies. They cost less than a dollar at any convenience store.

 

[Trimesh]

I found the photo hilarious. The issue itself I find laughable, you still have N64 cartridges with original battery inside them for saves 20+ years later.

That's CMOS RAM which is completely static in standby and takes only leakage current. The battery in the PS4 and PS5 is running the RTC, which takes way more power.

 

[Shelookdlvl18]

That's why I used the word "shills" in my other post. As in anyone defending this. As in plural.

But no, just like PS, Xbox has a built in feature that makes it so you can't use it without internet at some point. Only fanboys will argue which one is worse. They're both dictating that you have internet at some point, or else you have a brick.

Suck that corporate pole though.

Where is the word "shills"?

Not going to debate which is worse, but the initial online check on Xbox is also complete bs and shouldn’t be defended.

Yes, they both have that built in feature. One company told you about it before you bought their console, while the other company not only didn't tell you... They lied about it, while mocking the other company for it.

Dictating is forcing you to do something without options. MS does at least give you options. Sony is dictating.

Xbox absolutely has some shitty aspects, just like any other game company. Their lack of 1st party games? Yes, they're absolutely 100% incompetent to release a brand new console without jack shit for a 1st party game to showcase it on. The direction that Forza Motorsports has taken recently with their absurd policies I not only ranted about here, but twitter as well. Them bragging about being "the world's most powerful console" only to come out and lose some early comparisons by a considerable margin? Yes, they must have been all smoking crack to declare that.


But as far as needing an online connection? Yes, I complained about that too. In fact this very forum was chock fucking loaded front to back with complaint threads about exactly that back in 2013. So now that we find out that Sony's been secretly doing something similar this whole time, can we not have even one measly thread about it without you repeatedly crying "Bu bu bu but the Xbox too"?

 

[Trimesh]

This is not a "hardware flaw". This is just how cmos batteries work. You can fix it by replacing the battery when it dies. They cost less than a dollar at any convenience store.

The problem is that when you replace the battery it still doesn't work until you connect the console to the network to reset the internal clock from what it considers to be a trusted source. This is a minor inconvenience now, but at some point in the future when the PSN PS5 services are no longer available it will have the effect of entirely bricking the console. This is, at best, a highly questionable design decision.

 

[StateofMajora]

Where is the word "shills"?

Yes, they both have that built in feature. One company told you about it before you bought their console, while the other company not only didn't tell you... They lied about it, while mocking the other company for it.

Dictating is forcing you to do something without options. MS does at least give you options. Sony is dictating.

Xbox absolutely has some shitty aspects, just like any other game company. Their lack of 1st party games? Yes, they're absolutely 100% incompetent to release a brand new console without jack shit for a 1st party game to showcase it on. The direction that Forza Motorsports has taken recently with their absurd policies I not only ranted about here, but twitter as well. Them bragging about being "the world's most powerful console" only to come out and lose some early comparisons by a considerable margin? Yes, they must have been all smoking crack to declare that.


But as far as needing an online connection? Yes, I complained about that too. In fact this very forum was chock fucking loaded front to back with complaint threads about exactly that back in 2013. So now that we find out that Sony's been secretly doing something similar this whole time, can we not have even one measly thread about it without you repeatedly crying "Bu bu bu but the Xbox too"?

Post #135 or in other words the post right above the one you just quoted lol.

There is no option ; you can't use your xbox without an initial set up with internet. Just because we found out about this now doesn't mean Xbox's issue isn't there, or that it's not comparable. Since you say you complained about it, it means you know it's an issue. Why do you feel the need to see one thing as worse than the other?

But yeah dude. Pretty shitty from Sony, and I don't really see them changing this with later models although that's the hope.

With MS it's like, it seemed to make sense with the Xbox one launch because that always online stuff was built in the hardware supposedly, but why the hell is it still there in 2021, on a new console other than they want it to be there? Both these issues are equally shitty.

 

[Shelookdlvl18]

Post #135 or in other words the post right above the one you just quoted lol.

There is no option ; you can't use your xbox without an initial set up with internet. Just because we found out about this now doesn't mean Xbox's issue isn't there, or that it's not comparable. Since you say you complained about it, it means you know it's an issue. Why do you feel the need to see one thing as worse than the other?

But yeah dude. Pretty shitty from Sony, and I don't really see them changing this with later models although that's the hope.

With MS it's like, it seemed to make sense with the Xbox one launch because that always online stuff was built in the hardware supposedly, but why the hell is it still there in 2021, on a new console other than they want it to be there? Both these issues are equally shitty.

You know what... You're right. They are comparable, and the thread title should be changed at your insistance to reflect that.

While your comment is 3 paragraphs, with 4 mentions of "Xbox" and "MS", you did manage to squeak out one measly sentence that contained the word "Sony"... In a thread about Playstation. Congratulations, I didn't think you were even capable of that.

 

[Entroyp]

Just change the fucking battery in 10-15 years. Jesus people. Next thing people are going to bitch that that voids the warranty even when PS5 is no longer in production.

 

[packy34]

The problem is that when you replace the battery it still doesn't work until you connect the console to the network to reset the internal clock from what it considers to be a trusted source. This is a minor inconvenience now, but at some point in the future when the PSN PS5 services are no longer available it will have the effect of entirely bricking the console. This is, at best, a highly questionable design decision.

This is assuming Sony doesn't fix it via software sometime within the next decade, which is likely. This whole thing is barely above concern trolling.

 

[SumJester]

How do you lost your digital games? The Cbomb or whatever it's called go to Sony's servers and delete your account?

Let's look at the PSP, Vita and PS3 store for a little glimpse at the future shall we?

I love Sony hardware for decades, but damn Gaf really need to cut down on Apple dronning like behaviour.

 

[Trimesh]

This is assuming Sony doesn't fix it via software sometime within the next decade, which is likely. This whole thing is barely above concern trolling.

I'm an engineer. I'm describing what the actual situation is as of the present time, not as it might be subsequent to some hypothetical change that may or may not be made in the future. I also think, on a professional level, that ever letting it out of the door like that was shitty design.

 

[longdi]

Why the fuck are digital games tied to CMOS battery??

fuck sony

i had pc motherboard cmos battery runs out about the >3years mark.
all my bios settings reset!

thankfully i can easily access and replace with a 10c spare.

why did sony not thought of this better? dismantling a ps4 and ps5 looks harrowing!

 

[jaysius]

Not only that, but the PS5 SSD is soldered onto the board in several spots, so if it dies it’s completely dead, whereas the Series X at least is possibly replaceable, it’s 100% removable.

I really hope that these things “fail to external SSD” if you use the expansion memory for either.

 

[Zog]

Do people think that by the time this ever actually happens they'll still be using their PS5? you'll probably be on PS7 or PS8 which will likely play all of the older games so who freaking cares? Why are people such drama queens? xbox fans I can't wait until MS starts releasing some games so you guys actually have something to do.

I am still playing my NES and PS1.

 

[lh032]

i think its too early to panic now, im sure sony will fix that...if they wanted to lol

 

[Fredrik]

Yes, circle in red.

Loool it even have a battery holder?
I’ve had to solder to change capacitors on old gaming gear and here we’re concerned about swapping out an empty battery?
This is such a nonissue.

 

[The Shepard]

So all this is based on a worst case scenario and Sony and the playstation cease to be? This is such a non issue until that time comes true. There's also jailbreaking the console which I'm sure modders will have cracked the ps5 in 20+ years from now to counter the battery issue to play games. The PS6 will most likely play ps4 and 5 games on it to if its on the same x86 architecture. That ps3 store closure sure has made people paranoid.

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

PS5 Appears To Have Same Major Hardware Flaw As PS4 That Can Render Games Unplayable

A new report indicates that the PlayStation 5 has a hardware design issue that could end up costing users their digital game library.

gamerant.com

How to Replace the CMOS Battery

Information about why time may be lost or decreasing rapidly and how to replace your computer cmos battery.

www.computerhope.com

https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/tech-takes/what-is-cmos-battery-how-to-remove-and-replace

Rocks Digital Marketing Resources | Rocks Digital

Browse our digital marketing blog, download our free guides and get the most important how-tos. Call (214) 989-7549 for digital marketing help today.

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Don't buy PS5's and don't buy/build PC's then. Be careful of the CBOMB, don't replace it as you need to be a scientist to do so.

 

[dcx4610]

I think people are missing the point...

It's not just the CMOS battery, it's the internet connection and dependence on services. Sony just announced they are closing the PS3 and Vita stores. Servers don't last forever. Once your CMOS battery dies, yes you can replace it but you then have to connect back to the internet to sync everything back up. If the authentication servers are down, it doesn't matter that you replaced your CMOS battery. Your disc and digital games won't work. Your system is now a door stop.

It might be 10 years or 20 years from now but unless Sony fixes it, the systems will never be able to play games again.

A lot of people simply don't care. These people don't play old systems or care about older games. Granted, I don't see myself wanting to play the PS4 ever again but I'm not everyone and I don't like the idea of systems ceasing to work due to a reliance on servers. Imagine not being able to play the NES, Genesis, SNES or any other past system again because the service is down. Sony can and should fix this.

 

[sircaw]

Since the opening post, i have been living on the edge. I just don't know what to do anymore. This is a total game-changer for me, will be seeing the head doc for advice tomorrow morning.

Thank you for bringing this pending tragedy to my attention.

 

[Unrivaledx88]

Thwy really out here tryna knock Sony off there high horse

just stoppp

 

[Fredrik]

I think people are missing the point...

It's not just the CMOS battery, it's the internet connection and dependence on services. Sony just announced they are closing the PS3 and Vita stores. Servers don't last forever. Once your CMOS battery dies, yes you can replace it but you then have to connect back to the internet to sync everything back up. If the authentication servers are down, it doesn't matter that you replaced your CMOS battery. Your disc and digital games won't work. Your system is now a door stop.

It might be 10 years or 20 years from now but unless Sony fixes it, the systems will never be able to play games again.

A lot of people simply don't care. These people don't play old systems or care about older games. Granted, I don't see myself wanting to play the PS4 ever again but I'm not everyone and I don't like the idea of systems ceasing to work due to a reliance on servers. Imagine not being able to play the NES, Genesis, SNES or any other past system again because the service is down. Sony can and should fix this.

Games can’t be played without having access to internet and servers anyway since nothing works properly unpatched day 1.

But sure, maybe Sony is unaware this can happen, in that case these reports have a purpose since it might get them to take a step away from the server power switch.

 

[cireza]

Do people think that by the time this ever actually happens they'll still be using their PS5? you'll probably be on PS7 or PS8 which will likely play all of the older games so who freaking cares? Why are people such drama queens? xbox fans I can't wait until MS starts releasing some games so you guys actually have something to do.

It's been 30 years and I still use my MegaDrive. Obviously people won't be using their PS5 in 30 years.

 

[Esppiral]

Reading the comments in this thread I realize of three things.

People can't read.
People miss the point entirely.
People is in denial.

 

[shaddam]

When the activation servers will be offline bypassing the problem with some hack will be problaby easy as hell. But 99% of people will play the games on ps6(7)

 

[FatKingBallman]

Reading the comments in this thread I realize of three things.

People can't read.
People miss the point entirely.
People is in denial.

But you didn't realized that some people AGAIN want to make things blew out of proportion because it is a PS5. :/

 

[FatKingBallman]

The entire subject matter here is obviously far beyond your capability to grasp. It's like arguing with a 3 yr old.

I'm going to explain this as clearly as I can for you.

• The very first time you start your XSX/S, it will want an online connection in order to verify your XBL account. It will also want a connection the first time you install a disc based game. After that, you're good to go.

• The PS5 will not want to connect online upon first startup.

• In the future, when the cmos battery dies inside your PS5. (And it will die) You can replace the battery, at which point your PS5 will require an online connection to function properly. Same goes with both the PS4 and PS3.

Now, before you attempt any witty comeback in an attempt to defect, it's important to remember the following...

• While this won't be a problem for years regarding the PS5, it may well be a problem sooner rather than later with the PS3. While PSN still currently works fine on PS3, Sony is shutting down the PS Store on PS3 in July. Given Sony's track record of shutting down servers, it's only a matter of time before they shutter PSN altogether on the PS3.

• While some people may not care about legacy games on PS, others do. Seeing as Sony can't seem to get PS3 bc on even the PS5, and have shown no interest in doing so... At some point, PS3 digital games will no longer be playable period. "Bbbu but what about PSNow" you say? All PS3 games available to stream are using racks of physical PS3s to do so. Furthermore, in the future once the same applies to the PS4 things get even worse. As both digital as well as physical games won't work unless it can connect to PSN activation servers.

• While your "What about Xbox" attempts are noble. Unfortunately for you, there are 4 things that render your argument worthless.
1. Microsoft is currently spending money, and actively working on ensuring backwards compatibility for their legacy games.
2. Microsoft has a much better track record of keeping their servers live.
3. The XSX/S isn't a "brick" if you don't connect it online, and the specific reason I used the word "want" when referring to it connecting online is due to MS being smart enough to provide an alternative. Xbox consoles can actually be updated entirely offline if need be. But you wouldn't know anything about that being the salty ass Sony fanboy you are.
4. Last but not least. Microsoft was open and transparent about it's consoles requirements and features from day one. Even with the Xbox One, while it might've been muddled and confusing, they never denied things that actually were. Meanwhile, Sony was leading the crusade against MS and it's evil DRM practices (which was silly considering their own history with DRM), all while knowingly maintaining an even worse DRM in their very own consoles... All while maintaining they didn't.

Absolutely anyone defending Sony's bullshit practice here, much less attempting to point a finger at Microsoft or anyone else is nothing more than a pathetic cuck that simply doesn't have a leg to stand on. There's no benefit to supporting it. It does neither you, Sony, or gamers as a whole any favors. Quit crying about the media, youtubers, Gaffers, and the gaming community conspiring together in dark alleys to diss on your beloved Playstation via conspiracy theories. Instead, simply demand Sony do better. I promise you, nobody will consider you weak, and I guarantee the air out here is fresher than it is up Jim Ryan's ass.

I've said nothing wrong with battery replacement. PS5 is now and servers still active. How the hell you or anyone here knows when PS5 servers will be shut down?
Looks like you're defending MS. So, what's the problem? Again, something which is pretty normal for last 20 years, people want ( Xbox fans in this case) blew out of proportion

 

[Wizz-Art]

And here is the other issue with it that extreme Sony fanatics seem to overlook. Sony does NOT own their own infrastructure where PSN runs on. They rent their servers from AWS and Azure. What happens if they stop paying rent? It's not a likely scenario now, but when they are carelessly closing the storefronts for PS3 and Vita it's also not an unthinkable move.

I've see a lot of PS fans starting to see the issues with how Sony handles legacy systems and calling out BS moves like that!

Unfortunately I still see some fanatics that are like this:

You can make sure Jim Ryan aproves of that:

 

[FatKingBallman]

I've see a lot of PS fans starting to see the issues with how Sony handles legacy systems and calling out BS moves like that!

LOL. Can you spin it more, please. They won't because PS fans playing new games, exclusive ones, unlike Xbox fans which plays only backward compatibility games.

 

[Zeroing]

You can make sure Jim Ryan aproves of that:

Jim Ryan descended to hell on a pole dance while singing “call me by your name” and he did a lap dance to the devil, then he started to sell his “PS Satan sneakers ”

Wait I’m confusing things... it wasn’t Jim Ryan ...

 

[Wizz-Art]

LOL. Can you spin it more, please. They won't because PS fans playing new games, exclusive ones, unlike Xbox fans which plays only backward compatibility games.

As I said:

 

[Panajev2001a]

It's not a likely scenario now, but when they are carelessly closing the storefronts for PS3 and Vita it's also not an unthinkable move

The burden of proof here / the leap from closing a storefront (yet letting you redownload the games) and shutting down PSN console activations is quite FUD prize worthy.

Remember about it the next time there is the urge to moan about SonyGAF keeping the Xbox fans down or something that this is the burden of proof you have: “it seems unlikely but an unrelated event that sounds almost like something related to what I am suggesting happened… so there is the proof what I am saying is pending doom and deserves real concern”.

A “major” (oh sounds bad), “hardware” (wow, it is HW so it sounds unfixable), and “that may render game’s unplayable” (yikes, that sounds ominous and a surely pending doom). Someone has thread title writing down to a T.

 

[CRAIG667]

I love how people try to justified a bad news for PlayStation... When you can't play Xbox games on XSX/One without internet connexion.

yes you can as long as you have 'home console' set.

 

[Max_Po]

checked my 5 fat ps3s, 2 slim ps3, and ps4 pro.

All log in, I can sign in PSN and download and play games.

 

[isoRhythm]

Wait so what happens with other consoles when the CMOS battery dies (Series, One, and the Switch)?

 

[Wizz-Art]

The burden of proof here / the leap from closing a storefront (yet letting you redownload the games) and shutting down PSN console activations is quite FUD prize worthy.

Remember about it the next time there is the urge to moan about SonyGAF keeping the Xbox fans down or something that this is the burden of proof you have: “it seems unlikely but an unrelated event that sounds almost like something related to what I am suggesting happened… so there is the proof what I am saying is likely and a big cause of real concern”.

It's not only that, they also shut off servers for their first party games or did you forget that? I also read a report on this forum that patches for games couldn't be downloaded anymore. And the burden of proof do you mean it's not a fact that Sony doesn't have their own infrastructure so they run PSN on rented servers?

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The burden of proof here / the leap from closing a storefront (yet letting you redownload the games) and shutting down PSN console activations is quite FUD prize worthy.

Remember about it the next time there is the urge to moan about SonyGAF keeping the Xbox fans down or something that this is the burden of proof you have: “it seems unlikely but an unrelated event that sounds almost like something related to what I am suggesting happened… so there is the proof what I am saying is pending doom and deserves real concern”.

It's definitely XboxGAF if anything. Go ahead, try some of their lunacy and use Xbox instead of PlayStation and see how long it/you will last.

 

[RyRy93]

So something that hasn't been an issue for 8 years is a big deal now

 

[Calverz]

I love how people try to justified a bad news for PlayStation... When you can't play Xbox games on XSX/One without internet connexion.

Why bring xbox into the conversation? Console warrior??

 

[PropellerEar]

Some people on this thread have made themselves worth of getting some "fear of C-bomb" titles, for this valiant FUD campaign.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It's not only that, they also shut off servers for their first party games or did you forget that? I also read a report on this forum that patches for games couldn't be downloaded anymore. And the burden of proof do you mean it's not a fact that Sony doesn't have their own infrastructure so they run PSN on rented servers?

Sure, let’s continue with this approach… enough almost related circumstantial evidences almost adds up to a proof that the console activation servers are disappearing without a solution in sight, right ? More of the same low burden of proof.

PSN using AWS and/or other cloud solutions and then mmm suddenly turning everything off and folding … well is a whole other can of worms and there are different things that are worse than console activation in that scenario…

 

[Panajev2001a]

Why bring xbox into the conversation? Console warrior??

Is it fear of preservation for any game HW or another PS dedicated fake concern thread painting an unlikely and unsupported worst case scenario as certain pending doom? Smells like the latter…

 

[Wizz-Art]

Sure, let’s continue with this approach… enough almost related circumstantial evidences almost adds up to a proof that the console activation servers are disappearing without a solution in sight, right ? More of the same low burden of proof.

PSN using AWS and/or other cloud solutions and then mmm suddenly turning everything off and folding … well is a whole other can of worms and there are different things that are worse than console activation in that scenario…

It adds up and I'm glad that some Sony fans start to question how they handle important stuff like that. This CMOS battery thing is just another thing that's adding up to the total sum of stuff like i mentioned in my post. I'm sure Jim Ryan appreciates your defensive work, I hope you got compensated for your hard work!

 

[Drew1440]

Nice to see Sony take inspirations from 90s arcade boards, the suicide battery.
Hopefully there will be a way to spoof the PS4 PSN servers, or at least a homebrew app to resolve it.

 

[Zoro7]

I mean we had a couple of days of positive PS5 news. It was too much.

 

[Calverz]

Is it fear of preservation for any game HW or another PS dedicated fake concern thread painting an unlikely and unsupported worst case scenario as certain pending doom? Smells like the latter…

You are paranoid to say the least. Like others in this forum. The story is doing the rounds online and its worth mentioning in a gaming enthusiast forum. I just find it funny, childish almost, that the 2nd comment in is more or less...”bu bu but the x1 cant play games unless online”. Like wtf does that have to do with this story. Its console warring.

 

[The_Mike]

It's Sony's "we believe in generations™" technology, that disables previous generation by carefully calculate how long the generation is set to be.