Support NeoGAF

[bill0527]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

 

[Gonzo The Great]

sells better than any other Mario game

Not Mario Kart.

 

[Aquamarine]

2D Mario is pretty damned close to a killer app. They sell like crazy.

Perceived oversaturation greatly injured any "killer app" status that NSMB:U could have had.

 

[AranhaHunter]

The FE bundle released with a pre installed copy of the game.

I know.

If numbers for Vita and WiiU are confirmed then this month (again):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEVyDmcF7u0

2D Mario is pretty damned close to a killer app. They sell like crazy.

If 2D Mario is not a killer app, I don't know what is.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Vita numbers are laughable as usual.

Thread needs more Vita love.

 

[velvet_nitemare]

Yeah the same third party games that will be available for PS360, I have no doubts PS4 / 720 will sell I just think most of you think they will do much better than they actually will.

3 million each from launch - April 1st 2014, around the same as WiiU, get your excuses ready .

I really hope i remember this next year, but i doubt i will.

 

[UberTag]

What released for PSV in February to cause an increased weekly average?

Clearly everyone was excited about the PS4 unveil and wanted to stockpile some PS4 remote play controllers early.

 

[Randolph Freelander]

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

It will be OK, they'll have YouTube or Netflix and Facebook and whatever. Oh, games, how quaint.

 

[Apophis2036]

They need only 3 things to give it a real boost.

1. Kill off the Wii. The damn thing is still selling into the 100K. I know they are still making millions on it (which is probably why it isn't dead yet), but it's doing harm to the WiiU with people still thinking it's just a controller for the Wii.

2. Games. I think that Lego City and Monster hunter will push some Wii U's (the former more than the latter), but they need something big. Something that will make people forget their Wii's and move on.

3. Price drop. Nintendo, you have 14 billion dollars, and still profit off the Wii, DS, and 3DS, plus software. Bite the god damned bullet and sale the WiiU at (more of) a loss. $199.99 for basic and $249.99 for premium. Look what dropping the 3DS price did for it. Plus, I want ambassador privileges like with my 3DS



Out of those 3, only the 3DS is making profit and it's only been making it since last September IIRC. The Wii U and Vita are both selling at loss.

Why are people asking Nintendo to take $150 loss per console ?, you seen what those kind of loses done to Sony's financial results for PS3. *If* WiiU price drops it will be a $50 drop at most.

 

[Satchel]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

I'd argue both the 360 and PS3 had far worse launch line UPS than the WiiU

 

[Kai Dracon]

We know big Wii U games are coming. I'm thinking we need to accept that for better or worse, the facts point to Nintendo having been busy enough the last few years - but the scope of the project proving too much for how they were structured. And perhaps their existing mentality at that point.

If Nintendo shows up at E3 with a playable 3D Mario that blows people away, it won't be a game that they whipped together in six months after Wii U didn't do so well at Christmas. I'd think they were in fact working on it and prototyping since Mario Galaxy 2 shipped. The truly huge games like that take time. Worse when they're tangled up with platform launches, where specifications and development tools are in flux.

2D Mario is pretty damned close to a killer app. They sell like crazy.

There needs to be category for "tipping point" games. Not something so hot that it will sell millions of consoles by itself, but in combination with a full-blown killer app, will push a platform through the roof.

2D Mario is probably in that category. If people have the console, they will buy it - everyone will buy it, not just fans, not just hardcore enthusiasts of the franchise. But it may not be quite the right thing to sell by itself.

In this sense Nintendo was not wrong to emphasize they were launching with 2D Mario. It's a good thing to have out as soon as possible. Not enough by itself though.

I'd argue both the 360 and PS3 had far worse launch line UPS than the WiiU

In one sense Wii U had the best launch line-up of any Nintendo platform ever.

The reality is that Nintendo platforms always launch with one big "idea" game that the system is all but based on, and a bunch of rushed 3rd party drek that's almost always forgettable. Gamecube may have been the one console that had something as big as Melee soon after launch. The problem with Wii U is that it actually has an impressive line-up if it existed in a vacuum. Even with technical problems, games like ME3, ACIII, Batman, BLOPS2, are bigger and more robust games than any game console ever gets at launch.

But the kicker is they were not "new". They weren't that old either - but it was unattractive to launch those games with 1. problems from incomplete dev kits and short lead time, and 2. sixty bucks a pop.

The 3rd party ports should have been $40, at the very least.

 

[Pachterballs]

They need only 3 things to give it a real boost.

1. Kill off the Wii. The damn thing is still selling into the 100K. I know they are still making millions on it (which is probably why it isn't dead yet), but it's doing harm to the WiiU with people still thinking it's just a controller for the Wii.

this is ridiculous. wii still sells software, still revenue

2. Games. I think that Lego City and Monster hunter will push some Wii U's (the former more than the latter), but they need something big. Something that will make people forget their Wii's and move on.

yeah..good luck with that. see the xeenth thread about no games.

3. Price drop. Nintendo, you have 14 billion dollars, and still profit off the Wii, DS, and 3DS, plus software. Bite the god damned bullet and sale the WiiU at (more of) a loss. $199.99 for basic and $249.99 for premium. Look what dropping the 3DS price did for it. Plus, I want ambassador privileges like with my 3DS

they deliberately priced it high (well documented Nintendo arrogance), only to then drop it because no one was biting.


Out of those 3, only the 3DS is making profit and it's only been making it since last September IIRC. The Wii U and Vita are both selling at loss.

comments in red

 

[AdventureRacing]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

I think it's pretty clear already that 3rd parties have already made their bed with Sony's and MS's next consoles. I have no doubt that they will be far better supported right out of the gate.

 

[Apophis2036]

I really hope i remember this next year, but i doubt i will.

How many consoles do you expect PS4 and 720 to sell each from launch to April 1st 2014 ?, remember they will be cannibalizing each others sales for the first year.

 

[prwxv3]

Perceived oversaturation greatly injured any "killer app" status that NSMB:U could have had.

does not help that there is little incentive to buy a $300 console to play a $60 game too similar to a game you can get on a 100$ Wii

 

[grandjedi6]

fire emblem did pretty damn well for itself. it'll shouldn't have a problem breaking a million worldwide. if the first american/european fire emblem didn't do that, then it'll also be the best-selling game in the series.

There's no way the first NA Fire Emblem (Rekka no Ken) broke a million worldwide. For that to happen European sales must = Japanese + US sales, which I rather doubt is true (especially since the US was the GBA's strongest region).

 

[Darryl]

sells better than any other Mario game

Kart is right up there as well

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

you weren't around for the 3DS?

 

[sleepykyo]

I have a feeling the software number actuals are terrible.

Well Black Ops is at number 2, so Black Ops has amazing legs or it was a slow month.

 

[liger05]

What was the vita number?

 

[AniHawk]

I thought it was going to struggle after they let the wii brand die. Can you honestly say though that you expected this level of failure? In some countries in Europe you're probably better off measuring sales by the hundreds than the thousands.

i was expecting ps3 levels, which is more or less where it's at if 80k is correct.

 

[Papacheeks]

Someone tell me why the Wii is still selling.

Because it's cheap now, and there is a lot of great games to be had for cheap as well. Who wants to spend 300-350 for 2 games at 59.99. When they can spend 99-129 and get Mario Galaxy, Donkey Kong, and the likes for 19.99?

That makes sense, people will go where the games are man.

No games on Wii U, plus because of shoddy advertising and mixed messages about the system, no one see's the value in the 350$ system.

 

[Pachterballs]

We know big Wii U games are coming. I'm thinking we need to accept that for better or worse, the facts point to Nintendo having been busy enough the last few years - but the scope of the project proving too much for how they were structured. And perhaps their existing mentality at that point.

If Nintendo shows up at E3 with a playable 3D Mario that blows people away, it won't be a game that they whipped together in six months after Wii U didn't do so well at Christmas. I'd think they were in fact working on it and prototyping since Mario Galaxy 2 shipped. The truly huge games like that take time. Worse when they're tangled up with platform launches, where specifications and development tools are in flux.


There needs to be category for "tipping point" games. Not something so hot that it will sell millions of consoles by itself, but in combination with a full-blown killer app, will push a platform through the roof.

2D Mario is probably in that category. If people have the console, they will buy it - everyone will buy it, not just fans, not just hardcore enthusiasts of the franchise. But it may not be quite the right thing to sell by itself.

In this sense Nintendo was not wrong to emphasize they were launching with 2D Mario. It's a good thing to have out as soon as possible. Not enough by itself though.

also btw wii's game drought death ---> wiiU (about 1.5-2 years), where were their games? What were they doing? Sitting on their asses that's what.

This is wholely their fault.

I think it's pretty clear already that 3rd parties have already made their bed with Sony's and MS's next consoles. I have no doubt that they will be far better supported right out of the gate.

this is beyond doubt. Its reality.

 

[donny2112]

Must be true on an individual SKU basis. Clearly they show up 9 times out of the multi-SKU Top 10.

LIKELY INDIVIDUAL SKU TOP 10 (in some order)

Dead Space 3 (X360)
Dead Space 3 (PS3)
Call of Duty: Black Ops II (X360)
Call of Duty: Black Ops II (PS3)
Crysis 3 (X360)
NBA 2K13 (X360)
NBA 2K13 (PS3)
Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance (PS3)
Aliens: Colonial Marines (X360)
Just Dance 4 (Wii)

That's probably accurate. Fire Emblem: Awakening 3DS would be in this group as well if you included digital sales.

Microsoft excludes handheld systems and games from their comparisons. It'd be 5 out of top 10 PS3/360/Wii

Spoiler

/Wii U :lol

games, then.

 

[Meelow]

I have a feeling we'll get a Nintendo Direct next week.

Nintendo really has to make the Wii U look more attractive to the consumers.

Thinking the Wii U will ride off the Wii success was the same mistake Sony did with the PS3 with PS2.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

I'm still wondering what happened there. For months before the Wii U came out, Iwata and the rest were talking about how they saw how much droughts hurt past Nintendo hardware (especially the 3DS) and they were making sure that wasn't going to happen.

I get the amateur impression that Iwata, for whatever reason, believed that third-party support for Wii U's first few months would be far more impressive or at least attractive to consumers than it actually was and thus "allowed" Nintendo to space out their own titles more.

 

[MechaX]

On one hand, I'm glad that FE managed to pull that much.

On the other hand, it probably could have sold so much better if the launch was not completely fucked up.

Given the word of mouth, I'm betting it'll have good legs.

 

[DragonSworne]

Hey Nintendo

Start announcing games with release dates, you know, something that actually makes business sense.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

Sony's already shown like 3 fairly big titles presumably coming early on. And Knack. Plus whatever theyve saved for E3, like Last Guardian. Oh and all those cross-gen game things like Destiny, Watch Dogs, AC4, Thief, etc, since third parties will actually be there.

Nintendo clearly just found HD development really REALLY hard for the last 2 years of Wii nothingness, much like most of Japan did when they were making the jump in like 2005-6. 8 years ago. This is what happens when you erroneously believe your company can set the pace on how videogame tech and game development should proceed; that generation breather on competitive console tech has cost them a sustainable market.

 

[liger05]

I'm still wondering what happened there. For months before the Wii U came out, Iwata and the rest were talking about how they saw how much droughts hurt past Nintendo hardware (especially the 3DS) and they were making sure that wasn't going to happen.

I get the amateur impression that Iwata, for whatever reason, believed that third-party support for Wii U's first few months would be far more impressive or at least attractive to consumers than it actually was and thus "allowed" Nintendo to space out their own titles more.

I tend to think this as well. I think in Japan they expected more 3rd party support at launch. In the west I actually think Nintendo thought the launch lineup was ok not really appreciating that old 3rd party ports wont do shit for a new console.

 

[Huevos de Oro]

Wii U still struggling. Where are those pricecuts Nintendo?

 

[Randolph Freelander]

They need only 3 things to give it a real boost.

1. Kill off the Wii. The damn thing is still selling into the 100K. I know they are still making millions on it (which is probably why it isn't dead yet), but it's doing harm to the WiiU with people still thinking it's just a controller for the Wii.

That's cutting off your nose to spite your face. Compounding an error.

Selling the Wii is good business. The Wii U might just be bad business. Don't throw away good business and think it's going to salvage bad business.

 

[velvet_nitemare]

How many consoles do you expect PS4 and 720 to sell each from launch to April 1st 2014 ?, remember they will be cannibalizing each others sales for the first year.

The wii u is pulling historically low numbers worldwide. If MS take US & UK and Sony Take Mainland Eu and Japan, they can do numbers more in line with typical console sales. Weren't original Wii U projections 5.5 million before Nintendo lowered them? I'll go for that number, seems like a safe bet.

 

[Aquamarine]

What was the vita number?

Vita = Around 37K (36K to 38K).

 

[Little Green Yoda]

Because it's cheap now, and there is a lot of great games to be had for cheap as well. Who wants to spend 300-350 for 2 games at 59.99. When they can spend 99-129 and get Mario Galaxy, Donkey Kong, and the likes for 19.99?

That makes sense, people will go where the games are man.

No games on Wii U, plus because of shoddy advertising and mixed messages about the system, no one see's the value in the 350$ system.

It's true that the Wii is dirt cheap in comparison to everything else at this point but you'd think the market for the Wii is already saturated. Guess there really is a lot of people who buy consoles one generation late.

 

[shinra-bansho]

I have a feeling we'll get a Nintendo Direct next week.

Nintendo really has to make the Wii U look more attractive to the consumers.

The last one worked really well.

 

[UberTag]

Microsoft excludes handheld systems and games from their comparisons. It'd be 5 out of top 10 PS3/360/Wii

Spoiler

/Wii U :lol

games, then.

Well, yeah... that's another reason why FE: Awakening wouldn't count.
At least it did well.

 

[Mileena]

Wii U still struggling. Where are those pricecuts Nintendo?

No one will buy a cheap console with no games.

 

[Raist]

Who'd have thought that the successor to the Wii would be bombing everywhere?

S'up.

 

[prwxv3]

I also can't believe that Nintendo thought that the Wii brand was still strong (projected 5.5 million WiiUs lol) even after letting it almost drop off completely.

 

[liger05]

Vita = Around 37K (36K to 38K).

Taking the crown then.

 

[grandjedi6]

I'm still wondering what happened there. For months before the Wii U came out, Iwata and the rest were talking about how they saw how much droughts hurt past Nintendo hardware (especially the 3DS) and they were making sure that wasn't going to happen.

I get the amateur impression that Iwata, for whatever reason, believed that third-party support for Wii U's first few months would be far more impressive or at least attractive to consumers than it actually was and thus "allowed" Nintendo to space out their own titles more.

Well previous Nintendo droughts lasted till September. But this one is ending in March. So... progress?

They obviously expected to have a stronger launch that would allow them to coast till spring.

 

[tkscz]

Why are people asking Nintendo to take $150 loss per console ?, you seen what those kind of loses done to Sony's financial results for PS3. *If* WiiU price drops it will be a $50 drop at most.

I know, but when their biggest competition is themselves, they need to do something. Nintendo won't drop the Wii, that's obvious, but to the public, the Wii is so much more worth it than the Wii U. It's $100, it has a huge library, it has netflix, it's more well known. Nintendo shot themselves in the foot by making the Wii U seem like just and expensive add-on to the Wii. No one wants to spend $300 or more on controllers, and that's all people think the WiiU is, a controller. It bugs me that they did such shitty marketing this time around.

 

[Nirolak]

I'm still wondering what happened there. For months before the Wii U came out, Iwata and the rest were talking about how they saw how much droughts hurt past Nintendo hardware (especially the 3DS) and they were making sure that wasn't going to happen.

I get the amateur impression that Iwata, for whatever reason, believed that third-party support for Wii U's first few months would be far more impressive or at least attractive to consumers than it actually was and thus "allowed" Nintendo to space out their own titles more.

Well on paper it may have looked good to them.

"Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, New Super Mario Bros. Wii U, FIFA, Madden."

If you just look at it in a vacuum, you could come to a conclusion that your line-up is fine.

 

[Manmademan]

So, what exactly are the arguments against Nintendo dropping the price and trying to get as many units in the hands of gamers before next-gen releases?

unlike the 3DS, nintendo doesn't have a huge profit margin on the WiiU. I think pachter's estimate was about $10 per console, give or take.

even if they drop it $100, it would still be about as expensive as a PS3 and more expensive than a 360- both of which are running equivalent games, and have MORE room to price drop. that's a sucker's game right there.

a price drop wouldn't make much of a dent, even if nintendo was willing to take a bath on it.

 

[AdventureRacing]

i was expecting ps3 levels, which is more or less where it's at if 80k is correct.

In NA it's around PS3 levels (looking to be less soon though). In Japan it's ahead but i doubt that will be long. In Europe i doubt it's even remotely close to the PS3 even at it's worst point.

this is beyond doubt. Its reality.

That's....... exactly what i just said.

 

[Sandfox]

Well previous Nintendo droughts lasted till September. But this one is ending in March. So... progress?

They obviously expected to have a stronger launch that would allow them to coast till spring.

They had games planned but delays screwed them over.

 

[michaelius]

What released for PSV in February to cause an increased weekly average?

February = tax returns in some states ?

 

[DragonSworne]

Well on paper it may have looked good to them.

"Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, New Super Mario Bros. Wii U, FIFA, Madden."

If you just look at it in a vacuum, you could come to a conclusion that your line-up is fine.

Just proves how clueless Nintndo is

 

[TheNatural]

I am dumbfucking founded how anyone can launch a brand new console and have such a paltry lineup of games for it.

This isn't 1999. We have a lot more entertainment options and gaming platforms now. People aren't going to wait around. They're going to either skip your shit completely or move on to something else.

This way of doing things is just sooooooo Nintendo though. I really hope it bites them in the ass this time.

I hope Microsoft and Sony understand this. You can't afford to have a drought right out of the gate if you want to sell consoles.

Waste all your R&D money on a stupid fucking idea that adds ridiculous price to your system, at the cost of power needed to garner meaningful third party support, and there you go.

The funny thing is, Nintendo has the most powerful first party games on the market, and has shown they can produce the best bang for buck design for system power on the market. All they had to do is make the simple design decisions that would put them on even ground with competition - which by the way, they ended up doing ANYWAY.

N64 stuck with cartridges. They went to disc medium anyway.

Gamecube stuck with a weird ass console and controller scheme with a non DVD standard. They eventually offered these options anyway.

They didn't have to match 8GB GDDR5 or anything - they just needed to make a reasonably powerful system with a standard controller, and maybe optionally build off of the completely underused Wii Motion Plus.

They didn't. Now what you get is a disaster, and it's their own fault. Different for the sake of being different doesn't equal better.

 

[Mpl90]

I hope someone will share something about EOIV ( that had just one weel of sales counted, though )