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Are audiophiles full of it or have I just been spoiled by halfway decent gear?

teezzy

Banned
So what's the deal with audiophiles? Well known as a hobbyist pursuit with diminishing returns, yet still there's plenty of snobs out there who will disagree. They even disagree with one another! Yet it's fascinating isn't it?

Sound is important to me, but I don't consider myself part of their tribe. Throw a bunch of numbers and technical jargon my way and I'm in over my head. I think lossless audio and vinyl records are superfluous. Been there, done that. Not for me. I'm simply not knowledgeable enough beyond, "this sounds good to me"

I have fairly decent gear too...

Listening to music on my KRK Rokit 5s right now on my PC which I also often use for gaming

55e25e-edf21d-photo_jun_22__3_18_54_am-2.jpg


was just walking my dog and listening to music/podcasts on my Sony WF-1000MX3 ear buds

Sony_WF1000XM3-3_earbuds-charging-case-closed-1024x575.webp


when I game on my 3DS or Vita, I always utilize my wired Sony MDR-1R which I've had for years now

1Sony_MDR_1R_35481885.jpg


then for my living room I have some vintage floor standing Polk Monitor 10s and a 10" Yamaha subwoofer and some other Polk gear if I wanna go 5.1 for movies

ZEtvKNk.png



sOOb9BT.png


my sun room has a Google Home Max in it

google_home_max_grey_1583239241_12f0cc42_progressive.jpg


The reason I mention all this isn't to brag, especially because none of this is anything particularly special, but because they all sound great to me. That's about it. I couldn't really pinpoint the differences between the bunch apart from the Yamaha sub having lots of bass compared to the rest.

I know the specs on this gear must all vary wildly, so what gives? It all sounds fantastic. What else is there to audio gear apart from this silly notion of, "but what if it sounded better?"

So I ask, is it just me, or are audiophiles full of it? Would some really fancy gear make me wanna throw all this in the trash or something? I don't believe it. Not for a second.

Cheers.
 

teezzy

Banned
Most audiophiles can only tell you how good a set-up sounds if they know how much it cost. There is a difference in sound between things obviously but as the price goes up it starts to become minimal and personal preference at best.

Yeah I made the thread after watching this video:



Then walking my dog and listening to my earbuds and wondering about how they sound compared to whatever else is out there

More or less my conclusion too though
 

Trogdor1123

Gold Member
Not an audiophile either. The only thing I can tell is when something is “bad” as opposed to what is “good”. I have a new pair of apple airpod pros that are very nice but compared to my other ones it’s barely noticeable that there is a difference. Even with this “spatial “ audio. AirPods are mostly marketing though is my understanding. I will say this though, they deaden sound great and are very comfy

guess I just don’t know the difference which I’m ok with as long as they don’t sound bad.
 

dorkimoe

Member
what DAC do you use with your rokit?

I recently sold my Logitech 5.1's that i absolutely loved, but I didnt need 5.1 on my PC and all the wires drove me nuts. Picked up audiengine 2+ because i wanted to just reduce wires and plug directly into PC. However the sound is meh...(no sub) so thinking of either adding the sub to it or just getting rid of them and getting rokits and a sub with a dac.
 

teezzy

Banned
what DAC do you use with your rokit?

I recently sold my Logitech 5.1's that i absolutely loved, but I didnt need 5.1 on my PC and all the wires drove me nuts. Picked up audiengine 2+ because i wanted to just reduce wires and plug directly into PC. However the sound is meh...(no sub) so thinking of either adding the sub to it or just getting rid of them and getting rokits and a sub with a dac.

I have this M-Audio Air 192|4 . I don't use any of the other functions on it apart from plugging the speakers in.

71-par3BgkL._AC_SL1500_.jpg



My favorite part is the big knob. ;-)

Guess you could hook up a guitar or microphone to it and record a song or something if you're into that sort of thing

EDIT: but yeah, i kinda want a sub for my rokits too. might just buy a Rokit sub unless there's a cheaper route that'll blend well idk how all this works really
 
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dorkimoe

Member
I have this M-Audio Air 192|4 . I don't use any of the other functions on it apart from plugging the speakers in.

71-par3BgkL._AC_SL1500_.jpg



My favorite part is the big knob. ;-)

Guess you could hook up a guitar or microphone to it and record a song or something if you're into that sort of thing
Nope, im looking for something just to plug speakers in! Thanks!
 

DeafTourette

Perpetually Offended
I have a cochlear implant and Bluetooth sound goes straight to my auditory nerve! No headphones, ear buds or speakers needed to filter sound to my ears... It's just beamed straight to my brain, basically! But I've liked CD quality/lossless audio sound better than this watered down mp3 stuff so many are peddling.
 

Kadve

Member
I dont know. Would most people care about running every game on Ultra graphic settings? Does it acually make them look better or is it simply in your head because the number is higher?

Think its the same with audiophiles. Does Higher Fidelity always sound better? Maybe. Does it matter if you already think it sounds nice? No.
 
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bender

What time is it?
People prefer different sound stages and tones and people have wildly different tastes in genres of music. In the case of headphones, you can add in a dash of comfort. It's fine to be particular about your gear but there is no need to be a snob in any hobby.
 

teezzy

Banned
People prefer different sound stages and tones and people have wildly different tastes in genres of music. In the case of headphones, you can add in a dash of comfort. It's fine to be particular about your gear but there is no need to be a snob in any hobby.

Maybe that's it. I listen to a lot of alternative rock/metal. Much of it is pretty well-produced though...at least to my ears

Deftones, Tool, Chevelle, Smashing Pumpkins, NIN, Radiohead, Incubus, etc

Sometimes I'll throw on some John Coltrane or something while cleaning and I'm impressed by just how much 'warmth' there is

I know there's particular albums audiophiles love, but some of it is so boring to me - i can't be bothered.
 

Dark Star

Member
I used my bosses Focal Stella headphones with tube amp, DAC, etc for a day (they’re like 3000 dollars). They sound awesome obviously but I’m totally content using my Bose quietcomfort wireless headphones for the quality and affordable price range. When I’m riding my bike and jogging I like my AirPods Pro just fine.

I’m no audiophile, as I even use basic Logitech desktop speakers/subwoofer to mix my own music, but I do agree that there are diminishing returns on quality the higher in price you go with audio equipment. I can’t imagine needing to spend more than 400 bucks on headphones, personally.

I’d rather focus on the quality of my music, both in times of WAV vs MP3 files, and also just the art of sound design and how to capture low end and high end frequencies the best.
 
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Durask

Member
The reason I mention all this isn't to brag, especially because none of this is anything particularly special, but because they all sound great to me. That's about it. I couldn't really pinpoint the differences between the bunch apart from the Yamaha sub having lots of bass compared to the rest.

So you find no difference between Google Home Max and your big Polk speakers?
 

Ribi

Member
Not full of it. I had a fried try to convince my that thier 30$ apple ear buds were better than my starfield because they were louder at full volume. (Mind you they distort and become tint blasters at full while the starfields don't) this was running off their phone, I laughed and walked away
 
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teezzy

Banned
So you find no difference between Google Home Max and your big Polk speakers?

I guess I do. Its not as night and day as you'd think, but the Polks sound fuller. They're hooked to my AVR and there's a center speaker and a subwoofer helping them out too. Then they're spaced out for proper stereo imaging while the Max is a single unit.

The Google Home Max is no slouch either though. There's some nice high end, mids, and bass to it. Sounds... sharper than the warmth of the Polks? It's near the front of my house while the Polks are in back. I've had the cops called on me for Google Home being too loud at like 3am once. Didn't realize it was packing heat like that tbh.

Beats me
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
not full of it, just different priorities than most of us. I am not an audiophile, but I have spent $15 grand on my living room 11.2 setup. is it perfect? no where near. any true audiophile will pick it apart my setup, my Denon x6700h isn’t anything special, but the setup (to me) is at the perfect price/performance and diminish return spot. for any bigger returns on audio quality i’d have to invest tens of thousands more to get minor improvements, important to some, but for me i’m at the “i’m happy with this” point.
 

I_D

Member
There is unquestionably a difference in sound at a certain price point.

$20 speakers don't sound anywhere close to $150 speakers, for example. Even the difference between $20 speakers and $80 speakers can be pretty huge.

But those $150 probably sound pretty darn similar to $300 speakers.

But those same $300 probably sound a lot worse than $600 speakers.

But once you hit around $600, the differences get pretty small.

I have a $1500 speaker setup in my living room, and a $450 setup in my office.
To be honest... I can't really tell the difference, other than the quality of the bass (which can be purchased separately). There is a difference, yes, but I don't know if it's a $1000-dollar difference.
 

teezzy

Banned
not full of it, just different priorities than most of us. I am not an audiophile, but I have spent $15 grand on my living room 11.2 setup. is it perfect? no where near. any true audiophile will pick it apart my setup, my Denon x6700h isn’t anything special, but the setup (to me) is at the perfect price/performance and diminish return spot. for any bigger returns on audio quality i’d have to invest tens of thousands more to get minor improvements, important to some, but for me i’m at the “i’m happy with this” point.

What the heck kinda gear costs 15 grand?

Any pics? Genuinely curious

I couldn't imagine dropping that much and not feeling like you have top of the line stuff
 
A few years ago I spent well over a year on this one ultra high end job. This house had a budget of $24,000,000 and had gone over. It had a multi million dollar a/v budget, including the number one area that had a ridiculously expensive ($100,000+) laser projector, 10' tower speakers at $80,000 a piece, hidden woofers and other assorted speakers all over.

I could throw out more ludicrous numbers but the end result was a soundscape that I've never encountered in my life. I can't even put into words what it was like to stand in that (relatively large) room and be completely enveloped in crystal clear, punchy sound. It's hard to describe but there was no specific point that the sound actually emanated from, enveloped is the best word I can think of. The sound was just...there. Everywhere. It was able to get incredibly loud, yet there wasn't a hint of distortion or degradation of sound quality. No matter the dB level it remained clear, I heard things in songs I had never noticed before. Listening to the tune Black Sabbath was a damn near religious experience, the intro with the thunderstorm and then that epic Tony Iommi riff kicks in. Oh my God.

I have no idea what the diminishing returns were on something like this but in the end it doesn't even really matter, what you can achieve (if you've got the funds) is something that is out of this world.


Thanks for coming to my Ted talk
 
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AJUMP23

Gold Member
I’ve had bad setups and good setups and I can tell a difference between my Martin Logan’s in my media room and a soundbar in another room or a stupid Bluetooth speaker.
 

Durask

Member
What the heck kinda gear costs 15 grand?

Any pics? Genuinely curious

I couldn't imagine dropping that much and not feeling like you have top of the line stuff

11.2 so 11 speakers and 2 subs plus receiver plus wires plus miscellaneous parts plus labor (unless he did it all himself).

Oh and if you do it properly and do acoustic treatment of walls, ceiling, etc - 15K is not a large sum at all.
 
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BigBooper

Member
It gets to being like a religion with some of them, but I believe there are probably some who can tell the difference between good sound and audiophile sound. I don't personally believe the difference is worth the extra cost and time.
 

Con-Z-epT

Live from NeoGAF, it's Friday Night!
I care a lot for good sound and it is easy to get decent quality sound on a normal budget. I try to improve my equipment slowly over time without going overboard because this is basically a bottomless pit. At a certain price point it is however more about the characteristics of the sound than just about raw quality. Everyone has to find a middle ground for themselves and to be honest if i had the budget i surely would go overboard.

I have some "friends" who bought systems between 20000€ - 40000€ and they will tell me they can hear a huge difference between the 500€ cable and the one for 1500€. It sure sounds incredible but on the other hand it often just feels like arguing for a justification of the investment. Passionate or not at some point you will just make a clown of yourself.

It is also one thing to strongly believe in quality for yourself and just go for it or if you constantly need to remind others how cool you are because you have the ears of a bat. Not to generalize here but enthousiast often tend to be extremists.

In the beginning you can argue objectively about improved sound quality on a normal budget but later on everything will be highly subjective.

Just some thoughts.
 
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Ionian

Member
I care a lot for good sound and it is easy to get decent quality sound on a normal budget. I try to improve my equipment slowly over time without going overboard because this is basically a bottomless pit. At a certain price point it is however more about the characteristics of the sound than just

It is also one thing to strongly believe in quality for yourself and just go for it or if you constantly need to remind others how cool you are because you have the ears of a bat. Not to generalize here but enthousiast often tend to be extremists.
In the beginning you can argue objectively about improved sound quality on a normal budget but later on everything will be highly subjective.

Just some thoughts.
I've the ears of a bat myself, made music from the shittiest sound cards before I started taking it more seriously (DAWS and VSTs can work wonders, especially antares ones back in the day).

Really is a question of what you're using to playback on. Some gear. SI/So - shit in, shit out is a major factor. Especially if you want. A solid balance across mediums. Electro DAWS can be a good test but I mostly recorded live, going from mic'ing up Yamaha and Orange amps with Shure SM 57/58s for bass and guitar with a pre-amp and had a reasonably separates system to test and swore byJBL monitors and Seinnheiser HD40s and others for part mixing.

I studied most of it myself as I was fascinated but like anything it's a learning experience. Had my music played in clubs and weddings by mates (they had the music, I had no idea but was very flattered). Eventually got lazy and got a tone port uxb2, 3 in fact due to spills plus I smoked so the pots had to be cleaned for dust every
so often. I only did it for fun anyway despite and they were, cheap, light and portable. A few offers I turned down and so sold loads of best gear and instruments when moving countries. No where to store it all.

The audiophile gear, meh if you have money to burn or a pro studio. A lot of the time it's a waste unless it gets serious usage, for the average user it's a snob good that unless they're trained they simply won't notice the nuance in top-end equipment and it's more for bragging points with people who have money to burn.
 
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AV

We ain't outta here in ten minutes, we won't need no rocket to fly through space
I've heard what a $25,000 home audio setup sounds like. It was great. I also think the XM3 headphones I got for like $200 sound great.

Diminishing returns is putting it lightly for audio.
 

Mohonky

Member
So what's the deal with audiophiles? Well known as a hobbyist pursuit with diminishing returns, yet still there's plenty of snobs out there who will disagree. They even disagree with one another! Yet it's fascinating isn't it?

Sound is important to me, but I don't consider myself part of their tribe. Throw a bunch of numbers and technical jargon my way and I'm in over my head. I think lossless audio and vinyl records are superfluous. Been there, done that. Not for me. I'm simply not knowledgeable enough beyond, "this sounds good to me"

I have fairly decent gear too...

Listening to music on my KRK Rokit 5s right now on my PC which I also often use for gaming

55e25e-edf21d-photo_jun_22__3_18_54_am-2.jpg


was just walking my dog and listening to music/podcasts on my Sony WF-1000MX3 ear buds

Sony_WF1000XM3-3_earbuds-charging-case-closed-1024x575.webp


when I game on my 3DS or Vita, I always utilize my wired Sony MDR-1R which I've had for years now

1Sony_MDR_1R_35481885.jpg


then for my living room I have some vintage floor standing Polk Monitor 10s and a 10" Yamaha subwoofer and some other Polk gear if I wanna go 5.1 for movies

ZEtvKNk.png



sOOb9BT.png


my sun room has a Google Home Max in it

google_home_max_grey_1583239241_12f0cc42_progressive.jpg


The reason I mention all this isn't to brag, especially because none of this is anything particularly special, but because they all sound great to me. That's about it. I couldn't really pinpoint the differences between the bunch apart from the Yamaha sub having lots of bass compared to the rest.

I know the specs on this gear must all vary wildly, so what gives? It all sounds fantastic. What else is there to audio gear apart from this silly notion of, "but what if it sounded better?"

So I ask, is it just me, or are audiophiles full of it? Would some really fancy gear make me wanna throw all this in the trash or something? I don't believe it. Not for a second.

Cheers.
So a few things;

I have those same Sony MDR-1R's, I am actually wearing them right now. Though mine look a lot more beat up now as they are like 9yrs old lol. But don't underestimate those headphones, they are very very good for the money.

Secondly, I worked as a salesperson selling high end audiophile gear, over a decade ago.

Are audiophiles full of it - yes and no.

Firstly, I definitely cannot handle 'shit' audio. I absolutely don't need to spend thousands and I accept 'fit for purpose' but most speakers, headphones etc you get cheap are you know, shit but for most people they are 'fine'. I recently had this dilemma when I wanted to get a microphone as I had been getting into playing Left4Dead 2 Versus. I love my Sony MDR-1R's, if I was still as anal as I was about sound back in the day as when I bought the Sony's, I maybe would have spent more to get a good set of open cup planar headphones but the Sony do an amazing job for the money. So when I went to get something with a microphone, I just had no idea whether to try and get just a mic or go with headphones with a mic. The problem was I always have my fan on, so USB mics were just a constant whooshing mess. So I had to go back to getting headphones with a microphone. I ended up getting Logitech G935's, but also listened to a bunch of others from Astro A50's and Artics and JBL's etc. and honestly, they all sound fucking terrible, but I still bought the 935's and just accept they are 'for gaming' in multiplayer games,but as soon as I don't need that mic, I have my Sony's back on. Many, many people would probly think the 935's sound great, as do Astro A50's etc. but when I listened to them, I was trying to hide from the saleperson that every single set I listened to sounded like bloated garbage being pumped out from underwater.

So in that respect, there's absolutely a monumental difference between what most people would say is ok, and what someone who is used to hearing a more pure sound, is going to expect. In the same way I'm going to say those home heatre in a box systems you get with plastic speakers, wireless subs etc are terrible, but for the majority of people, they are completely fine.

Then you have how I break down audiophiles; those who just like really nice quality sounds, and those who are hobbyists. Those who like nice sound will update gear fairly rarely and stick with what they have for long periods because they buy something that sounds good to begin with and that's the level they are happy with. For them, its just nice sound, if they hear something better, they'll upgrade, but because they aren't doing back to back comparisons all the time, they usually only upgrade every now and again when it comes to speakers, amps etc. If it'shome theatre receivers or streaming devices, those more often because they change with technology and new standards. Hobbyists are a totally different beast. When you start going to 'hobbyists', things get super wanky super quick. Components made from some particular sort of wood from some very particular forest corner in the middle of nowhere because that wood 'has the best harmonic properties', cables that are forged and frozen to align their crystalline structure,some speaker that costs $50k......just because. Hobbyists are always changing gear, listening to different components back to back, changing this, changing that, moving shit around their room etc. For them, it's like searching for something that doesn't exist; some perfect combination of equipment that produces a completely linear response, but also that sounds warm, but also detailed, but airy, but also tight, but also with separation and presence.........for them, it's about the tinkering etc.

For me, it's the 'hobbyists' that are largely full of shit and the companies that market toward them. Speakers that costs 10's of thousands of dollars for no real reason. I'm sure they'll argue otherwise, but speakers are really fucking simple. They push and pull air. That's it. There's no secret to how a speaker works. It's not magic. So yeh, when you see some esoteric company charging a boatload for some high end speaker, you're paying for the boutique name and mostly, the carpentry that houses the speakers. You need to think of most high end speakers not so much as 'higher quality sound' but closer to 'designer furniture'. You can just as easily make an objectionably better speaker by building it in some home made enclosure with good drivers and cross overs than you'd get spending a cars worth of money on some boutique branded speaker.

Then I can tell you I have had a sound room setup with a dozen different bookshelf speakers and demoed them back to back to back and you find some interesting things. Obviously the most expensive speaker, isn't necessarily the nicest sounding. The speaker that initially jumps out at you and makes you go 'wow' isn't necessarily the speaker you want to buy for long listening periods or to live with. What you listen to is the biggest single factor that will decide what speaker is the right one.

Honestly could shit on all day about all the wank that goes on but honestly the simple answer is 'yes' audiophile like audio can be vastly superior to the majority of shit that makes it to the marketplace from big brands; but just because it's boutique and expensive doesn't necessarily mean it's better than a more plain jane, well designed speaker thats actually sensibly priced. So if you have that sensibly priced speaker / component combo that sounds good, you will run into diminishing returns quickly and you might be wondering just why that system that costs 4x as much is barely, if at all, any better.
 
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Ionian

Member
So a few things;

I have those same Sony MDR-1R's, I am actually wearing them right now. Though mine look a lot more beat up now as they are like 9yrs old lol. But don't underestimate those headphones, they are very very good for the money.

Secondly, I worked as a salesperson selling high end audiophile gear, over a decade ago.

Are audiophiles full of it - yes and no.

Firstly, I definitely cannot handle 'shit' audio. I absolutely don't need to spend thousands and I accept 'fit for purpose' but most speakers, headphones etc you get cheap are you know, shit but for most people they are 'fine'. I recently had this dilemma when I wanted to get a microphone as I had been getting into playing Left4Dead 2 Versus. I love my Sony MDR-1R's, if I was still as anal as I was about sound back in the day as when I bought the Sony's, I maybe would have spent more to get a good set of open cup planar headphones but the Sony do an amazing job for the money. So when I went to get something with a microphone, I just had no idea whether to try and get just a mic or go with headphones with a mic. The problem was I always have my fan on, so USB mics were just a constant whooshing mess. So I had to go back to getting headphones with a microphone. I ended up getting Logitech G935's, but also listened to a bunch of others from Astro A50's and Artics and JBL's etc. and honestly, they all sound fucking terrible, but I still bought the 935's and just accept they are 'for gaming' in multiplayer games,but as soon as I don't need that mic, I have my Sony's back on. Many, many people would probly think the 935's sound great, as do Astro A50's etc. but when I listened to them, I was trying to hide from the saleperson that every single set I listened to sounded like bloated garbage being pumped out from underwater.

So in that respect, there's absolutely a monumental difference between what most people would say is ok, and what someone who is used to hearing a more pure sound, is going to expect. In the same way I'm going to say those home heatre in a box systems you get with plastic speakers, wireless subs etc are terrible, but for the majority of people, they are completely fine.

Then you have how I break down audiophiles; those who just like really nice quality sounds, and those who are hobbyists. Those who like nice sound will update gear fairly rarely and stick with what they have for long periods because they buy something that sounds good to begin with and that's the level they are happy with. For them, its just nice sound, if they hear something better, they'll upgrade, but because they aren't doing back to back comparisons all the time, they usually only upgrade every now and again when it comes to speakers, amps etc. If it'shome theatre receivers or streaming devices, those more often because they change with technology and new standards. Hobbyists are a totally different beast. When you start going to 'hobbyists', things get super wanky super quick. Components made from some particular sort of wood from some very particular forest corner in the middle of nowhere because that wood 'has the best harmonic properties', cables that are forged and frozen to align their crystalline structure,some speaker that costs $50k......just because. Hobbyists are always changing gear, listening to different components back to back, changing this, changing that, moving shit around their room etc. For them, it's like searching for something that doesn't exist; some perfect combination of equipment that produces a completely linear response, but also that sounds warm, but also detailed, but airy, but also tight, but also with separation and presence.........for them, it's about the tinkering etc.

For me, it's the 'hobbyists' that are largely full of shit and the companies that market toward them. Speakers that costs 10's of thousands of dollars for no real reason. I'm sure they'll argue otherwise, but speakers are really fucking simple. They push and pull air. That's it. There's no secret to how a speaker works. It's not magic. So yeh, when you see some esoteric company charging a boatload for some high end speaker, you're paying for the boutique name and mostly, the carpentry that houses the speakers. You need to think of most high end speakers not so much as 'higher quality sound' but closer to 'designer furniture'. You can just as easily make an objectionably better speaker by building it in some home made enclosure with good drivers and cross overs than you'd get spending a cars worth of money on some boutique branded speaker.

Then I can tell you I have had a sound room setup with a dozen different bookshelf speakers and demoed them back to back to back and you find some interesting things. Obviously the most expensive speaker, isn't necessarily the nicest sounding. The speaker that initially jumps out at you and makes you go 'wow' isn't necessarily the speaker you want to buy for long listening periods or to live with. What you listen to is the biggest single factor that will decide what speaker is the right one.

Honestly could shit on all day about all the wank that goes on but honestly the simple answer is 'yes' audiophile like audio can be vastly superior to the majority of shit that makes it to the marketplace from big brands; but just because it's boutique and expensive doesn't necessarily mean it's better than a more plain jane, well designed speaker thats actually sensibly priced. So if you have that sensibly priced speaker / component combo that sounds good, you will run into diminishing returns quickly and you might be wondering just why that system that costs 4x as much is barely, if at all, any better.
Excellent post, nails it completely.
 

Kev Kev

Member
Most audiophiles can only tell you how good a set-up sounds if they know how much it cost. There is a difference in sound between things obviously but as the price goes up it starts to become minimal and personal preference at best.
The Office Thank You GIF


i have said as much another threads where people are posting headphones that costs thousands of dollars.

the increase in quality that you are getting from gear like that isnt worth the amount of money they are adding to the cost. now if money is no obstacle then sure go nuts, buy all the best reviewed, cutting edge, most expensive stuff you can, and yes you will indeed have the best audio experience possible.

but you need to be very well off financially if that is how you are going to go at all of your audio set ups, whether it be your entertainment center, computer, gaming headphones, music ear buds, etc. t just isnt worth the teeny tiny bit of increase in quality you get at a certain price point, unless your rich (or for whatever reason youre okay with spending ridiculous amounts of money on audio gear).

more often than not, youre paying for the name, as it has always been and always will be.

even if you have the money to blow, it still isnt worth it to me unless youre working in a top of the line, professional studio mixing, recording or editing audio for a multi-gajillion dollar project, or something like that. you simply dont need that much definition and clarity in your audio, and most of us just dont have that kind of money to blow.

unless your working in an industry where youre trying to get the edge on competition and literally need all the latest most cutting edge audio gear, its mostly a rat race to get the best, newest and most expensive gear, so you can show it off to everyone else and feel better about yourself.
 
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nkarafo

Member
The most important thing about sound is the source. And im not talking about the quality of the file, im talking about the mastering.

I have a certain 128kb MP3 of a David Bowie song that sounds like heaven. Every instrument super clear and a lot of depth. And a lot of FLAC songs that sound like shit, like some original masterings of thrash metal bands such as Slayer.

Doesn't matter how good my speakers and equippement is, shit mastering always sounds like shit and you can do too little by messing with sound settings and equalizers.
 

Fbh

Member
Eh, as most snob stuff it seems widely exaggerated and at some point it just turns into bragging about price and trying to appear refined.
From my experience, as with most stuff, it's worth it to spend a bit more to get higher quality mid tier products because you can definitely hear the difference between a $20 and $100 pair of headphones. But once you go beyond that you quickly get into the realm of diminishing returns.
 

sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
There are technical specifications that cheap hp or cheap gear can’t reproduce. That didn’t mean they are better per se, it’s just that they are capable of it.

I have a HD800S HP and it absolutely destroys every other HP I have in resolution and soundstage. But guess what, I prefer the chill playback of my AirPod Max HP.
If you want that soundstage or resolution you have to pay for it, is it always better ? No.

Always depends on what you actually want or need.
 

navii

My fantasy is that my girlfriend was actually a young high school girl.
You can buy equipment. But you can't buy enjoyment.
 
I used to work with a dude about 10 years ago that ended up falling into a job at this audio/guitar shop that was run by this older guy that was obsessed with high quality audio so he would come up on gear super cheap all the time.

Super high level amps, speakers and whatever. I don't know it's not my bag, but I have to admit that the super high quality stuff is very impressive, especially at high volumes, but ya, it just isn't worth it IMO.

It's like someone running two 3090 ti's frame counting DOOM Eternal. 95% of people won't be able to tell at all.
 

poppabk

Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
So a few things;

I have those same Sony MDR-1R's, I am actually wearing them right now. Though mine look a lot more beat up now as they are like 9yrs old lol. But don't underestimate those headphones, they are very very good for the money.
You don't find the MDR-1R's to have a
Midrange recession with an odd sound signature and a tonal balance that is forward in the upper-mids with odd unevenness throughout and which is slightly v-shaped?
 

teezzy

Banned
So a few things;

I have those same Sony MDR-1R's, I am actually wearing them right now. Though mine look a lot more beat up now as they are like 9yrs old lol. But don't underestimate those headphones, they are very very good for the money.

Secondly, I worked as a salesperson selling high end audiophile gear, over a decade ago.

Are audiophiles full of it - yes and no.

Firstly, I definitely cannot handle 'shit' audio. I absolutely don't need to spend thousands and I accept 'fit for purpose' but most speakers, headphones etc you get cheap are you know, shit but for most people they are 'fine'. I recently had this dilemma when I wanted to get a microphone as I had been getting into playing Left4Dead 2 Versus. I love my Sony MDR-1R's, if I was still as anal as I was about sound back in the day as when I bought the Sony's, I maybe would have spent more to get a good set of open cup planar headphones but the Sony do an amazing job for the money. So when I went to get something with a microphone, I just had no idea whether to try and get just a mic or go with headphones with a mic. The problem was I always have my fan on, so USB mics were just a constant whooshing mess. So I had to go back to getting headphones with a microphone. I ended up getting Logitech G935's, but also listened to a bunch of others from Astro A50's and Artics and JBL's etc. and honestly, they all sound fucking terrible, but I still bought the 935's and just accept they are 'for gaming' in multiplayer games,but as soon as I don't need that mic, I have my Sony's back on. Many, many people would probly think the 935's sound great, as do Astro A50's etc. but when I listened to them, I was trying to hide from the saleperson that every single set I listened to sounded like bloated garbage being pumped out from underwater.

So in that respect, there's absolutely a monumental difference between what most people would say is ok, and what someone who is used to hearing a more pure sound, is going to expect. In the same way I'm going to say those home heatre in a box systems you get with plastic speakers, wireless subs etc are terrible, but for the majority of people, they are completely fine.

Then you have how I break down audiophiles; those who just like really nice quality sounds, and those who are hobbyists. Those who like nice sound will update gear fairly rarely and stick with what they have for long periods because they buy something that sounds good to begin with and that's the level they are happy with. For them, its just nice sound, if they hear something better, they'll upgrade, but because they aren't doing back to back comparisons all the time, they usually only upgrade every now and again when it comes to speakers, amps etc. If it'shome theatre receivers or streaming devices, those more often because they change with technology and new standards. Hobbyists are a totally different beast. When you start going to 'hobbyists', things get super wanky super quick. Components made from some particular sort of wood from some very particular forest corner in the middle of nowhere because that wood 'has the best harmonic properties', cables that are forged and frozen to align their crystalline structure,some speaker that costs $50k......just because. Hobbyists are always changing gear, listening to different components back to back, changing this, changing that, moving shit around their room etc. For them, it's like searching for something that doesn't exist; some perfect combination of equipment that produces a completely linear response, but also that sounds warm, but also detailed, but airy, but also tight, but also with separation and presence.........for them, it's about the tinkering etc.

For me, it's the 'hobbyists' that are largely full of shit and the companies that market toward them. Speakers that costs 10's of thousands of dollars for no real reason. I'm sure they'll argue otherwise, but speakers are really fucking simple. They push and pull air. That's it. There's no secret to how a speaker works. It's not magic. So yeh, when you see some esoteric company charging a boatload for some high end speaker, you're paying for the boutique name and mostly, the carpentry that houses the speakers. You need to think of most high end speakers not so much as 'higher quality sound' but closer to 'designer furniture'. You can just as easily make an objectionably better speaker by building it in some home made enclosure with good drivers and cross overs than you'd get spending a cars worth of money on some boutique branded speaker.

Then I can tell you I have had a sound room setup with a dozen different bookshelf speakers and demoed them back to back to back and you find some interesting things. Obviously the most expensive speaker, isn't necessarily the nicest sounding. The speaker that initially jumps out at you and makes you go 'wow' isn't necessarily the speaker you want to buy for long listening periods or to live with. What you listen to is the biggest single factor that will decide what speaker is the right one.

Honestly could shit on all day about all the wank that goes on but honestly the simple answer is 'yes' audiophile like audio can be vastly superior to the majority of shit that makes it to the marketplace from big brands; but just because it's boutique and expensive doesn't necessarily mean it's better than a more plain jane, well designed speaker thats actually sensibly priced. So if you have that sensibly priced speaker / component combo that sounds good, you will run into diminishing returns quickly and you might be wondering just why that system that costs 4x as much is barely, if at all, any better.


Yeah my MDR-1Rs are beat to hell too. Used to use em to mix audio when I was into video editing, and on sets for live recording etc. They've been through hell.

Today they mostly pair nicely with my Blue Yeti for when Xaero Gravity Xaero Gravity subs to my OnlyFans for private ASMR sessions
 
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