HDM
Member
Without spoiling, it's not a bug, this is explained in the game. It is the entity that we fight that creates this phenomenon.
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Control Ultimate Edition Next-Gen Teaser Trailer
- Thread starter IbizaPocholo
- Start date
- Trailer Platform
VFXVeteran
Banned
It's MAX'D out in terms of what it can RENDER with the features they want to show at the budget they have for the game. That part of my statement is completely TRUE! If it wasn't, you'd see MORE features in the game or HIGHER FPS. You see NONE of that compared to what the PC provides. So it's NOT stupid to claim they are maxed out in power for the particular budget they are targeting.
regawdless
Banned
The raytraced debris might be too much for the consoles.
I know. I am just surprised that they chose a scene for their extremely short trailer that throws it literally in your face. Dumb decision.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
That's disappointing they couldn't add a mode with ray tracing and 60 fps through some combination of lowering resolution, toning down effects, etc. Surely they could have got there and still had an impressive looking game.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
I mean look how impressed console players are by the reflections in Spiderman. It doesn't take much.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
You are forgetting one important part. TIME! Given the budget and "TIME", they potentially can't do more. How about we give devs more than 1 year to figure everything out.
They could still be working on their RT features and maybe this is them showing the first level of it. Maybe with another update, they'll show RT debris.
Shmunter
Member
You can tell the papers aren’t being reflected in that chaos? I’m scrubbing through it and I’m none the wiser either way.
VFXVeteran
Banned
I'm not assuming that shit. To me, THAT'S DUMB. They did what they did and it's releasing soon. They implemented the reflections and they already had implemented the other features on the PC so there's no "mastering the PS5" to get more than reflections in the game. The freaking console HAS NO DLSSS!!! For Christ's Sake! Wtf do you guys expect?? This is why we always argue. You guys "wish" upon a star and I tell you the facts that you don't want to hear. It's made worse when I'm right after the game comes out.
Stop dreaming man. Did Spiderman MM have more RT features? Did you say, "this is their first gameplay footage but they may have more RT features to come?"
Be rationale!
RT is fucking expensive. And even the high-end GPUs REQUIRE DLSS to run at a reasonable FPS. You have a console that has NO DLSS. How much do you think genius developers will accomplish without hardware DLSS to push more RT to a console that shown to only perform at 2060 levels?
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recursive
Member
You also said wait for the Xbox tools, their api is fucked. Which one is it?
BlueXImpulse
Banned
Consoles don't have DLSS to upscale from a lower resolution to render every effect. Why are the usual suspects acting oblivious to this?
Shmunter
Member
Spider-Man had no RT according to you until DF told you it did. Your expertise is truly special. Special olympics special.
onnextflix5
Member
Yet this also has 1 rt feature yet only runs 30fps, spiderman looks great at 60fps with rt, why are u downplaying it, going forward insomniac will make games look even better with the ps5 and rt, u will see.
regawdless
Banned
I don't believe that, because usually devs show their game in the best light in teasers and trailers. So either it is what it is, or they are very dumb.
I mean, you look directly at the glass and nothing of the flying stuff is being reflected.
VFXVeteran
Banned
Because Spiderman's 60FPS rt mode takes more out of the render as opposed to the 30FPS mode. The guys that made Control has way more going on in the scenes with it's physics and they probably didn't lower the quality of the RT like Insomniac did. You can't compare them like you are doing.
v_iHuGi
Banned
VFXVeteran
Banned
I never said that Spiderman had NO RT. I don't know wtf you are talking about. And that's not the point. You conveniently skip EVERY single verified fact that I claim when a game does come out and is in the hands of people.
VFXVeteran
Banned
ALL you see is only reflections. Does it need to say it? Demon Souls mentioned using ray-tracing and never showed it.. turns out there was NONE in the game at the end with a little excuse as to why.
VFXVeteran
Banned
Because they want their box to do the things that are possible on PC??
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Shmunter
Member
Oh yeah you did. Lucky for you I don’t care enough to bother finding it.
At this stage, pretty much whatever you say, it’s safe to assume the opposite. That’s the only verification needed, signed, sealed and delivered.
Zathalus
Member
Developers need time to get used to new capabilities each console generation offers. There are numerous examples of this across previous console generations. Thats not to say there will be massive differences between launch and later games.
RT transparent reflections as well. Seems equivalent to the PC medium RT preset. Not bad for what appears to be 4k.
Seems analogous to 2070/2080 performance.
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hououinkyouma00
Member
I won’t disagree that it plays better, and every game okays better at 60 but if somebody is going to choose a game to make the sacrifice for RT it’s Control which looks amazing and is slow enough that you actually do notice it running around unlike Spider-Man.
Would I do it? No but I would understand if people did and I think it’s a good choice if you were going to do it.
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VFXVeteran
Banned
Whatever you fucking say bro. I'll let the games do the talking and I'll just follow up. So if I say there is no more "juice" for the PS5 to put out anymore RT effects in this game Control.. you believe there will be. Then when it comes out and it's not, I'll get in your ass. Period.
Leyasu
Banned
Gotta be said, I am not expecting too much from RT on these consoles. Even though I do think that they may squeeze more out in that department in a couple of years, if we are going to have a gen of just shiny shit and reflections, I would rather they didn't bother and put the power to use elsewhere.
v_iHuGi
Banned
Who's talking about demon souls wtf its a thread about Control where Remedy only MENTIONS RAY TRACING
On the video & settings.
Great Hair
Banned
VFXVeteran
Banned
The PC has the option to apply way more RT features in this game. I'm not focused on the various levels of reflections the game can provide. I'm focused on the fact that there is no more power to be had in order to turn on one or more other RT features without the help of hardware assisted DLSS. It's a very reasonable claim and one that SonyGAF finds very hard to swallow.
BlueXImpulse
Banned
Then why are you downing console performance when you know that everything is being rendered at a native resolution?
Md Ray
Member
Is RT + 60fps in Spider-Man imaginary?
VFXVeteran
Banned
I'm not downing it. I'm reminding the Sony warriors of how limited it is so they can stop thinking it's an infinite black box of power that is ONLY limited by the talent of the developer. Most of them genuinely think that they'll be able to play games with ALL RT features shown on a high-end PC at some point with 2060 proven performance.
VFXVeteran
Banned
Go back and look at the sacrifices they made. Do you think they just turned on a checkbox and did nothing else so it looks identical to the 30FPS mode? Is this how all of you guys are going to play this? Ignore the sacrifices (NPCs reflected with no shadows = NPCs reflect WITH shadows) and only look at the final output figures? "It's RT (no matter how crappy it looks or that it's only ONE feature) @4k (no matter that it's dynamic) @ 60FPS".
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Killer8
Member
You are right, not sure why you're being boo'd.
There are no cast shadows in that reflection. Look under the character's feet.
This already looks worse than the RT implementation on PC.
Also the RT seemingly cuts off beyond the tree.
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Md Ray
Member
Doesn't matter. You said forget RT for the entire gen if 60fps is the target. Spider-Man and COD Cold War prove you wrong.
Tickle My Tendies
Member
The 60FPS/RT mode in Miles and SM:R is easily the overall worst looking option of the three rendering modes, IMO.
I tested it in both games and didn't end up sticking with it in either. It is a cool option to have, and props to Insomniac for adding it, but for me Fidelity mode and standard Performance mode are just much better looking choices, for my tastes.
People tend to ignore the sacrifices necessary in order to offer RT reflections at 60 fps. Baseline 1080p resolution, peak 1440p, scaled back graphical settings, lower resolution reflections and draw distance, etc.
Neither PS5 nor XsX is going to be a RT powerhouse. I see people cheerlead "Insomniac has the Ray Tracing crown!!!!" all over the place but you clearly have never played Cyberpunk with all RT ultra, or Control on PC with everything cranked.
Hopefully mid-gen refreshes will bring enhanced RT capabilities (edit: or a DLSS 2.0 equivilant to enable more headroom for RT costs), or we will be waiting 6-7 years before full blown RT is a thing on console.
Hyperbole is fun.
Pretty easily.
30fps plays perfectly fine in many games.
I tested it in both games and didn't end up sticking with it in either. It is a cool option to have, and props to Insomniac for adding it, but for me Fidelity mode and standard Performance mode are just much better looking choices, for my tastes.
People tend to ignore the sacrifices necessary in order to offer RT reflections at 60 fps. Baseline 1080p resolution, peak 1440p, scaled back graphical settings, lower resolution reflections and draw distance, etc.
Neither PS5 nor XsX is going to be a RT powerhouse. I see people cheerlead "Insomniac has the Ray Tracing crown!!!!" all over the place but you clearly have never played Cyberpunk with all RT ultra, or Control on PC with everything cranked.
Hopefully mid-gen refreshes will bring enhanced RT capabilities (edit: or a DLSS 2.0 equivilant to enable more headroom for RT costs), or we will be waiting 6-7 years before full blown RT is a thing on console.
Hyperbole is fun.
Pretty easily.
30fps plays perfectly fine in many games.
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Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Does Spiderman even do transparency reflections? Or is every single piece of glass in New York a personal mirror.
Shmunter
Member
Yes it does. You can see into shop fronts through windows for example.
It also bends reflections and diffuses them depending on surfaces. I recommend checking out some of the analysis to get more in-depth info.
Kenpachii
Member
errr?
What?
Played the game when it was out and the lightning without RTX was absolute dog shit.
regawdless
Banned
I haven't seen any transparent reflections and haven't seen it mentioned in tech videos. But I don't own a PS5 yet, so I'm judging based on videos.
I believe they use fake transparent reflections. I think to remember it was mentioned somewhere.
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regawdless
Banned
I have to go back to the DF videos. I think they've mentioned that those transparencies in the shop windows are faked. Need to confirm it though.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
They're faking it.
Tickle My Tendies
Member
I don't think being able to see inside a store window means it is ray traced transparent reflections. I could be wrong though.
You are right, not sure why you're being boo'd.
There are no cast shadows in that reflection. Look under the character's feet.
This already looks worse than the RT implementation on PC.
Also the RT seemingly cuts off beyond the tree.
I personally would have preferred they had ported over the RT lighting instead of reflections, if we have to choose just one. Oh well.
I thought the game was beautiful on PC. The entire suite of RT options available there make a huge difference. Huge.
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Shmunter
Member
They’re everywhere. Streets are full of modelled stores with glass windows. Would be funny if the city streets were 2d textures like ps2.
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Okay.
But PC already got the Ultimate Edition.
And I dont think anything has been changed in non-RT version of the game lighting wise.
I legit would need to look at screenshots from when I played the game at launch and after the last DLC to know if anything changed.
I switched between RT and non-RT all the time to capture screenshots, I didnt think the lighting was dogshit, Remedys Multi-Scale Global Illumination is one of the most advanced non-RT implementations of Global Illumination in the industry right now.
Maybe its just the artstyle in general you didnt like?
This is what it looks like without RT:
^Is that dog shit lighting?