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Digital Foundry: Starfield Tech Breakdown - 30FPS, Visuals, Rendering Tech + Game Impressions
Fake
Member
I don't buy this 30 fps. You can drop native resolution, use DRS, checkerboard render and now even FSR 2. You can use dynamic between to low/medium/high settings, dynamic LOD...
PS4/Xbox One would be fine, but we're now in an age of amazing tools to mitigate the framerate. The game don't need to be native 4k, but neither 30 fps.
Will PC version runs at 30 fps with resolutions like 1920x1080p with weaker CPUs than Series X too?
PS4/Xbox One would be fine, but we're now in an age of amazing tools to mitigate the framerate. The game don't need to be native 4k, but neither 30 fps.
Will PC version runs at 30 fps with resolutions like 1920x1080p with weaker CPUs than Series X too?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
SlimySnake
You were right about the lighting before, DF had high praises for the lighting, fogging etc.
yamaci17
Member
yes? why are you surprised? my ryzen 2700 barely cracks 30 fps in flight simulator (and drops to 25s due to api overheads), that is what it is. and if you have something weaker than that, it is <30 FPS city.
it is clearly a CPU limitation. sometimes CPU limitations are not easy to work around by simple "dynamic LOD" tricks. you can make CPU bound games on PC look like absolute dogshit and all that would gain you like a joke %10-15 gain. it is very common that barely any setting affect CPU performance in a meaningful way (which is a huge pitfall if you've built your PC on a jank PC, there's no proper scaling for CPU performance. it will run whatever dev intended at its performance for)
Tripolygon
Banned
They stuck with their object persistent system which is very taxing on CPU that is why the game is 30fps. Other than that, the game looks ok, not amazing.
Fake
Member
I surprise because video games have an advantage in comparison with PC, with is their native gaming API. And as far I watching the video,
We don't need to discuss about how taxing RT is, right?
edit: No RT, but real time cube maps.
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yamaci17
Member
where did u here it will come bundled with Ray tracing? from what the looks of it, they're just introducing a raster based GI system (their lighting solutions usually sucked, which is why they got praises). yes it is costly of its own but at this point a proper GI is necessary for open world games. cyberpnk and Dying light 2 also has their GI solutions even without ray tracing. it makes games look good
Roxkis_ii
Member
I don't know why people keep thinking console users are going to tolerate 30 fps. Every game that has released with just 30 fps get shit on relentlessly. These people are going to learn one way or another.
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
No RT. Lighting is real time GI, shadows are screen space shadows and reflections are real time cube-maps.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
They don't use RT in this game. Real-Time GI is not the same as Ray-Traced GI.
This.
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I think this game has a good chance at game of the year despite the 30 FPS. But I am not convinced that Series X could not handle a decent performance mode. That console is a beast, and 60 FPS was supposed to be the base target at one point. And before this we saw cancelled features in Halo last year, BG3 delaying Xbox, and Redfall, which collectively make me think something beyond creative choices is dragging the X down.
darrylgorn
Member
Team Andromeda
Member
I don't remember Plague Tale getting sh8t on or indeed Flight Sim.
Fake
Member
I rewatched the video, no RT, but real time cube maps. My bad.
So, no next gen features, but still taxing? Is that the message?
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Mr.Phoenix
Member
This is not true... the game may be taxing on the CPU, but that is not the reason why.
Umbasaborne
Banned
Expect upscaled 4k and 30 fps to be the norm for console games moving forward, as we leave cross gen behind
ajanke
Member
huuuuuu makes me want to get a new PC but I think my 2080TI should still be okay at 1440pSo if this monster we saw was without RT and reescalated from somewhere from 1080 to 1440p with some FSR like thing
I need to see the PC version with RT and with DLSS
Fake
Member
We can only presume that the PS5pro/Xpro are real if this norm is going to happen. The game not even have RT enable and is targeting 30 fps.
oji-san
Banned
It's not only that there's none proper 60fps mode but the lack of any kind of options on SX, tho perhaps it will change later.. no 40fps mode, no unlocked mode of at least the next Xbox will run it better without patching.. like they aren't (yet) even trying, and it's ok.. it's their product and they owe us nothing but it's just disappointing.
“That’s not the feedback we’re getting right now. Right now, we’re pretty set on the hardware we have.” - Phil Spencer
If they did come out with pro hardware, then devs will just make the games even bigger, more feature rich, more textures and then scale back to 30fps.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Thats not a compliment. DF thought TLOU Part 1, Forza Horizon 5, and Horizon FW were PS5 masterclass. lol
You were right about the lighting before, DF had high praises for the lighting, fogging etc.
But yes, Starfield's lighting looked next gen from day one to me. And I mean going back to the original trailer I kept posting links showing Devs confirming it was realtime. From the next gen graphics thread back in 2021.
Found this just now when looking for starfield gifs. Starfield trailer was fully realtime, was not using cinematic tools and was running on a 2080 Super. MS has said that Gears 5 performed roughly equivalent to a 2080, and we have seen the PS5 outperform the 2080 in several AMD specific games. So both consoles should be able to run the game at these visuals.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
While its hard to believe that will always be the case when we have Sony's first party doing native 4K@30/40fps and reconstructed 4K@60fps... I have no qualms with reconstructed 4K@30fps as long as they give us a similarly reconstructed 60fps performance mode.
I can understand that that may not always be the case, but will expect to see it more times than not.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Which is odd for Alex not to harp on the inconsistencies or inaccuracy of the RTGI shadow combo at the moment. Only because he used to go hard in the paint on his Dictator account back when HZD first came out on here, pointing out how inaccurate the RTGI lighting was compared to Star Citizen showing zoomed in screens and how the shadows don't fully accurately cast from the light source.
You were right about the lighting before, DF had high praises for the lighting, fogging etc.
But he's always been pretty selective depending on where the games are coming from.
I will agree, however, I like the look of the lighting and atmosphere. Really digging the art direction that's reminding me of The Expanse in so many ways.
This truly is the best looking game so far that Bethesda will be putting out.
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Fake
Member
“That’s not the feedback we’re getting right now. Right now, we’re pretty set on the hardware we have.” - Phil Spencer
If they did come out with pro hardware, then devs will just make the games even bigger, more feature rich, more textures and then scale back to 30fps.
I'll be honest with you, I don't buy the Phil Spencer bs.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
He also recently said this game running at 30fps was not a hardware issue“That’s not the feedback we’re getting right now. Right now, we’re pretty set on the hardware we have.” - Phil Spencer
If they did come out with pro hardware, then devs will just make the games even bigger, more feature rich, more textures and then scale back to 30fps.
He lies left and right and simply is not ready to reveal a pro level console as sales just jumped for the Series X for this game.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
One shot was counted at 1296p around 60 percent of 4k with what looks like fsr 2.0 as the image is very sharp.
Game is bonkers. We've never seen scale and detail like this. Looks incredible.
Game is bonkers. We've never seen scale and detail like this. Looks incredible.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
He only said that for logistical reasons in the current ROI and sales not being where they hoped they would be. If Sony drops a Pro next year, they will be forced to react, they may not like it, but they will.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
DF did point out that the majority of the effects and fighting they used were also done in HZFW though.
Actually, DF went as far as say that they weren't really doing or using any new next-gen effects, but just a very creative use of tried and tried effects and they listed out examples of games that have done similar.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
It's pretty much obvious it's CPU bound. They kind of prove it in the video. You will see at launch once it's benchmarked on pc.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Star Citizen is a thing still. Whether a retail release or not.
And you can take off and land on planets anywhere manually. Larger scale.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Yeah and it doesn't look as good as this as an overall package.
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Tripolygon
Banned
You are welcome to your opinion, but I think that is why. They are trying to create a "high-fidelity" universe with object persistence and physics just like in their previous open world games and it's too taxing for the CPU in these consoles to run at 16ms. 30fps is a must to maintain consistency not only in their world simulation but also frame rate. Visually they aren't doing anything amazing, it's all because of their world simulation systems.
TheKremlinBossMan
Banned
I doubt they will review the demo they have had the full game code for a while. Everyone has. Wouldn't make sense to waste time on the demo when it isn't the final code.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
He can be a tool sometimes. He was doing that with avatar the other day.
OMG, no proper reflections under the belly of a deer.... SOMEONE CALL THE POLICE!
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
They show it in the video if you want to watch it?
darrylgorn
Member
Just out of curiosity, how many pixels is Star Citizen again?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Thirty7ven
Banned
What do you think, is this the best, biggest, most ambitious, most daring looking game ever made?
I Master l
Banned
Women are lusting for power, men be warned- "Will women love me and men want to be me because I played Starfield" - Alex
Roxkis_ii
Member
Is anyone really happy with 30FPS?
After I upgraded my monitor to 4k I found I needed to VSync my frame rate to 30FPS. Without capping, the framerate would fluctuate between 30 and 40, but this fluctuation causes jerkyness, and keeping it to a stable 30 produces a much smoother experience. It’s fine when looking into the...
forums.flightsimulator.com
Sure doesn't look like people find 30 fps attractive to me.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
It's running at 15 fps in the video on a 2070 super at 1080p...basically the system that is ps5 specs.
Mr Moose
Member
I'll let you know when I buy it if I remember. I have a 3600.
I thought they said before it had RT when they "reviewed" the previous trailer, but I might've been drunk at the time.
Umbasaborne
Banned
As someone who games on pc, that dude is the most pc master race gamer ive ever seen. He always has to include that the pc version is better. Like it doesn’t even need to be said, everyone knows that. But on a podcast he was like scoffing at the idea of playing a game on switch.
I'm no expert, that is for sure. But really? A first party game is too taxing for the reasonable expectations of people who own the flagship hardware? Really?
Perhaps I'm crazy. Just can't understand how it's possible. First party. Flagship console. But better off playing on a PC. Way too weird.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It's because of the platform it was confirmed to be running on. He has always been overly critical in that direction. Hence the HZD grinding he used to back in the day, long before he worked for DF.