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I've seen the light about Microsoft's strategy with the Series X

PresetError

Neophyte
First of all, sorry for opening another thread about Xbox on this forum. There are plenty of them and some are fairly redundant. If any mod considers this is the case of my thread please move or delete at will but I've got to tell you something.

I was watching this Spawn Wave video (by the way, I'm not a super fan of the guy but his video is pretty interesting as a reflection on Microsoft's business model with Gamepass).




And as I was watching the part where Spawn Wave says that Microsoft doesn't care anymore about selling consoles but they will keep making them as long as the internet bandwith standards don't allow a good cloud gaming experience, I was wondering if this is a good explanation or even a plausible excuse.

I do have wondered many times why Microsoft keeps manufacturing hardware when they are so obviously in deep with "play on any device" and "the Netflix of videogames". The first logical answer would be: because they don't want to give up on any part of the gaming market. Is it really true, though? Xbox executives keep saying console sales don't matter.

Why invest in a system as expensive (on paper) as the Series X, then? Why months and months of agressive marketing selling the "most powerful console" that "eats monsters for breakfast", etc. ending up in a showcase heavily focused on the Gamepass and not on the hardware power like the one we saw july 23rd? Are they really so clumsy and inept? I don't think so.

What I think is the Series X has the sole purpose of diverting attention on the fact Xbox as a platform is targeted at casuals. Let me explain...

There is nothing wrong about being a casual. There are tons and tons of casual gamers out there. In fact, the business model of Gamepass and xCloud relies on the sheer amount of potential costumers. Hence the famous "2 billion gamers" line Phil Spencer likes so much to point out. The problem is... inside the gaming culture nobody likes to be labeled as a casual. Everybody wants to feel they belong with the cool kids.

That's why the Series X exists and has been marketed that way. That's why Phil Spencer has been talking so much on the media about what gaming is, what gaming should be and everything Xbox being thought around gamers while trying to redefine what a gamer is and what a gamer wants. The XBox brand wants to be perceived as a cutting edge, hardcore and exclusive platform while targeting people who plays games on their smartphones, tablets and low end PC's, or finds attractive the option of having 100 random games available to consume like fast food on Gamepass, not really caring about their quality because they are so cheap and keep them entertained.

Let me know what you think about my theory. I feel like I've finally seen the light. All of a sudden everything Xbox has been doing lately makes sense to me.

I know, I know... TL/DR.
 
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REE Machine

Banned
The welfare box strategy with welfare pass doesnt entice me, in fact I think welfare pass is greatly effecting their games and the quality had dipped since they introduced it. Sony and Nintendo are making bangers while MS is making....well....im not sure anymore.

when their quality comes back ill buy the console
 

dalekjay

Member
I wonder how microsoft is going to sell gamepass to me without their console
When people like you that will not buy the console have access to Xcloud and literally no investment besides 10 bucks for the pass.
The only way I can selling to people not into Xbox is to just erase stadia from earth at least
 
Microsoft is full of shit.

They want to sell consoles but are accepting that they can't beat Sony right now. They started hiding their sales in their financial statements when things looked bad so now you just change it to "hey we don't want to sell consoles" for distraction and looking 2nd rate. .

If by some chance the new Xbox's outsell the ps5 you are going to absolutely hear them report console sales and how they are number one and want to sell consoles.

Don't fall for these lies.
 

Kokoloko85

Member
When people like you that will not buy the console have access to Xcloud and literally no investment besides 10 bucks for the pass.
The only way I can selling to people not into Xbox is to just erase stadia from earth at least

How are people going to play it without the Xbox console? On a PS5 or Switch?

Not everyone wants to stream on a phone or tablet and pay $10 a month to not own anything. Its like $300 after 2 years and you end up not owning anythig.

And not everyone has a decent Pc lol.

Xbox hasnt invested billions and made 3 skus in 3 years to not care about consoles lol
 
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FunkMiller

Member
If Microsoft are guilty of anything, it’s not having a coherent, simple strategy. And that’s been the case for many years now. They can’t seem to decide on what they want... hence mixed messages.

The 360 was the deserved success it was because the strategy was simple. It was Sony who weren’t clear and concise.

I‘m baffled as to why Microsoft are making the same messaging mistakes now as they did in 2013. It’s as if there are conflicting goals in their management structure.

Also, games sell consoles, services don’t.
 
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PresetError

Neophyte
The welfare box strategy with welfare pass doesnt entice me, in fact I think welfare pass is greatly effecting their games and the quality had dipped since they introduced it. Sony and Nintendo are making bangers while MS is making....well....im not sure anymore.

when their quality comes back ill buy the console

But quality doesn't really matter in a subscription service model. That's the whole point. It's quantity over quality. It's knowing you can channel surf your games so easily. If one is shit or you get bored of it, you go to the next and so on.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
Another FUD thread yep it is only that evil xbox discord lol.

Stupid google stadia showed no one gives a shit about a online only game device. consoles sell gamepass it is that simple. Microsoft has 2 years to move current users to a new generation console. They don't mind if it is this fall or next as long as you do. With out console hardware gamepass is dead those 5 PC users and 1 cloud user are not keeping it alive. Keep up the good work.
 

G-Bus

Banned
I mean.. they release a digital only box at $299 with a year of gamepass. Market it so people think it's like the Netflix for gaming. Never have to buy brand new games again. Easy choice for parents come the holidays.

Just screams casual.

Wasn't there an interview where they were more inclined to chase Nintendo and what they're doing.

The series X is to just keep the hardcore Xbox fans occupied.
 

REE Machine

Banned
But quality doesn't really matter in a subscription service model. That's the whole point. It's quantity over quality. It's knowing you can channel surf your games so easily. If one is shit or you get bored of it, you go to the next and so on.
Thats bullshit because most if not all of their first party games have dipped in quality, hell look at the recent halo infinite footage. MS can tout about all the clicks they want for a 1 dollar service on sale while Sony touts 10 million franchise sellers A total of probably 7 this gen
 

LordOfChaos

Member
I get it, services are high margin and Microsoft is pushing into them, regardless of if you pay for Gamepass on your PC or your XBO or your SeX. But I'm still wondering, isn't there inherent value in creating a large 9th gen install base as a more tantalizing hardware target? If it doesn't sell as much because you could just finish Infinite in a month on Gamepass on your PC or base XBO, does that inscentivize devleopers to target Series X?
 
I get it, services are high margin and Microsoft is pushing into them, regardless of if you pay for Gamepass on your PC or your XBO or your SeX. But I'm still wondering, isn't there inherent value in creating a large 9th gen install base as a more tantalizing hardware target? If it doesn't sell as much because you could just finish Infinite in a month on Gamepass on your PC or base XBO, does that inscentivize devleopers to target Series X?

Its high margin if they owned all the software. They will need to pay developers for using those games.
 
It in their name i mean Microsoft as in Software lol they make the Hardware to get a slice of the Pie from Sony and Nintendo and to get into console gaming but it is still will always be software and service first for the bulk of their gaming revenue Microsoft has always been a software service company first they introduce Xbox Live and now Gamepass they know where the money is at it in the Software and Service they even putting Gamepass everywhere if they could and now are also putting all their games on PC day 1 that is going all in on gamepass just like Nintendo is going all in on Handheld only Sony will be left still going mostly traditional wile the other 2 are taking off in different path.
 
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Aidah

Member
Microsoft cares about selling consoles. People who buy their consoles are Xbox's most valuable customers.
 
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Freeman

Banned
They don't care about where I play? Then release your games on the PS Store as a third-party like you do on Steam.

People give them way too much credit, they haven't done anything outside of developing mostly low quality games for years, their flagship IPs are all at an all time low. You can play their games for cheap? Sure, but their games are also cheap.

MS wants a cut from the works of all other devs without doing the work themselves and without taking any risk. In a Streaming only future there is no reason why other much bigger publishers wouldn't run their own services anyway. MS has a very small presence on PC, onde that install base drops on consoles what will they have? Since you don't onw your games on gamepass it is extremely easy to just let go of their ecosystem and join another. In the event gamepass proves to be a sucess, there is nothing stopping other competitors to copy the model while having a much better library of games.

The same guys that are always saying that MS doesn't care about console sales are the ones saying they are going to undercut Sony and be aggressive with console pricing. That makes no sense.

MS and EA are not leading us to the promise land, they are doing what they always did.
 
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I do have wondered many times why Microsoft keeps manufacturing hardware when they are so obviously in deep with "play on any device" and "the Netflix of videogames". The first logical answer would be: because they don't want to give up on any part of the gaming market. Is it really true, though? Xbox executives keep saying console sales don't matter.
Microsoft had no problem reporting on and even bragging about their sales numbers back when their consoles actually sold. When they announced they would no longer releases sales numbers back in 2015 they claimed it was because a console's success was better measured using different metrics, but everyone knew it was no coincidence that this happened right around the time it became glaringly obvious that Sony's lead in sales wasn't just s short term thing, and that the gap between the two was only going to get bigger.

There's a new generation coming up and Microsoft have stayed on course in that regard, presumably because they know they won't be beating Sony in sales this time either. But if they somehow did, I guarantee you they'd change their mind on the importance of sales numbers real quick.
 
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quest

Not Banned from OT
They don't care about where I play? Then release your games in the PS Store as a third-party like you do on Steam.

People give them way too much credit, they haven't done anything outside of developing mostly low quality games for years, their flagship IPs are all at an all time low. You can play their games for cheap? Sure, but their games are also cheap.

MS wants a cut from the works of all other devs without doing the work themselves and without taking any risk. In a Streaming only future there is no reason why other much bigger publishers wouldn't run their own services.

MS and EA are not leading us to the promise land, they are doing what they always did, always searching for that easy money.
You tell playground that then. Shit on halo all you want and 343 but to try and shit on top notch developers like playground is just plain trolling.


Even bottom of the barrel turn 10 and the coalition managed to keep up with ghosts of tsushima in its last games. This shit is getting real old fast 343 does not represent all of Microsoft studios.




 
This is stupid. Google sell phones right up against their own market. Microsoft with Surface do the same. Xbox is no different, they have the means to broaden their market base and segments while selling more hardware, software and services.

They care about console hardware, they care about services more.
 

Freeman

Banned
You tell playground that then. Shit on halo all you want and 343 but to try and shit on top notch developers like playground is just plain trolling.
That's where you are wrong, I hated Forza Horizon. When I got gamepass it was the first game I downloaded because I heard so much about it, it was suppose to be great. Turns out it has terrible gameplay/handling and that is a big no for any racing game, gimme GT Sport all day over it, better gameplay, proper tracks, good multiplayer, that's what I care about. What is even supposed to be good about Forza Horizon? I don't get it.

When I play a game I like from MS I'm honest about it, like Alan Wake.
 
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pixelation

Member
Microsoft is full of shit.

They want to sell consoles but are accepting that they can't beat Sony right now. They started hiding their sales in their financial statements when things looked bad so now you just change it to "hey we don't want to sell consoles" for distraction and looking 2nd rate. .

If by some chance the new Xbox's outsell the ps5 you are going to absolutely hear them report console sales and how they are number one and want to sell consoles.

Don't fall for these lies.
Exactly this...
 

REE Machine

Banned
Microsoft is full of shit.

They want to sell consoles but are accepting that they can't beat Sony right now. They started hiding their sales in their financial statements when things looked bad so now you just change it to "hey we don't want to sell consoles" for distraction and looking 2nd rate. .

If by some chance the new Xbox's outsell the ps5 you are going to absolutely hear them report console sales and how they are number one and want to sell consoles.

Don't fall for these lies.
That and they dont report sales, they report clicks and subscriptions now because thats the only narrative they can swing with poor performing games.
 

DavidGzz

Member
I predict that Game Pass+Xcloud will force Sony to upgrade PS Now faster than they'd like. Shit will be amazing for me and I hope Sony offers the same value eventually.
 

Schmick

Member
Thats bullshit because most if not all of their first party games have dipped in quality, hell look at the recent halo infinite footage. MS can tout about all the clicks they want for a 1 dollar service on sale while Sony touts 10 million franchise sellers A total of probably 7 this gen
This is down to opinion. A lot of people here are basing MS future on the Halo footage. I for one think that MS FS2020 is one the most ambitious games to feature on a console. Not a sign of lower quality.
 

turtlepowa

Banned
I predict that Game Pass+Xcloud will force Sony to upgrade PS Now faster than they'd like. Shit will be amazing for me and I hope Sony offers the same value eventually.
It's no coincidence that Death Stranding and Horizon Zero Dawn are coming to pc and most PS4 "exclusives" already can be played on Pc via Now. I'm pretty sure Sony is gonna push PS Now very hard very soon and i can't wait to read here on GAF why this is a good thing while Game Pass is the end of the world :messenger_grinning_sweat:
 

Kagey K

Banned
The welfare box strategy with welfare pass doesnt entice me, in fact I think welfare pass is greatly effecting their games and the quality had dipped since they introduced it. Sony and Nintendo are making bangers while MS is making....well....im not sure anymore.

when their quality comes back ill buy the console
This shit is offensive.

You don’t have to shame people for having lower incomes to make your game system seem better.

So fucking gross.
 
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quest

Not Banned from OT
Basically, the American market..still!! They tried with cod and tv, and now with a streaming service.

Xbox is the most American product in this global world.
Wtf are you talking about America has the worst first world internet with 10s of millions on dsl and most under data caps. But try to pile on Microsoft anyways. At least come up with something that is common sense. Internet sucks here it is slow and capped ffs go ask google how well onine gaming device worked. But that is an American thing gtfo with this made up troll attempts. Guess who depends on steaming for a lot of its psnow game catalog?
 

sn0man

Member
OP I think I get where you’re coming from. If you think of MS like a business that wants to make money on services, Xbox hardware makes sense as well. You sell hardware to lock in your service customers.

Imagine if Netflix had launched a Netflix box and put some/few/no exclusive benefits behind it. You leverage your fan base to sell that to casual streaming users. Casual users see the hardware as a sunk cost. Outwardly, the Netflix service customer justifies paying for streaming video because it is a good value. Mentally, the Netflix customer also justifies the streaming video subscription money as “well I got this awesome box so I might as well get the benefit of the service.”
 
First of all, sorry for opening another thread about Xbox on this forum. There are plenty of them and some are fairly redundant. If any mod considers this is the case of my thread please move or delete at will but I've got to tell you something.

I was watching this Spawn Wave video (by the way, I'm not a super fan of the guy but his video is pretty interesting as a reflection on Microsoft's business model with Gamepass).




And as I was watching the part where Spawn Wave says that Microsoft doesn't care anymore about selling consoles but they will keep making them as long as the internet bandwith standards don't allow a good cloud gaming experience, I was wondering if this is a good explanation or even a plausible excuse.

I do have wondered many times why Microsoft keeps manufacturing hardware when they are so obviously in deep with "play on any device" and "the Netflix of videogames". The first logical answer would be: because they don't want to give up on any part of the gaming market. Is it really true, though? Xbox executives keep saying console sales don't matter.

Why invest in a system as expensive (on paper) as the Series X, then? Why months and months of agressive marketing selling the "most powerful console" that "eats monsters for breakfast", etc. ending up in a showcase heavily focused on the Gamepass and not on the hardware power like the one we saw july 23rd? Are they really so clumsy and inept? I don't think so.

What I think is the Series X has the sole purpose of diverting attention on the fact Xbox as a platform is targeted at casuals. Let me explain...

There is nothing wrong about being a casual. There are tons and tons of casual gamers out there. In fact, the business model of Gamepass and xCloud relies on the sheer amount of potential costumers. Hence the famous "2 billion gamers" line Phil Spencer likes so much to point out. The problem is... inside the gaming culture nobody likes to be labeled as a casual. Everybody wants to feel they belong with the cool kids.

That's why the Series X exists and has been marketed that way. That's why Phil Spencer has been talking so much on the media about what gaming is, what gaming should be and everything Xbox being thought around gamers while trying to redefine what a gamer is and what a gamer wants. The XBox brand wants to be perceived as a cutting edge, hardcore and exclusive platform while targeting people who plays games on their smartphones, tablets and low end PC's, or finds attractive the option of having 100 random games available to consume like fast food on Gamepass, not really caring about their quality because they are so cheap and keep them entertained.

Let me know what you think about my theory. I feel like I've finally seen the light. All of a sudden everything Xbox has been doing lately makes sense to me.

I know, I know... TL/DR.

You make some really good points
 

Nikana

Go Go Neo Rangers!
Having a console on the market gives them more leverage with GP. They can point to their market share and say look we have X amount of the market. (Percentages, boxes sold etc) and use that as leverage to get their deals done. Every developer I have seen has said they are happy with GP so clearly they are doing something right.

Without the box they can't control the message and they would lose the negotiation power.

Plus they still are a major player in the market. Sony has more boxes for sure but to ignore 40 million plus consoles from Xbox would be daft. They still sell software in the Microsoft store.
 

Skifi28

Member
We don't care about selling consoles but here's the world's most powerful console for you to buy, but don't buy it because you will be able to play all our new games on your old console except if the developers decide otherwise because creative freedom or something.

Yeah... At this point I'm convinced even they have no clue what they're trying to do.
 

Max_Po

Banned
The last thing anyone wants to do is listen to this fucking manlet .... "Spawn wave"

This little shit just makes videos about gaming news and recently moved out of his mama's basement literally into a room which he is now calling office.
 

ACESHIGH

Banned
I'm not seeing how Xbox is targeted at casuals but Playstation isnt... it's not that their exclusives are Starcraft, Supreme Commander, Flight Simulator or Dwarf Fortress. The cinematic one and doners are as casual as it gets.
 

Cyborg

Member
I mean if you have a PC you don’t need the Series X. I personally think thats their flaw in the strategy. PC is getting more popular so no need to own a Series X.
 
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And if i have no interest in cloud gaming or pc gaming?
Then Xbox is not for you. Just like the country of Japan some people won't by an Xbox under any circumstances. Thankfully Xboxs existence doesn't affect any other console. Play what you want it's great to have options. Only MS is trying to appeal to as many people as possible and they are wise to do so.
 

DonF

Member
Wtf are you talking about America has the worst first world internet with 10s of millions on dsl and most under data caps. But try to pile on Microsoft anyways. At least come up with something that is common sense. Internet sucks here it is slow and capped ffs go ask google how well onine gaming device worked. But that is an American thing gtfo with this made up troll attempts. Guess who depends on steaming for a lot of its psnow game catalog?
Is game pass a streaming service or a rental service? That what I meant. I'm saying that if you get game pass you will get a a la carté service for games, that happens to use the internet.
I agree with OP, what Microsoft is selling is a casual friendly service.
I'm not talking about infrastructure.
 
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