ManaByte
Gold Member
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Kaz: To all our users (about the GT7 servers being down)
- Thread starter ethomaz
- Start date
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Ironically, it would make sense if cars were NFTs. Or if the game had any kind of player economy. The way the game is right now the statement makes zero sense tbh.
Bryank75
Banned
Well I guess he is basing his take on specific instances in descriptions that don't mention internet being a requirement.
Seems like they are not uniform.
Razvedka
Banned
I wonder if part of the car pricing was somehow contractual with the manufacturers. Like they insisted that their IRL prices in some meaningful way be reflected in the game to project quality (as consumers often conflate this with cost). Sony wasn't going to complain since this also turned out to be a huge money gen for them too.
Just one thought, not saying its probable or even what I believe.
Just one thought, not saying its probable or even what I believe.
I guess they could have brought everything else up to align them but that would have harmed the in game economy more. they did it for both outliers though, the highest earning per hr races were reduced to be in line with the average and the lowest earning races were increased which leads me to believe that they just saw people grinding the same race over and over. This happened in GT5 too and they nerfed earnings and introduced dailies. As for wording, to gain the most credits you MUST do that race over and over but now you can just play whatever race and gain a similar earning just playing whatever races you like including the ones that were low earning now giving you more.
If it was only about money making ability they could have just set future car prices higher and/or the Cr exchange rate higher to begin with IMO.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
If the bug is that rare, why bother shutting it down for everyone?
ethomaz
Banned
You can grind if you wish.
But think a bit about... an Rally event that takes 40s to finish that has the wrong tires gives you 60k credits for prize.
It that really right? That prize if for races with 5 minutes or more.
It was obvious why people where using it to grind.
If you want to increase the prizes so do to all events to be equal.
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ManaByte
Gold Member
Forza Horizon 5 has similar pricing for their licensed cars. But that game hands out credits like crazy and you never have a problem earning enough to get the cars you want.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
What a shitshow. Getting flashbacks to when the last Sim City was always online, and people said the only way it could work was always online…. then they patched out the always online.
Turk1993
GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
Interviewer: So you say that you whant players to enjoy all the cars, correct?
Translator looking at KAZ: Yes correct!
Interviewer: But why did you make it harder to earn credits than?
Translator: Not me, he did it ask him!
KAZ smirking: はははは はい私はしました
Translator looking at KAZ: Yes correct!
Interviewer: But why did you make it harder to earn credits than?
Translator: Not me, he did it ask him!
KAZ smirking: はははは はい私はしました
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
As a kid I used to do all the endurance races and grind out races in GT2 and GT3. As an adult with limited time I much prefer the FH approach of just showering you with cars and money constantly.
ethomaz
Banned
From what I understand is because the bug corrupted the saving.
So if you play the patch 1.07 you have the chance to lose all progress.
They wanted to avoid that and choose the downtime.
ManaByte
Gold Member
The always online in GT7 is a requirement by the FIA for the Sport mode for eSports. Until they detach the Sport mode from the main game, it'll require online.
kingfey
Banned
Nah, they will make all cars look like Thomas the engine. The pc way.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
THIS is why single player games needing an online connection is STUPID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hate some of you people that find no issue with it.
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kingfey
Banned
You are talking to a big corporation. There is no common sense down there.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I just dont have a good response to this because you are wrong. Nobody "must have" done anything before.. they had the ability to do something, now that ability is lessened overall. The 2 races increased still lead to a massive net negative of credits earnable by playing each race once. So how does that make it so players now don't have to (don't must) grind?
It makes the game even more grindy for people who want to earn those high credit amounts.
Literally everything he said is doublespeak. He has the nerve to talk about how they want to make the game so people don't need to spend money, but now made it so it takes longer to earn credits without spending money.
He talks about how previously players "must" grind those races, and now increases the amount of time (grind) it takes to earn the same amount of credits as before.
Not sure how you can say any of that last part when you started your post with "would have harmed the in game economy more." You seem to be aware that this adjustment makes it harder to earn credits... then you make the rest of your post.
"If it was only about money making ability they could have just set future car prices higher and/or the Cr exchange rate higher to begin with IMO."
That's just way more obvious.. and.. not sure if you missed it, they are aligning their prices with the booming classic (and new supercar) car industry.. so the prices will almost certainly go up. Would love to see how they react if the bubble bursts on that market, but it just continues to get more and more ridiculous at this point. The rich are getting richer, recessions rarely effect luxury items, and in fact they often cause that market to increase.. as the rich know they can take advantage of a recession to buy even more of our economy.
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ethomaz
Banned
That was really funny... where that happen? The face of the reporter lol
mansoor1980
Member
problem neogaf?
Swift_Star
Banned
That's never going to fly, and I don't even care about this game, at all.
But this will NEVER get Sony into trouble.
Do you realize the implication of that?
ethomaz
Banned
just_like_that
Member
modern day gaming
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Here's the TLDR of my posts.
Kaz: In GT7 I would like to have users enjoy lots of cars and races even without microtransactions.
Reality: It's now harder to earn cars without MTX after this patch.
Kaz: At the same time the pricing of cars is an important element that conveys their value and rarity, so I do think it’s important for it to be linked with the real world prices.
Reality: Well he just left out the part where this will definitely cause prices to rise. This raises the price of cars, so whether you are earning credits or buying them, this makes it harder to enjoy "lots of cars" over time
Kaz: would like to try to avoid a situation where a player must mechanically keep replaying certain events over and over again.
Reality: Making races earn less credits overall actually increases the need to grind to earn "lots of cars", not decrease them. It just means they'll be doing them over and over and over and over again, instead of over and over again.. or maybe switch to grinding different races.
Kaz: In GT7 I would like to have users enjoy lots of cars and races even without microtransactions.
Reality: It's now harder to earn cars without MTX after this patch.
Kaz: At the same time the pricing of cars is an important element that conveys their value and rarity, so I do think it’s important for it to be linked with the real world prices.
Reality: Well he just left out the part where this will definitely cause prices to rise. This raises the price of cars, so whether you are earning credits or buying them, this makes it harder to enjoy "lots of cars" over time
Kaz: would like to try to avoid a situation where a player must mechanically keep replaying certain events over and over again.
Reality: Making races earn less credits overall actually increases the need to grind to earn "lots of cars", not decrease them. It just means they'll be doing them over and over and over and over again, instead of over and over again.. or maybe switch to grinding different races.
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urmie
Member
"At the same time the pricing of cars is an important element that conveys their value and rarity, so I do think it’s important for it to be linked with the real world prices."
Fake digital rarity in video games. Thanks Kaz!
"I know you can't afford these cars in the real world, so we want to simulate that in the digital world as well, it's very important!" - Kaz 2022.
Fake digital rarity in video games. Thanks Kaz!
"I know you can't afford these cars in the real world, so we want to simulate that in the digital world as well, it's very important!" - Kaz 2022.
SLB1904
Banned
That's the problem. That's is not even 10% of the game. In fact I haven't touch this missions yet. They are a separate from the main campaign of the game
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
The PS4 can, and thus a cross-gen/cross-play negative strikes in this instance.
They should have just made the PS4 saves server side only. Or just the saves themselves on both and not the single player mode.
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ethomaz
Banned
I don’t think there is a local save.
The save is the same… online.
I keep shifting between PS5 and PS4 Pro version on PS5 with the new exactly same progress.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
There is a local 450MB and some change one, but unsure what it contains.
Probably scapes stuff and liveries.
Arthimura
Member
I'm glad I'm not an entitled Karen. I just solved some real life stuff and played Elden Ring.
It's bad that the servers went down for so many hours, it's uncommon but it may happen. When I used to play Blizzard games, mostly World of WarCraft, there was Tuesdays were I couln't play because of the maintenance.
About the online requirement, I'm against it in single player games, but GT has a strong economy and collectible aspect and I prefer having to be online than having to play with cheaters and hackers.
It's bad that the servers went down for so many hours, it's uncommon but it may happen. When I used to play Blizzard games, mostly World of WarCraft, there was Tuesdays were I couln't play because of the maintenance.
About the online requirement, I'm against it in single player games, but GT has a strong economy and collectible aspect and I prefer having to be online than having to play with cheaters and hackers.
You could be right but I'm just saying I read this in a different way to you:
"would like to try to avoid a situation where a player must mechanically keep replaying certain events over and over again"
"We will in time let you know the update plans for additional content, additional race events and additional features that will constructively resolve this."
To mean we balanced it so that all events have similar earnings now so you don't have to grind specific events over and over and new events are coming soon. Of course lowering the high outliers will always reduce it for people who actually grind the same race over and over. There is no getting around that.
They probably care about engagement numbers too so they don't want a game that's done in a week or 2 but grinding was always a thing before or after this patch. In GT since the beginning of time.
Having specific outliers people do over and over makes it more grindy instead of having more events and keeping the longevity that way.
Fatbody
Member
The whole thing is pretty fucked up when you consider the fact that the main appeal of these kind of games for decades has been that the average income person can enjoy a simulation of a car that most will never be able to afford or even ride passenger in. But now they are adding a simulation of that economic reality(using real money!)into the racing sim that you play to escape that reality.
So now your only course of action is to engage in a type of a humiliation ritual where you grind out tracks in a Ford Focus for dozens of hours to buy one car you really like while the few whales who can afford a real life Lambo(or average/low income folks with bad personal finance skills) are the only ones who will pay a 40 dollar micro transaction without blinking an eye.
So now your only course of action is to engage in a type of a humiliation ritual where you grind out tracks in a Ford Focus for dozens of hours to buy one car you really like while the few whales who can afford a real life Lambo(or average/low income folks with bad personal finance skills) are the only ones who will pay a 40 dollar micro transaction without blinking an eye.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I would honestly be down for that.
Turk1993
GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
It was a GT5 or GT5P event i think back in the day
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
It lowers the overall payout for people who don't grind as well if they run through all of the listed races.
There is no situation where his statement makes any sense, it's doublespeak at best, a lie at worst.
Here I'll do the math. After the bold new price, I'll put the net positive / negative accumulative in bold/italics.
- World Touring Car 800: 24 heures du Mans Racing Circuit: 5,000 Cr – 70,000 Cr +65,000
- World Touring Car 800: Monza Circuit: 5,000 Cr – 70,000 Cr +130,000
- World Rally Challenge: Alsace Village: 50,000 Cr – 30,000 Cr +110,000
- Dirt Champions: Fisherman’s Ranch: 65,000 Cr – 30,000 Cr +75,000
- Dirt Champions: Sardegna Windmills: 65,000 Cr – 40,000 Cr +50,000
- Dirt Champions: Colorado Springs Lake: 65,000 Cr – 40,000 Cr +25,000
- GT Cup Gr. 4: HIgh-Speed Ring: 65,000 Cr – 35,000 Cr -5,000
- GT Cup Gr. 4: Brands Hatch GP Circuit: 65,000 Cr – 45,000 Cr -25,000
- GT Cup Gr. 3: Spa Francorchamps: 75,000 Cr – 50,000 Cr -50,000
- GT Cup Gr. 3: Suzuka Circuit: 75,000 Cr – 50,000 Cr -75,000
- GT Cup Gr. 3: Autodrome Lago Maggiore: 75,000 Cr – 50,000 Cr -10,000
- Clubman Cup Plus: High Speed Ring: 35,000 Cr – 25,000 Cr -110,000
- Clubman Cup Plus: Tsukuba Circuit: 35,000 Cr – 25,000 Cr -120,000
- Clubman Cup Plus: Goodwood: 35,000 Cr – 12,000 Cr -143,000
- American Clubman Cup 700: Special Stage Route X: 30,000 Cr – 15,000 Cr -158,000
- American FR Challenge 550: Blue Moon Bay Speedway : 15,000 Cr – 10,000 Cr -163,000
- American FR Challenge 550: Weathertech Raceway Laguna Seca: 15,000 Cr – 10,000 Cr -168,000
- American FR Challenge 550: Willow Springs Raceway: 15,000 Cr – 10,000 Cr -173,000
The changes remover 173,000 total credits.
edit Fixed some math, also to note, if you factor in how much more difficult the "World Tour" races are which saw credit increases, and with each "failure" your time penalty is far higher.. it effectively tips these numbers even further.
Now does this make the game a horrible grind fest? I don't know, that's not my argument..
My argument is that his statement is some skeevy businessman BS lol
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
By the looks of it, if someone is a World Tour player, the boost is awesome. If someone doesn't do World Tour events, your credits dropped like a rock.
ManaByte
Gold Member
The World Tour races are super long.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Don't these races take an enormous amount of time?
It does make sense to raise them.. and it evens the races out better.
It also in general does the opposite of what Kaz is saying lol
Yes you are now more rewarded for those insanely long races, that are also from what I've read, incredibly hard to "beat"... but the overall economy saw a 173,000 credit decline for those just "going through all of the races w/o grinding."
AKA more grinding required. Nobody is going to "grind" world tour races.. and if they were, well, now this just increases the chance.. they'll play the same races over and over lol
Grind is about credits earned for your time and the ease at which you can earn those credits.. to increase the credits earned with longer, more difficult races, but decrease them on the shorter/easier races means ... more grind to earn the same credits, not less grind.
His statement DOES apply to the rising of the World Tour races, it does not, overall work, in any way, due to the massive nerfing of the other races.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Makes sense then the World Tours get giant boost. Must had been a programming typo or quirk to be only 5000. It's like they missed a zero.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
These are also only a handful of events. There are many more that have not changed at all.
lostinblue
Banned
Ridiculous. And reviews were already complaining mildly about how hard credits were hard to come by.
For them to be nerfed this way, and the price of microtransactions not being in line with GT Sports as originally implied to reviewers should warrant revised scores until Polyphony caves in.
Even if they didn't change any of those, the balance of the game already had a foot in the "credits are supposed to be hard to earn, but we sell them for a price" camp.
When what you have already feel like a tilted scale, the rebalancing has to go the other way to negate, otherwise, even if it's small, it to the unbalancing in no small way.
The list shows it's not even neutral (most of the changes are nerfs), so yeah, whether you like it or not, it tips the whole game in one direction.
I'm sure it's realistic, because of inflation and increasing gas prices.
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Lognor
Banned
Fuck them if they're that concerned with hackers or cheaters. If you're playing single player they shouldn't give a fuck if you're cheating. SMH
And okay, maybe to console warriors they will look like clowns. Much like maybe Microsoft looked like clowns when they walked about the required online for the Xbox One, but that was absolutely the right decision then and it's the right decision for Sony now. Who cares if they look like clowns in the short term? Keeping it online only in the long term will damage them more.
-183,000 credits is barely anything for somebody playing normally . You can get this by doing the first race that saw the 65,000 increase just 3 times if you're a grinder. I hope they even change it so that there is actually a net gain over these specific races to make people happy but do you honestly think that for people not grinding this affects the economy in any substantial way, 3 more races? IMO what he says has some truth even if there is some skevy businessman agenda. This balancing will prevent grinding the same event over and over and just play whatever race you want earning the same as everyone else, or new events that will hopefully come so that you have enjoyable content playing the game earning you the same amount rather than grinding the same outlier race for the sake of Cr.
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GHG
Member
The fake digital rarity factor actually makes it more likely for people who really want those cars to use microtransactions to get them just for the" exclusive" factor.
This guy knows what he's doing and he must think we're stupid. He can get fucked.
Fuz
Banned
That's ridiculous, and anyone who believes that is retarded.
kingfey
Banned
2014, yes. 2022, nope.
People have been trained to tolerate this behavior, that it become the normie behavior.
Right now, their biggest worry would be PR backlash, if they removed that online function.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I completely and utterly disagree there is zero truth to the statements that I've been analyzing. It's all utter bullshit.
ÆMNE22A!C
NO PAIN TRANCE CONTINUE
"Sony in trouble"
Bro what are you doing roleplaying as a no one asked for wannabe low tier market analyst fear mongering reaction hungry whatever
Jim's not your friend. Things said are performative. Businesses is business. I bet you take politicians words for truth, holy shit. They only care for us as much as they're allowed to. Get with it.
Kisses
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