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[Alan Wake]

But they couldn't keep it up, because they don't understand the market.

This became obvious when they announced XBO.

Yes. But we have to remember how it all started. Peter Moore said it well when he explained why they wanted Xbox to be separate from Microsoft. But once Xbox became big enough Microsoft the corporation wanted to dictate more, and here we are. It went to shit. With huge acquisitions like ZeniMax and ABK it was inevitable that Xbox would be assimilated with the rest of Microsoft. So either Phil Spencer was fine with that, being a long time Microsoft employee. Or he just didn't understand the consequences.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Yes. But we have to remember how it all started. Peter Moore said it well when he explained why they wanted Xbox to be separate from Microsoft. But once Xbox became big enough Microsoft the corporation wanted to dictate more, and here we are. It went to shit. With huge acquisitions like ZeniMax and ABK it was inevitable that Xbox would be assimilated with the rest of Microsoft. So either Phil Spencer was fine with that, being a long time Microsoft employee. Or he just didn't understand the consequences.

Xbox dying was already certain after the XBO reveal, especially coming off second half of X360.

There was already signs of Xbox messing up their games then.

 

[Alan Wake]

Xbox dying was already certain after the XBO reveal, especially coming off second half of X360.

There was already signs of Xbox messing up their games then.

That's easy to say in hindsight. But they still had games like Alan Wake, Halo 4, Gears of War 3 and so on from 2010-2012 before the One launch. And a decent launch lineup for Xbox One. After that it's like it completely dried up.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

That's easy to say in hindsight. But they still had games like Alan Wake, Halo 4, Gears of War 3 and so on from 2010-2012 before the One launch. And a decent launch lineup for Xbox One. After that it's like it completely dried up.

But I was one of those saying it back then already.

It's only hindsight if you laughed it off.

 

[Warablo]

Well you got the first half right

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

a) Xbox 360 rivaled the PS3
but in the second half of the 360 era Microsoft began to restrict the console to Gears, Forza and Halo.

yep. that became a meme

b) Knect's colossal success blinded the company's perception, which gradually alienated it from traditional customers in favor of a casual niche, a volatile audience.

c) mistake of not noticing that the WiiU was betrayed by the casual public and therefore the era of motion sensors was over.

d) In the transition to Xbox One Initiate unpopular policies such as attempts to attack the used games market

e) Microsoft's attempt on Xbox One to imitate Sony with narrative games (Quantum Break) was completely rejected by Xbox customers, Xbox customers buy few games and spend a lot of time in just one franchise. The initial Xbox One games sold less than expected and only Halo 5 had an acceptable commercial performance.
Therefore, it would have been better for the company to have just made Halo 5 for launch instead of trying to diversify, with the Xbox client, less is more.

....i dunno about this one. is not that they rejected those games. is that those games were not at the same standard as Playstation's

343's halos were always met with some weird controversy from the fanbase.

f) turning point
The profit in the console market is in the games not in the hardware, as Xbox customers were not buying the games Phil Spencer decides to recoup his investment by launching Xbox games on the PC (a taboo at that time) and starting a bold but stupid maneuver in my opinion about Game Pass, naturally the Xbox customer would be discouraged from purchasing games officially.

it was because they had only like 5 studios and we all know they are shit at videogame production.

and yeah. GP was a desperate attempt to save Xbox from irrelevance

g) At the end of the xbox one generation, MS had an administrative mistake related to the number of new releases, again Gamepass imposed a challenge of impossible deadlines, leading Microsoft to buy several studios and then an entire publisher (70 freaking bi)

well, I mean the idea was there; you buy the content... but the content has to be made and has to be great. two concept Ms dosen't have in its vocabulary.

h) The current generation began in a pre-launch cold war with MS talking about 12 teraflops (something that turned against it like the Atari Jaguar campaign. Do the math) but once again the deadlines were not being respected, the new Halo had a monkey with N64 look that was a disaster.

Rumors that Gamepass was stagnant, shareholders wanting results led to the recent wave of layoffs and in a way the end of Xbox as a reliable brand with a future etc.

Here's the million-dollar question. If GP was created because MS didn't have games with sales appeal, now it does. Is Call of Duty incompatible with GP under current conditions? Stop selling the game in a traditional way or cut content to adapt to Gamepass at the risk of starting to weaken this powerful franchise? We'll soon know.

CoD can't save GP when the service need 200M subscribers to make MS happy. is just a matter of time that service gets killed.

Will this be the narrative that history will enshrine when talking about Xbox in the future?

to make it short:

Xbox never had a good game development pipeline, instead of making, they decided to buy, but they fucked up that too. broke and without daddy's money they scrabble for survival... and they fucked up that too.

 

[CosmicComet]

Original Xbox - underrated catalog, shit controller until they fixed that

360 - all time great console, brought online gaming to mainstream, the rise of indie games

Then it all went to shit. That’s how Ill remember it anyway.

I dont think 360 is an ATG console when the latter half of it absolutely sucked.

360 certainly started the notion that MS had a weak first party compared to Ninty and Sony.

The 360 also started the terrible industry wide practice of charging for basic online connectivity in games. And normalized microtransactions and incomplete game releases.

I find it very easy to leave the 360 off a top 5 console list.

 

[BennyBlanco]

I dont think 360 is an ATG console when the latter half of it absolutely sucked.

360 certainly started the notion that MS had a weak first party compared to Ninty and Sony.

The 360 also started the terrible industry wide practice of charging for basic online connectivity in games. And normalized microtransactions and incomplete game releases.

I find it very easy to leave the 360 off a top 5 console list.

Eh I disagree. 360 was amazing. Great UI, great games, great controller. Top 3 console IMO.

 

[TransTrender]

Ehh, launch 360 was rather shit.
No HDMI, no WiFi.
Then the RROD stuff which persisted across all versions.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Really tired of this “Xbox One was the worst gen to lose” narrative. What was the point of Series S/X if that is the attitude?

What’s the point of a backwards compatibility program and cross saves then?

It’s not like new people won’t enter the market to buy a product or heaven forbid make your content and hardware appealing enough for consumers in the gaming market to still consider your product.

Piss poor attitude

 

[RAIDEN1]

I was thinking about this earlier, and for me I feel that Sony has had it all too easy since 2006.....Xbox was only in the fight for one round (the 360 era) then subsequently afterwards they went off kilter and haven't really been the same since, if we go back to pre-2006...they got lucky with Sega shooting themselves in the foot with the 32x, and then the Saturn not being a trailblazer despite being first out of the block, and as mentioned since Nintendo departed the horsepower war in 2006, there hasn't been anyone to REALLY make Sony sweat or knock them off their perch...and I can't see anyone coming in, when the next round of consoles start making their presence known either..

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

....i dunno about this one. is not that they rejected those games. is that those games were not at the same standard as Playstation's

343's halos were always met with some weird controversy from the fanbase.

As the other user said With halo, Forza, gears, they were really hitting some home runs. Did this become a meme? yes but it was what the players wanted, so Microsoft should have just given them that but Don Mattrick wanted an xbox more like Playstation with narrative games this move was intended to make the platform attractive to Playstation players but it went wrong, it only served to alienate loyal customers while Playstation players remained on Playstation.
They should have just made Forza 5 (only) instead of wasting time and money with Quantum Break when Alan Wake had already been rejected for the Xbox 360 fanbase. Regardless of whether the specialized critics gave it a low rating, what dictates this market is whether the customer is buying the game or not. So even at the risk of becoming a meme, in my opinion you can't let anyone external decide how to manage your commercial strategy, only regular customers should be heard (they weren't).

 

[Guerilla Munch]

Depends on how old you are. Going from Halo LAN parties to Halo 2 on Xbox Live in the same generation is by far my fondest stretch of gaming history. That was the pinnacle of gaming with the boys and the 100% unmoderated OG Xbox Live was some of the funniest shit ever.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

As the other user said With halo, Forza, gears, they were really hitting some home runs. Did this become a meme? yes but it was what the players wanted, so Microsoft should have just given them that but Don Mattrick wanted an xbox more like Playstation with narrative games this move was intended to make the platform attractive to Playstation players but it went wrong, it only served to alienate loyal customers while Playstation players remained on Playstation.
They should have just made Forza 5 (only) instead of wasting time and money with Quantum Break when Alan Wake had already been rejected for the Xbox 360 fanbase. Regardless of whether the specialized critics gave it a low rating, what dictates this market is whether the customer is buying the game or not. So even at the risk of becoming a meme, in my opinion you can't let anyone external decide how to manage your commercial strategy, only regular customers should be heard (they weren't).

The Xbox situation is very fascinating. because you don't fuck up so much a brand just doing only one thing wrong

in think the points that your are stating are not quite right.


1. Give Xbox players what they want.
2. they tried to make "Playstation games".
i think we can agree that the Xbox identity was alway Mutiplayer games /co-op.

ok. is not like during the Xbox One era they didn't provide those games, in fact; the Horizon IP was a better evolution for the forza series and is a multiplayer centric game

but the the 343's Halo games got mixed reception from the fans.

and gears became stagnant.

in other words, they were making the games that "Xbox fans wanted" the issue is that their quality and luster was dropping (outside Horizon)

and then you could say... but they were trying to make play station games....

... I'm not sure they were trying to make play station games.

Xbox was trying the trans-media shit with quantum break; TV eisodes as part of its narrative. I don't think Sony has never made game like that

sunset overdrive was colorful and fun, stilized game closer to a jet set radio. Sony was doing serious over the shoulder realistic games.

crackdown 3 = Xbox legacy
sea of thieves = multiplayer .

ReCore = they were selling it like an inafune/metroid game

State of Decay = Base building, resource management.

Dead Rising = Xbox legacy.

phantom dust = Xbox legacy

Ryse = is the closer one to a sony game i think. but clearly didn't set the tone for what Xbox was trying achieve as a brand.

conclusion:
Xbox's bread and butter lost its luster and they failed at creating great genere defining games either Mutiplayer and Single player whatsoever.

 

[Crayon]

Nobody every talks about how they lost the dudebros.

 

[MALpractice311]

To me it can be summed up like this, MS spent all its time making products they wanted to sell to consumers, rather than making products consumers actually wanted to buy. Listen to your audience.

 

[Kumomeme]

they has the chance to repeat the Xbox 360 era with Xbox Series X but throw wrench at everything with Series S, gamepass and lacking of exclusivity at first 2 years of the console cycle.

instead of trying to tackle their main issue one at a time, they end up greedy, hastily looking too far ahead at unproven future. prioritize bussiness model with monopoly intention than focusing make great game first and hearing their devs plea.

 

[reinking]

It will be remembered fondly much like the Zune, Windows Phone, HDDVD, Surface RT and Bob.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

 

[Alan Wake]

Really tired of this “Xbox One was the worst gen to lose” narrative. What was the point of Series S/X if that is the attitude?

What’s the point of a backwards compatibility program and cross saves then?

It’s not like new people won’t enter the market to buy a product or heaven forbid make your content and hardware appealing enough for consumers in the gaming market to still consider your product.

Piss poor attitude

They've even bragged about how many Xbox Series S buyers were completely new to the Xbox ecosystem this gen. Nothing makes sense.

 

[Lord Malachite]

The hard truth of the matter is that Xbox was never really winning on its own merits. During its best era, the first half of the seventh generation, Xbox pulled a metaphorical rabbit out of its hat with the 360 by managing to outsell the PS3 and capture a significant segment of the market. But this didn't happen because all of a sudden everyone was in love with Xbox. It happened because Sony screwed up with the PS3 launch by making a (then) overpriced console with a minimum $500 entry point, having a big drought of quality exclusive titles for the first two years of the PS3's life, having an obtuse system architecture that made the majority of multiplatform games worse on PS3, and having a weaker online network in PSN than Xbox Live.

In the middle of the gen, Sony aggressively cut the price on PS3 to make it competitive with 360 while simultaneously developing a huge amount of exclusive titles. Sony also had Naughty Dog do many free workshops for developers in the industry to teach them how to make their games sing on the PS3 instead of running like garbage. They also slowly improved PSN. It never caught up to XBL, but it got better and they made up for it with software and services, and making the online play component free on PS3 whereas it was paywalled on 360--a strategy Sony would come to employ with the PS4.

While all this was going on, Xbox just did what Xbox does. It put out its usual titles (Halo/Gears/Forza) and had some unsuccessful stuff. They acquired some Japanese exclusives but none of them sold well. They also had to spend over a billion dollars on repairs and warranties for the 360 because the system was poorly designed internally and has the highest failure rate in console history.

In short, Sony went back to doing what they do best. Kaz Hirai did a ton to fix the mess left behind when he took over and reestablish trust with gamers. Xbox just did what Xbox does--nothing particularly bad at that time. But they went on total cruise control with the 360 after 2010 while Sony kept pushing out banger after banger. They chased the flash-in-the-pan that was Kinect to their detriment when the eighth generation began. Their reveal, leadup, and launch of the 360's successor, the XB1, was disastrous and ensured Sony not only got the upper hand back but was in no danger of losing it again due to the terrible marketing and messaging going on at Xbox during that time period.

The glory days of Xbox, the first half of the seventh generation with the 360, were never a testament to Xbox's greatness. It was a testament to Sony doing a critical fumble on the world gaming stage with the PS3 reveal, leadup, and launch. One that Xbox bafflingly copied seven years later to similar results. When your success is based not on your own merits but on the folly of your biggest competitor, you have to hope your competition isn't able to pick itself back up. Sony did, and the rest is history.

 

[HofT]

Also, marketing matters and the names "One" and "Series S/X" are awful.

 

[Lord Malachite]

Really tired of this “Xbox One was the worst gen to lose” narrative. What was the point of Series S/X if that is the attitude?

What’s the point of a backwards compatibility program and cross saves then?

It’s not like new people won’t enter the market to buy a product or heaven forbid make your content and hardware appealing enough for consumers in the gaming market to still consider your product.

Piss poor attitude

You have to take into account why the eighth generation was the worst one to lose. Because it saw the rise of digital games on consoles. The more people that were playing on PS4 over XB1, the more people that were buying digital games on PS4 vs. XB1. The more people were building a PlayStation library over an Xbox one. When the ninth generation came around, most people don't want to jump ship to a console that their established digital library won't transfer over to. If you owned a PS4 and had a digital library on PS4, then getting a PS5 was like moving up an escalator, taking all your PS4 games with you. It was the same for XB1 players moving over to Series. But the user gap was wide, and it only continues to widen.

This also hits home to the reality that a great many Xbox owners no longer buy software. Why should they, when the games come to Gamepass on day one? Xbox has built a culture around not buying games and the entire reason for owning a Series boils down to having a cheap "Gamepass machine".

 

[Mobilemofo]

Its certainly proof that you need more than just money and suits to succeed. Microsofts downfall in console market should be a cautionary tale. This lot of next hardware for ms will be it's last i'd imagine.

 

[GymWolf]

We are gonna fondly remember og xbox and x360 and forget that there was something after that.

 

[DragonNCM]

I agree that the reveal of the Xbox One was the beginning of the end for Xbox

Ironically same fail management from the presentation is still here in 2024 with better job positions. Apparently the more you fail the more you climb in MS

 

[newtypepilot]

xbox will be remembered for failing the number one fundamental lesson to successful gaming console: software drives hardware sales. Not gimmick accessories, not subscription service (that can be accessed without said hardware btw), not "own the living room" nonsense, but software.

People don't buy Nintendo because of the hardware. They do it because it has strong library of first party exclusives.

Whatever lead they had gained from 360 was lost in the latter half of its lifecycle because they got complacent, neglected growing their first party games and focused on chasing stupid trends with Kinect. The RRoD issues also didn't help. The launch of the xbone only highlights incompetence of management and ensured xbox will always be behind Sony and Nintendo.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

Its certainly proof that you need more than just money and suits to succeed. Microsofts downfall in console market should be a cautionary tale. This lot of next hardware for ms will be it's last i'd imagine.

true

 

[laynelane]

I dont think 360 is an ATG console when the latter half of it absolutely sucked.

360 certainly started the notion that MS had a weak first party compared to Ninty and Sony.

The 360 also started the terrible industry wide practice of charging for basic online connectivity in games. And normalized microtransactions and incomplete game releases.

I find it very easy to leave the 360 off a top 5 console list.

The RRoD issue and how it was initially handled by Xbox (denial) is also part of it. The failure rate was unacceptably high for the console and then, on top of that, it didn't change much even after being repaired. I have no doubt this had an impact for many customers and helped them choose differently next generation.

 

[laynelane]

Really tired of this “Xbox One was the worst gen to lose” narrative. What was the point of Series S/X if that is the attitude?

What’s the point of a backwards compatibility program and cross saves then?

It’s not like new people won’t enter the market to buy a product or heaven forbid make your content and hardware appealing enough for consumers in the gaming market to still consider your product.

Piss poor attitude

That's just Phil making more excuses for his failures. He says a lot of things that catch on and are repeated. It could be a valid reason if he hadn't kept making mistake after mistake - ultimately leading the Xbox brand to where it is now - but, as it stands now, it's just yet another rationalization coming from him.

 

[EverydayBeast]

There’s a lot of stupid decisions from Microsoft no doubt and most people know Xbox and it’s Y2K dashboad

The 360 and the emergence of internet, easy to set up, the Xbox Live multiplayer desire, desire to get gamer score achievements

And the Xbox one’s doing a lot of interesting changes like the VHS style system

 

[kensama]

For me personnaly my statement and which could be the history is:

Without Microsoft infinite money, Xbox would have been shut down since a while