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Square Enix On The Popularity Gap Between Final Fantasy And Dragon Quest In The West
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
It would work for some. The question is if we would get a Type 0 scenario where people were selling the game without the code :sadface:
More than once they have lamented that no one bought them. It's much simpler than that. It's the obscene amount of money spent on VIIs advertising.
Dragon Quest was always behind FF in the US. They did themselves no favors by missing the SNES generation, which had its own mini boom in JRPGS and then coming so late with Dragon Warrior 7 basically completely missing that boom as well.
They did a reasonably good job with DW Monsters to answer the Pokémon craze but dropped the ball with that as the GBA came out.
While it didn't do FF VII numbers FF VI did quite well in the US. So did Mario RPG. I don't think V would have done well but DQ VI was a game they were planning on getting out over here before Enix USA went under that generation.
They did a reasonably good job with DW Monsters to answer the Pokémon craze but dropped the ball with that as the GBA came out.
While it didn't do FF VII numbers FF VI did quite well in the US. So did Mario RPG. I don't think V would have done well but DQ VI was a game they were planning on getting out over here before Enix USA went under that generation.
I'm aware, I was exaggerating hence the parenthetical. It is all wrapped in sugar sweet presentation though, and the sweetness is what hits you first... The cartoons mentioned earlier waste no time exposing their true colors.
-Mutsukki-
Member
7 is full of this just because of the oportunities that jumping from past to present creates. I really wish people got past the lighthearted art and general mood and try to really get to the heart of the game
clay_ghost
Member
It's the 1 2 punch of the snes FF still keeping the brand relevant in the West plus the CGI FF7 on PS prompting FF into stardom. I don't think releasing DQ 5,6 in the West plus an not so late release of 7 will have the same impact but the ip will definitely be more recognised.
4-7 are all like that to some degree or another. 9 has a bit of it too.
I want the damn games so fuck logic.
flintstryker
Banned
Doesn't matter to me if it every gets as big as FF especially of that means they have to neuter the series
clay_ghost
Member
Don't worry, SE still have other great Ips like Chrono and TWEWY!
They must be thanking Heaven for Kingdom Hearts
Isn't XV their fastest selling entry?
Screamapillar
Member
I mean it's a PS4 and 3DS game. Not exactly a risky bet for a western release. Two hugely popular systems with giant install bases, and both quite JRPG-friendly systems, too.
clay_ghost
Member
SE want FF sales for DQ.
-Mutsukki-
Member
It's also really far from killing the franchise lol
SolicitorPirate
Member
The question wasn't about profitability, it was matching FF's popularity in the West. I agree that a million+ in the West is good for what seems to be a modestly budgeted series, but that wasn't the issue at hand.
Yes, Overwatch suffocated Battleborn, but do you honestly believe that game would have been a success if it didn't release next to Overwatch? Its numbers are dismal to the point where a 100% increase in sales would still be a poor showing.
TOONAMI is literally airing two first run Dragon Ball series back to back starting this Saturday yet SE has never been able to capitalize on this connection. Not even once.
In fact the only time they've ever pushed Akira Toriyama was before DB was even a big deal in the US back when they were promoting the Dream Team for Chrono Trigger.
clay_ghost
Member
DBZ in the west is basically a lie / re branding of the original DBZ, with the dub changing some story elements and Goku being heroic, it also comes with new
shitty
-Mutsukki-
Member
It would certainly not have bombed as hard. But it always looked like a straight Overwatch clone and it would have died like it anyway, I don't think DQ is in the same boat honestly
What does that have to do with being accepting of Toriyama's art?
KojiKnight
Member
I literally learned to read because of my love for Dragon warrior/quest 1 when I was a kid... But I can't say I've been able to get into any of them since...
I agree that if it innovate too much, they will lose the devout fan base.
But I do know what I want from these games. Even now, if I go back to FF VII, VIII and IX and play them, I am charmed by the story, game play and presentation. The more FF go for realism, the more disconnect I feel from the characters, give less crap about their story and get bored by the game play.
With game play in RPG, it need to do a couple of things, 1. game play should not feel too repetitive, and 2. I have to feel that strategy is required to take down the boss or even small enemy. I feel a lot of modern RPG lacks the second component because the action is so fast pace and you feel like your cornered into making decisions that are not optimal.
My 2 cents again.
ScrapBrain
Member
Here's an idea: stop putting them on handhelds? I'm pushing 30 here and I really want to play these games, but I keep having to emulate them because I can't play them on a screen larger than 5 fucking inches. I believe that's why the money in the west isn't there. Japan is an on-the-go nation and the franchise sells really well on portables/mobile and, while I can't speak to a younger demographic they must be reaching for, my idea of a good 40+ hr experience is certainly not on a tiny screen, it's on my couch on the biggest screen I can find.
I'll continue to buy these games to support the effort to bring them here, but there could be a time when I'm no longer able to do that...considering half the time I just throw them in a stack of DS cases in the corner and never touch them again because I don't want to play them on the 3DS, it's not lookin so hot. I keep wondering why the hell I can't buy the PS1/PS2 versions of these games in the NA PSN store, or find ports of the remakes for the DS on a PC platform like Steam. the longer this goes on, the more I get the feeling that Square-Enix just has a particular knack for finding out how best to refuse my money
I'll continue to buy these games to support the effort to bring them here, but there could be a time when I'm no longer able to do that...considering half the time I just throw them in a stack of DS cases in the corner and never touch them again because I don't want to play them on the 3DS, it's not lookin so hot. I keep wondering why the hell I can't buy the PS1/PS2 versions of these games in the NA PSN store, or find ports of the remakes for the DS on a PC platform like Steam. the longer this goes on, the more I get the feeling that Square-Enix just has a particular knack for finding out how best to refuse my money
Square2015
Member
If they had released the SNES DQs, DQVIII would have been a million seller in NA.
#regret
#regret
Irishonion
Member
They definitely take a lot of time to get into the meat of them. Especially handheld titles. VIII was a bit more accessible.
Glendemonium
Member
Crazy part is, if you mentioned to an American audience that the art was done by none other than DBZ's and Chrono Trigger's Akira Toriyama there might of been some bump in success in the mid to late 90s at least.
But I agree marketing for DQ in the west was weak, hell marketing for some of Enix's classic RPGs were pretty weak that even Final Fantasy didn't get that huge media push until VII.
But I agree marketing for DQ in the west was weak, hell marketing for some of Enix's classic RPGs were pretty weak that even Final Fantasy didn't get that huge media push until VII.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I really don't think it mattered that FF had releases on the SNES, because VII ended up on the PS1 anyways. And the sheer hype the game got, hiad more to do with people treating the game as this once-in-a-lifetime experience. A large majority of the people who played FFVII, likely never played the series beforehand. If they did, it would be because FFVII exposed them to what the series was about.
ScientificPizza
Banned
Dragon Quest XI was ALWAYS coming out in the west. If they're putting the effort into bringing over Builders and Heroes they're gonna bring a main entry over. The only reason X didn't is because it's an MMO
SatelliteOfLove
Member
It's Gen 8. It's nearly a given again.
It no longer jolting around from form to form or not at all could only help their chances.
Cartago Delende Est
It's not just about the promotion. Final Fantasy got where it is because it wowed people technologically. Look at where Squaresoft was with Final Fantasy IX compared to Enix with Dragon Quest VII, both of which were out on PlayStation during the same year. Final Fantasy was pushing graphics, gameplay, and worldbuilding into new frontiers while Dragon Quest was mostly doing what it had always done. All the hype in the world wouldn't have made Dragon Quest as appealing to the masses as Final Fantasy, and I say that as a huge fan of Dragon Quest.
None of which is to say I don't think Dragon Quest deserves more fame in the West, because it absolutely does.
None of which is to say I don't think Dragon Quest deserves more fame in the West, because it absolutely does.
jimmypython
Member
no. It's not the art style. The west has no problem with cartoonish art style. Just see Pokemon and Dragon Ball.
SE still doesn't understand what's truly appealing to the western market, and/or how to market here.
(I have no answer to that either....obviously lol)
SE still doesn't understand what's truly appealing to the western market, and/or how to market here.
(I have no answer to that either....obviously lol)
I really enjoyed the aesthetics of DQ but the combat is really, REALLY simplistic. It's also what 50% of playtime consist of.
There's the occasional tense and exciting boss battle, but the regular encounters in most games are both way too frequent and way too repetitive.
I have played five DQ games at this point over the years and never managed to get past the halfway point in a single one of them.
I love the enemy designs in particular, it has great music (if usually way too few tracks per game), I adore the nostalgic, simple mood in them, but man, the battles get really old, which is something I can't look past in a game so heavily reliant on it.
Scrolling through a massive list of skills and magic with only six entries per page like on some 1990s digital LCD organizer is also really annoying. There has to be a way to make this both traditional and not completely outdated.
The way fast travel worked in VII 3DS was also hilariously stupid. If I remember correctly you could instantly zoom between towns, but not when you're in the past, so it only worked half of the time for no apparent reason.
There's the occasional tense and exciting boss battle, but the regular encounters in most games are both way too frequent and way too repetitive.
I have played five DQ games at this point over the years and never managed to get past the halfway point in a single one of them.
I love the enemy designs in particular, it has great music (if usually way too few tracks per game), I adore the nostalgic, simple mood in them, but man, the battles get really old, which is something I can't look past in a game so heavily reliant on it.
Scrolling through a massive list of skills and magic with only six entries per page like on some 1990s digital LCD organizer is also really annoying. There has to be a way to make this both traditional and not completely outdated.
The way fast travel worked in VII 3DS was also hilariously stupid. If I remember correctly you could instantly zoom between towns, but not when you're in the past, so it only worked half of the time for no apparent reason.
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
To be honest I don't know if the premise of DQ will heavily click on the Western market because it's very simplistic and it's not what you call a game that has a standout cast like the ones from FF. I only fondly remember Yangus and Jessica and that's about it.
christaran
Member
As a westerner, I actually don't understand at all why adults in this part of the world are turned off by cartoon aesthetic.
Basically this. I can't honestly understand why anyone would doubt their hopes of appealing to Western consumers as a major consideration for making a PS4 version. It's always been the release of the 3DS version outside of Japan that's been more questionable (that version could easily carry the game by itself in its home market).
DBZ Kai is more in line with the original. Personally, I consider it much worse (though nostalgia was also a factor in not perceiving flaws that were already there with the series), and the music from the previous localization was far preferable to what replaced it in Kai, which easily has one of the worst soundtracks I've heard in any anime series.
Pokemon Go was the most massive video game phenomenon of the last couple of years. Everybody and their mom played that and games can barely get more cartoony than Pokemon. People also love the Simpsons, South Park, Minecraft, Pixar movies, Mickey Mouse... So that's definitely not it.
Choppasmith
Member
People are talking about this pretty much confirming DQ XI in the West, but the comparison between DQ and FF really makes me hope that new Itadaki/Fortune Street is coming out here. I mean he talks about getting FF fans in the West on board and I would think that reason alone is good reason to bring the game out.
Here's to hoping!
Here's to hoping!
-Mutsukki-
Member
You didn't really need to zoom in the past since it would generally just feature one map and you could choose any from the tablet room. It also wouldn't make sense because some tablets are farther in time than others
You want the West to buy DQ games? How about making people know that DQXI exists, outside of established fans of the series? Put a freaking trailer at Sony's E3 press conference or PSX 2017! Nintendo Directs aren't good enough...the DQ trailers are drowned out by first party Nintendo games. Advertise DQXI like Sony advertises Ni No Kuni 2, and you'll actually get a game that performs well!
KingdomHeartsFan
Member
Good thing is they are doing a good job localizing DQ games now.
-Mutsukki-
Member
if by recent you mean anything after Blue Dragon, then IX by a fucking landslide
I didn't even remember blue dragon was a thing
Bonfires Down
Member
I remember starting DQ IV on DS, and the story and combat were so boring. I put it down after a few hours. DQ Builders and Heroes look interesting though.