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[-Arcadia-]

Genuine question, no console warrior BS, please.

This seems like an interesting sub-discussion that's lost in all the furor about the Xbox brand and wider delay talk right now.

As someone that really liked what was shown in terms of gameplay...

- Is it possible that Microsoft could, by November 2021 or earlier, really turn things around?

- Do you think a substantial improvement is on the table, and what do you expect?

- Is there any sort of precedent for a radical overhaul like this?

- Are visuals on the order of what we saw in the earlier trailers within reach?

I'm no expert, and I've never shot myself in the foot, so I feel genuinely inquisitive about what to expect when a game five years in dev, gets a possible one year delay, with a visual overhaul specifically in mind.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

A year? It'll release in March of 2021.

 

[Coolwhhip]

The visuals are just an obvious symptom, I don't expect the other aspects of the game to be much better. I wouldn't get my hopes up in general.

 

[whitesugar]

Absolutely. I expect graphically it will be very nice in the end.
The game's bigger problem is that 343i are an average studio and nothing in their previous attempts at th franchise or their gameplay trailer suggest they are able to bring Halo forward

 

[SteveLorde]

Yes absolutely, because Halo Infinite already has the base engine ready for mind blowing graphics.

The problem lies in 343 shitstudios that are going cheap on the graphics.

 

[VertigoOA]

Visually?

It’s probably much more than that...

it’s gonna be a shitshow until then. I imagine Spencer is raising hell trying to make 343 into a competent studio.

 

[Stuart360]

Has it actually been confirmed its delayed for a year?. They just said delayed into 2021 i think.
Although i wouldnt be surprised if they do delay it for next holiday. I think how well sales for XSX will determine that.

 

[CrysisFreak]

Can someone tell me if the game is full open world with an explorable ring like the YouTube fanboys said or if it's semi open-world like Dragon Age inquisition where the map is split up into parts?
Because if it's the former the game is automatically much more impressive imho if it's the later idk what they are smoking.
I've read some conflicting statements.

 

[Stuart360]

Can someone tell me if the game is full open world with an explorable ring like the YouTube fanboys said or if it's semi open-world like Dragon Age inquisition where the map is split up into parts?
Because if it's the former the game is automatically much more impressive imho if it's the later idk what they are smoking.
I've read some conflicting statements.

I dont think anyone knows for sure. The gameplay presentation showed the map for a few seconds, and it looked like the map was broke into sections, with gaps in between. But it was also at the part where the ring was destroyed, so that part of the game maybe broken segments, but the map overall could be a big open world.

 

[TheRaidenPT]

They gotta cancel base Xbox One and focus on Series X tbh

 

[Lupin3]

I fail to see how they could do anything substantial in whatever time they have left, if what they showed us is all they've got right now.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

A year? It'll release in March of 2021.

I don’t know. I’m thinking closer to full year or something like Summer or Fall 2021. Maybe it will release faster with the additional assistance they are receiving though.

 

[Ceadeus]

They never said Halo was to release in December 2021..

Could very well be Q1 2021.

Neogaf has turned into a Halo threads forum recently and it's starting to get tiring.

 

[-Arcadia-]

Can someone tell me if the game is full open world with an explorable ring like the YouTube fanboys said or if it's semi open-world like Dragon Age inquisition where the map is split up into parts?
Because if it's the former the game is automatically much more impressive imho if it's the later idk what they are smoking.
I've read some conflicting statements.

I've no idea where to find it, admittedly, but I believe we had confirmation from 343 that the game consists of large open-world parts.

 

[deriks]

To change graphics and some tech shit is not that hard. Since the game as a whole was close to being done, this should not be any problem to a big studio. Maybe the original models are better looking than what we saw, and then it just need a better art direction to make the game look more alive - everyone noticed that it's blend as fuck

 

[CeeJay]

Yes absolutely, because Halo Infinite already has the base engine ready for mind blowing graphics.

The problem lies in 343 shitstudios that are going cheap on the graphics.

The Slipspace engine that the new Halo is using was developed by 343 as well though. The game could potentially be rotten to the core.

For me, 343 had enough time to develop Halo Infinite and enough time to create a polished presentation for the Xbox event. I really do not know how much difference another year, 2 years, 3 years... is going to make to the game. 343 had miss-steps with Halo 4 and Halo 5 and they really needed to dispel any fears with their presentation of Halo Infinite but instead they put something out that was worse than anyone could have guessed it was going to be.

Interestingly around the time of the event it was announced that Destiny 2 was coming to Gamepass later on this year with all the DLCs included. To me that was a warning shot to 343 that Bungie and Microsoft are getting friendly again and it really wouldn't surprise me if Microsoft don't somehow do a deal with Bungie to work on Halo again as a contingency for 343s apparent incompetence with the IP.

343 have got to be in last chance saloon right now. I do hope that they turn it around although I think the writing is already on the wall for them.

 

[-Arcadia-]

- Is it possible that Microsoft could, by November 2021 or earlier, really turn things around?

Interesting test of how many people don't read OPs around here.

 

[Sony]

We don't even know if the delay is to upgrade the visuals. I doubt it's because the visuals. I think the game itself with its current visuals needs work.

 

[Hudo]

It kinda depends. If they have implemented their renderer somewhat cleanly and modular, then that should be doable. If you're talking about somehow overhauling assets, then this might not be doable unless they have an algorithmic way of doing it, like using GANs to upscale or create assets (which would still require manual post-processing, so to speak).

But I guess Microsoft wouldn't have granted them that delay if 343 hadn't presented some sort of convincing concept/plan. Because delaying the game is not an easy decision.

 

[Cato]

Holiday 2021 is my guess.
The recent showing was not great.

 

[aries_71]

I don't think is enough time to do substantial changes. 343 plan was probably to ship a barebone product, and keep adding to it for some years. A la Destiny 2.
Problem with that strategy is that MS will probably downsize the studio and they will barely be able to maintain the service as is.

 

[Flintty]

I’d like to think so but not too much confidence. I think they’d need to shelve XBO version or split off a separate team to finish that as a parallel project, then go balls deep on the XSX version.

 

[M1chl]

It is, but only if competent enough studio is behind it. The greatest mistery of our time: Halo 5 graphics vs Halo: Infinite graphics.

 

[-Arcadia-]

We don't even know if the delay is to upgrade the visuals. I doubt it's because the visuals. I think the game itself with its current visuals needs work.

As they were ready to deliver it for holiday until the visual backlash started, it's a pretty safe bet, if not absolute.

Neogaf has turned into a Halo threads forum recently and it's starting to get tiring.

Go make some threads about other stuff then. This is big news, and this forum of individual people isn't here to specifically entertain you.

 

[GHG]

We probably need to wait for more details.

Are they delaying it to launch it with the RT enabled on Series X rather than via a patch or will it still release without RT and will that patch still come at a later date?

Really it's impossible to tell but what we do know is that they had 5 years and that's the current state of the game. By that metric an extra year might not do much unless change the way they've been approaching the project.

They are getting help from other studios internally and externally at the moment so it's all hands to the pump. There are reasons to be optimistic but it largely depends on what state the foundations (the game engine) are in.

If the codebase is a mess then this delay is to get that in order so that when they ship they have a solid base off which to build on.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Yes, absolutely.

Final Fantasy 14 belly-flopped and then re-launched successfully after about a year (memory is fuzzy and I can't be arsed to look it up). So they're skipping the dismal belly-flop and just skipping to the part where they release a banner game like people wanted.

 

[SirTerry-T]

It worked for the Sonic movie

Just a matter of waiting I suppose.
A lot depends on if the graphical issues are technical or a more a matter of art direction.
If it's art direction, improving that in the time left would be the lesser of two evils.
Either way, I don't envy them but as a dev myself I hope they can shut themselves off from all the shit being flung at them from the internet and deliver something they are proud off.

A rather optimistic viewpoint, I know but there's enough crap that's talked about game development by people with no idea how it really works, that I really hope 343 can turn this around and shut some of those dissenting voices up.

 

[CrysisFreak]

I laugh every time people say it's going to be glorious once ray tracing hits I cannot even haha.

We don't ever fucking know what ray tracing they aim to implement. RT GI? Yeah that would be swell wouldn't it. But at 4k60? Idk sounds unrealistic to me.
So what else could it be? RT shadows? RT reflections? Those are not going to be enough to change the visuals.

And I doubt they delayed it by a whole year to nov 2021. If so then idk what they expect sales wise.
I think they only delayed it by a few months because I'll say it again it's by far their most important game! They fckn need it and they need it soon.
They better release it in Q2 at the latest.

 

[genesisblock]

At best, the only issue right now is Graphics - something that tends to be polished at the final run of the development - unless their campaign has some serious issues.

 

[hyperbertha]

Can someone tell me if the game is full open world with an explorable ring like the YouTube fanboys said or if it's semi open-world like Dragon Age inquisition where the map is split up into parts?
Because if it's the former the game is automatically much more impressive imho if it's the later idk what they are smoking.
I've read some conflicting statements.

Usually when a dev is this shy about revealing the details of the game, it tends to be the latter! If it truly was a full ring they would have done their hardest to showcase and highlight that fact imo.

 

[Flintty]

If I could indulge fantasy for a moment and think forward to March next year where there’s a full Infinite blowout with epic gameplay, multiplayer and open world shenanigans with beautiful ray tracing and vastly improved graphics...

 

[FranXico]

Are they delaying it to launch it with the RT enabled on Series X rather than via a patch

Well, according to experts, Ray Tracing would solve pretty much everything.

 

[Paracelsus]

People at this point probably expect this

to turn into this

 

[Rentahamster]

Sure, it's possible. If the rest of the game is more or less feature complete, then they only really need to focus on the visuals and QA. If progress is lacking in other areas, then, well, perhaps it's less possible.

Frankly, they seem to have some long-held internal issues that persist from their founding to this day. A studio so privileged to have been gifted one of the most beloved franchises in video game history to have such a spotty record with that IP is very puzzling. That they haven't fixed those issues after all these years isn't a good sign.

 

[shaddam]

With competent programmers? Maybe. With diversity hires? No way

 

[VAVA Mk2]

They never said Halo was to release in December 2021..

Could very well be Q1 2021.

Neogaf has turned into a Halo threads forum recently and it's starting to get tiring.

Well it is the biggest game for one of the two new consoles releasing this year. Hasn't been much to talk about in regards to Halo in 5 years too.

 

[PresetError]

I don't think there will be many changes on the graphics side. Maybe textures and lighting, but the key decisions for this game have been made long time ago and can't be undone.

 

[V4skunk]

If the assets are all there it won't take long to turn everything up.
The most demanding thing will be changing the lighting to make it look better.

 

[Birdo]

They need to bring in top men to polish it.

Top men.

 

[ricardo_sousa11]

No, it wont be enough because they lack talent, they could have made it visually appealing to start with, but they didnt because they dont have a clear art direction, a visual overhaul would require re-modelling both the map and models, as well as upgrading lighting, textures, fix all the popin we've seen and so on.

it wont happen, they might upgrade the lighting but thats it.

 

[Tiamat2san]

They never said Halo was to release in December 2021..

Could very well be Q1 2021.

Neogaf has turned into a Halo threads forum recently and it's starting to get tiring.

Well, it has been a TLOU2 forum for 2 months (leaks, then release)
And there aren’t any big news since the halo shit show.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Genuine question, no console warrior BS, please.

This seems like an interesting sub-discussion that's lost in all the furor about the Xbox brand and wider delay talk right now.

As someone that really liked what was shown in terms of gameplay...

- Is it possible that Microsoft could, by November 2021 or earlier, really turn things around?

- Do you think a substantial improvement is on the table, and what do you expect?

- Is there any sort of precedent for a radical overhaul like this?

- Are visuals on the order of what we saw in the earlier trailers within reach?

I'm no expert, and I've never shot myself in the foot, so I feel genuinely inquisitive about what to expect when a game five years in dev, gets a possible one year delay, with a visual overhaul specifically in mind.

Impossible.
More if is a sandbox

 

[Cert.in.Death]

Time always helps, but there’s only so much that can be done. If anything, they can update the models and add layers of animation effects but they have to calculate the additions based on the hardware. So if they are going to revamp the visuals, it will likely only be seen on the XSeX.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

This feels like a concern troll. A year is a lot of time to improve graphics.

 

[Tulipanzo]

This is the thing, visually they may be able to turn things around. However, the visuals are just a symptom of the larger problems the studio has had, down to losing two creative directors in two months.
Fixing it visually it's also especially hard given how many platforms the game will have to be running on, and the inherent limitations of that (eg. elevators to hide loading) will remain across all consoles.

What I expect is a game that looks stronger visually, but is ultimately still bogged down by a Destiny-like structure to ensure it can become a GaaS for the next decade.

 

[VFXVeteran]

They can turn it around in months.

The game engine needs a revampled lighting system. The assets can be tweaked. They need some really high res texture maps and normal maps. FX work will have to be tweaked. If they are wanting to keep the 60FPS target, some of the more complex rendering applications will need to be scaled down for the XSX.

 

[Nemesis Prime]

It honestly didn’t look THAT bad... the world itself has a serene beauty to it, I think a year should be enough time to make a NOTICEABLE difference to the visuals

I don’t think a substantial different is realistic though, I could see improvements in textures, lighting, LOD issues, and shadows. This should be enough to make a big difference to the game. But it’s clear the game is meant to be scalable with low-medium end PCs and Xbox one so don’t expect it To be mind blowing

 

[Graciaus]

The graphics are irrelevant really. There are plenty of good games that dont look that great. But If the multi-player and campaign are trash like 4 and 5 Halo is done. Shitty graphics will just be another thing to laugh about. The player base is already nothing compared to what it use to be.

 

[Dane]

For a year? Yes, because it gives them enough time to fix the engine. If they had it content wise nearly done, it's even a huge extra time

 

[Vawn]

For who? 343? Probably not.

They really should just pull 343 off the series completely and find a better studio to take over their most important franchise.

I hear MS has 7000 kazillion dollars and will eventually start spending it on Xbox (been hearing this for 20 years now). So, just buy Bungie MS.