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[Fafalada]

Dreamcast was a failure that sinked Sega as a hardware maker...

I mean - sure, but that in of itself isn't a measure of popularity/something being niche though. Commercial failures happen to very mainstream things also.

And I think Sony would have considered Move a failure, but not Eye Toy, even though they sold roughly the same.

 

[jm89]

So how is this going to work for physical games? Do you buy a physical PS6 game and also receive a code for the PS6 handheld? Or do you have to buy the same game twice?

 

[Elios83]

I realllllly hope this doesn't turn into a series S situation, where it holds back the entire generation.

There won't be another generation in the traditional way.
The two basic principles on which "generations" were based on don't exist anymore:

1. A company can pack significant innovations and poweful hardware in a box and sell it a < 499$ mainstream price and the price will become lower after a few years reaching new users. This can't happen anymore because in the current hw business unless you make something with conservative (disappointing) specs you will end up at >=599$ price. Also the ability to do major price drops or start making profits on hardware with future hw revisions is gone and that makes the idea of initially subsidizing the launch price hard to implement.
This was a pillar of the traditional console business model.
Now if hw costs don't go down in time you accept that financial burden forever or you have to raise prices later...which is what has happened this gen and not once...

2. The arrival of the new box can convince all major publishers to quickly embrace the new platform leaving the previous gen behind almost immediately, using all the features of the new platform and allowing the new platform to build a new installed base from zero quickly.
This hasn't even happened during the PS5 gen, not even Sony as the platform holder pushed for this because with current development costs you need to sell million units to break even.

Next gen will be about an ecosystem of products reaching different markets with ad hoc products. You can't do a single good for everyone product anymore.
The handheld will be a way to target the Switch and the handheld PCs market, what traditionally would have been the "real" PS6 will be a high end expensive (800$) device for enthusiasts bridging the gap with the high end PC experience and current PS5 plus maybe a PS6Lite (basically a PS5 equivalent with a modern architecture that can optimize their manufacturing efficiency) will target the mainstream market not interested in portability.
All games will continue to target PS5 specs for years to come, having something like the Switch 2 being a new product in that kind of performance ballpark is only going to validate the strategy even more for third party publishers.

 

[Setsuna Mudou]

I'm not quite sure of that just yet. If it is a PS6, then that's a hard task to live up to. What will it do that the PS5 generation can't do?

That's up to Sony to tell us, but from the leaks so far seems some AI to be used, perhaps for NPC dialogues and more realistic behavior of NPCs that can adapt on the fly to things the player does and how he plays.
Last gen to this gen, you could argue the real jump was the SSD and how that improved the experience of simply launching a game, tiny to no loading screens, etc.

So don't worry about the handheld, Cerny's got this shit.

 

[BlackTron]

Don't ever reply to Protobyte...stay your hand...

 

[Ceadeus]

I hope the battery doesn't have a 3 hour autonomy and the handheld not a system to port the usual boring PS catalog. Also hope it's not digital only. The 256gb SSD is gonna fill up real fast and proprietary Sony card is going to be more expensive than gold.

Two and a half hours battery life 900p40fps spider man port

 

[mckmas8808]

can't remember the thread, but here is the video I put up

Looking at this on my 6.5 in screen on my phone , I got to say this doesn't look too bad.

There won't be another generation in the traditional way.
The two basic principles on which "generations" were based on don't exist anymore:

1. A company can pack significant innovations and poweful hardware in a box and sell it a < 499$ mainstream price and the price will become lower after a few years reaching new users. This can't happen anymore because in the current hw business unless you make something with conservative (disappointing) specs you will end up at >=599$ price. Also the ability to do major price drops or start making profits on hardware with future hw revisions is gone and that makes the idea of initially subsidizing the launch price hard to implement.
This was a pillar of the traditional console business model.
Now if hw costs don't go down in time you accept that financial burden forever or you have to raise prices later...which is what has happened this gen and not once...

2. The arrival of the new box can convince all major publishers to quickly embrace the new platform leaving the previous gen behind almost immediately, using all the features of the new platform and allowing the new platform to build a new installed base from zero quickly.
This hasn't even happened during the PS5 gen, not even Sony as the platform holder pushed for this because with current development costs you need to sell million units to break even.

Next gen will be about an ecosystem of products reaching different markets with ad hoc products. You can't do a single good for everyone product anymore.
The handheld will be a way to target the Switch and the handheld PCs market, what traditionally would have been the "real" PS6 will be a high end expensive (800$) device for enthusiasts bridging the gap with the high end PC experience and current PS5 plus maybe a PS6Lite (basically a PS5 equivalent with a modern architecture that can optimize their manufacturing efficiency) will target the mainstream market not interested in portability.
All games will continue to target PS5 specs for years to come, having something like the Switch 2 being a new product in that kind of performance ballpark is only going to validate the strategy even more for third party publishers.

The idea of a PS6s hurts my heart so much. Why do you guys think this version of a PS6 is so smart?

 

[Elios83]

The idea of a PS6s hurts my heart so much. Why do you guys think this version of a PS6 is so smart?

It's a forced necessity, it's not something that I consider ideal as well but the hardware business has changed too much to make the old approach viable.

Just releasing a high end PS6 at 799$ with almost (if not) zero exclusives because no one can afford to leave PS5 behind and very little room to cut prices in the future is just poor business planning and a recipe to see their installed base cut in half next gen in the best case.

The only way to address the new market realities is an ecosystem based approach where you make different products targeted at different needs (the handheld to reach the portable/hybrid market, current PS5 or a PS6Lite that replaces it as a modern version of it with an accessible 499$ price, the high end enthusiast model for core gamers at 799$).
All these products will together create an ecosystem of over 100m users buying games and services from PlayStation.

 

[mckmas8808]

It's a forced necessity, it's not something that I consider ideal as well but the hardware business has changed too much to make the old approach viable.

Just releasing a high end PS6 at 799$ with almost (if not) zero exclusives because no one can afford to leave PS5 behind and very little room to cut prices in the future is just poor business planning and a recipe to see their installed base cut in half next gen in the best case.

The only way to address the new market realities is an ecosystem based approach where you make different products targeted at different needs (the handheld to reach the portable/hybrid market, current PS5 or a PS6Lite that replaces it as a modern version of it with an accessible 499$ price, the high end enthusiast model for core gamers at 799$).
All these products will together create an ecosystem of over 100m users buying games and services from PlayStation.

I do understand this post, but literally hate every single sentence in it. It makes me want to throw up. The honest truth is if a new generation PlayStation 6 must cost $800 then that means it's coming out too early.

 

[Elios83]

I do understand this post, but literally hate every single sentence in it. It makes me want to throw up. The honest truth is if a new generation PlayStation 6 must cost $800 then that means it's coming out too early.

Delaying things is not going to fix anything.
Prices aren't going down, they now stay the same or go up for the same exact thing. Even 2020 hardware is having price increases in 2026.
They need something conceived from the beginning in a smart way and with conservative enough specs to hit mainstream market at 499$ top, if they want to reach that market.
We are also probably one war away for things to precipitate even further..waiting could be for nothing or to find yourself in an even worse situation while other competitors could take advantage of the situation.
Companies adapt to do business in the given market realities they don't wait for hypothetical better times with no dates or guarantees.

PS5 gen was already a transition to this outcome given the long cross gen phase, the price increases, the small number of exclusives, most games being developed not with a system in mind but fully scalable and running on multiple devices with very different specs.
This hasn't prevented developers from taking advantage of the PS5 specific features (like SSD, 3D audio, Dualsense), it will be the same for PS6 which will focus on path tracing and a lot of dedicated AI features.

 

[archangelmorph]

The clout chasing, internet rumour mill is at fever pitch these days innit...?

No idea why anyone believes any of these bullshit takes...

 

[Zathalus]

The clout chasing, internet rumour mill is at fever pitch these days innit...?

No idea why anyone believes any of these bullshit takes...

Seems odd to deny it at this stage. MLID has had a pretty damn good track record of Sony/AMD leaks recently.

 

[Games Bookstore]

I suspect with this recent DRM move with the 30 day check in, it will mean all games physical and digital will be tied to your user account.

On top of that there is also the rumour of Sony's version of Smart Delivery.

In this scenario the upshot will be, the game will work across any recent playstation ecosystem device. As an example:

You wish to play Cyberpunk on your PS6P. The physical copy of the game has been installed on your PS5. Your PS account recognises this installation and allow you to download the PS6P variant of Cyberpunk, DRM will check in every 30 days to ensure you still own the game.

 

[Shogmaster]

PS6 Potato

PS6 G

G for gimped

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

I do understand this post, but literally hate every single sentence in it. It makes me want to throw up. The honest truth is if a new generation PlayStation 6 must cost $800 then that means it's coming out too early.

Lol... delaying it may actually mean it ends up costing more when you are ready to release it. Are you not seeing that the PS5 cost more today than it did at launch? Almost 6 years later. Thats the reality of the world we live in today.

Another way to look at this is, right now, making hardware that actually amounts to a generational leap over the PS5, will mean that that hardware will cost at least $800 to make. And mind you, this would still put it in that midrange PC category at its time of launch, which all consoles tend to fall under in their year of launch. Now you aren't going to realistically expect everyone to be able to afford an $800+ console, so you try and scale your portfolio, hence, PS6 home console at $800 and PS6 lite/handheld at $450. Cause that's what $450 will get you right now, a PS6lite.

The real crazy part is... can you imagine what an equivalent speced PC to the PS6 will cost? You will be spedning $750-$900 to get a GPU that will match it, and that's just the GPU, you will still have to buy a CPU, RAM, SSD, Case, PSU....etc.

Yeah, point is.... EVERYTHING is more expensive these days. When the PS5 launched, its GPU equivalent (RX6700xt) cost around $475 and was released over a year after the PS5. Again, that was just a GPU. So this is nothing new, the value proposition for consoles has always been that what you would pay for a whole console is equivalent to what you would pay for that console's GPU equivalent (more or less).

Things have just got a lot pricier.

 

[KeplerL2]

Lol... delaying it may actually mean it ends up costing more when you are ready to release it. Are you not seeing that the PS5 cost more today than it did at launch? Almost 6 years later. Thats the reality of the world we live in today.

Another way to look at this is, right now, making hardware that actually amounts to a generational leap over the PS5, will mean that that hardware will cost at least $800 to make. And mind you, this would still put it in that midrange PC category at its time of launch, which all consoles tend to fall under in their year of launch. Now you aren't going to realistically expect everyone to be able to afford an $800+ console, so you try and scale your portfolio, hence, PS6 home console at $800 and PS6 lite/handheld at $450. Cause that's what $450 will get you right now, a PS6lite.

The real crazy part is... can you imagine what an equivalent speced PC to the PS6 will cost? You will be spedning $750-$900 to get a GPU that will match it, and that's just the GPU, you will still have to buy a CPU, RAM, SSD, Case, PSU....etc.

Yeah, point is.... EVERYTHING is more expensive these days. When the PS5 launched, its GPU equivalent (RX6700xt) cost around $475 and was released over a year after the PS5. Again, that was just a GPU. So this is nothing new, the value proposition for consoles has always been that what you would pay for a whole console is equivalent to what you would pay for that console's GPU equivalent (more or less).

Things have just got a lot pricier.

The RTX 6070 will almost certainly be faster than the PS6 and I doubt that will be more than $699

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

The RTX 6070 will almost certainly be faster than the PS6 and I doubt that will be more than $699

Everything suggests it will cost more than that. The 5070 launched at $550. Right now, its prices are averaging at $635 -$850 (PCpartspicker).

But even if it's not more than $699... that's still just one part of a potential PC build. And still speaking to what I am saying about everything just being more expensive these days. Personally, I believe the 6070 is going to be $800.

 

[viveks86]

The RTX 6070 will almost certainly be faster than the PS6

So it's faster than a 5090 in PT, then?

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I have a feeling that NV is more likely to do 'Shrinkflation' at the mid tier and below than jack up prices.

 

[ComputerBlue]

Aren't people expecting this to launch next year, and studios are just only being briefed on it?

 

[KeplerL2]

So it's faster than a 5090 in PT, then?

Of course!*

*with 12x MFG

 

[bitbydeath]

I mean yeah, I guess. Gens just don't really exist. The reality is that these things are just PCs now. PCs have never really had gens either.

This is incorrect.
Gens are when the baselines move, that is why PC doesn't have them, as they are never the baseline. (Aside from some indies)

PS5 currently is the baseline today and PS6 will be in future.
That doesn't mean games can't be downgraded from the baseline to work on weaker hardware such as the handheld, it just means games will be built with PS6 specs in mind first and foremost.

 

[KeplerL2]

Aren't people expecting this to launch next year, and studios are just only being briefed on it?

That's the normal timing. 3rd party disclosure is probably late this year/early next year.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Aren't people expecting this to launch next year, and studios are just only being briefed on it?

They already know about the LPM obviously.

it just means games will be built with PS6 specs in mind first and foremost.

PS5

 

[bitbydeath]

They already know about the LPM obviously.



PS5

PS5 currently, PS6 once it launches.
Similar to how PS5 games were downgraded to work on PS4.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

PS5 currently, PS6 once it launches.
Similar to how PS5 games were downgraded to work on PS4.

The handheld is slower than the PS5...

 

[bitbydeath]

The handheld is slower than the PS5...

Same deal. The baseline still changes.

 

[mckmas8808]

Delaying things is not going to fix anything.
Prices aren't going down, they now stay the same or go up for the same exact thing. Even 2020 hardware is having price increases in 2026.
They need something conceived from the beginning in a smart way and with conservative enough specs to hit mainstream market at 499$ top, if they want to reach that market.
We are also probably one war away for things to precipitate even further..waiting could be for nothing or to find yourself in an even worse situation while other competitors could take advantage of the situation.
Companies adapt to do business in the given market realities they don't wait for hypothetical better times with no dates or guarantees.

PS5 gen was already a transition to this outcome given the long cross gen phase, the price increases, the small number of exclusives, most games being developed not with a system in mind but fully scalable and running on multiple devices with very different specs.
This hasn't prevented developers from taking advantage of the PS5 specific features (like SSD, 3D audio, Dualsense), it will be the same for PS6 which will focus on path tracing and a lot of dedicated AI features.

Isn't new AI spending artificially driving up cost now? And wasn't some of that spending starting to fall off? I'm not convinced RAM prices and SSD prices will continue to stay high like this. Either way there's no way in the world $499 can be Sony's target for their "mainstream" PS6. NO WAY! Given today's prices, they may be forced to shoot for $699 and rely on a longer cross-gen period.

But a PS6s for $499 would be a disaster, considering they would still be selling the PS5 in 2027.

 

[Shogmaster]

Of course!*

*with 12x MFG

DLSS 5.5 12X FRAME GEN CONFIRNED

 

[onQ123]

So how is this going to work for physical games? Do you buy a physical PS6 game and also receive a code for the PS6 handheld? Or do you have to buy the same game twice?

If you have them both you could probably install the game to the portable from the disc inside of the PS6 if they have something in place to keep you from installing games then passing them to someone else to do the same . Like they could use NFC or something on the disc so you would have to have the disc with you to play the game.


A code system would probably work also

 

[Unfortunatecookie]

There won't be another generation in the traditional way.
The two basic principles on which "generations" were based on don't exist anymore:

1. A company can pack significant innovations and poweful hardware in a box and sell it a < 499$ mainstream price and the price will become lower after a few years reaching new users. This can't happen anymore because in the current hw business unless you make something with conservative (disappointing) specs you will end up at >=599$ price. Also the ability to do major price drops or start making profits on hardware with future hw revisions is gone and that makes the idea of initially subsidizing the launch price hard to implement.
This was a pillar of the traditional console business model.
Now if hw costs don't go down in time you accept that financial burden forever or you have to raise prices later...which is what has happened this gen and not once...

2. The arrival of the new box can convince all major publishers to quickly embrace the new platform leaving the previous gen behind almost immediately, using all the features of the new platform and allowing the new platform to build a new installed base from zero quickly.
This hasn't even happened during the PS5 gen, not even Sony as the platform holder pushed for this because with current development costs you need to sell million units to break even.

Next gen will be about an ecosystem of products reaching different markets with ad hoc products. You can't do a single good for everyone product anymore.
The handheld will be a way to target the Switch and the handheld PCs market, what traditionally would have been the "real" PS6 will be a high end expensive (800$) device for enthusiasts bridging the gap with the high end PC experience and current PS5 plus maybe a PS6Lite (basically a PS5 equivalent with a modern architecture that can optimize their manufacturing efficiency) will target the mainstream market not interested in portability.
All games will continue to target PS5 specs for years to come, having something like the Switch 2 being a new product in that kind of performance ballpark is only going to validate the strategy even more for third party publishers.

Excellent post.

You're 100% correct that "traditional" generations are done for. In 2026, there are still games releasing and being actively supported on the PS4 — a 2013 machine. To put that in context, the Ouya came out that year, the GTX 780Ti was the shit on PC, and the iPhone 5S was the flagship phone from Apple.

I have no clue what the PS6Lite/PS6Handheld will cost, but my suspicion is Sony saw the success around the Switch, saw the (positive) response to the Portal, and they saw the reality of people (finally) seeing diminishing returns on console; all of which, for better or for worse, radically change the idea of console generations. I don't think they go forward with a portable that they can't price competitively. My expectation is Sony will be willing to take a reputation hit on the console pricing in order to make the handheld reasonably affordable. As crazy as it sounds, an $800 PS6 with a $500 PS6 handheld could be a reality.

 

[Salty Pickle]

The handheld is slower than the PS5...

But they are not aiming for the same settings as for the PS5, right? Base resolution etc and won't be targeting 4k output.

 

[Salty Pickle]

So going by this logic, 540p will and should be the native resolution of most games on this PSHH. And even some going as low as 480p and then his PSSR3 to push it up to 1080p. That sounds good. But if this is the case, I'm assuming Sony absolutely knows that can't add a dock to this device. Meaning they'll save money relative to the Switch2 and dedicate that cost to a better CPU and GPU (when compared to what the Switch 2 has).

There's no way Sony will want to create a Handheld PS Profile and a Docked-Handheld PS Profile. Along with a PS5 and PS5 Profile. And a PS6 Profile. And a PS6s profile (GOD PLEASE LIKE THIS BE NONEXISTENT!)

IMO a "PS6s-profile" would be the same as handheld in docked mode because I believe if ever a PS6s comes around it would use the exact same hardware as the handheld (minus screen etc). Would probably fit in an Apple-tv kind of form factor.

 

[mckmas8808]

Excellent post.

You're 100% correct that "traditional" generations are done for. In 2026, there are still games releasing and being actively supported on the PS4 — a 2013 machine. To put that in context, the Ouya came out that year, the GTX 780Ti was the shit on PC, and the iPhone 5S was the flagship phone from Apple.

I have no clue what the PS6Lite/PS6Handheld will cost, but my suspicion is Sony saw the success around the Switch, saw the (positive) response to the Portal, and they saw the reality of people (finally) seeing diminishing returns on console; all of which, for better or for worse, radically change the idea of console generations. I don't think they go forward with a portable that they can't price competitively. My expectation is Sony will be willing to take a reputation hit on the console pricing in order to make the handheld reasonably affordable. As crazy as it sounds, an $800 PS6 with a $500 PS6 handheld could be a reality.

Get that price to $700 for the PS6 (with Sony losing $75 per console sold) and Sony will be swimming in cash and profits for another 5 years next-Gen.

Especially if they can sell that PS handheld for $500!

 

[mckmas8808]

IMO a "PS6s-profile" would be the same as handheld in docked mode because I believe if ever a PS6s comes around it would use the exact same hardware as the handheld (minus screen etc). Would probably fit in an Apple-tv kind of form factor.

The problem with that is people would have a different level of expectation since it is connected into a 4KTV. The handheld would be designed to run games at a native resolution of 480p to 540p and then with pssr3 upscale the image to a 1080p 8-inch screen.

A PS6S would look horrible on a 4k screen. Even if they bumped the native resolution to 720p.

 

[Physiognomonics]

Aren't people expecting this to launch next year, and studios are just only being briefed on it?

Enough to motivate them making a low power mode patch. That thing isn't getting any exclusive games.

 

[ergem]

They need something conceived from the beginning in a smart way and with conservative enough specs to hit mainstream market at 499$ top, if they want to reach that market.

They need to cut down the GDDR7 RAM to 20GB and the SSD to 500GB and they can get to that $499. This would be infinitely better than a Canis-based console (canis apu can exist as a handheld, I have no qualms about that). In a world where Canis handheld and PS5 exist, a 20GB RAM PS6 will not hold back anything.

One of the reasons PS5 and PS5 Pro are expensive is because of that 1GB and 2GB SSDs. Orion-based PS6 should have a 500GB version and a 1TB version at different price points.

This allows Sony to not delay PS6 and still offer a relatively cheap PS6. PS6 Pro can come later, say 2030, with more powerful APU and 30GB RAM. This move fulfills others wants to delay PS6 for a more powerful machine. Win-win

 

[saintjules]

They said F the handheld and decided on this instead /s

 

[Esppiral]

So how is this going to work for physical games? Do you buy a physical PS6 game and also receive a code for the PS6 handheld? Or do you have to buy the same game twice?

Do you really need an answer?

 

[mckmas8808]

Do you really need an answer?

Yeah......it's pretty obvious this will be a digital only device.

 

[vivftp]

So how is this going to work for physical games? Do you buy a physical PS6 game and also receive a code for the PS6 handheld? Or do you have to buy the same game twice?

Extremely easy. Design the PS6 Portable so it has a dock that can output to a TV, much like a Switch. Design the dock so it can accept the optional detachable disc drive that also goes on the PS6 itself. Now owners of the Portable can choose to get the disc drive so they can play their physical games when the Portable is connected to the dock. When the PS6 Portable is used away from the dock, it's digital and streaming only.