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[PhoenixDark]

Like I have said in countless other threads. Videogamers are very loyal consumers .. it takes 1 or 2 generations of screwups to lose your fanbase. Both of Sony's generations have been fantastic, no way they will lose half their fanbase over a few hundred dollars.

It's all about the brand.

Like Nintendo? *whoosh*

Brand loyalty is overrated, especially with $400 and $600 systems. If the consumer doesn't see enough difference between both systems to warrant a $100-200 price, they'll either move on to the cheaper system or wait for their desired system to drop in price. People are still buying the PS2 to this day; in other words, people are cheap

 

[VALIS]

*snort*

Analyst report that doesn't have Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a drunken retard! How do these people have jobs??!1 His mother should die in a plane crash! I've never been so offended in my 15 years on this planet!!"

Analyst report that has Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a mighty fine and well-balanced bit of research and forecasting. It's like God spoke directly through him. Modern science needs to clone this man's DNA and produce a race of super-smart people."

 

[PhoenixDark]

*snort*

Analyst report that doesn't have Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a drunken retard! How do these people have jobs??!1 His mother should die in a plane crash! I've never been so offended in my 15 years on this planet!!"

Analyst report that has Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a mighty fine and well-balanced bit of research and forecasting. It's like God spoke directly through him. Modern science needs to clone this man's DNA and produce a race of super-smart people."

I think you're suggesting GAF is biased towards Sony. Anyone else getting that idea?

 

[Safe Bet]

I'll tell you why Sony won't win the next -gen race: India, South Africa, Russia, Brazil, Mexico...

MS's strategy is targeted towards making those areas more important than the Obvious 3. If it works, well, India has more people than the US, Japan, and Europe combined. There's a lot of other countries that receive less than their fair share of attention but are starting to drastically increase their consumer spending. And MS is taking the time to market to them directly.

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer a $500 home computer that plays video games over a $400 machine that does nothing but play video games...

But hell, that's just me speculating...

 

[PhoenixDark]

Seems to me people in the third-world would perfer a $500 home computer that plays video games over a $400 machine that does nothing but play video games...

But hell, I'm just specualting...

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer $500 worth of, oh I don't know, FOOD than any videogames system.

 

[Safe Bet]

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer $500 worth of, oh I don't know, FOOD than any videogames system.

I am now shaking my fist at you...

 

[AniHawk]

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer $500 worth of, oh I don't know, FOOD than any videogames system.

But the PS3 can also make toast.

 

[ethelred]

*snort*

Analyst report that doesn't have Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a drunken retard! How do these people have jobs??!1 His mother should die in a plane crash! I've never been so offended in my 15 years on this planet!!"

Analyst report that has Sony on top; the GAF reaction: "What a mighty fine and well-balanced bit of research and forecasting. It's like God spoke directly through him. Modern science needs to clone this man's DNA and produce a race of super-smart people."

Still miffed about that Steve Kent thing, eh?

But the PS3 can also make toast.

The 360 can cook eggs.

Eggs > toast.

MICROSOFT AM WIN GHANA TOTAL

 

[MobiusPigeon]

Like Nintendo? *whoosh*

Brand loyalty is overrated, especially with $400 and $600 systems. If the consumer doesn't see enough difference between both systems to warrant a $100-200 price, they'll either move on to the cheaper system or wait for their desired system to drop in price. People are still buying the PS2 to this day; in other words, people are cheap

qft. i think it's funny that people argue brand and price when psp is doing miserable compared to nintendo. if it were name, this would be a 3 way race between nintendo, sega and atari and if price didn't matter the 3do would have killed everything because it had street fighter. the perfect blend of 3rd party support, 1st party goods, price and marketing/consumer want are the perfect storm for domination imo. miss any one of those and the door is open for your cookies to be snatched. customer care counts too and you'll notice someone has stopped being so arrogant lately.

 

[mood]

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer a $500 home computer that plays video games over a $400 machine that does nothing but play video games...

But hell, that's just me speculating...

Well, there are people in those countries with disposable income as well. Its just a matter of being able to break into those target markets.

 

[PhoenixDark]

But the PS3 can also make toast.

You can even design the cinnamon swirls on the bread with the Sixxaxis controller

 

[Safe Bet]

qft. i think it's funny that people argue brand and price when psp is doing miserable compared to nintendo. if it were name, this would be a 3 way race between nintendo, sega and atari and if price didn't matter the 3do would have killed everything because it had street fighter. the perfect blend of 3rd party support, 1st party goods, price and marketing/consumer want are the perfect storm for domination imo. miss any one of those and the door is open for your cookies to be snatched. customer care counts too and you'll notice someone has stopped being so arrogant lately.

The Wall of Words

 

[Bad_Boy]

:lol

 

[PhoenixDark]

qft. i think it's funny that people argue brand and price when psp is doing miserable compared to nintendo. if it were name, this would be a 3 way race between nintendo, sega and atari and if price didn't matter the 3do would have killed everything because it had street fighter. the perfect blend of 3rd party support, 1st party goods, price and marketing/consumer want are the perfect storm for domination imo. miss any one of those and the door is open for your cookies to be snatched. customer care counts too and you'll notice someone has stopped being so arrogant lately.

Why did you quote my post? WHY

 

[VALIS]

I never realized India, South Africa, Russia, Mexico and Brazil were third world countries. *slaps forehead*

Still miffed about that Steve Kent thing, eh?

Yes.

 

[Safe Bet]

I never realized India, South Africa, Russia, Mexico and Brazil were third world countries. *slaps forehead*

The old habits die hard..

My bad...

 

[Juice]

So they'll win because Japanese consumers will buy a Wii instead of a PS3? Brilliant.

I thought the same thing.

 

[quetz67]

I thought the same thing.

How about reading guys, he neither said Sony will win the japanese market, nor that all customers will buy a Wii.

He is well informed, so he gives them both an (equal) chance...but I know that doesnt compute with GAF, as GAF only knows black or white.

 

[boutrosinit]

Ha! That dude totally ripped off an article I read last week! On this forum no less!

 

[_Alkaline_]

I think you're suggesting GAF is biased towards Sony. Anyone else getting that idea?

A bit, I guess. Sony threads always seem to have about 10 more pages.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

When the PS2, a six-year-old console, outsells your next-gen hardware month after month--which has been the case in recent months--something is not right.[/URL]

Honestly I think they could have gotten more out of this statement if they brought up the DS, a repackaged version of ten year old hardware.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

Dooble Pzot.

 

[cedric69]

I still expect PS3 to win the console war once again - but I do think that the marketshare will be considerably tighter than last generation.

Which will mean winning the battle and losing the war, is anybody concurring on this?

Leaving Nintendo aside (they print money, we know ), if Microsoft gets 45% of the next generation hardware... how do you think they will be positioned for the next next-generation? In my opinion they will be positioned well enough for the "game people" to convince the board to give them a whole lot of money to win the war with the next battle.

 

[travisbickle]

$129.99 vs $299/$399

hmmmmm

It's about aspirations. This is what Sony is relying on, and what Microsoft should get through to the customer. They should be telling the customer not to buy the 6 year old cheap subpar console and save up to buy the new HD uber graphics it'll-last-for-the-next-6 years 360.

I reckon Microsoft should have increased the price of the 360 and offered free online, customers aren't dumb, I think they would have been more willing to pay a higher premium if they didn't have to pay a yearly fee, they know the costs.

It's too late now, and they'll probably have to suck up more losses by offering free online play.

 

[linsivvi]

I'll tell you why Sony won't win the next -gen race: India, South Africa, Russia, Brazil, Mexico...

MS's strategy is targeted towards making those areas more important than the Obvious 3. If it works, well, India has more people than the US, Japan, and Europe combined. There's a lot of other countries that receive less than their fair share of attention but are starting to drastically increase their consumer spending. And MS is taking the time to market to them directly.

LOL. I suggest you try to learn more about the world. If population is the only thing that counted, that any country outside Asia is irrelevant.

 

[quetz67]

LOL. I suggest you try to learn more about the world. If population is the only thing that counted, that any country outside Asia is irrelevant.

yeah thats really funny how some people think (not!).

but at least india might become the second biggest market for pirated games

 

[Settra]

1 reason PS3 will "win": It will sell the most units.

I should write for BW!

 

[Kolgar]

He's wrong on the first two points.

1) Brand. Sure, PlayStation is the strongest brand in the industry. But "PlayStation" in consumers' minds means a game console they can actually afford. PS3 isn't going to be affordable anytime soon due to Blu-Ray, a technology people with SDTVs (i.e., most of them) won't benefit from. How much tech does Joe Sixpack actually want?

As we've seen, FOUR hundred dollars is too much for a games console. It's certainly the upper limit. After the holiday honeymoon, I think Sony's going to find that demand tapers off for its system pretty fast.

2) Microsoft squandered its lead. Did it? They've ramped up production so supply problems are history. They've amassed a solid software library that's about to get goosed by Gears of Awe. Devs are familiar with the system. And there's a pretty good installed base. Not to mention, Sony's unlikely to catch up A SINGLE CONSOLE this holiday season due to their own supply constraints. And Microsoft's in control of the price-drop situation this gen.

At the end of the day, it's price that's Sony's big problem. It may not kill them and it may not prevent them from winning, but it'll do some damage and we'll just have to see how much.

In the meantime, thanks to that price and the terrible shipment numbers they're likely to see this year, Sony's left a few doors of its own open for Microsoft and Nintendo to just stroll on in.

 

[ORANGUTAN]

Wow, I expected this article to be mainstream fluff but this guy knows what's up. Totally agree on the Microsoft section... they blew it. 2.7 million in the U.S. is pitiful. Selling less than Xbox and a 6-year old PS2 is laughable. They needed the "best looking next-gen game ever" a.k.a. Gears of War, several months ago. All we've had so far are PC and current-gen ports with a sprinkling of Dead Rising and Saint's Row. Pathetic...

 

[SovanJedi]

The machine is supposed to be snapped up by the hardcore fanbase (along with the Sony loyalists, of course, which I'm putting aside for my case in point), but there's been so much negativity from the company (everything from crazy PR statements, lackluster gaming presentations - including THAT E3 showing - and putting the fear of dread in import shops after the Lik-Sang incident) I don't know how they believe that demographic is "in the bag", as it were.

I don't expect people to agree with me on this point entirely since some of these individual points are a non-issue for individuals. However it's not exactly building up a helpful image for the machine in the hardcore ground as a whole, is it?

 

[mrklaw]

When the PS2, a six-year-old console, outsells your next-gen hardware month after month--which has been the case in recent months--something is not right

well, he nearly got to the end of the 2nd paragraph before I started to pay less attention to his points.

And then later on he spouts bluray storage which IMO is just him stretching for '5 reasons'.

TBH the first two are the big ones, and I mostly agree with them

Playstation brand is MASSIVE. People will wait for PS3 even if they don't know why - they had a good time with PS1 and 2 so will wait for 3.

And i can't help thinking MS wasted the year they had.

 

[mrklaw]

qft. i think it's funny that people argue brand and price when psp is doing miserable compared to nintendo. if it were name, this would be a 3 way race between nintendo, sega and atari and if price didn't matter the 3do would have killed everything because it had street fighter. the perfect blend of 3rd party support, 1st party goods, price and marketing/consumer want are the perfect storm for domination imo. miss any one of those and the door is open for your cookies to be snatched. customer care counts too and you'll notice someone has stopped being so arrogant lately.

what?

IMO brand is *underated*. Your use of PSP Vs DS means nothing. Brand is relevant in particular spheres. So Playstation brand is massive in home consoles. Doesn't automatically mean that'll translate into the handheld space where the gameboy/Nintendo brand is equally massive. But likewise that doesn't diminish the power of the brand in its main area - Home consoles.

 

[StRaNgE]

why then did the xbox not smoke everything if having an edge in graphics is really such a big deal?

a noticeable difference between the visuals of the PS3 and the Xbox 360,

 

[Wollan]

why then did the xbox not smoke everything if having an edge in graphics is really such a big deal?

It's a + . Not a sole 'win' point. Don't you think the fact that the Xbox was the stronger console helped it sell?

 

[Pureauthor]

what?

IMO brand is *underated*. Your use of PSP Vs DS means nothing. Brand is relevant in particular spheres. So Playstation brand is massive in home consoles. Doesn't automatically mean that'll translate into the handheld space where the gameboy/Nintendo brand is equally massive. But likewise that doesn't diminish the power of the brand in its main area - Home consoles.

Brand has been shown (time and time again) to not be a deciding factor in system wars. It may play a part, but it can only go so far.

And I am sick and tired of GAF revisionist history that acts like the PSP was some dark horse that came out of nowhere to steal Nintendo's handheld marketshare.

 

[Kolgar]

Wow, I expected this article to be mainstream fluff but this guy knows what's up. Totally agree on the Microsoft section... they blew it. 2.7 million in the U.S. is pitiful. Selling less than Xbox and a 6-year old PS2 is laughable. They needed the "best looking next-gen game ever" a.k.a. Gears of War, several months ago. All we've had so far are PC and current-gen ports with a sprinkling of Dead Rising and Saint's Row. Pathetic...

The software situation's merely a symptom of being first mover. As first next-gen console to market, it caused a shift. Devs had to learn the tech while still being preoccupied with last-gen, where all the money was.

Now that everyone's arriving to the party, things should and will improve. Look at the third-party situation. MS seems to be getting more and better support than they did with Xbox. That's a good sign.

 

[Zaptruder]

If Sony are able to win with the PS3, it'll be because they've managed to successfully place and market it as an aspirational product (think ipod/BMWs), while at the same time, Nintendo will have been unable to capitalize on it's early hype... either because 3rd party developers just don't get it... or because the Wii while different, isn't the be all and end all that we all thought it would be.

Even if Wii does manage to win... I think it'll do so without taking much from the Playstation 3; the two products are sufficiently different, where the latter will still have its primary appeal in those that enjoy traditional style gaming, as well as those that like premium electronics, the Wii will take hold as the 'everybody loves gaming' style machine.

And the people in this thread thinking Xbox 360 has a chance of doing really well this gen... are likely myopic americans that can't understand the situation for the X360 outside of America.

 

[Angelcurio]

Seems to me people in the third-world would prefer $500 worth of, oh I don't know, FOOD than any videogames system.

A user from the third world says you are wrong

 

[jett]

Well duh.

 

[travisbickle]

why then did the xbox not smoke everything if having an edge in graphics is really such a big deal?

The difference never really extended beyond xbox games looking nicer than PS2 games, not enough to make a difference when PS2 had arguebly the better library.


Now because the machines are so powerful a difference between them could mean a lot, say PS2 is the base for power

PS2 = 1 and xbox is twice as powerful xbox = 2

So xbox 360 is 10 x as powerful as xbox, so xbox 360 = 20

and PS3 has a third more power then xbox 360, so PS3 = 26.5 approx

So you can do more difference with the extra power of 6.5 PS2s, difference between 360 and PS3, then you can with one, difference between PS2 and Xbox, even though there's no way near as much difference in power then the previous gen, twice against a third.

 

[DSN2K]

I expect Sony to Win eventually by the numbers(Margin is the real question) and I really don't care about that, what I'm more interested in is how much ground Microsoft and Nintendo can make up on Sony over the next 5 years.

 

[mrklaw]

The difference never really extended beyond xbox games looking nicer than PS2 games, not enough to make a difference when PS2 had arguebly the better library.


Now because the machines are so powerful a difference between them could mean a lot, say PS2 is the base for power

PS2 = 1 and xbox is twice as powerful xbox = 2

So xbox 360 is 10 x as powerful as xbox, so xbox 360 = 20

and PS3 has a third more power then xbox 360, so PS3 = 26.5 approx

So you can do more difference with the extra power of 6.5 PS2s, difference between 360 and PS3, then you can with one, difference between PS2 and Xbox, even though there's no way near as much difference in power then the previous gen, twice against a third.

you don't even need to get that complicated.

Xbox was better looking than PS2, but PS2 had the marketshare.

This time, PS3 is likely to have the marketshare *and* the looks. The potential is frightening. Luckily Sony is doing their bit to keep things interesting with joke pricing

 

[Dr_Cogent]

The Brand

Go up to any random person on the street and ask them to name a video game system. Odds are that the vast majority of the time the individual will respond with "PlayStation" or "PlayStation 2." In the late '80s and early '90s Nintendo was king, but on today's market there is no brand more synonymous with the world of video games than PlayStation. It's true that Microsoft has made great strides in this area with the Xbox and now Xbox 360, but on a pure mindshare basis Xbox still can't compare.

So in the late '80s and early '90s people would have said "Nintendo". Then later it became "Playstation". So what makes them think Brand means anything? Brand only gets you so far, and then its the features, price and software library that matter most.

Everyone can speculate, no one really knows shit.

 

[gutter_trash]

console life, years of support and lastibility are on the PS3's side, they even stated that they want a long PS3 lifespane so you are guaranteed console support, their track record is pretty good to trust from the PS1, and PS2's life cycles.

600 dollars may be alot, but you if divide that price by the amount of continuous software support years...... it's actually pretty cheap

 

[open_mouth_]

Good article overall, but a few things I don't agree with:

Sony's going to offer completely free online and the online play will be as good and seemless as XBL

A few years from now the PS3 won't be $499/$599 like it is today. It'll be $249/$299 someday, but what the author is forgetting is that the 360 will be at a mass market $149/$179 by that time with cheaper and more plentiful games The 360 is going to be the PS2 of this generation more than the PS3 will be. Book it.

 

[Zweisy1]

I'd expect Sony to sell most consoles in the long run.. Just maybe by not quite as much as PS2 did in comparison to its competitors. I hope I'll be proven wrong though cause I'd much rather see Nintendo or Microsoft come out on top.

Anyway, IBM is the true winner of this console war.

 

[ORANGUTAN]

The difference never really extended beyond xbox games looking nicer than PS2 games, not enough to make a difference when PS2 had arguebly the better library.


Now because the machines are so powerful a difference between them could mean a lot, say PS2 is the base for power

PS2 = 1 and xbox is twice as powerful xbox = 2

So xbox 360 is 10 x as powerful as xbox, so xbox 360 = 20

and PS3 has a third more power then xbox 360, so PS3 = 26.5 approx

So you can do more difference with the extra power of 6.5 PS2s, difference between 360 and PS3, then you can with one, difference between PS2 and Xbox, even though there's no way near as much difference in power then the previous gen, twice against a third.

:lol Are you serious with that BS? Best looking game of next-gen, including all future games we've seen on 360 OR PS3. Check the new vids.

 

[travisbickle]

you don't even need to get that complicated.

I was trying to explain that a PS3 that has a third more power than a 360, can make more of a difference then an xbox which was twice as powerful as a PS2.

 

[plagiarize]

Sony will win because Microsoft will continue to misstep and Nintendo will continue to be Nintendo.

just a check... are you presuming that Sony will stop misstepping (shortages, delays, anti consumer attitude in Europe et al) then?

 

[bumpkin]

The Brand
Good call... Except my response is the open-pricing, aka consumer ass-raping. Not to mention the absolutely morbid launch quanitites for Japan.

Microsoft Squandered its Lead
This may be true, but the winds of change are starting to blow. Remember the Blue Dragon pre-orders selling out?

Japan is Ripe for the taking
Yeah, for the Nintendo Wii. Just look at the DS... PSP is technically a better machine, and it's still being outsold. And I see the 360 starting to get some legs with Blue Dragon and other titles with that all-important eastern appeal.

Blu-ray will matter
No, it won't. UMD was nearly a complete failure, as was Mini-Disc (another proprietary Sony format). Those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.

Free Online
How many users has XBL passed now, something like 5 million? People who want to play games online don't care about a fee if the service is worthwhile.

Final Thoughts
Shut the **** up and go away, Brightman.