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Can we all agree that Tetsuya Nomura is terrible at Storytelling but great at Cinematic Gameplay?

KàIRóS

Member
I think we can all agree that Nomura has a talent to overcomplicate things when it comes to narrative, the man clearly loves to add and add unecessary bits of lore, KH right now has a mess of a plot and this weird tendecy of his also showed on FFVIIR, I still cringe thinking about those whisperers or whatever those phantoms were called.

BUT let's also give the man credit where it's due, the gameplay on his games in general is crafted in such a way that combat feels so cinematic, particularly during boss battles, that is something that I really, really liked in the remake, in OG FFVII the Airbuster was easily one of the most forgettable bosses in the game, just some random big robot, in the remake there's even buildup before the fight and the fight itself is epic AF and this happens throughout the whole game with every boss, on paper it's nothing out of the ordinary or even something that hasn't been done before, it's basically just adding different phases to bosses but the sheer amount of spectale through every phase from transitions to party banter to new objectives added in order to beat that boss, even just the camera work, immersive, fun and cinematic all at the sametime.

And even if we go back to KH it's clear that this cinematic gameplay has been something that Nomura has always prioritized in his games, just think about the crazy amount of animations the animators had to do for Sora in KH2 for the "Reaction Command" mechanic, just in order to use that one time against that one boss so that the battle could feel more epic.


 

Doom85

Member
QTE.. And the master of those is Quantic Dream.

Season 2 Reaction GIF by Parks and Recreation


Sure, I guess they can be considered good at that. Dunno about master though.

Certainly not master at storytelling though. I’d rather read a full 1,000 page novel by Nomura than a 25 page short story by David “EMOTIONS” Cage. I don’t have the hate boner for Nomura’s writing like some do here, though I admit he doesn’t write great scripts or anything, but David Cage SUCKS at writing. He can sometimes make a good premise, and then proceeds to lower his pants and shit all over said premise and then give it the middle finger for good measure.
 
Season 2 Reaction GIF by Parks and Recreation


Sure, I guess they can be considered good at that. Dunno about master though.

Certainly not master at storytelling though. I’d rather read a full 1,000 page novel by Nomura than a 25 page short story by David “EMOTIONS” Cage. I don’t have the hate boner for Nomura’s writing like some do here, though I admit he doesn’t write great scripts or anything, but David Cage SUCKS at writing. He can sometimes make a good premise, and then proceeds to lower his pants and shit all over said premise and then give it the middle finger for good measure.
Cage = Nomura
 

Doom85

Member
Cage = Nomura

There isn‘t enough cocaine in the world that Nomura could snort for him to conjure up as nonsensical a turn as Fahrenheit’s third act. Or as bullshit a reveal as to who the killer is in Heavy Rain. Also, Nomura doesn’t shoehorn an attempted rape scene(s) on each of his primary female characters, nor is there any zombie sex. So no, there is no equality here.
 

TransTrender

Gold Member
I dunno man.
The story telling in FFVII:R is a goddamn masterpiece compared to even the first KH game, so I'm extremely optimistic going forward from here. Also I think pretty much everything else in FFVII:R is extraordinarily well done and single handedly restored my faith in SQE
 
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fallingdove

Member
Nope. Terrible at both story telling and cinematic gameplay.

Nomura is a good to great artist. As a visual designer he has done some really solid things. But he struggles with everything else he attempts. He can’t seem to connect visual language with mechanics or story (or anything else for that matter).

SquareEnix made a huge mistake giving Nomura the keys to the kingdom. I really hope that Square ends up being purchased by Sony. Some strong management is exactly what SE needs to return to their former greatness.
 
Can we all agree that this kind of "can we all..." Thread titles are just SHIT. It's like you come here with already your mind set on the answer and want to push everyone on that direction to just confirm your opinion instead of making a thread and see what is everyone believing.
 
Yeah I question the guy's direction and decision making.

Character design, mood and theme, he seems to nail it most of the time. But Nomura's storywriting ability appears to be atrocious, if he really is the source of all this bad writing.

I notice you dont always see it coming though. At first the story in one of his projects might show promise or seem like good, but then as it unfolds you see how it falls apart due to poor decision making/handling. The ideas are sometimes ok, but often times the way they're executed is either cringey or just not done well. For example:

KH1
mostly a great game. i wonder where they'll take it next

COM
shits getting weirder

KH2
Game's still fun but plot is really starting to not make any sense

spin offs/prequels and shit
Im even more confused now

KH3
What even the fuck is this shit. Both the gameplay AND the story are trash.

Specifically for KH I bet there's probably some influence from Disney in there somewhere fucking the writing up somehow someway.

On a side note I always felt like if KH was a bit more mature/darker than it often is it would do it well. You see glimpses of it being darker now and again in the series (the first game does it for me mainly) but I dont think they could ever go deeper into that side of things because Disney wouldnt let them.

Another side note, I am interested to see how Nomura incorporates elements from the original cancelled Versus 13 into KH4 tho. It's a shame the original game never materialized properly, it looked far more interesting than what the fuck FF15 ended up being.
 

TheInfamousKira

Reseterror Resettler
Nomura is a plague.... Of biblical proportions.



I'll never get picking characters and dialogue intended to be and acknowledged in universe to be trite and annoying and using it as evidence of bad writing. You can nail Nomura with a lot, but if you found a character meant to be annoying annoying, then that's a well written character.
 

Nankatsu

Gold Member
FFVIIR gameplay is top-tier for me, best of the best when it comes to action-rpg. Every single boss battle is goddamn amazing, and gameplay really shines if you play the game on the hardest difficult.

So I'll give kudos to Nomura on that regard.

As far as his narratives go, well...

If You Say So Reaction GIF by Identity
 
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NeoIkaruGAF

Gold Member
To think that the guy who designed the characters for FF7 and Parasite Eve is the same who went on to design the ridiculous cast of FFX and everything that came after, never fails to amaze me. And make me very sad.
Nomura’s designs are the single reason why I was uncomfortable with FFX as soon as the game started. That feeling never really went away. While Disney (and maybe somebody else) clearly restrained Nomura in the first Kingdom Hearts, what happened next couldn’t be more cringey if you tried and were paid millions for it.
And yeah, I too fell for those flashy QTEs in KH2 the first time. When I tried replaying the game, though, there’s so much nonsense to get through for the few good parts.

The guy has style. Shame that his pathological passion for belts, zippers and asymmetry often gets in the way. He can make very cool stuff. But he doesn’t know when to stop.
 

Punished Miku

Gold Member
The guy has a vision, I'll give him that. He writes stories like a 14 year old that's really into comic books and wants to write the coolest thing he can think of. In a way, I honestly find that charming. He apparently came up with the story and concept behind Stranger in Paradise, and it feels like the kind of thing a 14 year old would try to come up with that was cool. In the end, I actually ended up loving the story lol.

Whatever he tried to do on Kingdom Hearts is a complete failure though. Maybe it was too difficult to try and think of a story involving Disney characters and multiple IP and whatever the hell is going on, but it sucks.

He's hit and miss. Has many hits, and many misses. I still find myself interested in a lot of what he does.
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
The npcs in FF6 had better dialog and cut scenes than anything this guy has done.

plus he gets way too much credit for ff7. That game was written and overseen by the people who made the previous games great.
 
No we can’t all agree especially when Nomura was not the one who came up with the idea to change VII’s plot with remake.

I love VIIR but it’s also very indicative of just another Business Division 1 game. It’s very much like a spiritual sequel to X and XIII in a lot of ways.

Not sure what to make of his work on KH. It’s a series that ultimately belongs to Disney and is heavy on restrictions and I hate everything about it outside of the gameplay.

Basically my point is that this thread is dumb
 

Punished Miku

Gold Member
It’s very much like a spiritual sequel to X and XIII in a lot of ways.
Exactly. Shame my favorite FF team is being wasted on a remake. We could have had another large budget Final Fantasy with original characters and a new world.

I think Toriyama does a lot on VIIR and they try to not publicize it since people are so irrationally angry at him, despite him being one of the most solid directors at SQEX. I don't know what Nomura is in charge of exactly.
 

wvnative

Member
I dunno man.
The story telling in FFVII:R is a goddamn masterpiece compared to even the first KH game, so I'm extremely optimistic going forward from here. Also I think pretty much everything else in FFVII:R is extraordinarily well done and single handedly restored my faith in SQE
14 is also a masterpiece. And gameplay in KH3 is amazing after patch 1.07.

But your right playing through 7 R for the first time was a transcendent experience that I hadn't had since FFX, it reminded me of when games were such a magical experience and why i love them, as well as reminded me why square enix is so dear to me when they get their heads out of their asses.

I can't wait till next year! Keep it coming SE!
 

Fuz

Member
Can we all agree that this kind of "can we all..." Thread titles are just SHIT. It's like you come here with already your mind set on the answer and want to push everyone on that direction to just confirm your opinion instead of making a thread and see what is everyone believing.
Come on, it's just a figure of speech.
 
I find Nomura doesn’t get quite enough credit for certain design contributions. He’s particularly underpraised for his boss encounters, which at their peak rival the best in the business.

But it’s hard to give him credit when his narrative compulsion is so terribly conceived and drafted.
 

Northeastmonk

Gold Member

The Toy Store in Kingdom Hearts 3 was a lot of fun. It looked great and it was fun to explore. I think they do a great job except the dialogue drags on and on. They’ve got the talent, but it’s like someone should have put their hand on his shoulder and said, “good, that’s enough”.
 
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