Support NeoGAF

[StreetsofBeige]

I’m probably younger than you, or not much older.

I push for things that don’t affect me in many places in life - because it’s the BEST possible scenario regardless of my personal view.

It isn’t that hard. It’s narrow minded AF to feel a different way.

Convenience is cute and all, but look at what the west has sacrificed in the name of it.

Problem: “We can’t expand police budget and hire more cops! That’s inconvenient!”

Solution: “more cameras, more tickets, and many times - more accidents! BIG BROTHER KNOWS BEST!”

Problem: “we can’t just wait 10 minutes to text someone back!”

Solution: self driving cars with technology to DRIVE ITSELF AWAY FROM THE OWNER IF THEY DEEM IT NECESSARY

Problem: I can’t get up and swap a disc for ~10 second and 5 whole steps

Solution: “you own nothing, your games cost more and are of a lesser quality and… LOL NO SALES BECUZ NO COMPETITION!”


It’s stupid. Competition = best possible outcome. You should care, unless your parents are giving you an allowance still to not. Anti consumer is NEVER good. Period, period, period. The way tech fans deep throat the companies cuz “muh entertainment” is next level disgusting.

I think at the end of the day, a lot of entertainment products (games, movies, songs etc...) that are digitally distributed have these kinds of limitations (limited physical copies sold, might be revoked, online servers shut down, it's a digital download only etc....) because it's more convenient and people dont really care since by the time any crash and burn scenario comes around as they are already done with it and dont care.

On the other hand, if someone bought a microwave and the box said after 5 years the manufacturer has the right to activate a self termination feature to shut it down for good and you have to buy another, all consumers would avoid any kind of kitchen appliance like that like the plague. They want it fully working until it breaks wear and tear style because they know they might be using it daily for a decade.

As I said above, the best way for gamers to make a stand is make a stand right away and dont give in. But they always do. Everyone laughed at Obivion horse armour. But look at mtx now. it's a billion times worse (literally). For every $5 set of digital horse plate mail they sold 15 years ago, the industry has probably sold $1B worth of mtx in modern day. Horse armour was just a test and laughed at for being the first dopey attempt every gamer noticed. Gamers could had made a stand and not buy any of that stuff, but they didn't. It's the biggest money maker now where mtx revenue is more than the sales from selling the games themselves.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

And yet in PC land, people complain about EGS because they can't be arsed to have a second launcher.

It's a convenience world.

No different than people ordering Uber Eats or Skip the dishes. Do the math with jack up prices, delivery charges, tipping etc.... and that food order is probably at least 50% more than if someone got off their ass and bought it themselves. A take out joint near me has raised prices last few years and has settled at $9.50 for a combo. It used to be $7.50-8.00. Skip the Dishes is $14. Add in all the extra fees and tipping and it's $20 easy.

I'll just grab it for $9.50 next time I'm at that strip mall doing grocery shopping and kill two birds with one stone. But some people would rather sit home and order it online at stupid costs.

 

[skyfall]

Too many new games pushing the medium forward

 

[Krathoon]

Digital PC games totally killed the PC game section at Walmart. You used to have these nice boxes to look at.

 

[Krathoon]

I really don't like DRM on PC games. It is like you don't really own the game. Annoys the hell out of me.

 

[HoofHearted]

I really don't like DRM on PC games. It is like you don't really own the game. Annoys the hell out of me.

Read your EULAs - That’s because you don’t actually own the game… you own a license to use / play a copy of the game..

That license could be revoked.

This is also why this thread is also rather pointless…

 

[sendit]

Read your EULAs - That’s because you don’t actually own the game… you own a license to use / play a copy of the game..

That license could be revoked.

This is also why this thread is also rather pointless…

A physical medium gives people a facade of actually owning something when they don't.

 

[HoofHearted]

A physical medium gives people a facade of actually owning something when they don't.

Oh I get it… I just always find it interesting that we still have these types of discussions regarding distribution options in this day and age…

 

[Sleepwalker]

Read your EULAs - That’s because you don’t actually own the game… you own a license to use / play a copy of the game..

That license could be revoked.

This is also why this thread is also rather pointless…

Its easy to revoke access to a digital key but they cant enforce it against a physical key.

They could ban your account or console but nothing stops you from getting access to the same game using the same disc key on a different account or console altogether. So while you may technically not own it, in practice there's no reliable way for them to revoke it.

 

[Krathoon]

Well, that is what I mean. You don't own a copy of the game. You just have the right to play it.

It is just that, with digital media, it is way too easy for them to revoke your license.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Its easy to revoke access to a digital key but they cant enforce it against a physical key.

They could ban your account or console but nothing stops you from getting access to the same game using the same disc key on a different account or console altogether. So while you may technically not own it, in practice there's no reliable way for them to revoke it.

For SP modes yes I think you're right. There's only so much they can do to totally limit access.

But for MP mode all they have to do shut down servers and regardless of what a gamer has (disc or digital), a gamer just lost half their content.

 

[HoofHearted]

Its easy to revoke access to a digital key but they cant enforce it against a physical key.

They could ban your account or console but nothing stops you from getting access to the same game using the same disc key on a different account or console altogether. So while you may technically not own it, in practice there's no reliable way for them to revoke it.

For older games that don’t require updates/patches or online activation - sure.

However, for any other game (or software application in general for that matter) - That “physical“ key you’re referring to can absolutely be locked out…. There are PLENTY of examples how companies actively do this today.

And your point is moot - you still don’t “own” the game anyway… the company can elect to stop supporting the game…

 

[Sleepwalker]

For SP modes yes I think you're right. There's only so much they can do to totally limit access.

But for MP mode all they have to do shut down servers and regardless of what a gamer has (disc or digital), a gamer just lost half their content.

Yes fair enough.

Sports games and MP games are the kind of games I only get digitally.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Yes fair enough.

Sports games and MP games are the kind of games I only get digitally.

There's one thing I will always respect in PC gaming. Even though I dont play PC MP anymore (last time I did was Unreal 20 years ago), you can find gamers/programmers clever enough to make their own custom servers to keep a game alive even if the game maker shuts it down. You dont get that in console gaming.

 

[Krathoon]

There is kind of this attitude like you should just throw away your old games. Fortunately, there are people that try to preserve them.

 

[ResetEraVetVIP]

No, but they market has already dictated where they want to go. So I guess I do speak for most people.

That doesn’t make them correct...

 

[ResetEraVetVIP]

Go try to buy old forza, NFS, Godzilla (ps4) digital or any of the many games taken down of digital stores due to licensing issues. Can still find them in the wild physically, good luck on the digital stores. Preservation of older games will be in heavy danger without physical as well.

Someone gets this simple concept.

 

[ResetEraVetVIP]

Honestly doesn't matter. Those disks don't even have the whole game anymore. Not to mention the dozen patches the game will get in the first month or two. The only way to own and back up a copy of the game is PC.

Does matter, you can do more with physical games. PERIOD.

 

[KaiserBecks]

I'm not sure how I feel about this guy getting ridiculed by probably the same people who went batshit crazy 10 years ago, when there was a real possibility that physical media was about to become obsolete. But fuck Gamestop right?

 

[Poop!]

Got Hogwarts Legacy and was met with a 30 gig download. Only works if game is playable without the internet

 

[Barakov]

Never thought I'd agree with a Gamestop CEO but here we are.

 

[Destruction-1002]

Does matter, you can do more with physical games. PERIOD.

If games were designed to stream off the disc, it would been a good thing or were a portion of the game is installed rather than the game entirely

Unfortunalely, optical disc drive hadn't gotten faster over time

PS1 CD drive transfer speed is 300KB/s
PS2 DVD drive transfer speed is 5.28MB/s
PS3 bluray drive transfer speed is 9MB/s
PS4 bluray drive transfer speed is 27MB/s

Three times more speed in 7 years, clearly that how games on PS4 install entirely on HDD

 

[sendit]

That doesn’t make them correct...

Because people have opted for what they value more doesn’t make them correct? Lol okay

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

Got Hogwarts Legacy and was met with a 30 gig download. Only works if game is playable without the internet

That's an exception and not the norm. That said, shame on WB for cheaping out (we are talking cents here, btw) by not using 100GB UHD discs which would have fit the entire required game data on it... Pisses me off when this happens as the disc basically becomes a license key. The only saving grace is that it can be played offline once that 40GB download completes.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

For older games that don’t require updates/patches or online activation - sure.

However, for any other game (or software application in general for that matter) - That “physical“ key you’re referring to can absolutely be locked out…. There are PLENTY of examples how companies actively do this today.

And your point is moot - you still don’t “own” the game anyway… the company can elect to stop supporting the game…

This is still not the whole picture. You’re looking purely at a small piece of the puzzle. So the game can only be played with a significant patch, sure - and if your account gets banned they can keep you from playing it, blah blah. You can STILL sell the game used and make money back. You can make another account, play the game again. Collectors today still collect retro games for not only use, but just collection. All of this becomes I delete with digital only.

Does matter, you can do more with physical games. PERIOD.

Yep. More options, more price competition. Period.

Got Hogwarts Legacy and was met with a 30 gig download. Only works if game is playable without the internet

See point above. You still have additional avenues to pursue with a physical copy than digital, even if game requires digital framework. This isn’t even touching on the competition causing sales up front, etc.

Because people have opted for what they value more doesn’t make them correct? Lol okay

I am a huge fan of capitalism, though it isn’t perfect - nor is any economic system.

That being said, ruling off mob mentality is a take I expect someone in high school to use.

Germany like Nazi leadership during ww2 too. Guess according to you, their market and populace was right though because #themajoritysaidso

Btw, the numbers by Entertainment Retail Association that 90% of game sales were digital to 10% physical, was made using mobile and digital only games as well. The actual number is nowhere near as large as that. Even if it *hypothetically* was, 10% of something is still a decent chunk. Though we are certainly moving towards a forced adoption of digital only by those amazingly caring mega corps like “pay me $80 a year to play online” Sony and “MTx are the future!” Microsoft, it should be fought by all gamers even those preferring digital only.

You’re literally fighting to take away your options… why?

Literally, WHY make that argument if you aren’t a corporate bootlicker? It comes with *literally* zero net positives.




Side note about that digital only future. I guess eff collectors editions and all!

 

[THE DUCK]

What's with all the "digital only" guys all over the internet always getting their panties in a twist whenever someone says something about physical games? Is choice not a good thing?

To be honest it's the "physical" people constantly diminishing in a rediculous way the huge benefits of being digital only as if they don't exist.

And then there is the whole notion that is presented thst its way more expensive, which frankly isn't true unless you sell your used games (something most die hard physical people don't do anyhow).

 

[0neAnd0nly]

To be honest it's the "physical" people constantly diminishing in a rediculous way the huge benefits of being digital only as if they don't exist.

And then there is the whole notion that is presented thst its way more expensive, which frankly isn't true unless you sell your used games (something most die hard physical people don't do anyhow).

Respectfully, what are the “HUGE” benefits?

Benefits of physical:

- Price competition between multiple retail stores worldwide

- allowing mom and pop small business to have a chance

-collectors edition,

- retail 2nd hand market

- private 2nd hand market

- you physically posses an item with actual value (even if a penny), promo items for some releases, etc.

- Game / Art preservation

- Ability to find old games taken off of digital marketplaces, a growing issue btw

- etc…

Benefits of digital:

- DoNt HaVe To LeAvE mUh ChAiR fOr 12 SeCoNdS!!1!

- ? Feel free to make a second point, as long as it isn’t the actual BS point of about environmental impact which isn’t lessened with digital only in any meaningful way.

 

[sendit]

This is still not the whole picture. You’re looking purely at a small piece of the puzzle. So the game can only be played with a significant patch, sure - and if your account gets banned they can keep you from playing it, blah blah. You can STILL sell the game used and make money back. You can make another account, play the game again. Collectors today still collect retro games for not only use, but just collection. All of this becomes I delete with digital only.



Yep. More options, more price competition. Period.



See point above. You still have additional avenues to pursue with a physical copy than digital, even if game requires digital framework. This isn’t even touching on the competition causing sales up front, etc.



I am a huge fan of capitalism, though it isn’t perfect - nor is any economic system.

That being said, ruling off mob mentality is a take I expect someone in high school to use.

Germany like Nazi leadership during ww2 too. Guess according to you, their market and populace was right though because #themajoritysaidso

Btw, the numbers by Entertainment Retail Association that 90% of game sales were digital to 10% physical, was made using mobile and digital only games as well. The actual number is nowhere near as large as that. Even if it *hypothetically* was, 10% of something is still a decent chunk. Though we are certainly moving towards a forced adoption of digital only by those amazingly caring mega corps like “pay me $80 a year to play online” Sony and “MTx are the future!” Microsoft, it should be fought by all gamers even those preferring digital only.

You’re literally fighting to take away your options… why?

Literally, WHY make that argument if you aren’t a corporate bootlicker? It comes with *literally* zero net positives.




Side note about that digital only future. I guess eff collectors editions and all!

You’re comparing the holocaust to digital distribution.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

You’re comparing the holocaust to digital distribution.

Nope. Adults call this an “analogy”.

You keep painting this broad brush but using purposefully narrow views, so I did the same thing. It is suppose to be ridiculous.

Just like saying mob mentality is correct.

You know, ridiculous.

 

[sendit]

Nope. Adults call this an “analogy”.

You keep painting this broad brush but using purposefully narrow views, so I did the same thing. It is suppose to be ridiculous.

Just like saying mob mentality is correct.

You know, ridiculous.

Hey “Adult”, an analogy is a comparison.

Additionally, you’re completely off base. People wanting to buy digital isn’t mob mentality.

You actually remind me of the “mob mentality” of people claiming the Covid vaccine is like the holocaust.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Hey “Adult”, an analogy is a comparison.

Additionally, you’re completely off base. People wanting to buy digital isn’t mob mentality.

You actually remind me of the “mob mentality” of people claiming the Covid vaccine is like the holocaust.

Aight fam, you win.

Less competition > more competition.

You've been so correct in so much of your ramblings thus far. All that matters is your opinion. Fickle and selfish AF = ftw!

BTW, I worked in the industry. I still don't boot lick as hard as you do for the corporations. Ew.

All seriousness, don't take this crap too seriously. Hope your night is good, we just agree to disagree. Feels like a waste to continue arguing something we see very, very fundamentally different.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

To be honest it's the "physical" people constantly diminishing in a rediculous way the huge benefits of being digital only as if they don't exist.

And then there is the whole notion that is presented thst its way more expensive, which frankly isn't true unless you sell your used games (something most die hard physical people don't do anyhow).

Digital is cheaper.

All someone has to do is home sharing with a friend or fam member and right away that's costs cut in half. Heck, even sub plans are included as part of the deal. That full pried $70 US game is $35 splitting with a friend, and that bargain bin $20 game is now $10. Not only cheaper, but both gamers have the game.

Physical is best for collectors, people who have old systems they still hook up and for gamers who buy, play, and dump right away to someone getting 80% of their money back. Or they take advantage of GS deals (if they still have them) where you can trade back a game and get full price as credit if you trade it in the first couple weeks the game comes out.

 

[THE DUCK]

Respectfully, what are the “HUGE” benefits?

Benefits of physical:

- Price competition between multiple retail stores worldwide

- allowing mom and pop small business to have a chance

-collectors edition,

- retail 2nd hand market

- private 2nd hand market

- you physically posses an item with actual value (even if a penny), promo items for some releases, etc.

- Game / Art preservation

- Ability to find old games taken off of digital marketplaces, a growing issue btw

- etc…

Benefits of digital:

- DoNt HaVe To LeAvE mUh ChAiR fOr 12 SeCoNdS!!1!

- ? Feel free to make a second point, as long as it isn’t the actual BS point of about environmental impact which isn’t lessened with digital only in any meaningful way.

See, it's this kind of arrogant bs that causes the pushback. Let's examine your points. Remember now, what you value doesn't have value for everyone else.

Benefits of physical:

- Price competition between multiple retail stores worldwide

Generally speaking, this not a real benefit. 98% of the time a game is known sale at Amazon or bestbuy or gamestop its also known sale at the digital store. Even if it's not, many times there are sales on digital games when the physical is not. It all evens out. Sure, once in a blue moon a game will be blown out by a store, but by then they are cheap on e-store as well.

- allowing mom and pop small business to have a chance
Sorry don't care, and I say that a former mom and pop shop owner. The market dictates success ir failure, businesses need to adapt to what sells.

-collectors edition,

Great, if you want this, less than 1% of the market cares.

- retail 2nd hand market

Great if you buy used games.

- private 2nd hand market
Great if you sell your games. Most collectors don't.......

- you physically posses an item with actual value (even if a penny), promo items for some releases, etc.

Ok, so selling them is a big benefit, but what are you keeping then? Nothing.
Your not really posessing anythjng......its a license agreement and a plastic case and a $1 insert in most cases.

- Game / Art preservation

Err, ok, keep your collection, that can be cool, if you have the space.

- Ability to find old games taken off of digital marketplaces, a growing issue btw

Not really, I have more access to games via emulation than any physical collection in existence.

- etc…

There really isn't much of an etc.

As to digital:


Benefits of digital:

- DoNt HaVe To LeAvE mUh ChAiR fOr 12 SeCoNdS!!1!

It's not just a matter of a chair. I have 3 xboxes, I don't need to worry about where a game is, or if it's updated. I can switch games faster (especially with quick redume)

- ? Feel free to make a second point, as long as it isn’t the actual BS point of about environmental impact which isn’t lessened with digital only in any meaningful way.

Here's some more actual digital points:

- No need to preorder anything
- No need to visit a store at -40
- Everything is in stock
- My entire library takes up zero physical space (this would be a real issue)
- My library is easy to search, organize and find games (I have hundreds)
- Often find games on sale at great prices
- I can use my entire library on any console at home or at a friend's at any time
- Nothing ever gets damged, lost, stolen, or not returned

For me, there is almost zero downside to digital. I don't care if in 20 years it gets shut off, I'll be too busy with new games and if I really want to go back I can just emulate.

Now I don't totally dispute that it's cool own actual things and there's a good feeling to that that is not replicated by digital, but it's just not enough to matter to many people.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

See, it's this kind of arrogant bs that causes the pushback. Let's examine your points. Remember now, what you value doesn't have value for everyone else.

Benefits of physical:

- Price competition between multiple retail stores worldwide

Generally speaking, this not a real benefit. 98% of the time a game is known sale at Amazon or bestbuy or gamestop its also known sale at the digital store. Even if it's not, many times there are sales on digital games when the physical is not. It all evens out. Sure, once in a blue moon a game will be blown out by a store, but by then they are cheap on e-store as well.

- allowing mom and pop small business to have a chance
Sorry don't care, and I say that a former mom and pop shop owner. The market dictates success ir failure, businesses need to adapt to what sells.

-collectors edition,

Great, if you want this, less than 1% of the market cares.

- retail 2nd hand market

Great if you buy used games.

- private 2nd hand market
Great if you sell your games. Most collectors don't.......

- you physically posses an item with actual value (even if a penny), promo items for some releases, etc.

Ok, so selling them is a big benefit, but what are you keeping then? Nothing.
Your not really posessing anythjng......its a license agreement and a plastic case and a $1 insert in most cases.

- Game / Art preservation

Err, ok, keep your collection, that can be cool, if you have the space.

- Ability to find old games taken off of digital marketplaces, a growing issue btw

Not really, I have more access to games via emulation than any physical collection in existence.

- etc…

There really isn't much of an etc.

As to digital:


Benefits of digital:

- DoNt HaVe To LeAvE mUh ChAiR fOr 12 SeCoNdS!!1!

It's not just a matter of a chair. I have 3 xboxes, I don't need to worry about where a game is, or if it's updated. I can switch games faster (especially with quick redume)

- ? Feel free to make a second point, as long as it isn’t the actual BS point of about environmental impact which isn’t lessened with digital only in any meaningful way.

Here's some more actual digital points:

- No need to preorder anything
- No need to visit a store at -40
- Everything is in stock
- My entire library takes up zero physical space (this would be a real issue)
- My library is easy to search, organize and find games (I have hundreds)
- Often find games on sale at great prices
- I can use my entire library on any console at home or at a friend's at any time
- Nothing ever gets damged, lost, stolen, or not returned

For me, there is almost zero downside to digital. I don't care if in 20 years it gets shut off, I'll be too busy with new games and if I really want to go back I can just emulate.

Now I don't totally dispute that it's cool own actual things and there's a good feeling to that that is not replicated by digital, but it's just not enough to matter to many people.

For anyone claiming physical is cheaper than digital, one thing they never bring up is home sharing with a friend cuts the cost in half. Two people play for the price of one.

 

[Seider]

Gamestop is out of bussiness and they know it.

 

[Virex]

To be honest it's the "physical" people constantly diminishing in a rediculous way the huge benefits of being digital only as if they don't exist.

And then there is the whole notion that is presented thst its way more expensive, which frankly isn't true unless you sell your used games (something most die hard physical people don't do anyhow).

I live in South Africa. This is the norm here. Physical price vs. Digital price

I

 

[0neAnd0nly]

See, it's this kind of arrogant bs that causes the pushback. Let's examine your points. Remember now, what you value doesn't have value for everyone else.

Benefits of physical:

- Price competition between multiple retail stores worldwide

Generally speaking, this not a real benefit. 98% of the time a game is known sale at Amazon or bestbuy or gamestop its also known sale at the digital store. Even if it's not, many times there are sales on digital games when the physical is not. It all evens out. Sure, once in a blue moon a game will be blown out by a store, but by then they are cheap on e-store as well.

- allowing mom and pop small business to have a chance
Sorry don't care, and I say that a former mom and pop shop owner. The market dictates success ir failure, businesses need to adapt to what sells.

-collectors edition,

Great, if you want this, less than 1% of the market cares.

- retail 2nd hand market

Great if you buy used games.

- private 2nd hand market
Great if you sell your games. Most collectors don't.......

- you physically posses an item with actual value (even if a penny), promo items for some releases, etc.

Ok, so selling them is a big benefit, but what are you keeping then? Nothing.
Your not really posessing anythjng......its a license agreement and a plastic case and a $1 insert in most cases.

- Game / Art preservation

Err, ok, keep your collection, that can be cool, if you have the space.

- Ability to find old games taken off of digital marketplaces, a growing issue btw

Not really, I have more access to games via emulation than any physical collection in existence.

- etc…

There really isn't much of an etc.

As to digital:


Benefits of digital:

- DoNt HaVe To LeAvE mUh ChAiR fOr 12 SeCoNdS!!1!

It's not just a matter of a chair. I have 3 xboxes, I don't need to worry about where a game is, or if it's updated. I can switch games faster (especially with quick redume)

- ? Feel free to make a second point, as long as it isn’t the actual BS point of about environmental impact which isn’t lessened with digital only in any meaningful way.

Here's some more actual digital points:

- No need to preorder anything
- No need to visit a store at -40
- Everything is in stock
- My entire library takes up zero physical space (this would be a real issue)
- My library is easy to search, organize and find games (I have hundreds)
- Often find games on sale at great prices
- I can use my entire library on any console at home or at a friend's at any time
- Nothing ever gets damged, lost, stolen, or not returned

For me, there is almost zero downside to digital. I don't care if in 20 years it gets shut off, I'll be too busy with new games and if I really want to go back I can just emulate.

Now I don't totally dispute that it's cool own actual things and there's a good feeling to that that is not replicated by digital, but it's just not enough to matter to many people.

Ignoring stuff like digital sales are always equated with physics sales (no their not), games get damaged easy (no, Blu rays dont), etc.

I am somehow the “arrogant” one but nearly every point you make is an argument why YOU don’t care and that’s the reasoning.

I am arguing the greater picture. I have probably a collection of 600 games. Some digital, some physical.

We still NEED physical however for obvious reasons. I’m sure you won’t care about how in some countries digital is way higher priced that physical, or how as streetsofbeige pointed out, game sharing helps families save money, etc.

You won’t care. Doesn’t affect YOU, right?

Sony literally won the ps4 game from the start LARGELY thanks to their mic drop anti DRM e3 moment that sent shockwaves and had MS backpedaling trying to figure out how to undo what they did.

My how far we have fallen in one console generation.

 

[Hudo]

If games were designed to stream off the disc, it would been a good thing or were a portion of the game is installed rather than the game entirely

Unfortunalely, optical disc drive hadn't gotten faster over time

PS1 CD drive transfer speed is 300KB/s
PS2 DVD drive transfer speed is 5.28MB/s
PS3 bluray drive transfer speed is 9MB/s
PS4 bluray drive transfer speed is 27MB/s

Three times more speed in 7 years, clearly that how games on PS4 install entirely on HDD

C64 floppy disk drive transfer speed was around 300 bytes/s.

 

[THE DUCK]

I live in South Africa. This is the norm here. Physical price vs. Digital price

I

Maybe that's true there, but it's definately not the case here. And if I want, I can cherry pick some games on sale digitally here that aren't on sale physically and say physically is more expensive, won't make it so. Probably better to show a price history graph.

 

[THE DUCK]

Ignoring stuff like digital sales are always equated with physics sales (no their not), games get damaged easy (no, Blu rays dont), etc.

I am somehow the “arrogant” one but nearly every point you make is an argument why YOU don’t care and that’s the reasoning.

I am arguing the greater picture. I have probably a collection of 600 games. Some digital, some physical.

We still NEED physical however for obvious reasons. I’m sure you won’t care about how in some countries digital is way higher priced that physical, or how as streetsofbeige pointed out, game sharing helps families save money, etc.

You won’t care. Doesn’t affect YOU, right?

Sony literally won the ps4 game from the start LARGELY thanks to their mic drop anti DRM e3 moment that sent shockwaves and had MS backpedaling trying to figure out how to undo what they did.

My how far we have fallen in one console generation.

Just because you don't agree with my points don't make them invalid. Many of the points I have made are valid and shared by many other people on this board in dozens of other threads before this one. And this board doesn't even represent the casual gamer, who sure as crap could care less if it's physical or digital, whatever is easier. They don't care about collecting, they don't buy and sell games, they just play.

Ps4 was released 10 years ago, it's not the same market today. As fast as Sony was anti DRM then fast forward 8 years and you have a fully digital ps5. And a massive streaming service.

We don't NEED physical anything, it's a hobby, not life or death. A person can read a book, run outside, play a sport, play cards, or work. The drama you are portraying is rediculous. How far we have fallen, lol, don't take this so seriously......gaming is supposed to be fun.

Based on what you say, you'd think the sky would fall if another physical game was ever released.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Just because you don't agree with my points don't make them invalid. Many of the points I have made are valid and shared by many other people on this board in dozens of other threads before this one. And this board doesn't even represent the casual gamer, who sure as crap could care less if it's physical or digital, whatever is easier. They don't care about collecting, they don't buy and sell games, they just play.

Ps4 was released 10 years ago, it's not the same market today. As fast as Sony was anti DRM then fast forward 8 years and you have a fully digital ps5. And a massive streaming service.

We don't NEED physical anything, it's a hobby, not life or death. A person can read a book, run outside, play a sport, play cards, or work. The drama you are portraying is rediculous. How far we have fallen, lol, don't take this so seriously......gaming is supposed to be fun.

Based on what you say, you'd think the sky would fall if another physical game was ever released.

Yeah, you nailed me. You know me well, bruh.

I argued your points with factual opposition.

If “casuals” didn’t care about collecting, what’s the point of physical anything? Games, die cast cars, toys, etc. people collect. Everyone does. Kids to adults, everything in between.

Yeah, it isn’t the same market today. PlayStation is run by a far worse president, the growing generations are clueless corporate and political bootlickers whose short sightedness rivals that of a bat, and people love owning nothing. Cool.

We are on a GAMING board. So I can be serious about… gaming, yeah? I’m being dramatic? We are in a gamer centric discussion board discussing a serious issue for our community. You think I care about entertainment that much in my life? My mother just died, I have bills up the whazoo, I actually pay attention to real important issues. This is a gaming board though, so all of that isn’t pertaining to the topic. How far we have fallen as a consumer is a fitting statement, because we have. People accept lesser and lesser quality, longer than ever dev time and delays, higher prices, fake and forced shortages, more subscriptions, MTx at record levels, consolidation of publishers creating virtual monopolies, etc. We have fallen dramatically far and dramatically fast.

It’s spelled ridiculous*, by the way.

I frankly care less than ever what happens to the future of gaming as a whole. Both console companies suck, MS especially. I have serious doubts I would even buy the next console gen. I no longer work in the industry, I hardly have time to touch a controller these days. BUT, while I still have a slight bit of skin in this race, I will fight pro consumer EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

More competition is better, period. It isn’t even a controversial statement if you are educated through high school. Economics and business teach us plenty on this subject. This is a statement we should all be in support of, regardless if one prefers digital or physical.

Explain to me a scenario in which less competition BENEFITED the consumer.

 

[THE DUCK]

Yeah, you nailed me. You know me well, bruh.

I argued your points with factual opposition.

It seemed more like you dismissed them all in one statement and ignored most of them.

If “casuals” didn’t care about collecting, what’s the point of physical anything? Games, die cast cars, toys, etc. people collect. Everyone does. Kids to adults, everything in between.

I would respectfully disagree. Casual die case car buyers, toys etc, they don't buy 500 hundred of them, they have 10. Some things do have a more tangible reason for being, you couldn't play with most toys or cars, etc digitally.
Games and moves and TV are different these days, I think if you took a survey of those under 25 you would find a staggering number that flat out don't care if they consumer digital or physical. (they are so used to digital, it's normal)

Yeah, it isn’t the same market today. PlayStation is run by a far worse president, the growing generations are clueless corporate and political bootlickers whose short sightedness rivals that of a bat, and people love owning nothing. Cool.

I would have to disagree and say that not much has changed. Sony is still the same money seeking company they have always been. Some would say not far worse, considering the success.
It's the market that decides what is good and bad, not us.

We are on a GAMING board. So I can be serious about… gaming, yeah? I’m being dramatic? We are in a gamer centric discussion board discussing a serious issue for our community. You think I care about entertainment that much in my life? My mother just died, I have bills up the whazoo, I actually pay attention to real important issues. This is a gaming board though, so all of that isn’t pertaining to the topic. How far we have fallen as a consumer is a fitting statement, because we have. People accept lesser and lesser quality, longer than ever dev time and delays, higher prices, fake and forced shortages, more subscriptions, MTx at record levels, consolidation of publishers creating virtual monopolies, etc. We have fallen dramatically far and dramatically fast.

I am very sorry your mother passed away. (truely) And I hope your bills find a way to dissapear quickly. I am glad you have an escape like games to go to, helps for me as well.
Where you lose me is the idea that everything is bad, dark, worse. I'm not accepting less quality, I only buy games that are fun. Subs aren't forced. We've had some of the best games come out in the past 2-3 years. Prices for games aren't really higher when you factor in inflation.
The glass if half full, not empty. MS, Sony and Nintendo are all hard at work on a next wave of great games.
One nice thing, once you fall behind, games get a lot cheaper, so if you are busy now it should make things more affordable going forward. (I'm behind myself and it pays off sometimes)

It’s spelled ridiculous*, by the way.

I skipped grade 4, sorry, I am not very good at spelling at times.

I frankly care less than ever what happens to the future of gaming as a whole. Both console companies suck, MS especially. I have serious doubts I would even buy the next console gen. I no longer work in the industry, I hardly have time to touch a controller these days. BUT, while I still have a slight bit of skin in this race, I will fight pro consumer EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

It's ok to want choice, but what are you going to do if the market truely wants digital? Wouldn't it then be pro consumer to provide everything that way?

More competition is better, period. It isn’t even a controversial statement if you are educated through high school. Economics and business teach us plenty on this subject. This is a statement we should all be in support of, regardless if one prefers digital or physical.

I agree with that completely. I just don't happen to agree that competition needs to exist in a physical space. I would love to see an all out battle for Sony, MS and Nintendo to keep fighting the good fight.

Explain to me a scenario in which less competition BENEFITED the consumer.

None, but see above.

 

[BacklashWave534]

Does matter, you can do more with physical games. PERIOD.

Yeah, i agree 100%. Especially when it comes to renting or sharing disks or not worrying about being banned and losing your games. They just aren't complete which irritates me.

 

[sendit]

Aight fam, you win.

Less competition > more competition.

You've been so correct in so much of your ramblings thus far. All that matters is your opinion. Fickle and selfish AF = ftw!

BTW, I worked in the industry. I still don't boot lick as hard as you do for the corporations. Ew.

All seriousness, don't take this crap too seriously. Hope your night is good, we just agree to disagree. Feels like a waste to continue arguing something we see very, very fundamentally different.

Learn to read/comprehend. That isn’t what anyone is saying.

 

[jayj]

Gamestop is the company that bought out all the video game stores and ruined the industry for everyone. The sooner they go away the sooner video game stores might become appealing again.

 

[SCB3]

I agree, to a point for example I should be able to download the contents to my console so I don’t need the disc in the drive the entire time

On a 30 day license where after that I need to put the disc in would be fine imo

I made the mistake of going all digital with last gen and missed the physical aspect, I’ve been going back and collecting certain games (Mario and Pokémon now that MGS and Fallout are complete) and that’s been fun but man the amount of money I lost selling these back a few ago makes me cringe

 

[jayj]

GameStop is in the business for GameStop. Used game sales only profit their business model, not the industry. I also agree that having a disc for a lot of games is pointless. Not having a manual makes inside the case look even worse.

I stopped buying physical discs back in the early days of the PS4/One gen because it became apparent to me how they had lost all their value. I bought over 90% of my games on disc back in the 360/PS3 era because that was the last time when games could actually run off a disc, which made them worthwhile. As soon as they became little more than glorified backup discs and a physical version of DRM, I lost all interest in having them.

 

[Bojanglez]

I get this guy's sentiment and he obviously has his own motives for such a thing, but it is impractical unless you also mandate that every game becomes available on disc. Even if every console had a disc drive, over time more and more publishers will decide not to sell discs and eventually that will be that. No point artificially prolonging it, instead the industry should look at other standards to support game preservation and even reselling if that is what people want.

 

[Northeastmonk]

I stopped buying physical discs back in the early days of the PS4/One gen because it became apparent to me how they had lost all their value. I bought over 90% of my games on disc back in the 360/PS3 era because that was the last time when games could actually run off a disc, which made them worthwhile. As soon as they became little more than glorified backup discs and a physical version of DRM, I lost all interest in having them.

Yea. That feeling doesn’t just go away either. You get very little out of owning a physical disc unless of course you sell it. The physical editions I have bought, I’ve sold because the game didn’t last me multiple playthroughs. If I wanted a game, I’d own it digitally. I’ve got quite a big library of new releases digitally too. Dead Space Remake for instance. I’m not in the mood to sell it, so owning it physically is pointless. I finished it yes, but it’s good enough to go back to someday.

I thought about this with Elden Ring. I had it digitally and had the CE. The only reason the disc would be a good idea would be for vanilla prepatched game, but even that would be a mess. Games get patched and the file size is beyond the disc. At that point you’re just listening to the disc make noise in your console. The actual value of that is getting a little profit from selling it once you’re done.

I started back then too, back when Sony sold movies too. I keep the games I want this way. I’m not selling games just to get rid of it. Im kinda glad about that. Real life happens and it sucks when real life forces someone to sell their game stuff. I kinda found it irritating when I worked at GameStop and some guy would tell me all his woes and dislikes while selling his consoles for a fraction of what they’re worth.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Learn to read/comprehend. That isn’t what anyone is saying.

No offense man, but this is the issue with the generations Millennial and below, and why there is bubbling frustration and tension.

It isn’t always about ME. Short sighted, lazy, selfish tendencies have led us to some dark BS especially in the coming future ALREADY, and that isn’t even talking about gaming.

Just because YOU like something doesn’t mean you shouldn’t care about the broader picture.

Physical and competition = a good thing for everybody.

My first comment you quoted and argued with. Literally the only argument I make is about competition, the picking apart of your uncaring selfish views prior isn’t enough to warrant a response or argument. So what are you arguing with me about, if it isn’t competition, then?

In fact, nearly all of my replies in this thread mention, as a whole, my argument is about competition and pro-consumer practice. Look at every post I have made. I mention it nearly every time.

But go on, tell me about how the dude who doesn’t understand what a sarcastic analogy is, or how my entire argument in the thread is about competition thinks I need to learn reading comprehension.