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Indiana House OKs controversial religious freedom bill

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snacknuts

we all knew her
Fuck my stupid state. This is probably going to be passed into law despite a lot of pushback from Indiana-based companies who recognize that it will negatively impact their ability to bring talent to work for them (never mind the abhorrent notion of the bill in the first place). I'm sure it will eventually be ruled unconstitutional, but I'm kind of blind with rage about this at the moment.

Controversial religious freedom legislation that could protect business owners who don’t want to provide services for same-sex couples appears poised to become law in Indiana.

The Republican-controlled Indiana House approved the measure this afternoon on a 63-31 vote, largely along party lines. Five Republicans joined 26 Democrats in opposing the bill.


The vote likely clears a path for the hot-button legislation to become law. The Senate already approved a slightly different version of the bill last month and Gov. Mike Pence has expressed support for the measure.

Senate Bill 101 would prevent state and local governments from “substantially burdening” a person’s exercise of religion unless the government can prove it has a compelling interest and is doing so in the least restrictive means.

Supporters say the measure would protect people and business owners with strong religious beliefs from government intrusion.

“It’s important that we allow our citizens to hold religious beliefs, maybe even those we might be appalled by, and to be able to express those,” said Rep. Tom Washburne, R-Inglefield.

Opponents say it would license discrimination, particularly against gays and lesbians.

“It basically says to a group of people you’re second rate, you don’t matter, and if you walk into my store, I don’t have to serve you,” said Minority Leader Scott Pelath, D-Michigan City.

Social conservatives have pushed hard for such measures across the country following recent federal court rulings that legalized same-sex marriage in Indiana and other states.

The proposal is modeled on a 22-year-old federal law known as the Religious Freedom and Restoration Act. That law played a key role in the U.S. Supreme Court's decision that allowed Hobby Lobby and other closely held corporations with religious objections to opt out of an Affordable Care Act requirement that they cover certain contraceptives for women.

Nineteen other states have adopted similar “religious freedom” laws, and several others are considering legislation.

Gay rights groups and several major Indiana employers — including Salesforce, Cummins, and Eskanazi Health — have opposed the measure, fearing it will encourage discrimination and hurt Indiana’s reputation as a welcoming state.

Legal scholars have voiced contrasting opinions about legislation’s impact. The issue has also divided religious leaders.

In debating the measure on Monday, lawmakers on both sides of the issue cited religious scripture to defend their positions.

Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, spoke about an anesthesiologist who didn’t want to anesthetize a woman in preparation for an abortion. Borders said he believes the Bible’s command to “do all things as unto the Lord” means religious believers need to be protected not just in church, but in their workplaces as well.

Rep. Ed DeLaney, D-Indianapolis, cited the Bible for the opposite purpose – to argue that Jesus served all people.

“My prophet had dinner with hookers,” he said. “Was he blessing them? I hope so.”

A House committee last week amended the bill to exempt employers from any lawsuits brought by employees under the legislation.

The bill’s author, Sen. Dennis Kruse, could concur with the House version as early as this week, sending it to Pence for his signature. He could also try to negotiate differences with House sponsors, in which case both chambers would have to vote on last time on the bill’s final version.

Deny me service because of your religious beliefs if old.

UPDATE: The governor signed this shit legislation into law this morning (26 Mar) in a private ceremony.

Gov. Mike Pence signed the controversial "religious freedom" legislation in a private ceremony this morning.

Spokeswoman Kara Brooks said the event was closed to the press and the public. One source said a packed house gathered for the signing just before 10 a.m.

The governor's office declined to immediately say who was in attendance. A large round of applause came from the governor's office at about 9:55 a.m.

The measure could allow business owners to refuse services to same-sex couples and has set off a firestorm of controversy.

Pence has been under intense pressure from opponents since the Republican-controlled Indiana General Assembly approved the measure on Tuesday.

The organizers of Gen Con, the city's largest convention, sent a letter to the governor Tuesday threatening to move the event elsewhere in future years if the bill becomes law. And the Disciples of Christ, a Christian denomination based in Indianapolis, said it would look to other cities for its annual convention if Pence signs the bill.

Asked why the ceremony would be private, Brooks said there was "no particular reason."

"Some (bill signings) are public; some are private," she said. "Don't read into it any more or less."
 

Damaniel

Banned
The conservative mantra at work: "Hail the almighty dollar! Well, except when those dollars come from teh gheys, blacks and other people we don't like."

We'll just have to keep on dragging the midwestern/southern bigots kicking and screaming into the 21st century. To the rest of you in those states - we need your help with the dragging part. Vote these stupid bigoted hicks out of office for us, please.
 

Shy Fingers

Banned
happyendings-cleanse3.gif


What would happen if a muslim refused christian?
 

dabig2

Member
“It’s important that we allow our citizens to hold religious beliefs, maybe even those we might be appalled by, and to be able to express those,” said Rep. Tom Washburne, R-Inglefield.

lSRrkhp.jpg


Replace with Indiana.
 

Shamdeo

Member
A House committee last week amended the bill to exempt employers from any lawsuits brought by employees under the legislation.

If I'm interpreting this part right, it means employees who object to acting as their bigoted employers' attack dogs have no grounds for disputing termination?

Villainy.
 

Derwind

Member
“It’s important that we allow our citizens to hold religious beliefs, maybe even those we might be appalled by, and to be able to express those,” said Rep. Tom Washburne, R-Inglefield.

Really, thats a slippery fucking slope when your giving some citizens the power to weild their beliefs to the detriment of another citizen.

Can an Paramedic just refuse to assist someone based on their beliefs. Can a Teacher refuse to host a student to their classroom based on their beliefs.

Lets segregate our water fountains so we don't catch the gays.

Seriously fuck this shit.
 

Velcro Fly

Member
I'm stuck between shitty ass Illinois and backwards ass Indiana.

Knew this shit would pass but it doesn't make it any less disappointing at how stupid Indiana is.
 
Really, thats a slippery fucking slope when your giving some citizens the power to weild their beliefs to the detriment of another citizen.

I'm actually wondering how deep this will go. Can atheists refuse to serve Christians? Or will the people touting religious freedom make a stink once it's them being discriminated against?
 

ivysaur12

Banned
Pre-Metaphoreus:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/dominicholden/indiana-passes-religious-freedom-bill#.lwG5Wy11b

The bill’s prime sponsor in the house, Republican Rep. Timothy Wesco, disagreed. Wesco said the law is “modeled” after the federal Religious Freedom Restoration Act. Passed by Congress in 1993, that law prevents government, in specific, from burdening a person’s exercise of religion. “People have argued that this will allow discrimination,” he said. “You cannot show me a single case where applying this test of religious freedom issues has resulted in discrimination of any kind.”

However, the Indiana bill is broader than federal law, which does not concern private parties. While the Indiana bill says that a “governmental entity may not substantially burden a person’s exercise of religion,” it also applies those rules to businesses and interactions between private parties “regardless of whether the state or any other government entity is party to the proceeding.”

Sixteen law professors sent a letter to Indiana lawmakers in February appearing to support the notion the law would allow turning away customers.

The professors cited a New Mexico case in which a same-sex couple successfully sued a photographer for discrimination for refusing to take wedding photos, despite the state already having a Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA).

“The New Mexico Supreme Court held that its state RFRA does not even apply when the religious objector has been sued by a private citizen,” said the letter led by Daniel O. Conkle, a professor of law at the University of Indiana. “That was almost certainly a mistake, and the proposed Indiana legislation makes it clear that the Indiana RFRA would indeed apply in these circumstances.”

This seems to be the broadest "religious freedom" law that's passed yet.
 
If I'm interpreting this part right, it means employees who object to acting as their bigoted employers' attack dogs have no grounds for disputing termination?

Villainy.

In all fairness, Indiana is a Right to Work state, so employers don't need grounds for termination... they can just do it.
 

gcubed

Member
It already passed the Senate and Pence is going to sign it.

going into affect means actually being used. Its an unenforceable law that will only exist to humiliate morons who passed it. (the portion that pertains to allowing private business to discriminate)

The first time it gets invoked it will be struck down. The shame of it is that you can't publicly humiliate politicians for being idiots after the fact.
 

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Eventually this will hit the Supreme Court and be struck down. Just might be a few years before it happens, sadly.
 
Great, now I can open the all-you-can-eat Atheist Fedora Buffet - No Christians/Jews/Muslims allowed.

Our seating fits those of a husky persuasion and Neckbeards get 25% off every Thursday! Women are technically allowed.


Seriously, this shit shouldn't even have to be struck down. I would think that common sense would drive these bigots out of business, but maybe I'm wrong.
 

ChaosXVI

Member
Ugh...I hate that the mid-west has been leaning increasingly to the right these past few years...Good thing I live in downstate Illinois. Chicago may be a horrible place to travel to, but I'll always love it for keeping Illinois blue forever, even if a Republican can become governor, it's not like he can really do anything here...
 

genjiZERO

Member
These people, and rightfully so, will be remembered as being bigots. Republicans are always talking about how they find it distasteful to be called this, but it's for reasons like this.
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
Ugh...I hate that the mid-west has been leaning increasingly to the right these past few years...Good thing I live in downstate Illinois. Chicago may be a horrible place to travel to, but I'll always love it for keeping Illinois blue forever, even if a Republican can become governor, it's not like he can really do anything here...

Illinois enacted an RFRA 17 years ago.
 

tirminyl

Member
Again I say, I will incorporate myself to get more rights as a person. Also, do I get my own lobbyist after doing so?
 

Loofy

Member
On one hand this sounds terrible. On the other an anesthesiologist being forced to help with an abortion sounds terrible too(example in OP).
 

Kard8p3

Member
On one hand this sounds terrible. On the other an anesthesiologist being forced to help with an abortion sounds terrible too(example in OP).

Yeah, no. That's his job. He's a medical professional. He is going to encounter people of all walks of life, he doesn't get to be a pissbaby about who he does his job on.
 

Alphahawk

Member
This is never going to get anywhere. Even if it passes into law advocy groups would sue and then the whole thing will get taken to the Supreme Court who will strike it down for being discriminatory It sucks that the legislature is wasting everyone's time, but it's nothing that you should worry about as it never has a realistic chance of being enforced.,
 

Loofy

Member
Yeah, no. That's his job. He's a medical professional. He is going to encounter people of all walks of life, he doesn't get to be a pissbaby about who he does his job on.
Would you say the same thing about doctors being forced to administer euthanasia?
 
Would you say the same thing about doctors being forced to administer euthanasia?

Would I say that a doctor should have to perform his job on one of his patients regardless of that patient's sexual orientation, race, or religion? Yes. Although I don't know if there are any doctors whose job description reads euthenasia.
 

F0rneus

Tears in the rain
People should be free to follow their religion, but never at the detriment of other people IMO
 
On one hand this sounds terrible. On the other an anesthesiologist being forced to help with an abortion sounds terrible too(example in OP).

Good point, let's make sure everyone in the surgical chamber gets to ask the person who is about to die whether or not they've been divorced, worked during the Sabbath or wore mixed fabrics so that they don't have that hanging over their conscience, either.

If you're worried about ending someone's life because your religion would condemn you for the death then being part of surgery is one hell of a career path.
 

DS-61-5

Member
I'd imagine the courts will strike this down pretty quickly, right?

Not a chance. It's about as safe as any law could be based on current precedents.

It's modeled on the federal RFRA, which the Court has repeatedly upheld (Hobby Lobby isn't a First Amendment case: it's a RFRA case). The original RFRA bill, ironically enough, was pushed by Chuck Schumer and Ted Kennedy and Orrin Hatch, overruling a Scalia opinion as insufficiently protective of religion. If you read the Congressional Record "debates" on this, as I did recently, it's almost all left-leaning members of Congress slamming Scalia as a jerk mean to religion while conservative offered more muted comments about the importance of religion to America. The final vote was basically unanimous, with three dissenters in the Senate [most prominently, the arch-conservative Republican Jesse Helms, who correctly predicted this would be used as a way to get out of neutral, otherwise socially useful legislation].
 
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