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[Bernardougf]

Good! Fuck this sub shit

 

[DrFigs]

It's great for consumers. I saved so much money with PlayStation Plus Extra.

it's great for some consumers for sure. but assuming there are more people like me, who mostly play a handful of the same games for most of the year. i don't really get value from ps plus at all.

 

[Generic]

Yeah, the better gamer comment was just an exaggeration. As for access and owning the game, I don't think it's as important as most people like to make it seem. How many games that are not multiplayer can people claim that they play throughout the year and for multiple years? Sub services are designed for people who want to experience games and move on to the next one. This doesn't apply to multiplayer games that need a separate sub to keep playing.

I'm curious to see what will happen when everything becomes full digital.

 

[TGO]

MS is making bets for the far future. Here's an article from 2010 about digital sales being 20%. What were they now in 2024, 90%? I don't know the exact percentages.

2010's total game sales

March 18, 2010 - VGChartz Ltd, a business intelligence and research firm for retail video game purchases, and Forecasti…

www.gamesindustry.biz

As always, you can't predict the future. But there's really no one logical that actually thinks this isn't one of the more likely possibilities. Guess we'll see.

All of Sony's Sales figures leaked, we can't account for 3rd Party, but First Party?

Sales numbers for every PS4 and PS5 era PlayStation first party games have been leaked

transcription by @Welfare All games that appear in this OP Platform Title [PS4] Bloodborne [PC] Days Gone [PS4] Days Gone [PS4] Death Stranding [PS5] Death Stranding Director's Cut [PS5] Demon's Souls [PS4] Detroit: Become Human [PS4] DRIVECLUB [PS4] Ghost of Tsushima...

www.installbaseforum.com

 

[Agent X]

This is deliberately from Sony to maximise sales. You don't want everyone to know that every game will come to a subscription after 12 months. That's why they randomly drop them. A year is just the minimum before it comes to ps plus, but for many games it will be longer then that because many of sonys games have long legs and keep selling for years. It's actually the perfect strategy and the right way to do it.

That's true. A subscription service is a great place to put games after they've been out for a while.

From a business perspective, it generally isn't sensible to place a big blockbuster game on a subscription service on release day. Let the game prove itself on the shelf. That's where the publishers, developers, and retailers will make their initial cash. After sales drop off, they can consider putting it on the subscription service. The game can get a "second wind", and provide another opportunity to earn money for the producers.

 

[TheGodfather07]

"It's actually the perfect strategy and the right way to do it"

For Sony, yes, but not for people who subscribe to their service. Especially after increasing the price of PS+ while promising 'more quality games'. You would expect them at least to not remove their own games from the service.

Yeah I thought the same. How many have they actually removed though? Was it just spider-man?

 

[mayham2199]

"It's actually the perfect strategy and the right way to do it"

For Sony, yes, but not for people who subscribe to their service. Especially after increasing the price of PS+ while promising 'more quality games'. You would expect them at least to not remove their own games from the service.

Don’t think they ever promised more quality.

 

[Flabagast]

Now Xbox fans, if you want a chance to save your ecosystem, cancel your subs and start buying games

 

[Chechack]

If you play online you need it anyways on both platforms but gp is both cheaper and much better.

People like me who only play Genshin/Warframe/GundamBattle Network dont need to sub tho fyi

 

[LordBlodgett]

Are you saying that wanting to own licenses or anything you spend money on is being a dinosaur? I’ll be a dinosaur all day I guess. I come from a world where they taught you in economics that purchasing goods and services should have value. There is no value when they chose there not to be. You are at their will and mercy. I couldn’t imagine spending what I did on my last home and them telling me I don’t really own it and after a few years they can take it back if they wish to do so. Same as music, it disappears off their service and even songs you buy outright disappear because the license is gone. I’m not seeing how that is beneficial for people in anyway. I believe the same thing happened with movies on Sony. And movies bought digitally, they just disappeared before folks complained enough and they got the licenses for those back. Happens every day on streaming and digital services.

I read a ton of blah blah blah I make money off Microsoft and they do subscriptions so keep it up so I make mine? Is that about right?

The thing about a subscription is that if it doesn't provide value then you can just cancel it at the drop of a hat. If a music streaming service gets rid of the music you like then you cancel and go elsewhere, same with video, and same with games. I am subscribed to several streaming services, and I cancel when I'm done watching the shows I want and go elsewhere. In my opinion this beats buying. All those blu-rays I bought over the years are worth next to nothing on the open market, and aren't even worth my time to try to sell. What about the boxes of CD's I have in the garage? waste of money and space. Games are not much different, especially in the digital age. Nearly every physical game from the 360/PS3 until now is worth very little unless it was limited release or is still very new. If I can play it on a subscription service instead of buying then sign me up. My goal is to watch movies & TV shows, listen to music, and play games. Whether I own those things or not does not matter to me at the end of the day. My deciding factor is what the best value is.

 

[Kumomeme]

for only 10% of total video game content spending in the US.

but the idea that subs will become dominant is unsupported by data.

seems that MS is too hastily push the service in hope it will be their major 'groundbreaking game changer' so their console/brand would easily end up beating their competitors left & right and instantly dominate the market. which is, not happened and their plan turn south instead. this gen they actually betting on lot of plan that look possible on paper but no actual successfull data to back it up.

perhaps what they should do from beginning is, tread the path slowly, build the foundation properly, gain steady growth first(not by expecting instant blazing turbo fast adoption), study the market change, developers reception with it effect then later with sufficient data and footing, they can started higher gear to push it alongside their console or platform like windows.

the road is far and steep. but instead of treat it like a marathon, they push it into sprint. at same time, they keep pointing finger left and right to other runners who ahead of them.

 

[Clintizzle]

This is deliberately from Sony to maximise sales. You don't want everyone to know that every game will come to a subscription after 12 months. That's why they randomly drop them. A year is just the minimum before it comes to ps plus, but for many games it will be longer then that because many of sonys games have long legs and keep selling for years. It's actually the perfect strategy and the right way to do it.

For who? Sony and their shareholders?

 

[Salz01]

I cancelled my Xbox sub a few months back. Haven’t missed it. Will buy good exclusive games on it if and when they ever release on it.

 

[TheGodfather07]

For who? Sony and their shareholders?

Well yeah. Who else? You think any corporation gives a shit about you? They do what's best for them.

 

[Topher]

Want to make an avatar bet?

lol.....no

 

[Pimpbaa]

Now Xbox fans, if you want a chance to save your ecosystem, cancel your subs and start buying games

But why would I want to buy games in an ecosystem that is seemingly in trouble? I’m not investing any more than the Gamepass sub. PS6 is in no danger of not coming out plus it will most likely be BC with PS5 and PS4 games.

 

[bender]

lol.....no

 

[Topher]

Pretty accurate considering the last time I lost an avatar bet, Ass of Can Whooping had me sporting some furry cat hooker......thing.....as my avatar.

I learned my lesson

 

[bender]

Pretty accurate considering the last time I lost an avatar bet, Ass of Can Whooping had me sporting some furry cat hooker......thing.....as my avatar.

I learned my lesson

And who'd you lose a bet to for your current avatar?

 

[kikkis]

People like me who only play Genshin/Warframe/GundamBattle Network dont need to sub tho fyi

True, I think this one reason why devs will start to go f2p route for online games to circumvent the paywall.

 

[AmuroChan]

I do wonder if MS can pivot from their original strategy or if it's too late? Would XBox fans revolt if MS no longer releases 1st party games on GP on day 1? Let's say they pivot to something akin to films where 1st party games will get a 60-day window to sell a la carte, and then hit GP after that. Would XBox fans accept that compromise if MS says it is necessary for XBox to survive long term?

 

[Spitfire098]

I have already canceled ps extra keeping essential. Shits expensive and not enough time to play everyday.

 

[Clintizzle]

Well yeah. Who else? You think any corporation gives a shit about you? They do what's best for them.

The original post I quoted pretty much sounded like you were celebrating the fact that Sony was taking away games so they can make more money from it. Like you were happy that people had to pay $60 for a 5 year old game so that a billion dollar company makes more money.

Your next post might as well be something along the lines of "I don't care if TloU gets re-remastered for PS5 Pro again, I'll gladly pay $10 - $50 just so Sony makes more money and the shareholders can no starve."

I'm done with arguing about this tbh.

 

[Lord Malachite]

Subscriptions aren't really sustainable as the main revenue generator of the games industry, because too many games cost what a AAAA Hollywood blockbuster film costs, but the audience is much less. Even the best selling games, like CoD in its heyday, still only reached a fraction of the people a truly blockbuster film would. The reason the games were profitable is because instead of paying $10 - $15 for a movie ticket, fewer people were paying $60 - $120 for the game, not to mention microtransactions and DLC being another revenue stream. A single person playing CoD could potentially spend the equivalent of ten movie tickets, so it worked just fine.
Gaming subscriptions severely cut down on that revenue, and the increased volume of a subscription fee is just not enough to makeup for the tried and true model of selling a game. Ultimately, publishers are making less money, which is driving up game prices and leading to increasingly shittier, anti-consumer practices as they attempt to keep their bottom line intact.

There's nothing inherently wrong with subscription services as an add-on for those who want it. But the push to make them the primary delivery system is a huge step in the wrong direction, something Microsoft severely miscalculated on IMO. It doesn't matter if they can subsidize things year in and year out with their deep pockets if the end result is the industry being laid waste to in the process.

 

[Clintizzle]

Again, missing the point. Gamepass dictates what you play, it is not a good value because folks are subbing to gamepass AND buying games. Is that too hard for some of you to understand? If you wanted a rental service, gamefly is a better option. You can pick whatever game you want.

Fucking lol. Use GameFly? I feel like I'm in a aged care facility and all these old cunts telling me about the good old days when you had to read the newspaper to see what's on TV that week.

Imagine having to wait for a RENTAL game to be delivered and you and then have to deal with couriers to send it back. Do you have special pigeons for delivery as well?

Also I assume you're American because you think Gamefly is available for all gamers..

1, Boot up console
2, Download game
3, Play Game
It's that easy.

 

[Starbuck2907]

Gamepass is a long term vision. It is designed to coexist with normal sales. I feel like this board is vastly underestimating the long term ability of Gamepass to do well once King/Ativision/bethesda’s entire catalogs are listed. Plus, at the top gamepass tier EA games are included. They really need to do a better job explaining what’s in gamepass.

Also, I don’t feel like gamepass has hurt console sales. The lack of AAA welll-reviewed first party games has done that.

Didn’t they actually remake Xbox live silver and gold to gamepass core and ultimate or something like that? Technically, isn’t every Xbox live account now a “gamepass ” account?

I am very happy with my Xbox, but I mainly prefer it because of the controller and download speeds and interface vs the PS5. I own all consoles and a gaming pc.

 

[demigod]

Fucking lol. Use GameFly? I feel like I'm in a aged care facility and all these old cunts telling me about the good old days when you had to read the newspaper to see what's on TV that week.

Imagine having to wait for a RENTAL game to be delivered and you and then have to deal with couriers to send it back. Do you have special pigeons for delivery as well?

Also I assume you're American because you think Gamefly is available for all gamers..

1, Boot up console
2, Download game
3, Play Game
It's that easy.

Keep moving that goalposts son.

 

[Oddvintagechap]

So happy Xbox GP is failing. Sure I would love to have all the games to be all available to me for 10 dollars a month. But that’s some bullshit gingerbread house concept. More like raise prices when everything is tied to a subscription. Then cost cutting everywhere. Make games GaaS over single player.

Terrible Shit.

 

[The Pleasure]

I do wonder if MS can pivot from their original strategy or if it's too late? Would XBox fans revolt if MS no longer releases 1st party games on GP on day 1? Let's say they pivot to something akin to films where 1st party games will get a 60-day window to sell a la carte, and then hit GP after that. Would XBox fans accept that compromise if MS says it is necessary for XBox to survive long term?

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I doubt it. Game Pass is fine for those who want a library of game to play, but doesn't really do much for those who spend the majority of their game time playing Call of Duty.

This.

You're basically paying for a shitload of games you don't care about.
That's why sub services are stagnating.

 

[crackajack]

Subs are great for cheapass bargain bin players like me and I would have thought more players want such a buffet. Thx MS to force Sony's hand and give me much to play. But the fomo crowd is seemingly much larger though and does not care for anything "old" and prefers to choose.
I wonder what 10% means. The revenue purely off the sub fee alone? Excluding the follow up sales of mtx and season passes? Game sales directly after one game is leaving? For now people want to buy specific games and pay probably more in doing so, and that happens also more likely on PS since they are obviously leading but are less willing to put their games early on it, before their pull expires. 10% overall sound actually not much but probably is for a kinda limited interested market. For something that is hardly for casuals, who don't need a ton of games, just a few trendy games per year, isn't for collectors at all, and is offering almost everything "too late" on Plus, or offers never the specific game someone has on their wishlist. Once MS finally figures out a release cadence and up their quality, their day and date threat might actually get a lot more traction. Even Starfield might make numbers over its lifetime, or at least similar to Fallout and TES once patched, often by fan stuff, then sold forever. No idea if Starfield actually can become that. But MS had too few good and too many misfires to really get there yet. I thought Starfield might be the start, but I assume we have to wait for AB stuff to make an impact...
Sony never figured out how to grow PS Now either, but they also never tried to make it the forerunner for their sales and as such it never needed to be really important.
I certainly benefit from it, and I kinda think it will take over over some more time, and that might be when quality and content might shift. Not looking forward to that. MS failure for now has imho more to do with clueless bosses, than designing anything with GP in mind.

 

[PeteBull]

This.

You're basically paying for a shitload of games you don't care about.
That's why sub services are stagnating.

Yups, its like banging cave trolls aka 2's and 3's, u had sex doing it but was it really fun? And do u wanna pay for dates/drinks leading to this shit, only if u are some desperate and often even then u just feel repulsed even thinking about it, u would rather put in effort(aka pay those 70$ or even less if u buy at promotions or used ) to get a solid 6 or 7 instead and actually enjoy it fully =D

 

[Clintizzle]

Keep moving that goalposts son.

Thanks, Dad. Don't forget to buy stamps next time you are at the post office. We wouldn't want to upset the mail man who delivers your rental games which you then have to spend hours waiting for the update to download via the internet (which I know you struggle with the concept off) to play. ✌

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

Most games I know aren't fit for the same kind of consumption that movies and tv series are, so the Netflix model makes less sense for games.

A game usually requires a much longer time investment than a movie. Even short games take about as long to complete as watching a season of your favorite show (say, 10 episodes, each 45 minutes long), and that's assuming no multiplayer or any other incentive to replay.

By encouraging consumers to pay a fixed monthly rate for accessing a large selection of games, you probably end up conditioning players to try many games but commit to few, and complete even less, so they miss out on the emotional attachment that comes with investing in a game or franchise over many years. And that last part is what creates returning customers when hardware cycles refresh.

In short, subscriptions are a good way to introduce your library to a new audience, but I don't think they're what gets this audience to stay in your ecosystem.
That's my interpretation, any way.

 

[BigLee74]

‘All eggs in one basket’ - forum wallopers.

Meanwhile, I guess I’m dreaming the Xbox Store where I can still buy every game possible.

Subscription will steadily grow, but the other purchase options will always remain too. Exactly the same as what has happened for TV/movies and music.

Xbox’s biggest mistake stems from losing so badly when the digital age really took off - ie the Xbox One/PS4 era. In those 7 years, people grew their digital libraries to such an extent they wouldn’t swap platforms if you paid them. That will take time to recover from (if at all) and can only be done by making the platform more attractive - games, power, features (of which one is the quality of Gamepass). I’m pretty sure we will see Microsoft trying like a bear in the remainder of this gen.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

‘All eggs in one basket’ - forum wallopers.

Meanwhile, I guess I’m dreaming the Xbox Store where I can still buy every game possible.

Subscription will steadily grow, but the other purchase options will always remain too. Exactly the same as what has happened for TV/movies and music.

Xbox’s biggest mistake stems from losing so badly when the digital age really took off - ie the Xbox One/PS4 era. In those 7 years, people grew their digital libraries to such an extent they wouldn’t swap platforms if you paid them. That will take time to recover from (if at all) and can only be done by making the platform more attractive - games, power, features (of which one is the quality of Gamepass). I’m pretty sure we will see Microsoft trying like a bear in the remainder of this gen.

I think the majority of consumers don't care about having access to a huge library of games they've never heard of, they care about a small number of games that strongly appeal to them. That's why Nintendo's approach of releasing games with a specific appeal in mind and then marketing the hell out of them to the right audience is more successful.

 

[Woopah]

No statistical claims for his data. Which services . How it’s calculated. Etc.

May as well be HentaiGuy420 making this tweet because it has just much credibility.

He's an Executive Director at Circana, that gives him way more credibility that most since he actually has access to at least some data.

I'm probably missing something but at a high level, what % of new games are released on a subscription service? The only company that actively adds new games to a subscription service is Microsoft so if the data that Matt is working off didn't include PS or Nintendo - it would paint a very different picture, not in terms of Subs growth, but in terms of Sub vs other spending.

I completely agree that Xbox has not done enough to grow that GP base. I don't have any faith in cloud boosting that in the future either. but if we get back to me as a consumer, I don't really care. I still think GP is great value for me and how i like to play games.

I believe he's talking about all subscriptions, so PS+ and NSO would be included in the calculations.

 

[systemr123]

Ok. around all this drama, i have to ask:


Where the fuck is Phil Spencer and what game has been playing lately?

Probably still playing Vampire Survivors as always, basking in its graphical glory.

 

[Winter John]

My sub runs out in February. I doubt I'll bother with another. I think it's a good deal for people new to Xbox, but it's kind of pointless if you buy games and got a decent library. The main benefit I found was it saved me from wasting money on games that turned out to be mediocre or outright broken trash. Xbox should really push that feature more. "Look at all this shit we saved you from buying."

 

[systemr123]

My sub runs out in February. I doubt I'll bother with another. I think it's a good deal for people new to Xbox, but it's kind of pointless if you buy games and got a decent library. The main benefit I found was it saved me from wasting money on games that turned out to be mediocre or outright broken trash. Xbox should really push that feature more. "Look at all this shit we saved you from buying."

So you saved a lot of money by playing garbage games . It does make sense, buying 1 such a crappy game can cost you 50 bucks and that sucks. It’s 3 months of sub sort of. So don’t buy 1 crap game each 3 months and you can justify Gamepass.

 

[Winter John]

So you saved a lot of money by playing garbage games . It does make sense, buying 1 such a crappy game can cost you 50 bucks and that sucks. It’s 3 months of sub sort of. So don’t buy 1 crap game each 3 months and you can justify Gamepass.

I saved a lot of money trying out games on GP that I might've bought. Redfall, Starfield and the like. Before anyone starts. Yeah. There's definitely good games on there. Games I never would've considered if I hadn't been able to try them out. GP is excellent for people who don't have a lot of games, and for the rest of us it's a pretty decent demo service.

 

[Punished Miku]

I saved a lot of money trying out games on GP that I might've bought. Redfall, Starfield and the like. Before anyone starts. Yeah. There's definitely good games on there. Games I never would've considered if I hadn't been able to try them out. GP is excellent for people who don't have a lot of games, and for the rest of us it's a pretty decent demo service.

The way I look at it, if I can play several larger games I would have otherwise bought on day 1 and complete them, I probably wont need to play them again for a few years. At that point they will be $20 or less. I beat Lies of P, and will pick it up when it's $15-20. That's basically $50 saved right there. Same with Wo Long. Same with Starfield. Same with Atomic Heart. That's $200 right there, and I'm going to own these eventually. The other 100 or so games I get a year are just a bonus at that point. Many of those indies are $30-40 now also.

 

[Winter John]

The way I look at it, if I can play several larger games I would have otherwise bought on day 1 and complete them, I probably wont need to play them again for a few years. At that point they will be $20 or less. I beat Lies of P, and will pick it up when it's $15-20. That's basically $50 saved right there. Same with Wo Long. Same with Starfield. Same with Atomic Heart. That's $200 right there, and I'm going to own these eventually. The other 100 or so games I get a year are just a bonus at that point. Many of those indies are $30-40 now also.

Sure. Lies Of P is a good example. I thought I would've loved that game. It looked real good. Everyone was rating it. If I hadn't had GP I would've bought it and then refunded a few hours later because I couldn't get into it. I don't know why. If I got time I'm gonna download it again and give it another shot, because as far as I can tell people still really like it.

 

[Punished Miku]

Sure. Lies Of P is a good example. I thought I would've loved that game. It looked real good. Everyone was rating it. If I hadn't had GP I would've bought it and then refunded a few hours later because I couldn't get into it. I don't know why. If I got time I'm gonna download it again and give it another shot, because as far as I can tell people still really like it.

I'm pretty anti-Souls games at this point and it even won me over. It's worth another shot, but everyone's tastes are different.

 

[Tajaz2426]

The thing about a subscription is that if it doesn't provide value then you can just cancel it at the drop of a hat. If a music streaming service gets rid of the music you like then you cancel and go elsewhere, same with video, and same with games. I am subscribed to several streaming services, and I cancel when I'm done watching the shows I want and go elsewhere. In my opinion this beats buying. All those blu-rays I bought over the years are worth next to nothing on the open market, and aren't even worth my time to try to sell. What about the boxes of CD's I have in the garage? waste of money and space. Games are not much different, especially in the digital age. Nearly every physical game from the 360/PS3 until now is worth very little unless it was limited release or is still very new. If I can play it on a subscription service instead of buying then sign me up. My goal is to watch movies & TV shows, listen to music, and play games. Whether I own those things or not does not matter to me at the end of the day. My deciding factor is what the best value is.

There is absolutely no value in putting money in a blender and then trashing it. You cannot have value in something you rent. Stop.

If, you believe that, have at it. Maybe I’m not used to people just throwing money away to companies for nothing.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Gamepass is a long term vision. It is designed to coexist with normal sales. I feel like this board is vastly underestimating the long term ability of Gamepass to do well once King/Ativision/bethesda’s entire catalogs are listed. Plus, at the top gamepass tier EA games are included. They really need to do a better job explaining what’s in gamepass.

Also, I don’t feel like gamepass has hurt console sales. The lack of AAA welll-reviewed first party games has done that.

Didn’t they actually remake Xbox live silver and gold to gamepass core and ultimate or something like that? Technically, isn’t every Xbox live account now a “gamepass ” account?

I am very happy with my Xbox, but I mainly prefer it because of the controller and download speeds and interface vs the PS5. I own all consoles and a gaming pc.

Download speeds?

Unless I'm missing something, the PS5 downloads games faster than what I get on Series X. Wifi or otherwise. It installs games faster too.

 

[Punished Miku]

There is absolutely no value in putting money in a blender and then trashing it. You cannot have value in something you rent. Stop.

If, you believe that, have at it. Maybe I’m not used to people just throwing money away to companies for nothing.

How do you feel about concert tickets? Movie theaters?

 

[Tajaz2426]

How do you feel about concert tickets? Movie theaters?

I don’t spend money on that type of stuff. Never have. I buy music and movies I want. I don’t spend money on things I do not own.

I don’t have a problem with spending money on things like that though if someone wants to, the problem is there is no value in renting anything and can be unilaterally taken with no recourse. I don’t want my kids and grandkids being forced into monthly subscriptions for everything.

Like the gent a little bit up said that BMW wants a subscription for hearing your seats. I do not care what people do but don’t pretend there is value in renting month after month for years when you could simply one time purchase and own.

I’m aware we all spend money we cannot get back on goods and services. It’s just becoming a pain seeing it in my face a subscription for everything.

Edit: when I bought my EV Wrangler I paid a little over 70k I shouldn’t have to then be hit with a subscription to unlock my doors and start my vehicle or set up charging times and get my vehicle report. 5 years ago my wife’s Mercedes was just bought and I could use my phone and everything just worked. It’s quite ridiculous where we are now to pay a monthly fee to heat your seats.

 

[demigod]

I don’t spend money on that type of stuff. Never have. I buy music and movies I want. I don’t spend money on things I do not own.

I don’t have a problem with spending money on things like that though if someone wants to, the problem is there is no value in renting anything and can be unilaterally taken with no recourse. I don’t want my kids and grandkids being forced into monthly subscriptions for everything.

Like the gent a little bit up said that BMW wants a subscription for hearing your seats. I do not care what people do but don’t pretend there is value in renting month after month for years when you could simply one time purchase and own.

I’m aware we all spend money we cannot get back on goods and services. It’s just becoming a pain seeing it in my face a subscription for everything.

Edit: when I bought my EV Wrangler I paid a little over 70k I shouldn’t have to then be hit with a subscription to unlock my doors and start my vehicle or set up charging times and get my vehicle report. 5 years ago my wife’s Mercedes was just bought and I could use my phone and everything just worked. It’s quite ridiculous where we are now to pay a monthly fee to heat your seats.

Lexus wanted $300 a year for me to remote start my car back in 2016. I said F U to them and bought a $250 remote start from Best Buy. They have now dropped it to $80 a year, gee I wonder why. Greedy fucktards couldn’t bother to put aa remote start on the key fob.

 

[Punished Miku]

I don’t spend money on that type of stuff. Never have. I buy music and movies I want. I don’t spend money on things I do not own.

I don’t have a problem with spending money on things like that though if someone wants to, the problem is there is no value in renting anything and can be unilaterally taken with no recourse. I don’t want my kids and grandkids being forced into monthly subscriptions for everything.

Like the gent a little bit up said that BMW wants a subscription for hearing your seats. I do not care what people do but don’t pretend there is value in renting month after month for years when you could simply one time purchase and own.

I’m aware we all spend money we cannot get back on goods and services. It’s just becoming a pain seeing it in my face a subscription for everything.

Edit: when I bought my EV Wrangler I paid a little over 70k I shouldn’t have to then be hit with a subscription to unlock my doors and start my vehicle or set up charging times and get my vehicle report. 5 years ago my wife’s Mercedes was just bought and I could use my phone and everything just worked. It’s quite ridiculous where we are now to pay a monthly fee to heat your seats.

Subs for basic features in a car are pretty absurd, and I'd never go for that either. I don't think anyone will honestly, except maybe Tesla owners.