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[Epsilon-delta]

Aya has got this.

Annnnd we're done here.

Not even close.

One can discuss a topic without resorting to oppression olympics. Because where does it stop in regards to other topics?

Who has it worse in the US? Blacks? Homeless? Transgender? Native Americans?

It depends on who ask or what studies you cite.

People venting their frustration over a disadvantage does not mean they're equating their discrimination to discrimination experienced by other marginalized groups. It just means their venting, nothing more. You're just trivializing their experiences to the point that it stifles honest discussion.

For example: bamboo ceiling in the Asian community or racism against Asians. Someone recognizes there is a problem but responds with "but you're a model minority" or at least you're not black/hispanic.

That means diddly squat in the discussion and yet, IIRC, this has happened in the past here in OT.

If you're going to take this route then why complain about anything being an American?

Let us take it to the absurdity:

Aren't we all lucky that we live in the US vs <insert horrible country>?

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Maybe I missed it somewhere between page 5 and 13, but has anyone in this thread said that people aren't allowed to or shouldn't have physical preferences when dating?

I for one think it should be fine for people to say that they aren't interested in overweight people on their dating profiles, but I recognize the double standard when it comes to height discrimination being accepted. I think they should both be accepted as well as stating dating preferences for any other physical attribute or disability.

I only date people with 100ppp

 

[Unbounded]

Being short doesn't make you automatically undesirable the way that being fat, or in a wheelchair, or missing a limb, or being darker skin or having a a specific occupation is. I'm not saying you can't complain about it but this conversation always teeters on the line of being more mad at women for having these standards while in the same breath, some of these same short men won't even see themselves dating any one from any of those same other marganizlized groups.

Uh, as an above-average height black guy, short definitely is in the same realm as all of those other things.

Okay, sure, physical disability is at the bottom of that desirability chain, but being short or black/brown/dark are definitely the next few links up.

EDIT: Because I guess I have to:

Taken from: here.

The bottom line here is that for whatever reason, height in aggregate is a pretty significant factor in dating for both tall women and short men. Those groups have every right to gripe about it.

Mind you, the data is getting a little old. I do wish these dating companies would put out some more updated stuff.

 

[D i Z]

Not even close.

One can discuss a topic without resorting to oppression olympics. Because where does it stop in regards to other topics?

Who has it worse in the US? Blacks? Homeless? Transgender? Native Americans?

It depends on who ask or what studies you cite.

People venting their frustration over a disadvantage does not mean they're equating their discrimination to discrimination experienced by other marginalized groups. It just means their venting, nothing more. You're just trivializing their experiences to the point that it stifles honest discussion.

For example: bamboo ceiling in the Asian community or racism against Asians. Someone recognizes there is a problem but responds with "but you're a model minority" or at least you're not black/hispanic.

That means diddly squat in the discussion and yet, IIRC, this has happened in the past here in OT.

If you're going to take this route then why complain about anything being an American?

Let us take it to the absurdity:

Aren't we all lucky that we live in the US vs <insert horrible country>?

Good point. Except that Aya was writing about the way that people here are equating their height disadvantage to these other aspects of disadvantage. She addressed that specifically. She was also addressing the double standards rampant in this discussion, and by addressing the two responses to her argument and not the argument itself, you're actually not addressing the comment or the topic at all.

 

[Crayon]

Not even close.

One can discuss a topic without resorting to oppression olympics. Because where does it stop in regards to other topics?

Who has it worse in the US? Blacks? Homeless? Transgender? Native Americans?

It depends on who ask or what studies you cite.

People venting their frustration over a disadvantage does not mean they're equating their discrimination to discrimination experienced by other marginalized groups. It just means their venting, nothing more. You're just trivializing their experiences to the point that it stifles honest discussion.

For example: bamboo ceiling in the Asian community or racism against Asians. Someone recognizes there is a problem but responds with "but you're a model minority" or at least you're not black/hispanic.

That means diddly squat in the discussion and yet, IIRC, this has happened in the past here in OT.

If you're going to take this route then why complain about anything being an American?

Let us take it to the absurdity:

Aren't we all lucky that we live in the US vs <insert horrible country>?

The height bias grievance and the thread are legitimate. Aya picked out some patterns that tend to pop up in these topics and I happened to agree. I don't think the main point was to diminish the topic, but to lend some perspective.

 

[Tunahead]

Look on the positive side, though: Prejudiced people are complete and utter morons. They have no awareness of anything, including the notion that some people might not like prejudice. This means it's real easy to spot which people are prejudiced, because they're too stupid to try and hide this negative quality from you. This is an absolute boon when dating. You can just cull all the bigots on first dates. You don't even have to ask any questions, because they can't wait to tell you about the Dolchstosslegende or Zionism or whatever dumb garbage is popular with those people now.

 

[Anarion07]

I'm 5'5

Spoiler

and female

Also, you aren't funny. I'd rather date a funny short dude than a tall idiot.


Twitter is your "evidence"? lmao

The poster i replied to said that attidues like that don't exist.
What kind of proof do you want then?
Unfortunately i havent recorded the incidents where stuff like that happened to me irl, which was twice so far.
And that definitely did not stem from a lack of confidence or the like.

Of course it is anecdotal evidence, but saying it doesnt exist is wrong.

 

[DongBeetle]

"Manlets" will never not be a funny thing to say. Sorry.

You know what other words sound funny and make people feel like dogshit?

 

[Epsilon-delta]

Good point. Except that Aya was writing about the way that people here are equating their height disadvantage to these other aspects of disadvantage. She addressed that specifically. She was also addressing the double standards rampant in this discussion, and by addressing the two responses to her argument and not the argument itself, you're actually not addressing the comment or the topic at all.

His/her reply is general and doesn't actually quote people who are equating their height disadvantage to other aspects of disadvantage.

I'm not denying or saying it cannot be discussed....but this whole thing seems like while you are annoyed that your height gives you a disadvantage in the dating world, I have also seen y'all dismissing other factors such as weight, disability and race that are also disadvantages.

Being short doesn't make you automatically undesirable the way that being fat, or in a wheelchair, or missing a limb, or being darker skin or having a a specific occupation is. I'm not saying you can't complain about it but this conversation always teeters on the line of being more mad at women for having these standards while in the same breath, some of these same short men won't even see themselves dating any one from any of those same other marganizlized groups.

If the discussion was simply about, hey being short in the business world and the stereotypes that go along with it is fucked up...then yes, short people have it bad. They also have it bad in the dating world, but it's not AS bad as other groups who literally get the worst end of the stick. You can be short and still be desired. Other people are still shitted on for stuff they haven't been able to control for centuries.... I'm not saying seek help, but having some self reflection on y'all opinions about y'all beauty standards is also fair game as well.

The part bolded is the definition of oppression olympics.

Edit: It sums up as yea, some people have it bad but others have it worse. It's lazy discussion at best.

 

[Stinkles]

I'm 5'10 and considered short but literally just on the cusp of tall enough that it's almost never been an issue except for dating a couple of really tall chicks but it seemed to bother them more than me.


Every now and then I would interact with people who had completely unrealistic criteria for dating including a minimum bar of six feet despite their own diminutive stature. It seemed like a bullet point checklist. One in particular wanted a six foot handsome Jewish Wall Street hedge fund manager and literally refused every other courtship attempt. She was not in the (physical or personality) tier of people who can command such rigid criteria and as a result is still single fifteen years later. And in manhattan to boot.

When people refuse to explore outside of their prejudices they miss opportunities and should be careful they're not being unreasonable.

 

[D i Z]

His/her reply is general and doesn't actually quote people who are equating their height disadvantage to other aspects of disadvantage.



The part bolded is the definition of oppression olympics.

Edit: It sums up as yea, some people have it bad but others have it worse. It's lazy discussion at best.

If you want to boil her entire contribution down to the one thing that you want to hang your hat on, go for it. You're not contributing much by doing so either, I hope you see that.

You know what other words sound funny and make people feel like dogshit?

I know plenty of words used throughout history to oppress a whole lot of people. Also know a lot of catchy buzzwords that are irksome, but won't make it out of the decade.

 

[DongBeetle]

I know plenty of words used throughout history to oppress a whole lot of people. Also know a lot of catchy buzzwords that are irksome, but won't make it out of the decade.

So you knowingly use and perpetuate a word even though its only purpose is to make people feel shitty for something they can't control? Dude

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Uh, as an above-average height black guy, short definitely is in the same realm as all of those other things.

Okay, sure, physical disability is at the bottom of that desirability chain, but being short or black/brown/dark are definitely the next few links up.

EDIT: Because I guess I have to:

Taken from: here.

The bottom line here is that for whatever reason, height in aggregate is a pretty significant factor in dating for both tall women and short men. Those groups have every right to gripe about it.

Mind you, the data is getting a little old. I do wish these dating companies would put out some more updated stuff.

8 - 12 range is ok. Same with messages. You also may have other contributing factors since OKC didn't do much research past their DB.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

His/her reply is general and doesn't actually quote people who are equating their height disadvantage to other aspects of disadvantage.



The part bolded is the definition of oppression olympics.

I agree that the reply is just flat out misguided, and I roll my eyes heartily at those quoting it and going "we're done", but I wish we would stop using the word "opression" when talking about height issues. Are short people really being oppressed in America? I don't think even discriminated is the right word. Mocked? Sure. Derided/disparaged/belittled/etc, sometimes, yeah. And that's of course not cool, at all, and it should be discussed. But opressed, discriminated, or being victims of prejudice? I think that might be taking it too far.

 

[DongBeetle]

I agree that the reply is just flat out misguided, and I roll my eyes heartily at those quoting it and going "we're done", but I wish we would stop using the word "opression" when talking about height issues. Are short people really being oppressed in America? I don't think even discriminated is the right word. Mocked? Sure. Derided/disparaged/belittled/etc, sometimes, yeah. And that's of course not cool, at all, and it should be discussed. But opressed, discriminated, or being victims of prejudice? I think that might be taking it too far.

Agree. It's still worthy of discussion without mockery.

 

[D i Z]

So you knowingly use and perpetuate a word even though its only purpose is to make people feel shitty for something they can't control? Dude

I actually don't use it. I made a statement about it. I do see that there isn't much of a distinction between the two however, and in this very same thread I've said that I would be more thoughtful of the discussion and lay off the jokes.

 

[wandering]

I'm 5'10 and considered short but literally just on the cusp of tall enough that it's almost never been an issue except for dating a couple of really tall chicks but it seemed to bother them more than me.


Every now and then I would interact with people who had completely unrealistic criteria for dating including a minimum bar of six feet despite their own diminutive stature. It seemed like a bullet point checklist. One in particular wanted a six foot handsome Jewish Wall Street hedge fund manager and literally refused every other courtship attempt. She was not in the (physical or personality) tier of people who can command such rigid criteria and as a result is still single fifteen years later. And in manhattan to boot.

When people refuse to explore outside of their prejudices they miss opportunities and should be careful they're not being unreasonable.

5'10 is short? Where do you live?

 

[NEO0MJ]

I do feel that it's wrong. Why does a short guy get told that he's "overcompensating" when he gets something nice but when a taller person does it people find it normal, like it's how the world works?

 

[DongBeetle]

I actually don't use it. I made a statement about it. I do see that there isn't much of a distinction between the two however, and in this very same thread I've said that I would be more thoughtful of the discussion and lay off the jokes.

Alright I get you. Yeah slurs are slurs

 

[Epsilon-delta]

If you want to boil her entire contribution down to the one thing that you want to hang your hat on, go for it. You're not contributing much by doing so either, I hope you see that.

I addressed the faulty logic in the reply; the same reply you told me to respond to.

If I'm not contributing much, then so are others who address arguments by pointing out how others have it worse.

 

[NEO0MJ]

5'10 is short? Where do you live?

Scandinavian country, maybe? They have an average height of 5'11, and I imagine the average of younger generations is even higher.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

I agree that the reply is just flat out misguided, and I roll my eyes heartily at those quoting it and going "we're done", but I wish we would stop using the word "opression" when talking about height issues. Are short people really being oppressed in America? I don't think even discriminated is the right word. Mocked? Sure. Derided/disparaged/belittled/etc, sometimes, yeah. And that's of course not cool, at all, and it should be discussed. But opressed, discriminated, or being victims of prejudice? I think that might be taking it too far.

Being discriminated by height is very real.

Perfectchaos linked an article/study showing how tall people are paid more compared to people who are average or below-average height.

Then you throw in the dating world scene.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Agree. It's still worthy of discussion without mockery.

Oh, most definitely. I think it's the first time I've participated in a "height" thread so I didn't know it was a recurring theme on GAF. I saw some of the first page posts and thought people were just being silly, or joking. Now on page 8 I'm not so sure. I think I've made my stance pretty clear here, but still this is an interesting thread.

 

[samn]

Uh, as an above-average height black guy, short definitely is in the same realm as all of those other things.

Okay, sure, physical disability is at the bottom of that desirability chain, but being short or black/brown/dark are definitely the next few links up.

EDIT: Because I guess I have to:

Taken from: here.

The bottom line here is that for whatever reason, height in aggregate is a pretty significant factor in dating for both tall women and short men. Those groups have every right to gripe about it.

Mind you, the data is getting a little old. I do wish these dating companies would put out some more updated stuff.

I don't find that OKCupid blog article very convincing. The underlying assumption is that the OKCupid population is identical to the US population. Taller men may be more willing to potentially humiliate themselves on online dating.

 

[Lovely Salsa]

Scandinavian country, maybe? They have an average height of 5'11, and I imagine the average of younger generations is even higher.

Dutchland is taller and dinaric alps or whatever they're called are at 6'1 average

 

[D i Z]

I addressed the faulty logic in the reply; the same reply you told me to respond to.

If I'm not contributing much, then so are others who address arguments by pointing out how others have it worse.

Ok. I'll just say that I got her reasoning, and the following discourse about it has opened this topic up a little and leave it at that then.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

5'10 is short? Where do you live?

Scandinavian country, maybe? They have an average height of 5'11, and I imagine the average of younger generations is even higher.

Wait, that's Frankie, doesn't he live in the States? He's bald though, so he's probably double discriminated.

Being discriminated by height is very real.

Perfectchaos linked an article/study showing how tall people are paid more compared to people who are average or below-average height.

Then you throw in the dating world scene.

Ah, I missed that. Thank you. I'll check now.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

It's very odd that this discussion isn't treated in the same way as other seemingly similar topics on this board.

I believe I know the logic but I really don't want to go into it.

 

[D i Z]

It's very odd that this discussion isn't treated in the same way as other seemingly similar topics on this board.

I believe I know the logic but I really don't want to go into it.

We're all here and it's worth talking about. I don't see why you wouldn't.

 

[NEO0MJ]

Dutchland is taller and dinaric alps or whatever they're called are at 6'1 average

Guess my data is outdated. Crazy how high the average height is in some countries.

Wait, that's Frankie, doesn't he live in the States? He's bald though, so he's probably double discriminated.

Don't know, just gave a possible explanation for why 5'10 might be considered short.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Being discriminated by height is very real.

Perfectchaos linked an article/study showing how tall people are paid more compared to people who are average or below-average height.

Then you throw in the dating world scene.

Well, yeah.

No one is arguing it doesn't exist. We all know it exists.

What some y'all can't seem to grasp is the intensity of your statements makes you look foolish. Your life isn't ending, you still on average make lots (if you're a white male), don't get pulled over by the cops, still get plenty of dates, don't have to receive a lot of harassmemt or threatening messages for rejecting a person, or any other of the very awful things disadvantaged people have. It's this bitter woe is me attitude that no one wants a part of cause you're making everything seem completely hostile and awful if you're shorter than 6 feet when that isn't true.

Bald men have it just as bad as short people in some areas but they move on. They accept the blows and realize that some ribbery isn't the end of their social, love, or career life.

 

[BigBlueBanana]

I'm 6'6", completely bald except for my beard which is gray. This has basically been my look since I was in my early 30's.

I don't think about my height much but I sometimes think it'd be nice to have a full head of dark hair in exchange for losing 10 inches of height.

 

[DongBeetle]

Well, yeah.

No one is arguing it doesn't exist. We all know it exists.

What some y'all can't seem to grasp is the intensity of your statements makes you look foolish. Your life isn't ending, you still on average make lots (if you're a white male), don't get pulled over by the cops, still get plenty of dates, don't have to receive a lot of harassmemt or threatening messages for rejecting a person, or any other of the very awful things disadvantaged people have. It's this bitter woe is me attitude that no one wants a part of cause you're making everything seem completely hostile and awful if you're shorter than 6 feet when that isn't true.

Not even close.

One can discuss a topic without resorting to oppression olympics. Because where does it stop in regards to other topics?

Who has it worse in the US? Blacks? Homeless? Transgender? Native Americans?

It depends on who ask or what studies you cite.

People venting their frustration over a disadvantage does not mean they're equating their discrimination to discrimination experienced by other marginalized groups. It just means their venting, nothing more. You're just trivializing their experiences to the point that it stifles honest discussion.

For example: bamboo ceiling in the Asian community or racism against Asians. Someone recognizes there is a problem but responds with "but you're a model minority" or at least you're not black/hispanic.

That means diddly squat in the discussion and yet, IIRC, this has happened in the past here in OT.

If you're going to take this route then why complain about anything being an American?

Let us take it to the absurdity:

Aren't we all lucky that we live in the US vs <insert horrible country>?

Good read for ya my man

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Good read for ya my man

Cause your world isn't ending. It never was. You can be upset but you'll still get the ribbing that a bald man gets. People aren't going to hand out sympathy if you're still well ahead in life.

 

[DongBeetle]

Cause your world isn't ending. It never was. You can be upset but you'll still get the ribbing that a bald man gets. People aren't going to hand out sympathy if you're still well ahead in life.

Right because none of this matters if my "world isnt ending"

What? We're trying to discuss a real issue here and you immediately dismiss all these people with that?

 

[Stinkles]

5'10 is short? Where do you live?

I don't think it's short but in my (US) peer group I'm often in the lower fiftieth percentile. Like I said, cusp. And people are getting taller all the time. My first few trips to Japan I would often be the tallest person in the train car but those days are long gone.

 

[tcrunch]

The effects of being short on job/economic/leadership prospects seem more important than not being as attractive to potential dates, but one of these things affects men and women both, while the other mostly affects just men until you get to the point of dwarfism, or in reverse case where very tall women struggle to find dates. I don't know what to tell ya OP.

 

[boiled goose]

Im not short and taller than most women, but woman being overly explicit about height preferences is a turn off.

It's shallow.

 

[Jindrax]

It's whatever you make of it.
You can complain and be complexed about it.
Blame all your shortcomings (lol) on it.

Or you can just accept that's the way it is and deal with it.

Yeah I'm pretty short and black. Still got a great job and I'm currently dating a girl who's actually taller than me.

You gotta use these things as motivation.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Don't know, just gave a possible explanation for why 5'10 might be considered short.

Oh, sorry. I don't know, the 6' standard perhaps? Like, it can both be a preconceived notion where if your height is below 6' (no matter if it's just one inch) then you're "short" by American standards, or it can be a visual thing if you work/socialize with people above 6'. I honestly don't know.

Well, yeah.

No one is arguing it doesn't exist. We all know it exists.

What some y'all can't seem to grasp is the intensity of your statements makes you look foolish. Your life isn't ending, you still on average make lots (if you're a white male), don't get pulled over by the cops, still get plenty of dates, don't have to receive a lot of harassmemt or threatening messages for rejecting a person, or any other of the very awful things disadvantaged people have. It's this bitter woe is me attitude that no one wants a part of cause you're making everything seem completely hostile and awful if you're shorter than 6 feet when that isn't true.

Bald men have it just as bad as short people in some areas but they move on. They accept the blows and realize that some ribbery isn't the end of their social, love, or career life.

I've seen your posts throughout the thread and I honestly cannot comprehend why you're being so obtuse. I don't see any "bitter woe is me" attitude, and I don't know that you're in a position to be telling people how to feel about their issues. Also, as a short bald guy, let me tell right now: you don't know what you're talking about.

I'm 6'6", completely bald except for my beard which is gray. This has basically been my look since I was in my early 30's.

I don't think about my height much but I sometimes think it'd be nice to have a full head of dark hair in exchange for losing 10 inches of height.

I don't have anything to offer to the gods to get 5 more inches of height and a full head of hair.

Im not short and taller than most women, but woman being overly explicit about height preferences is a turn off.

It's shallow.

Sure it is, but then if it's a turn off, why do you care? Like, somebody just removed themselves from your dating pool because of their shallow preferences. Why would you care about what that person thinks if you've just said you're turned off by that person's attitude?

 

[Village]

This

Or wallow in your self pity about the women/partners who do care and you never had a chance to begin with.

Ok I feel like this statement is sort of ineffective and trying to win a non existent argument, I don't think the op is willing in self pity. I just think they wish to have a conversation.

This just sort of comes off as needlessly " i want to be sassy and have the last word" along with the post you quoted rather that actually... like contributing to the conversation at large. Along with how the statement itself kind of just rolls over the complications of " get over that thing sections of society doesn't like you for being" is you know... complicated. That is an extremely complicated subject that with people with their own insecurities that can reasonably manifest because of the society push back against who or what they are however that may manifest.

So i guess my point is, your statement was kind of just mean and sassy and didn't really help, nor did the person you quote.

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

I mean I'm not gonna mock someone on their appearance but I can still have preferences if I want to date them. So yeah I'm swiping left on small tits because I love funbags (OP mentioned this in case someone thinks I'm just pulling it out of the blue)

 

[Anarion07]

I mean I'm not gonna mock someone on their appearance but I can still have preferences if I want to date them. So yeah I'm swiping left on small tits because I love funbags (OP mentioned this in case someone thinks I'm just pulling it out of the blue)

Which is perfectly fine. But put "small titted girls swipe Left" in your bio and you would be the jerk. While "only 6 feet and above " in a girls bio is standard

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

We're all here and it's worth talking about. I don't see why you wouldn't.

I believe it's the in-group out-group mentality.

Height is something that crosses all ethnicity, religions, cultures, etc. Because tall or short people are subgroups of nearly every privileged/unprivileged group out there, they are treated in the same way across all groups. And most people are not okay with letting their advantage go.

Thus the resistance to and mocking of of the topic at hand.

 

[7Th]

When will they learn?

 

[Village]

I can't say I understand this issue in particular, or that I ever understood. I was born a long ass baby, and I was tall all my life, I was taller than my teacher's in by fifth grade. Being a tall guy all my life I've never understood the desire of a partner who's taller than you and dismissing on that's smaller than you. So these threads are always interesting reads on some level

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Which is perfectly fine. But put "small titted girls swipe Left" in your bio and you would be the jerk. While "only 6 feet and above " in a girls bio is standard

Try something like "no tits no ass swipe left" vs "manlets swipe left". Both seem equally offensive to me.

But something like "I prefer voluptuous women" vs "I prefer tall men" where both will likely be seen as shallow, but not as offensive as the above (unless someone is easily offended).

It's one thing to have preferences for partners (and remember, Tinder is not OKCupid), it's another thing entirely to be an ass about it.

 

[ExVicis]

Try something like "no tits no ass swipe left" vs "manlets swipe left". Both seem equally offensive to me.

But something like "I prefer voluptuous women" vs "I prefer tall men" where both will likely be seen as shallow, but not as offensive as the above (unless someone is easily offended).

It's one thing to have preferences for partners (and remember, Tinder is not OKCupid), it's another thing entirely to be an ass about it.

"I don't want none unless you gut buns hun"

 

[WeirdoStalkerJr]

I am 5 8 stocky, know how to box. Pretty much don't fuck me. Us short folk are usually the first to scrap and throw down.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

Cause your world isn't ending. It never was. You can be upset but you'll still get the ribbing that a bald man gets. People aren't going to hand out sympathy if you're still well ahead in life.

Reading over AyaisMUsikWhore's post more and more, I can understand where he/she is coming from and why DiZ and Crayon made their replies.

You other hand, I cannot.

It's just outright dismissal. OT should not be reduced to a flowchart where topics are only discussed if they are world-ending or not.