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[Aaron Strife]

It's not that rural voters deserve nothing, but what does anyone expect "us" (Democrats as a whole) to do if they keep their heads in the sand and vote for Republicans who are doing everything they can to inflict as much pain on people as possible?

Trump is president, not Clinton or Sanders. The Republicans control Congress, not Democrats. They also control most of the state governments.

Clinton ran on a platform that highlighted the drug epidemic in rural communities, expanding high-speed internet nationwide, investing more into education and infrastructure, job training programs, all things that could lift up rural towns and citizens. Trump waddled in peddling snake oil about bringing the coal industry back and making healthcare cheaper and better than the Affordable Care Act. Guess who they voted for? It wasn't just Clinton either (although there may be things about her campaign that exacerbated the trend), as these states and towns have been slipping away from Democrats for decades. West Virginia was a solid Clinton state in 1996 that went for Trump by forty points.

Democrats should absolutely pay heed to rural concerns and include them in their platform. I don't think anyone reasonable is advocating that we just say fuck it to these communities and let them die - that's the Republican Party. But Democratic Congressmen, Senators etc. have their own priorities, appealing to their districts and states. We can't carry the load for rural voters. If rural communities want the federal government to invest in them, they need to elect representatives to Congress who will do that. They need to elect governors and state legislatures who will work with Congress, not spit in the eye of transportation projects that would create jobs or Medicaid expansion that would literally save lives. We're not responsible for what the fucking Republicans are doing.

Just to give an example, one of the few prominent Democratic politicians left in these areas, Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia - no friend of the left - is fighting hard to restore health benefits for coal workers in his state. He was joined by Sherrod Brown of Ohio, trying to do the same thing for coal workers in Ohio, Kentucky and West Virginia. The other four Senators of those states - Shelly Moore-Capito, Mitch McConnell, Rand Paul and Rob Portman - are all Republicans and give absolutely no fuck about helping their constituents. McConnell is the Senate majority leader and still refuses to do anything about it. And I have no doubt in my mind that all four of these GOP Senators will be re-elected next time they're up, because their voters will either be fooled by whatever bullshit the GOP is peddling then, or because they decided hurting black people is just that much more important than their own fucking lives.

 

[jman2050]

What exactly do you want from us? We offer them help for years and they slap us with Trump. Now they're okay with their elected leaders lying about easily proved shit, attacking journalists, and full-on corruption. Why should we be nice to people who go out of their way to hurt us?

Well this is the age-old conundrum of human history. It's really easy to be self-serving and advance your own interests at the expense of everyone else, and it's easy to attain and exercise power this way. It's really hard, conversely, to remain committed to helping others and acting in a way sympathetic to people's needs when those same people oppose and spit on your attempts to be hospitable to their troubles and in fact hurt you back.

In that situation it's essentially a power struggle in your mind to determine what is the truly "good" course of action to take. Some people are wholly committed to trying to help as many people as they can regardless of how much they're taken advantage of and how much they are ruined by being unwilling to reciprocate harm with harm. Others are far more pragmatic and adopt a give-and-take approach where the only people deserving of help are those willing to take it and attack us in return. And then it only gets more complicated and shaded from there. Meanwhile a person with less scruples doesn't have to worry about any of this. "Does this help me and the people I know that will help me further in the future? Let's do it."

It's an unequal balance of power. It's much harder to act in the interests of a group that doesn't necessarily include you than it is to act in the interests of a group that's centered around you.

 

[WascallyWabbit]

It's not that rural voters deserve nothing, but what does anyone expect "us" (Democrats as a whole) to do if they keep their heads in the sand and vote for Republicans who are doing everything they can to inflict as much pain on people as possible?

Trump is president, not Clinton or Sanders. The Republicans control Congress, not Democrats. They also control most of the state governments.

Clinton ran on a platform that highlighted the drug epidemic in rural communities, expanding high-speed internet nationwide, investing more into education and infrastructure, job training programs, all things that could lift up rural towns and citizens. Trump waddled in peddling snake oil about bringing the coal industry back and making healthcare cheaper and better than the Affordable Care Act. Guess who they voted for? It wasn't just Clinton either (although there may be things about her campaign that exacerbated the trend), as these states and towns have been slipping away from Democrats for decades. West Virginia was a solid Clinton state in 1996 that went for Trump by forty points.

Democrats should absolutely pay heed to rural concerns and include them in their platform. I don't think anyone reasonable is advocating that we just say fuck it to these communities and let them die - that's the Republican Party. But Democratic Congressmen, Senators etc. have their own priorities, appealing to their districts and states. We can't carry the load for rural voters. If rural communities want the federal government to invest in them, they need to elect representatives to Congress who will do that. They need to elect governors and state legislatures who will work with Congress, not spit in the eye of transportation projects that would create jobs or Medicaid expansion that would literally save lives. We're not responsible for what the fucking Republicans are doing.

Just to give an example, one of the few prominent Democratic politicians left in these areas, Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia - no friend of the left - is fighting hard to restore health benefits for coal workers in his state. He was joined by Sherrod Brown of Ohio, trying to do the same thing for coal workers in Ohio, Kentucky and West Virginia. The other four Senators of those states - Shelly Moore-Capito, Mitch McConnell, Rand Paul and Rob Portman - are all Republicans and give absolutely no fuck about helping their constituents. McConnell is the Senate majority leader and still refuses to do anything about it. And I have no doubt in my mind that all four of these GOP Senators will be re-elected next time they're up, because their voters will either be fooled by whatever bullshit the GOP is peddling then, or because they decided hurting black people is just that much more important than their own fucking lives.

Well said!

 

[Mr_Antimatter]

This attitude is poisonous, and it contributes significantly to the growing polarization against the liberal establishment in rural areas. They're not stupid, and they can see the paternalism and contempt emanating from elite power centers.

It blows my mind how common it is to hear things like this from people who claim to be from the party of compassion.

You cannot help those who do not want your help. Having lives in small towns most of my youth to early adulthood, they are often governed by older, very conservative folks who dinner want change, competitive businesses, or anything else that challenges their power.

Any contempt that liberals have for them is due largely to decades if not centuries of contempt for anything liberal.

At some point, you have to wash your hands of them, focus on people who actually want help, and leave them to their fiefdoms of dirt. It's such a shame they hold such disproportionate political power.

 

[Derwind]

I'm seeing it happen in this thread, and I want to caution against this behavior because it has a worrying trajectory:

Please don't demonize Rural America, for simply being Rural Americans.

It's one thing to say, "Oh you voted for an asshole? you're either an asshole or just plain stupid." It's another thing entirely to say, "Oh you live in an area that historically votes for assholes? you're either an asshole or just plain stupid."

Hand-waving the slow decay of the entirety of Rural America because you assume they're probably backward thinking folk is a big leap in logic, and only breeds a condescending bias against them.

I'm not preaching any "reach across the isle/just try talking to the bigots!" type of nonsense. All I'm saying is to not let the lone mention of the phrase "Rural America" sap any semblance of concern you have for these people away. There are Rural Americans who didn't vote Trump, and Rural Americans who aren't bigots.

While I do roast rural Trump voters, I agree in part with your message. But the trend of urbanization and automation aren't something that you can simply reverse and the majority of the leadership in these areas have had a big R next to there name for sometimes decades and generations. The same leadership that has failed to get ahead of this problem these rural communities faces. Rather they've been profiting from these very consistent RED counties and have done very little to help these people.

You can moan & groan about a random Twitter user, article, the elite left or neogaffers being too harsh rural parts of America but these are not the people that have caused this situation to spiral out of control.

I hope those that can be convinced in those regions make the changes necessary to better their lives and the lives of their family.

I'd customarily make a joke about not having a spare bootstrap on hand but I'll opt out from the jokes today.

 

[Lubricus]

At some point it has to flip the other way though, doesn't it? If you end up with all this empty space in the heartland.. won't someone eventually capitalize on that?

Big agriculture, timber, waste disposal are some of the things growing in rural areas but the need for labor is down since these industries have gotten more efficient.

Intensive farming such as chicken and pork houses are pretty much automatic- feeding, water, and environmental control are all automatic.

Small towns supplying local farmers are unnecessary now.

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

Except it's also suburban areas that are trending blue.



I get where you are coming from, but rural America is increasingly becoming THE problem holding America back and stubbornly doing so. Particularly WHITE rural America.

If they can actually be won over by Bernie types at the local and state level I am willing to try, but:

- Nationally Dems need to focus on just maximizing suburban and urban votes
- If they CAN'T be won over by Bernie types than we shouldn't waste any time with them.

One of the problems is that they actually think they ARE voting in their own interests. They are constantly used and lied to by their candidates/representatives.

Dems since 2008 help out the rural voter quite a decent bit via their legislation, but too often ignore them at best "oh, they're lost to us, whatever lol". Terrible messaging.

GOP for decades have treated them like the salt of the earth, the backbone of America, yet do jack shit for them ever.

It's one of the reason we're seeing such fervent devotion to Bernie and Trump is that they on the campaign trail didn't hew to this song and dance and cut thru the partisan divide on an axis never seen before.

I've been formulating for a while now that large tracts of America's heartland from Georgia to WV to South Dakota to Texas is degenerating into a "white ghetto" where few jobs, few immigrants, few young people ever move to but a whole lotta drugs do. I think alot of people there deep down realize this and have went for upheaval candidates...it's just that for everyone's worst interest it was the traitorous, manchild conman, so the problem will only exacerbate rather than replace the current "say one thing, do another" rhetoric and action from Washington and to a large part, the states.

 

[TestOfTide]

Dems since 2008 help out the rural voter quite a decent bit via their legislation, but too often ignore them at best "oh, they're lost to us, whatever lol". Terrible messaging.

GOP for decades have treated them like the salt of the earth, the backbone of America, yet do jack shit for them ever.

It's one of the reason we're seeing such fervent devotion to Bernie and Trump is that they on the campaign trail didn't hew to this song and dance and cut thru the partisan divide on an axis never seen before.

I've been formulating for a while now that large tracts of America's heartland from Georgia to WV to South Dakota to Texas is degenerating into a "white ghetto" where few jobs, few immigrants, few young people ever move to but a whole lotta drugs do. I think alot of people there deep down realize this and have went for upheaval candidates...it's just that for everyone's worst interest it was the traitorous, manchild conman, so the problem will only exacerbate rather than replace the current "say one thing, do another" rhetoric and action from Washington and to a large part, the states.

Well maybe those areas shouldn't be so damn arrogant as to refer to themselves as the "heartland of America" or "real America" as though they matter more than the cities and suburbs that actually support this country's economy.

Conservatives may like to think about Rural America when they think of America, but the vast majority of Americans do NOT think of Rural America when they imagine America in their head.

New York City is just as much "real America", if not more so.

 

[Zeus Molecules]

A lot of this I feel is the long term effects of Walmart on small rural communities and the economic recession.

 

[kirblar]

A lot of this I feel is the long term effects of Walmart on small rural communities and the economic recession.

Wal-Mart hasn't done this to them- retail shops were never providing keystone industries that would anchor a town.

 

[super-heated plasma]

Grew up and lived almost 2/3rds my life in rural Michigan. It was garbage. Full of bigots. Glad to never go back.

Almost exactly like my story, though I lived the first third in the Sterling Heights before moving to Lapeer county.

 

[PHOENIXZERO]

Grew up and lived almost 2/3rds my life in rural Michigan. It was garbage. Full of bigots. Glad to never go back.

Most of Michigan sucks.


My county has an active KKK chapter. =\

 

[Izayoi]

A lot of this I feel is the long term effects of Walmart on small rural communities and the economic recession.

Walmart is just a small piece in this puzzle.