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[Callibretto]

the cutest Ace Attorney girls now is Trucy, followed by Iris and Maggie imo, well

Spoiler

Vera is pretty cute, I like her animation with drawing emoticons

Adrian is pretty, but not exactly cute, I'd group her with Franziska, Desiree, Mia and Angel Star from pw 1 case 5

 

[clav]

Thinking about it:

Spoiler

The game feels really incomplete. I can't point me finger on it, but it seems like there is no tension in the whole game.

Trucy doesn't get hurt. Klavier just helps you out and doesn't object much. Ema bitches, not enough science searching: nothing new except the scanner and footprint analysis.

The whole Gavin plot scheme and who is really who were somewhat shocking, but it wasn't really that shocking compared to the previous PW games.

Liked the Mason system. Somewhat wish we could play the investigation parts like that.

Apollo doesn't seem the right PW replacement we all love. Sure, I like the perceive mode. Way better than Psychelocks, though it seems like I've grown to like those as well. He seems not confident of himself either. Not "cool" enough.

I don't know. Somewhat disappointed.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Okay, I just beat the game. Here is my massive critique on the game.

Note: Spoilers

------

When we first heard that Phoenix Wright would not be the lead protagonist in the latest Gyakuten Saiban game, people thought that Capcom jumped the shark. Then we heard rumblings from Japan about how the characters were weak, and the game itself was a lower tiered entry. Here is why I think that this viewpoint is wrong.

Gameplay -

Spoiler

Like the other Ace Attorney games, the gameplay is split into two parts. The entire game also has 3D objects that can be viewed and analyzed. Capcom also has a lot more features that uses the stylus. The heir to Psyce Locks,the "Perceive" system is slightly more realistic. This new system is a lot of fun and it is a hell of a time. I am hoping that we can use this out of court in Gyakuten Saiban 5 and 6 because it really adds to the game. In case 4 we also got the return of Psychelocks and at that point we see the clunkiness of the old system compared to the Perceive System. We also got the new addition of the Mason system that was essentially keeping track of Phoenix Wright's adventures in the 7 years after he got his badge pulled. I will say it before and I will say it again. The Mason system is awesome as hell and this form of storytelling has unlimited potential, here is hoping that we will get more of it again. The pacing of the cases were great, but I do wish that we had 3 day cases like in the first game.

The Main Cast -

Spoiler

The main cast is great. Apollo Justice is more naive and less sarcastic than Phoenix Wright, while being more hot blooded than Phoenix. The plot twist about him being Trucy's older brother was brilliant, even though I pretty much guessed this before the plot twist was revealed. Trucy is absolutely adorable as a sidekick. She is incredibly likable to the nth degree. She also is incredibly naive about the world, but her naivete kind of gives her unintentional sarcasm. Hopefully she stays on as the sidekick so we could really see her blossom as a character.

On the other hand, Ema Skye was nowhere near as likable and endearing as I like her to be. Plot wise, it makes sense as to why she is the way she is, but ultimately it also makes her pretty unlikable. She is nice to Apollo and they have a sense of camaraderie, but her biting attitude can grate on you. Phoenix Wright plays a big role, and his new role as a broke piano player fits him surprisingly well. We see that he retains his acumen as an attorney (arguably he never lost it since he spent 7 years trying to find a resolution). Hopefully the torch will be passed from this point onwards, because his role in what is supposed to be a new story arc was too big. This reminded me of Kaliedo Star when the lead was chasing after someone, but never officially became the successor until the next season. Klavier Gavin was a great character, not a great prosecutor. There was a sense of tension with him, but it was never as divisive as Von Karma or Godot. This is why beating him was anticlimactic, because for the most part he was kind of on your side. He was a perfect gentleman, and because of that he was a weaker prosecutor. I wonder if his reaction to the plot twist in the end would lead to a more interesting Gavin in the next games.

The Secondary Cast -

Spoiler

Of the secondary cast, there are some that worked out really well and some that didn't. The one that stuck out the most was Lamiroir and her whole story. She was a blind person pretending to see and she had amnesia. Could her character be any more stereotypical? With that said, she was a surprisingly good character. She was extremely likable and hopefully she will get developed more in the next games. On the other hand, the game had some annoying characters, whether it was intentionally or unintentionally. The ones that stick out the most were characters like Wocky and Brushel that just rubbed me the wrong way. That is a given, just like any Phoenix Wright/Ace Attorney game.

The main Villains -

Spoiler

The game's 3 main villains were interesting. Alita was manipulative, but she wasn't truly evil, so taking her down didn't feel too good. Daryan was a total prick and beating him felt good. The main ultimate villain, Kristoph Gavin lives up to the Phoenix Wright/Ace Attorney supervillain. On the evil scale he doesn't touch Dahlia (my avatar), but that is to be expected since she was the ultimate Villain in the series and we wont likely see another villain on her level until Ace Attorney 6. On the other hand, he stands up quite well to Engarde and Von Karma. Kristoph was evil and manipulative. At first he forged documents so that he could win the court case against his little brother, then after he gets kicked off by Zak Gramarye he uses it to take it out on Phoenix Wright. Then to clear traces of his fake documents, he tries to kill the people involved. If that wasn't enough, he was crazy to keep tabs on all the people involved in the case, even as his star rose as a defense attorney. Then it ends in a crescendo when he kills Zak and tries to pin it on Phoenix Wright.

Plot Holes

Spoiler

-Thalassa Gramarye was shot when an accident went wrong. Nothing was explained on how she went in Bolginia
-Nothing about Apollo Justice's background is explained, except who is his mother. This will likely be explained in the future
-Thalassa/Lamirior never told Apollo and Trucy that she is their mother. Through the mason system "we" the jury (in Case 4) found out about it, but the game never really made a distinction on what "we" as the jury know, or what Apollo as the defense attorney knew going into the last part of case 4
-What the hell happened to Machi, he is going to jail, sure. It was odd that they didn't show him in the ending credits
-Of course, we also don't know how most of the cast of the first 3 Ace Attorney games feel about Phoenix's "Forgery of Evidence." Especially when we consider that this was published all over.

 

[Callibretto]

agreed for the most part with hcoregamer except for one big part. I think

Spoiler

Kristoph is very weak as the main villain, by far, the weakest of any other pw main villain. his motive is jealousy and pride, similar with Manfred von Karma, but his method is very weak. blame Phoenix for forging evidence and then tried to eliminate witness. but his plan failed for 7 years. even Matt engarde is more interesting by hiring a hitman, kidnapper, and then try to double cross the hitman later. also he managed to slip through the magatama by not lying that he didn't kill the victim.

some of the plotholes, I expect them is intentional to leave something open for future sequels, like we know about Maya's missing mother in PW1 but never see her until PW3. I just hope they

Spoiler

don't kill Phoenix, because like you said, his role in the story is basically over, but I really don't want him to be killed like Mia

 

[clav]

agreed for the most part with hcoregamer except for one big part. I think

Spoiler

Kristoph is very weak as the main villain, by far, the weakest of any other pw main villain. his motive is jealousy and pride, similar with Manfred von Karma, but his method is very weak. blame Phoenix for forging evidence and then tried to eliminate witness. but his plan failed for 7 years. even Matt engarde is more interesting by hiring a hitman, kidnapper, and then try to double cross the hitman later. also he managed to slip through the magatama by not lying that he didn't kill the victim.

some of the plotholes, I expect them is intentional to leave something open for future sequels, like we know about Maya's missing mother in PW1 but never see her until PW3. I just hope they

Spoiler

don't kill Phoenix, because like you said, his role in the story is basically over, but I really don't want him to be killed like Mia

Spoiler

Everyone knows Phoenix can't die. He's been tested in two situations.

Falling off the bridge and getting hit by a car

 

[kiryogi]

Well.. I just finished it this moment. But, I'm pretty bad about putting down what I feel about it right at that moment. Especially if it was really good. Hopefully I can be a bit more collected in the next day and post my thoughts as well. On the other hand now.. How many years will it be until Ace Attorney 5 ;_;

 

[AshStrife]

Ok, I finished the game but I have three questions that have been bugging me.

Case 4-1:

Spoiler

What was the big deal about the forged evidence? Phoenix never presented the card as the real card but more as a hypothetical example of what happened to the real card and why it was missing. There was nothing remotely illegal about it. But after the trial, Apollo was OMG! Forged Evidence!

Case 4-4:

Spoiler

Ok it was established that Kristoph tried to kill the Mishams using the stamp and nail polish but the trap got delayed because Vera decided to preserve the stamp. My question is what triggered the trap after 7 years? Why did Drew suddenly decide to use the stamp which he had avoided before because of Vera.

2nd Question regarding Case 4-4:

Spoiler

What was the deal with Zak, he could have avoided all the mess by presenting the real page from the diary but instead never shows it to Phoenix. He later then shows up and tries to destroy Phoenix's poker playing career after apologizing for destroying his lawyer career.

Overall thoughts on the game
I pretty much liked all the new characters. Apollo needs a little bit more development though for his overall character felt a little too much like Phoenix from PW1. Loved the visuals, music and the integration of 3D crime scenes with scientific evidence. Hope they further build up on the game engine.

On the negative side, the final case was a letdown. I appreciate what they were trying to do in the final case but I am pretty sure everyone noticed the paradoxical nature of the

Spoiler

Mason System. Phoenix was often gathering evidence from the present and was using them to derive information in the past. Also Apollo wasn't properly integrated in the final case. There seemed to be huge disconnect between the case and Apollo, which leads me to believe the writers didn't properly think their way through the final case.

Hopefully, they remedy this in the next game.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

I have another question, CASE FOUR SPOILERS

Spoiler

why was Zak being such a dick and trying to cheat on Phoenix at poker, that seems a bit harsh considering he already screwed over Phoenix and lost him his badge.

 

[Callibretto]

Ok, I finished the game but I have three questions that have been bugging me.

Case 4-1:

Spoiler

What was the big deal about the forged evidence? Phoenix never presented the card as the real card but more as a hypothetical example of what happened to the real card and why it was missing. There was nothing remotely illegal about it. But after the trial, Apollo was OMG! Forged Evidence!

I think the problem is

Spoiler

that the card is not presented as hypothethical example at the beginning. if I remember right, Phoenix said he took the card and give it to Trucy to later give it back during trial. also the whole case is built using that card on the premise that there's blood in the card, where in actuality, Phoenix lied about finding that card. he bluffed knowing Kristoph can't denied it because if he did, he basically admit he take the real card

Case 4-4:

Spoiler

Ok it was established that Kristoph tried to kill the Mishams using the stamp and nail polish but the trap got delayed because Vera decided to preserve the stamp. My question is what triggered the trap after 7 years? Why did Drew suddenly decide to use the stamp which he had avoided before because of Vera.

probably because he is now aware that

Spoiler

Zak has contacted Phoenix, so he want to tied any loose ends which is Zak, framing Phoenix for Zak's murder, and maybe sending letter to Misham warning him about Brushnel and told him to reply back using the old stamp, this will in turn lead to events that may make Vera nervous and biting his poisoned nail. personally I think Kristoph is very weak as the main villain, all his plan doesn't work out as he planned. first Zak got away, then Drew Misham don't die for 7 long years, and later Apollo with Phoenix's help put him in jail

2nd Question regarding Case 4-4:

Spoiler

What was the deal with Zak, he could have avoided all the mess by presenting the real page from the diary but instead never shows it to Phoenix. He later then shows up and tries to destroy Phoenix's poker playing career after apologizing for destroying his lawyer career.

only thing I can think of is probably

Spoiler

Zak is just that passionate about Poker, and since this is supposedly his last game with Phoenix before he has to go into hiding again which is why he loose temper. but I agree, it's a little weird he snaps over poker after having friendly chat with Phoenix

Overall thoughts on the game
I pretty much liked all the new characters. Apollo needs a little bit more development though for his overall character felt a little too much like Phoenix from PW1. Loved the visuals, music and the integration of 3D crime scenes with scientific evidence. Hope they further build up on the game engine.

On the negative side, the final case was a letdown. I appreciate what they were trying to do in the final case but I am pretty sure everyone noticed the paradoxical nature of the

Spoiler

Mason System. Phoenix was often gathering evidence from the present and was using them to derive information in the past. Also Apollo wasn't properly integrated in the final case. There seemed to be huge disconnect between the case and Apollo, which leads me to believe the writers didn't properly think their way through the final case.

from what I gather, the

Spoiler

mason system, whenever you use evidence from the future, it's meant to imply that Phoenix realize it later. after the end of past mason event, we usually get Phoenix comment like 'by the time I realize, it's already too late' or something like that

 

[AshStrife]

I think the problem is

Spoiler

that the card is not presented as hypothethical example at the beginning. if I remember right, Phoenix said he took the card and give it to Trucy to later give it back during trial. also the whole case is built using that card on the premise that there's blood in the card, where in actuality, Phoenix lied about finding that card. he bluffed knowing Kristoph can't denied it because if he did, he basically admit he take the real card

Ok, that makes sense. I'll replay that part later.

probably because he is now aware that

Spoiler

Zak has contacted Phoenix, so he want to tied any loose ends which is Zak, framing Phoenix for Zak's murder, and maybe sending letter to Misham warning him about Brushnel and told him to reply back using the old stamp, this will in turn lead to events that may make Vera nervous and biting his poisoned nail. personally I think Kristoph is very weak as the main villain, all his plan doesn't work out as he planned. first Zak got away, then Drew Misham don't die for 7 long years, and later Apollo with Phoenix's help put him in jail

Well I guess that explanation is satisfactory but yeah the plan was pretty weak. I really don't think it makes much sense for

Spoiler

Drew to use the original stamp for it meant so much to Vera.

only thing I can think of is probably

Spoiler

Zak is just that passionate about Poker, and since this is supposedly his last game with Phoenix before he has to go into hiding again which is why he loose temper. but I agree, it's a little weird he snaps over poker after having friendly chat with Phoenix

Yeah, but he did not only want to beat him at poker

Spoiler

by cheating. He also wanted to frame Phoenix as a cheater.I can see why he wanted to win badly but why frame Phoenix?

from what I gather, the

Spoiler

mason system, whenever you use evidence from the future, it's meant to imply that Phoenix realize it later. after the end of past mason event, we usually get Phoenix comment like 'by the time I realize, it's already too late' or something like that

That makes sense to a certain extent but remember the part where

Spoiler

Phoenix gets Thalassa's photo from the reporter. He then uses that to get information from Zak about Apollo. He couldn't have met the reporter until he had talked to Zak, and obviously that means he couldn't have gotten the photograph until after the meeting with Zak.

 

[Link1110]

Spoiler

Everyone knows Phoenix can't die.

(Speculation)

Spoiler

I expect Phoenix to die sometime in AA5. I'm guessing the second case, but I'd hope he'd get a full last case dedicated to it.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

some of the plotholes, I expect them is intentional to leave something open for future sequels, like we know about Maya's missing mother in PW1 but never see her until PW3. I just hope they

Spoiler

don't kill Phoenix, because like you said, his role in the story is basically over, but I really don't want him to be killed like Mia

If anything else I think that

Spoiler

Lamoire will get killed later on, and her death will likely be in the grand finale of this saga when Trucy and Apollo find out they are brother and sister. As much as I hate for it to happen, there is already a precedent when Misty Fey was officially murdered in Case 5 with Maya and Phoenix Wright finding out the truth near the end.

Also if you consider

Spoiler

Phoenix Wright's role as Apollo's mentor, it also kind of makes sense for him to get killed because it is a cloud that will always be looming over Apollo Justice. Phoenix Wright has always been a level above Apollo, and he will always be there as a point of comparison. That is of course unless Capcom makes him a prosecutor, which would also make sense because in effect Apollo Justice would "beat him" in the final court battle, thus handing the baton over to Apollo.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Well.. I just finished it this moment. But, I'm pretty bad about putting down what I feel about it right at that moment. Especially if it was really good. Hopefully I can be a bit more collected in the next day and post my thoughts as well. On the other hand now.. How many years will it be until Ace Attorney 5 ;_;

I predict a full announcement at TGS and a Japanese release in Spring 2009, with a USA release in Fall 2009.

The huge increase in USA sales from AA3 ----> AA4 will teach capcom to never put an english version of GS again for the Japanese. So we wont effectively be able to play it until the Fall release.

 

[Hero]

I predict a full announcement at TGS and a Japanese release in Spring 2009, with a USA release in Fall 2009.

The huge increase in USA sales from AA3 ----> AA4 will teach capcom to never put an english version of GS again for the Japanese. So we wont effectively be able to play it until the Fall release.

Are you saying that AA4 is already performing better than AA3 and you suspect it's because lots of people imported AA3? Just making sure I'm following you.

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

Spoiler

All I can hope for is to have Apollo get more character development in the next game. This still felt like it was Phoenix's game. Hopefully Capcom will just let the writers do what they want next time.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Are you saying that AA4 is already performing better than AA3 and you suspect it's because lots of people imported AA3? Just making sure I'm following you.

A niche game with a limited fanbase.

This niche game sells in Japan with an english translation 3 months before the USA release. Naturally it will split the fanbase, and thus cut sales.

How many of those "core Phoenix Wright fans" actually double dipped like me and bought GS3 DS and AA3?

Spoiler

All I can hope for is to have Apollo get more character development in the next game. This still felt like it was Phoenix's game. Hopefully Capcom will just let the writers do what they want next time.

Since Apollo and Trucy have been developed, and they are very likable. Hopefully that means they can cut off all ties with the previous games.

I am hoping for cameos of

Spoiler

Vera and Lamiroir

in the next two games, not Pearls and the rest of the cast from AA1-3

 

[Hero]

While this is logical I was curious if you actually had some kind of source or something, I didn't hear anything about the sales of either game.

 

[Cynar]

I preferred the cast of the first three games. 4 was ok but I won't be getting 5 if it follows Apollo and Trucy.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

While this is logical I was curious if you actually had some kind of source or something, I didn't hear anything about the sales of either game.

Here is what I know.

Phoenix Wright (AA1) - 100,000 sold
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
AA2: Justice for All
.
.
.
.
.
.
.(x5) AA3: Trial and Tribulations

From what I hear in the retail space, AA4 is already on track to beating AA2 by a pretty large margin, and the damn game was just released last week. When it is all said and done it wont do Phoenix Wright numbers, but it will definitely do far better than AA2 and AA3.

I preferred the cast of the first three games. 4 was ok but I won't be getting 5 if it follows Apollo and Trucy.

There really is nothing I can say to a statement like this.

*shakes head in disgust*

 

[grandjedi6]

I preferred the cast of the first three games. 4 was ok but I won't be getting 5 if it follows Apollo and Trucy.

Apollo > Phoenix
Trucy > all the Feys combined

 

[AshStrife]

Also if you consider

Spoiler

Phoenix Wright's role as Apollo's mentor, it also kind of makes sense for him to get killed because it is a cloud that will always be looming over Apollo Justice. Phoenix Wright has always been a level above Apollo, and he will always be there as a point of comparison. That is of course unless Capcom makes him a prosecutor, which would also make sense because in effect Apollo Justice would "beat him" in the final court battle, thus handing the baton over to Apollo.

I really don't see any reason for them to kill

Spoiler

Phoenix. A background role where he momentarily pops up to give advice will be well suited for him. Heck that's what he did in cases 4-2 and 4-3 and it was perfect. Remember Mia, even though they killed her, she kept popping up to give advice. This time if they kill Phoenix, they won't be able to pop him back.

Also I really don't see them doing the same thing twice. It would be quite lame.

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

Apollo > Phoenix
Trucy > all the Feys combined

I heartily agree. And I think Phoenix is a better

Spoiler

mentor than Mia, too.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Apollo > Phoenix
Trucy > Maya/Emma

Fixed for great justice

"All the feys" would also include Misty, Mia,

Spoiler

Iris, Dahlia

, Morgan, and Pearls.

I really don't see any reason for them to kill

Spoiler

Phoenix. A background role where he momentarily pops up to give advice will be well suited for him. Heck that's what he did in cases 4-2 and 4-3 and it was perfect. Remember Mia, even though they killed her, she kept popping up to give advice. This time if they kill Phoenix, they won't be able to pop him back.

Also I really don't see them doing the same thing twice. It would be quite lame.

I agree, he was an amazing "master" to be mentoring Apollo.

I just can't see Apollo leaving his shadow

Spoiler

unless he somehow "beats" Phoenix and surpasses his master. It would be a hell of a treat seeing Phoenix try for the prosecutors office and be the "final boss" in AA5.

 

[Durante]

Spoiler

The game feels really incomplete. I can't point me finger on it, but it seems like there is no tension in the whole game.

Trucy doesn't get hurt. Klavier just helps you out and doesn't object much. Ema bitches, not enough science searching: nothing new except the scanner and footprint analysis.

I just finished the game, and I agree.

Spoiler

The short time playing as Phoenix during case 4 just drove home how superior he is to Apollo. Even if you disregard their character (though I'd take sarcastic over naive any day) his expressions and gestures are just a lot more memorable IMO.

Also, I can't fully explain it, but the cases felt somewhat cramped or confined compared to part 3.

Now don't get me wrong, I still enjoyed the game greatly and it glued me to the DS like only AA games can, but in the end it's quite disappointing.

 

[BorkBork]

Just finished the first case. Best first case in an Ace Attorney game by far.

*M. Night Shamamamamalan* WHAT A TWIST!

 

[Hcoregamer00]

I just finished the game, and I agree.

Spoiler

The short time playing as Phoenix during case 4 just drove home how superior he is to Apollo. Even if you disregard their character (though I'd take sarcastic over naive any day) his expressions and gestures are just a lot more memorable IMO.

Also, I can't fully explain it, but the cases felt somewhat cramped or confined compared to part 3.

Now don't get me wrong, I still enjoyed the game greatly and it glued me to the DS like only AA games can, but in the end it's quite disappointing.

Well, the only reason why Apollo wasn't as memorable as Phoenix in my opinion is because

Spoiler

Phoenix had too strong of a role in here, and we see that he is far beyond Apollo. Even as an attorney without a badge, he never lost his touch as an "ace attorney." The character of Apollo wasn't weak at all, it was that the juggernaut called Phoenix Wright was still commanding the storyline

I totally agree about AA4 being a little rushed and cramped compared to AA3.

Spoiler

Reason 1: The final case was spent mostly investigating through the mason system and finding out the truth behind Phoenix losing his badge as an attorney.

Reason 2: The pacing of the game didn't have an epic ending because the final part of the game didn't have a 3 part trial.

Reason 3: The pacing of the entire game, made it feel less epic. They had 4 cases, and in all honesty it would have been far better paced as 5-6 cases. The game would have made much more sense if Case 4 was the flashback case with Phoenix Wright and Case 5 was the trial in the modern times along with the mason system.

 

[Sushen]

I predict a full announcement at TGS and a Japanese release in Spring 2009, with a USA release in Fall 2009.

The huge increase in USA sales from AA3 ----> AA4 will teach capcom to never put an english version of GS again for the Japanese. So we wont effectively be able to play it until the Fall release.

This franchise is another "megaman franchise" for Capcom, if you know what I mean. At least one game a year which won't change the formula much unless switching platforms like GBA to DS. Very predictable and similar outputs, but they must have an extremely streamlined pipeline that can crank out a new game in short time with no delays and very minimum resources. With this business model, they don't need a mega seller and they can rely on strong fanbase of around 100k to make a decent profit to keep going. Atlus USA runs just like that. Personally, I don't mind at all since it's like having a subscription service for an awesome detective novel. Anyway, in other word, I won't be surprised to see AA5 this summer in Japan and US to follow in Fall or Winter.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

This franchise is another "megaman franchise" for Capcom, if you know what I mean. At least one game a year which won't change the formula much unless switching platforms like GBA to DS. Very predictable and similar outputs, but they must have an extremely streamlined pipeline that can crank out a new game in short time with no delays and very minimum resources. With this business model, they don't need a mega seller and they can rely on strong fanbase of around 100k to make a decent profit to keep going. Atlus USA runs just like that. Personally, I don't mind at all since it's like having a subscription service for an awesome detective novel.

Hmm....

GS1 2001
GS2 2002
GS3 2004
GS4 2007

That is definitely not a yearly release schedule.

Also I would like to point out that in Japan GS4 is the highest selling game in the franchise by a HUGE HUGE margin with 500k sold. This fact alone makes the transition from a Megaman franchise to something a little bigger, they NEED space between game releases to ensure quality. The moment they half ass a GS game is the day you will see that half-million Japanese fans whittle to nothing.

 

[MechaX]

Apollo > Phoenix
Trucy > all the Feys combined

So far, I would say that Apollo > PW1 Phoenix. PW2 is pretty equal, Case 4 notwithstanding, and PW3 Phoenix blows Apollo out of the water in every conceivable aspect. But of course, that's not quite a fair comparison in the slightest.

At first, I had the ranking for assistants as Maya > Trucy > Other Feys > Emma. But after Trucy's

Spoiler

Mr. Hat trick in Case 2

, Trucy is definitely at the top of the list.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

So far, I would say that Apollo > PW1 Phoenix. PW2 is pretty equal, Case 4 notwithstanding, and PW3 Phoenix blows Apollo out of the water in every conceivable aspect. But of course, that's not quite a fair comparison in the slightest.

At first, I had the ranking for assistants as Maya > Trucy > Other Feys > Emma. But after Trucy's

Spoiler

Mr. Hat trick in Case 2

, Trucy is definitely at the top of the list.

Comparatively speaking, Phoenix Wright in his first year is nowhere near as good as Apollo in his first year. I agree on that statement.

The difference is that Phoenix Wright never had to compete with a far superior Ace Attorney in the original game,

Spoiler

she was brutally murdered in case 2 of Phoenix Wright

. In here the

Spoiler

Ace Attorney is still Phoenix Wright

I absolutely agree about Trucy, she was charming from the beginning all the way to the end. All those Trucy haters can go suck a lemon.

 

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Okay, help me guys.

I can only afford one DS game right now, and I can't decide between this and Professor Layton. I'm a huge AA fan, but PL greatly interests me as well.

halp

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Okay, help me guys.

I can only afford one DS game right now, and I can't decide between this and Professor Layton. I'm a huge AA fan, but PL greatly interests me as well.

halp

Since you with buy both eventually, I say get AA4 first.

What do you expect, I got a Dahlia avatar. I am not the most fair person when it comes to these questions.

 

[grandjedi6]

Fixed for great justice

"All the feys" would also include Misty, Mia,

Spoiler

Iris, Dahlia

, Morgan, and Pearls.

I stand by my statement. Though you are right, I should have included Emma also.

So.. Trucy > All Feys, Emma and Maggey combined

Hmm....

GS1 2001
GS2 2002
GS3 2004
GS4 2007

That is definitely not a yearly release schedule.

Also I would like to point out that in Japan GS4 is the highest selling game in the franchise by a HUGE HUGE margin with 500k sold. This fact alone makes the transition from a Megaman franchise to something a little bigger, they NEED space between game releases to ensure quality. The moment they half ass a GS game is the day you will see that half-million Japanese fans whittle to nothing.

The original 3 games came out within roughly 1 year of each other while the 4th one was later for obvious reasons.

Okay, help me guys.

I can only afford one DS game right now, and I can't decide between this and Professor Layton. I'm a huge AA fan, but PL greatly interests me as well.

halp

Professor Layton is selling so well it's essentially a non-game. Buy Apollo Justice first, it has the greater chance of going out of stock

 

[Hcoregamer00]

The original 3 games came out within roughly 1 year of each other while the 4th one was later for obvious reasons.

That is not one year apart.

If you are talking about American releases, sure.

Phoenix Wright: October 2005
Ace Attorney 2: February 2007
Ace Attorney 3: October 2007
Ace Attorney 4: February 2008

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

Wait so, do people already know how this game is selling? Because it deserves to do great.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

Wait so, do people already know how this game is selling? Because it deserves to do great.

Check out the US retail musings thread.

The game is doing great.

 

[grandjedi6]

That is not one year apart.

If you are talking about American releases, sure.

Phoenix Wright: October 2005
Ace Attorney 2: February 2007
Ace Attorney 3: October 2007
Ace Attorney 4: February 2008

No, the Japanese releases were roughly a year apart for the 1st 3 games. Then the 4th took longer for obvious reasons (aka they weren't working on it the whole time)

 

[Sushen]

Hmm....

GS1 2001
GS2 2002
GS3 2004
GS4 2007

That is definitely not a yearly release schedule.

Also I would like to point out that in Japan GS4 is the highest selling game in the franchise by a HUGE HUGE margin with 500k sold. This fact alone makes the transition from a Megaman franchise to something a little bigger, they NEED space between game releases to ensure quality. The moment they half ass a GS game is the day you will see that half-million Japanese fans whittle to nothing.

As you mentioned in your other posting, it's closer to each other. The Japanese release dates above is not correct representation because the game was originally GBA titles and DS versions are rather "re-makes". GS4 sold rather big in Japan, but I think, that's rather exception to the rule than the rule itself. Just look at the game and how much of design, art, and code assets are recycled from previous games; it's rather obvious what the intention is with Capcom. Heck, we're talking about Capcom with Megaman, Street Fighter 2 and so many more "series" of games that are cranked out like clockworks.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

No, the Japanese releases were roughly a year apart for the 1st 3 games. Then the 4th took longer for obvious reasons (aka they weren't working on it the whole time)

This time is obviously proving to be very different.

Gyakuten Saiban 4 was released in Spring 2007, and if your yearly thing holds true then we would have at least heard more about GS5 because it would be released in Spring 2008.

Of course, that is assuming that Gyakuten Saiban 5 uses the same schedule as the GBA games, which it doesn't since it has become a bigger franchise.

As you mentioned in your other posting, it's closer to each other. The Japanese release dates above is not correct representation because the game was originally GBA titles and DS versions are rather "re-makes". GS4 sold rather big in Japan, but I think, that's rather exception to the rule than the rule itself. Just look at the game and how much of design, art, and code assets are recycled from previous games; it's rather obvious what the intention is with Capcom. Heck, we're talking about Capcom with Megaman, Street Fighter 2 and so many more "series" of games that are cranked out like clockworks.

My point is that using Yearly is not a good representation of the game series.

Especially when considering that the original GBA releases were niche releases. Only until the DS did the series come to its own.

 

[grandjedi6]

This time is obviously proving to be very different.

Gyakuten Saiban 4 was released in Spring 2007, and if your yearly thing holds true then we would have at least heard more about GS5 because it would be released in Spring 2008.

Of course, that is assuming that Gyakuten Saiban 5 uses the same schedule as the GBA games, which it doesn't since it has become a bigger franchise.

Well yes. AA5 won't come out in Japan until the Fall or Spring 2009 at the earliest. I'm just pointing out that your Gyakuten Saiban isn't yearly argument is flawed.

 

[Sushen]

My point is that using Yearly is not a good representation of the game series.

Especially when considering that the original GBA releases were niche releases. Only until the DS did the series come to its own.

Then my point is that they have all the tools to make it an anual franchise ready now. The remake of Phoenix Wright 1 did well in the US surely influenced them to bring the rest and more. The interval between the titles released in the US is narrowing, either, which means that they have a well-established pipeline for future releases.

From the track record, Capcom, once they found the working formula, never touches the main formula and goes into maintenance mode milking the game as long as the market would take it. I'm not saying all these as something negative, either. As a fan of the series, I would be more than happy to get a new game every year. Just don't expect big chances between the games and it'll never be a multi-million selling franchise and Capcom is well-aware of it.

 

[grandjedi6]

yo

<--------

 

[methodman]

great game. loved every minute of it. I hope they have

Spoiler

more Apollo in the next game though, it seemed like Phoenix casts a shadow that Apollo will never be able to beat.

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

It would be awesome if Phoenix was one of the prosecutors in the next game!
Finally get to beat the ol' man.

 

[kiryogi]

Yggdra down, Trucy up! And on the whole AA5 thing. I know there was some chatter about it, but at this rate it doesn't even sound like they've started on it yet. I'd give it 1-2 years at least. 2010 US? ;_;

 

[grandjedi6]

Yggdra down, Trucy up! And on the whole AA5 thing. I know there was some chatter about it, but at this rate it doesn't even sound like they've started on it yet. I'd give it 1-2 years at least. 2010 US? ;_;

There is no way they haven't started on it. But they probably are taking their sweet time with it.


And Trucy continues to be awesome.

 

[Firestorm]

"Someone came in and got the last copy literally 3 minutes ago"
I cannot believe I don't have this game yet and my friend is on case 4.

 

[grandjedi6]

"Someone came in and got the last copy literally 3 minutes ago"
I cannot believe I don't have this game yet and my friend is on case 4.

 

[Fuu]

I'm going a bit slower with this one, hard to get time to play recently. I'm on the second case and having much fun. I like Apollo, Trucy and Klavier already, they clicked with me fast. I don't really compare then to the characters from the previous games, it's pointless to do so.

The first case was awesome,

Spoiler

I got goosebumps and all emotional when Phoenix's objection theme played

. Can't wait to get home and play more.

 

[Docpan]

Definitely the best game in the series.

All of the importers were totally wrong with this one. Everything about the game is better, and I do mean everything. The prosecutor this time around can't quite match up to Godot, but it's a close call.

Case 1 was easily the best first case of any in the series. Another thing I've noticed in AA games is that Case 3 always tends to be the shittiest. Not so with AJ. Awesome, Awesome, Awesome.

You can argue that it's shorter and this is a step backwards, but actually I think it feels just right. Case 1 and 4 of AA3 were so short that they were over basically before I knew it. Actually, case 4 and 5 of AA3 can be considered one long case, but I digress.

AA4 >> every other game in the series. I hope all the initial hate it received doesn't dissuade the creators from using Apollo again in the next game.