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Trudeau tones down warm welcome for migrants as Canada struggles to cope with influx
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
FrankCanada97
Roughly the size of a baaaaaarge
This is going to be a mess, the amount of refugee claims will only be increasing in the next few years. New refugees are going to face an 11 year wait for refugee hearings, and the costs associated with providing for refugee claimants is only going to increase as well. Canada is stuck with them since the government can't just arrest and deport them.
WaterAstro
Member
Will America pay for our wall?
LucidMomentum
Member
Man I hope Machado gets through.
With that being said, immigration is on of the toughest aspects of government to tackle.
There's always the need to help people, but it seems like there's never enough.
With that being said, immigration is on of the toughest aspects of government to tackle.
There's always the need to help people, but it seems like there's never enough.
Audioboxer
Member
This is what happened/is happening in parts of Europe. Keep in mind I am not talking about refugees fleeing warzones, but as Trudeau referred to
It's almost as if you cannot just stand at a podium and make "empty" promises about immigration like you're earning brownie points and feeling good about yourself as waves of people clap at you and call you progressive. Immigration is a very complex, multi-faceted issue that involves a lot of money, time, resources, housing and so on. No country can handle taking in large streams of people non-stop if it's not capable of doing so. You cannot wave a magic wand at immigration.
When it's handled poorly or is ill-thought out you can lead your country down a path of unrest, turmoil, financial strain and give rise to right-wing parties that spend all the time beating you over the head for fumbling your own immigration policies/promises.
Canada is a big country, but even Canada needs a leader with a brain to look at immigration for the complex topic it is and work with all of the Government members/agencies to truly knuckle down on what numbers they can support and how they can do it.
Angela Merkel has even had to take note of her own immigration Governmental choices and try and reframe things ~ https://www.thelocal.de/20170704/merkel-party-vows-to-control-migration-more-strongly-if-re-elected The world has gone mad if genuinely intelligent people believe immigration is just a bad word, or something only the far right are allowed to talk about. Sadly some daft comments are probably going to be aimed at Trudeau now calling him all sorts of names or making accusations about him because he's talking about immigration. Yes, there's right and wrong ways to do it, but the point is every single damn Government has to talk about it and sort their border/immigration stances and policies out. People have to accept that.
Phrozenflame500
Member
You know Trump might have a solution for that...
GameAddict411
Member
The sad thing in all of this is that the Haitians that keep on crossing the borders cross on the hope that Canada will somehow give them residency or citizenship. There has been incredible amount of misinformation throughout the internet. The definition of a Refugee or an asylum seeker is really hard to meet, and that's even true in the United States. That person has to prove that because of personal reasons he or she is afraid to go back home. It has to be an something that person can't change about themselves. Someone who is gay from Ghana or Yemen meet the definition of a refugee. A poor person from Haiti does not. A person fleeing natural disasters or wars does not qualify as a refugee, unless they are designated as such(EX Syrians) by those respective countries. The reality of the situation is that a lot of these people will get deported from Canada when is determined that they don't meet the definition of a refugee.
GameAddict411
Member
http://globalnews.ca/news/3694772/canada-deporting-asylum-seekers/
Just an article signifying what I posted before
Just an article signifying what I posted before
ClosingADoor
Member
That immigration friendly image didn't last long for Canada. Turns out when you say people are welcome, a lot will come that you actually can't really give a place in your country.
Paracelsus
Member
I was told they shut down visa process for people in Venezuela from a girl looking to get the hell out, to Panama allegedly. Not sure how true that is but yeah.
rrvv
Member
Is Kinda hard to integrate integrate the population when some of them have next to nothing.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
With automation looming for things like truck driving there's going to be no way for them to support themselves in future. It may well start to affect skilled workers too in 20 years. So, if you want to leave your country you should do so now. International mobility might well become much much harder with greater technological growth unless something else is figured out. But is this really news? Trudeau never said the refugee program was a route for economic migrants in the first place. There are other routes that exist for that.
~ Zyzomys ~
Member
The Canadian refugee policy remains unchanged. Haitians who have lived in the United States, many for years, and then choose to illegally enter Canada are neither refugees or immigrants.
chromatic9
Member
11k sounds like a lowish to regular number compared to what smaller European countries take on. ~100k would be extreme.
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
It's interesting because I don't think the characterization of the article's title is accurate to what's actually going on, and the source is a UK-based newspaper with a conservative editorial bent. I would encourage anyone who is interested in the complexities of asylum seekers in Canada and the government response to check Canadian media, not global media who are trying to use Canada as a cudgel to influence their own domestic politics.
To give a Canadian context, here are stories related to this issue on the front pages of every major Canadian outlet:
CBC: How asylum seekers make refugee claims, and why they take so long
CTV: No story on the subject
Globe and Mail: Syrian Refugees try to restart businesses in Canada
National Post (conservative): MP says Haitians in Miami 'misinformed' on what it takes to come to Canada
National Post: Trudeau takes aim at 'racist' rallies, urges trust in immigration system
The Star: No story on the subject
Huffington Post: Trudeau Government Worried Asylum Seeker Influx Could Hurt 2019 Election Chances
Global: Many people illegally crossing into Canada were fed wrong information about asylum system
OP, where did you find this article?
To give a Canadian context, here are stories related to this issue on the front pages of every major Canadian outlet:
CBC: How asylum seekers make refugee claims, and why they take so long
CTV: No story on the subject
Globe and Mail: Syrian Refugees try to restart businesses in Canada
National Post (conservative): MP says Haitians in Miami 'misinformed' on what it takes to come to Canada
National Post: Trudeau takes aim at 'racist' rallies, urges trust in immigration system
The Star: No story on the subject
Huffington Post: Trudeau Government Worried Asylum Seeker Influx Could Hurt 2019 Election Chances
Global: Many people illegally crossing into Canada were fed wrong information about asylum system
OP, where did you find this article?
gutter_trash
Banned
Less than 40% of the migrants crossing from the US will be granted refugee status.
The US isn't a third world country so it is super difficult to lay claim from the migrants to get refugee status.
if they don't get accepted, they are not going back to Miami, they are go to Port-au-Prince
The US isn't a third world country so it is super difficult to lay claim from the migrants to get refugee status.
if they don't get accepted, they are not going back to Miami, they are go to Port-au-Prince
kitsunelaine
Banned
Just wanted to say: this is a Good Post and people should read it.
Poetic.Injustice
Member
Google news feed.
ClosingADoor
Member
Yes, which is the exact same thing that happened in Europe. The message was sent people were welcome, but it wasn't made clear exactly who, so others next to actually refugees took their chances also.
Countries next to conflict zones have more refugees. Nothing surprising. In the 90s with the conflict in the Balkans I'm guessing a ton of European countries got more refugees from there then the Middle East did for example.
Alx
Member
11300 people in 2017 doesn't sound that much, considering 10 times that amount crossed the Mediterranean sea to Europe in the same period. Even normalized by total population it's still below what many western countries are facing. *e - maybe not, once normalized it is indeed a lot (need to update my references for EU population...).
nelsonroyale
Member
The demonization of economic migration is problematic. I think it is absolutely understandable why people would want to move somewhere else to improve their lot in life. Europeans have done this for centuries. It wasn't generally the most successful Europeans who settled in Canada, the US and Australia for instance. However, it is clear that countries can't leave their borders open for anybody to enter...Not in the current climate at least. Which gets back to the fact that we need to address the inequality between nations on a global level if we want to largely solve economic migration. Trudeau and pretty much anyone in western government are symptoms people...Climate change is likely to massively increase migration in the next half century...
gutter_trash
Banned
The migrants' biggest problem is that they are crossing from the US.
The US has their rules on review refugee claiments.They should be patient and try to go through the process on the US side.
Fleeing the US for Canada is counter-productive because they have to prove why their lives are in danger in the US.
many will be sitting in limbo for a long time to backlog and slowness of our Canadian side of review each claiment's case.
Children, Mothers with Children, and whole families are the most likely to get the green light.
If a claiment gets rejected, they are not going to be deport back to the US. They will get deported to their country of origin, whether it be Haitii, Honduras, El Salvador or where ever they come from
The US has their rules on review refugee claiments.They should be patient and try to go through the process on the US side.
Fleeing the US for Canada is counter-productive because they have to prove why their lives are in danger in the US.
many will be sitting in limbo for a long time to backlog and slowness of our Canadian side of review each claiment's case.
Children, Mothers with Children, and whole families are the most likely to get the green light.
If a claiment gets rejected, they are not going to be deport back to the US. They will get deported to their country of origin, whether it be Haitii, Honduras, El Salvador or where ever they come from
I don't understand how some of the new arrivals are getting by living in Vancouver or Toronto, two of the most expensive cities on earth. When people in full-time jobs are struggling to afford to put a roof over their heads, what chance do refugees have?
I hope the gov are being sensible and looking toward spreading them out in underpopulated areas
I hope the gov are being sensible and looking toward spreading them out in underpopulated areas
Wafflecakes
Member
Ummmm..... lolololol.
Why not have the refugees settle in Antarctica? It would lead to an economic BOOM!!!!!!!! HOW AWESOME AND AMAZING!!!!
There is a reason no one lives in Northern Canada.
I wouldn't think people would want to live in extreme climates like northern Canada as their first choice.
"During the coldest 3 months, mean monthly temperatures range from −20 °F (−29 °C) in the southern sections to −30 °F (−34 °C) in the northern sections although temperatures can go down to −55 to −60 °F (−48 to −51 °C)."
"In the summer months, temperatures average below 45 °F (7.2 °C) and may occasionally exceed 65 °F (18.3 °C)."
BobNewbert31
Member
Yup, the cost burden just moves up. Mexico pays for ours, we pay for yours, and you have to pay for the polar bears' wall.
Wafflecakes
Member
Just because there's space doesn't mean there is infrastructure in place to support an influx of people there. I'm sure our more populated city centers are far better equipped to do so.
Workers move from places with little capital and poor infrastructure to places with plentiful capital and good infrastructure, thereby becoming much more productive. Further along their children also receive better education and are more productive than they would have been in their home countries.
Couch surfing around the Haitian community? These cities are so expensive because they're the most productive. They're also the most likely to already have established communities that can be supportive of asylum seekers, and are probably where we'd want immigrants to move.
Didn't last long? Multiculturalism has been a core part of the Canadian identity for a really long time. And I really don't see anything to indicate it's stopped being so.
Regardless, it's just not that big a deal.
http://nationalpost.com/opinion/and...s-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-asylum-seekers
gutter_trash
Banned
lots of people have heads in the clouds.
It is unrealistic to dump human populations in the middle of nowhere for them to build new towns.
the cities will be taking the majority of the accepted migrants. Close to family members or other members of the same community.
Canada is a low population country with the population concentrated in urban and suburban areas proximity to rivers, lakes, oceans close to the border
It is unrealistic to dump human populations in the middle of nowhere for them to build new towns.
the cities will be taking the majority of the accepted migrants. Close to family members or other members of the same community.
Canada is a low population country with the population concentrated in urban and suburban areas proximity to rivers, lakes, oceans close to the border
FrankCanada97
Roughly the size of a baaaaaarge
Yeah, this is probably true. Although my parents tell me they were left in a small town in Saskatchewan when they arrived as refugees. I couldn't imagine how my life turned out if they didn't decide to leave for Toronto after a few years.
Onlinehero
Member
What claims do Haitians generally have to be protected in the US currently? Environmental? Persecution? I'd wager the US and Canada have something similar to the Dublin act to speed up the process if they've travelled through the US. Although I'd also wager that Canada can't deport a person who will be sent home by the US if there's a risk of them being persecuted or victims of natural disasters.
If I were Haitian I'd wait until 'ol Orange is closer to doing something stupid (that effects Haitians specifically).
If I were Haitian I'd wait until 'ol Orange is closer to doing something stupid (that effects Haitians specifically).
Finland alone had 32,500 asylum applicants in 2015.
It's complicated. That said, i'd prefer they do something now in regards to the influx of refugees and allow them in rather than have more people risking frostbite like what happened to Seidu Mohammed and his partner. It's clear they don't feel safe in the United States due to ICE's recent actions and that more immigrants, undocumented or otherwise, and refugees in the U.S.A. are going to cross the border so it's best to address the issue now rather than risk it becoming a (toxic) political topic come 2019's federal election.
low population country? what? Canada has roughly 36 million inhabitants. And they get cold feet from 10k refugees?
just for comparison:
Austria, a country which is slightly larger than New Brunswick (83,879 km²) with a population of roughly 8 million and mostly consisting of mountains with a few big cities where most of the population lives was able to take in 14.627 this year alone (which is about half of that they took in last year around this time).
and there are many more examples like this (besides the well know German and Swedish ones). Don't even get me started on all these 3rd world countries hosting the lions share of refugees.
"Those fleeing terror, prosecution, and war" sounds pretty clear to me. Economic migrants aren't included under that umbrella, and the Prime Minister's statement was clearly in regards to Syrians and others fleeing from active war zones.
You Are Viewtiful
Member
Canada took in 40k Syrians the past two years, that's the third highest in the Western world after Germany and Sweden last I checked. 11k is the number that crossed in illegally from the US, not how many refugees we've taken in.
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