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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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roops67

Member
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
 
By-mission

By-mission

Member
Local Ray

I do not know to what extent it would be true, but there were some rumors that Adshir would be implementing some patents with Sony for RayTracyng solutions ... Obviously we are in the field of speculation, but the Spiderman video with RayTracyng seems to use assets of Insomaniac's game, of course reduced to run on a mobile device and prove the technique, what made me return to this speculation is the fact that Sony made this exclusive deal with Marvel "the spider man" is exclusive to Playstation, but look at it the video continues on YouTube and on their official website.

"Nonetheless, ray tracing comes with some major challenges for still images such as heavy traversals of static accelerating structures which result in high complexity, high power, reduced performance, lack of coherence in secondary rays that limit the use of SIMD mechanisms, and noise which reduces quality or performance. Noise is a function of the samples per pixel (SPP).


V8q08H9.png


Sample rate and noise in a ray-traced image.

The challenges are even worse for animation because accelerating structures must be repetitively rebuilt so there can’t be any skinned animation, and again noisy “film-grain” which results in low quality.

So Adshir has come up with a way to sidestep most of these issues with a novel and patented (30 of them) technique they are calling LocalRay. And the company has the audacity to suggest it is the first and only realtime ray tracing (RTRT) solution on battery-powered devices. Using proprietary dynamic data structures, the company reduces computational complexity. The net result, says Adshir, is a software solution that doesn’t need any hardware accelerators, low cost, low power, and has compatibility with all game development platforms (Unity, Unreal, gaming engines, etc.).

Adshir accomplished this breakthrough because their approach turns the whole laborious tree-intersection branching process upside-down—literally. The net result is they don’t have to do the rebuilding, branching, and testing and therefore can produce an image without requiring a denoising stage. They can support ray-traced skin animation with no penalty … and can run in realtime using a conventional raster graphics pipeline.
 
Knitted Knight

Knitted Knight

Banned
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...


Such a great made trailer... had platforming gameplay, puzzle gameplay, combat gameplay, panoramic view from the world, story cinematics, boss intro and teaser etc etc. Hit all the right notes. Textbook example of how to introduce your game. A lot of thought went into it.
 
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ArcaneNLSC

ArcaneNLSC

Member
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...



I remember posting that back a couple of weeks ago after watching and yeah the attention to detail in it is fantastic from the slight eye darts to the balance and flow of light and dark compositions and flow of the animations
 
Cobenzl

Cobenzl

Member
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...


It’s “in-engine” - confirmed in tweet reply to me.

 
bitbydeath

bitbydeath

Member
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...


I’m surprised this game doesn’t get talked about more. This is the Pixar level graphics we’ve been waiting for.
 
kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
HAL-01 said:
"In-engine" and "pre-rendered" aren't mutually exclusive. Most games with prerendered cutscenes do it in-engine. They should've asked if it was running in real time, specifically, if they wanted to clear things up
Click to expand...
I’m petty sure pre-rendered means it’s not real time, because when we play a game and a pre-rendered cutscene plays, it’s basically just a video file at that point being played on the console.

That’s why in Uncharteds 1,2,3 you couldn’t change the cutscene characters’ looks. It was always default Nate with default gun, the cutscenes were pre-rendered files.

But for Uncharted 4, they’re all done in-engine real time. And you can tell because right before the cutscene starts, any changes to Nate’s weapons or clothes, like getting his clothes muddy or wet or whatever, it all shows up in the cutscene. Nate has the same guns he has during gameplay.

Thats why I think pre-rendered means not running in real time. Like how there was that video of the UE5 demo playing on a laptop. It’s just a video file being played, the device is not real time rendering.
 
Games Dean

Games Dean

Member
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...

Ember Lab is awesome. They made one of my favorite youtube videos ever a few years ago about Majora's Mask. Who would've thought years later they'd be launching their first game alongside PS5? I'm really excited for this game.

 
icerock

icerock

Member
You give devs a specific power budget, and they'll use all of their resources to make the hardware sing well beyond its capabilities. I really wonder how many of you were around when specs in 2012 were leaked, even the most ardent fanboys were shattered by how utterly mediocre the hardware was. Yet, 7 years later, the amount of mind-boggling graphics we saw on these consoles, it's difficult to list all of them here.

Richard from DF made an observation on the sheer number of games which are using RT this early on in first batch of games. Dictator delved deeper and highlighted all of the instances, which also showcased how devs are using the limited power to produce a stunning frame. For instance, GT7 is using check-boarding to achieve RT reflections, a compromise necessary due to limited power on the GPU and other technical targets of hitting 4K/60.

Off the top of my head, I can recall three games with use of RT while pushing 4K/60. GT7, Ghostwire: Tokyo and Deathloop. I'm sure there are more games which I'm missing. Besides, there have been other games targeting a lower frame-rate but using more intensive RT such as Ratchet and Clank: Riftapart, Stray, Pragmata etc. If any of you have experience gaming on PC, you'll realize how utterly impressive these results are on a ~$500 console. Even $1000 RTX GPUs are brought to their knees at 4K any time RT is involved, and that's why the big hope is, of a much more advanced and evolved version of DLSS in the upcoming batch of Ampere cards.

The dick-measuring contest wrt specs have been done and beaten to death, everyone is aware of the advantages of each console. Throwing a snarky comment here and there on capabilities of these consoles will inevitably lead the discourse to a point of no return. Just watch the existing footage already out there and try to appreciate the jump in quality from current-gen to next. I'm sure, there are few on here, who are disappointed to not see anything running at the fidelity of UE5 demo or HB:2 teaser trailer in the revealed games so far. But, just realize how early we are in the life-cycle of a next-gen console. 6-7 years from now, we'll again look back and think how we saw certain graphical benchmarks of gameplay experiences which we never envisioned at the start. And, that will be down to the organic nature of development on these consoles, the devs will learn the machine better as time goes on and once again make them sing well beyond what we can think of right now.
 
Metroiddarks

Metroiddarks

Member
ArcaneNLSC said:
Agreed Kena was I think up there with Horizon Forbidden West, Spider-Man MM as well as Ratchet and Clank in terms of being highlights and quality
Click to expand...
Kena will be limited for basically:

1)Is crossgen, yes looks very good but this have its limitations as you know
2)Ember lab is new in gaming (the experience matters)
3)New hardware (PS5)

But even with that, the game looks very good but is because this guys are very good.

 
R

roops67

Member
Cobenzl said:
It’s “in-engine” - confirmed in tweet reply to me.

Click to expand...

Thanks buddy that's the confirmation I'm glad to see. They said somewhere else it was 'pre-rendered in-engine' , which is kinda self contradicting. In-engine would assume it's scripted real time, but pre-rendered is a video?? So I played it safe and stuck with pre-rendered cos otherwise I got jumped on by
IntentionalPun IntentionalPun
 
bitbydeath

bitbydeath

Member
roops67 said:
Thanks buddy that's the confirmation I'm glad to see. They said somewhere else it was 'pre-rendered in-engine' , which is kinda self contradicting. In-engine would assume it's scripted real time, but pre-rendered is a video?? So I played it safe and stuck with pre-rendered cos otherwise I got jumped on by
IntentionalPun IntentionalPun
Click to expand...

I figured it was both. Recorded in-engine on PS5 so it could be easily passed down to PS4.
 
kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
HAL-01 said:
You're right, what i said is that "in engine" is not synonymous to "real time". for example in Resident Evil 4 all cutscenes were in-engine, however they ran in real time only on the gamecube. the ps2 used video files captured from the GC version
Click to expand...
I’m pretty sure almost everything this entire generation is technically “in engine.” I’m pretty sure it’s a useless term now. Like Uncharted 2 cutscenes were pre-rendered but still in-engine.

I think it was Killzone 2 back for PS3 back in 2006 that had that first trailer that was mislabeled as in-engine when it wasn’t. Like that entire trailer was made using other machines to render the video, not a PS3.

I’m pretty sure everything from the PS5 show of Kena was still in engine, just some of it was pre-rendered.

In engine is supposed to be showing off what the console engine* (*edited after I was corrected) can render, real time or pre-rendered.

So only real time in-engine footage, like when Kojima debuted Death Stranding at E3 2016, is the real way to show the power of a system.

Was the Kena cinematic stuff supposedly not even in-engine? Cause it didn’t look that crazy good. It just looked pre-rendered to me.
 
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kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
roops67 said:
Thanks buddy that's the confirmation I'm glad to see. They said somewhere else it was 'pre-rendered in-engine' , which is kinda self contradicting. In-engine would assume it's scripted real time, but pre-rendered is a video?? So I played it safe and stuck with pre-rendered cos otherwise I got jumped on by
IntentionalPun IntentionalPun
Click to expand...
Pre rendered and in engine is like The Last of Us on PS3 cutscenes. Everything was rendered in engine, but the cutscenes are not real time, they’re pre-rendered and then made into video files for the final game data package.
 
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kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
bitbydeath said:
I figured it was both. Recorded in-engine on PS5 so it could be easily passed down to PS4.
Click to expand...
I think everything of Kena is in-engine, just the cinematics are not running in real time. They’re pre-rendered in-engine.

Everyone seems to be confused as to what the levels are for showing off graphics power... I think this is how it goes..

1. Real time in-engine - this is what a system can really do. It’s the impressive shit. Every frame is rendered in say 33.3 ms for a 30 Hz game.

2. Pre-rendered in-engine - cool, but not as impressive. Uncharted 2 cutscenes. They run as video files when we play the game. The rendering could take longer than would be possible for gameplay, giving the engine more capability to render stuff. Only shows off what an engine can do, but could be done off console on other machines.

3. Not even in-engine - This shows literally nothing for determining the power of a console or engine. It could be anything. Even live action movies etc.

Edit - thanks to HAL-01 HAL-01 for clarifying some stuff.
 
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kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
icerock said:
You give devs a specific power budget, and they'll use all of their resources to make the hardware sing well beyond its capabilities. I really wonder how many of you were around when specs in 2012 were leaked, even the most ardent fanboys were shattered by how utterly mediocre the hardware was. Yet, 7 years later, the amount of mind-boggling graphics we saw on these consoles, it's difficult to list all of them here.

Richard from DF made an observation on the sheer number of games which are using RT this early on in first batch of games. Dictator delved deeper and highlighted all of the instances, which also showcased how devs are using the limited power to produce a stunning frame. For instance, GT7 is using check-boarding to achieve RT reflections, a compromise necessary due to limited power on the GPU and other technical targets of hitting 4K/60.

Off the top of my head, I can recall three games with use of RT while pushing 4K/60. GT7, Ghostwire: Tokyo and Deathloop. I'm sure there are more games which I'm missing. Besides, there have been other games targeting a lower frame-rate but using more intensive RT such as Ratchet and Clank: Riftapart, Stray, Pragmata etc. If any of you have experience gaming on PC, you'll realize how utterly impressive these results are on a ~$500 console. Even $1000 RTX GPUs are brought to their knees at 4K any time RT is involved, and that's why the big hope is, of a much more advanced and evolved version of DLSS in the upcoming batch of Ampere cards.

The dick-measuring contest wrt specs have been done and beaten to death, everyone is aware of the advantages of each console. Throwing a snarky comment here and there on capabilities of these consoles will inevitably lead the discourse to a point of no return. Just watch the existing footage already out there and try to appreciate the jump in quality from current-gen to next. I'm sure, there are few on here, who are disappointed to not see anything running at the fidelity of UE5 demo or HB:2 teaser trailer in the revealed games so far. But, just realize how early we are in the life-cycle of a next-gen console. 6-7 years from now, we'll again look back and think how we saw certain graphical benchmarks of gameplay experiences which we never envisioned at the start. And, that will be down to the organic nature of development on these consoles, the devs will learn the machine better as time goes on and once again make them sing well beyond what we can think of right now.
Click to expand...
Agreed, very well said.
 
SlimySnake

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
icerock said:
You give devs a specific power budget, and they'll use all of their resources to make the hardware sing well beyond its capabilities. I really wonder how many of you were around when specs in 2012 were leaked, even the most ardent fanboys were shattered by how utterly mediocre the hardware was. Yet, 7 years later, the amount of mind-boggling graphics we saw on these consoles, it's difficult to list all of them here.

Richard from DF made an observation on the sheer number of games which are using RT this early on in first batch of games. Dictator delved deeper and highlighted all of the instances, which also showcased how devs are using the limited power to produce a stunning frame. For instance, GT7 is using check-boarding to achieve RT reflections, a compromise necessary due to limited power on the GPU and other technical targets of hitting 4K/60.

Off the top of my head, I can recall three games with use of RT while pushing 4K/60. GT7, Ghostwire: Tokyo and Deathloop. I'm sure there are more games which I'm missing. Besides, there have been other games targeting a lower frame-rate but using more intensive RT such as Ratchet and Clank: Riftapart, Stray, Pragmata etc. If any of you have experience gaming on PC, you'll realize how utterly impressive these results are on a ~$500 console. Even $1000 RTX GPUs are brought to their knees at 4K any time RT is involved, and that's why the big hope is, of a much more advanced and evolved version of DLSS in the upcoming batch of Ampere cards.

The dick-measuring contest wrt specs have been done and beaten to death, everyone is aware of the advantages of each console. Throwing a snarky comment here and there on capabilities of these consoles will inevitably lead the discourse to a point of no return. Just watch the existing footage already out there and try to appreciate the jump in quality from current-gen to next. I'm sure, there are few on here, who are disappointed to not see anything running at the fidelity of UE5 demo or HB:2 teaser trailer in the revealed games so far. But, just realize how early we are in the life-cycle of a next-gen console. 6-7 years from now, we'll again look back and think how we saw certain graphical benchmarks of gameplay experiences which we never envisioned at the start. And, that will be down to the organic nature of development on these consoles, the devs will learn the machine better as time goes on and once again make them sing well beyond what we can think of right now.
Click to expand...
I was one of those people who were disappointed but i knew that the gddr5 (it was only 4gb in the leaks) would fix a lot of the issues that plagued ps3 games in particular. 8gb of course was overkill but it is a big reason why open world games look so fucking good this gen. Funny how no one argues that vram isn't important for graphics rendering but dare mention ssd can improve the graphics and they all pounce on you like hyenas.

I was watching the jackfrags gow stream this morning and the detail on kratos and baldurs face was overwhelming. I swear it looked better than a real-life movie when he has him in a chokehold towards the end. Just an astounding amount of detail they managed to pack in a single close up real-time cutscene.

And yeah, i was surprised by how many games were using rt, especially at native 4k. Pragmata is actually full rt with reflections and maybe even real-time ray traced GI according to Alex. Yes the girl and the environments look current gen but it looks far better than any current gen rtx showpiece.

I think naughty dogs second game next gen will look like hellblade 2. Tlou2 looks a gen ahead of uncharted 4 at times. It looks like that prerendered uncharted 4 teaser. Absolutely insane.
 
FranXico

FranXico

Member
Bryank75 said:
What the fuck is the deal with Xbox money-hatting Yakuza just on next gen?

Then they are talking about anti-consumer shit... what hypocrites. Why is nobody making more noise?

Is it just because it's a PS4 game anyway or does nobody care?
Click to expand...
It's because it's ok when Microsoft does it, of course. They're doing that because Evil Sony left them no choice. Remember, Phil and friends are the good guys.
 
HAL-01

HAL-01

Member
kyliethicc said:
In engine is supposed to be showing off what the console can render, real time or pre-rendered.
Click to expand...
"in engine" only shows what the engine is capable of, its not representative of what the console can do. You could make a photorealistic CGI movie on UE4 that's "in-engine", but that no hardware would be able to run smoothly in real time. Only thing representative of console graphics performance is a real-time demo.

kyliethicc said:
Was the Kena cinematic stuff supposedly not even in-engine? Cause it didn’t look that crazy good. It just looked pre-rendered to me.
Click to expand...
People were arguing about the cutscenes being real time or pre-rendered in-engine, and ember labs clarified that some of them were pre-rendered. Veteran argued some time ago that they used a CGI offline renderer, but looking at the artifacts on the screenshots i can safely say theyre done in UE4.
 
DarkMage619

DarkMage619

$MSFT
ToadMan said:
What MS gain from putting GP on PlayStation is the savings from no longer developing custom hardware. Xsex is looking increasingly like the last custom hardware box they put out.

I’m fairly confident that MS would sell enough subscriptions to GP/xcloud to make it worth it to them. Sony on the other hand, are probably resistant to the idea for now.
Click to expand...
Do you have know how much MS makes from 3rd party licenses? That would be gone. The 3rd party games on game pass would be gone too. So all they'd have is 1st party games. If that's the case then game pass wouldn't need to exist at all. Xbox live gold would be gone too. They have to PAY Sony a % for their license and dev kits. And xcloud wouldn't work cause it would be competing with PSnow. And all that work developing those systems would be lost too. All for games Sony fans hate? Where is this major source of revenue coming from again?

Perhaps you just don't want MS in the console space cause I don't see how going 3rd party generates more than what they'd lose. They have the best hardware going into the next generation. I'm pretty sure Xbox isn't going anywhere. Quote me on that.
 
kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
HAL-01 said:
"in engine" only shows what the engine is capable of, its not representative of what the console can do. You could make a photorealistic CGI movie on UE4 that's "in-engine", but that no hardware would be able to run smoothly in real time. Only thing representative of console graphics performance is a real-time demo.


People were arguing about the cutscenes being real time or pre-rendered in-engine, and ember labs clarified that some of them were pre-rendered. Veteran argued some time ago that they used a CGI offline renderer, but looking at the artifacts on the screenshots i can safely say theyre done in UE4.
Click to expand...
Thanks. Makes sense.
 
FeiRR

FeiRR

Banned
roops67 said:
Revisiting the Kena trailer, OMFG what an eye-opener from an animator's point of view. This guy's attention to detail breaks down the poses and moves and it's insane. Have learnt so much about movements that would have never noticed before

I would understand why the CGI none-gameplay cutscenes part of the trailer would be pre-rendered... I can't imagine how they would have this amount of detail animations being scripted in-engine even if the PS5 hardware is capable of rendering it real-time. Tho this is also coming out on PS4 too so yeah they could have done it just for consistency between the two I guess... aslong the jump between cutscenes and gameplay aren't jarring !
Click to expand...

If they have it offline rendered anyway, they had it scripted and working in-engine. So it's not the reason. My guess would be that they want certain cutscenes to look the same across 3 platforms they're developing for. Remember that it's also going to be released for PS4 and PC. PS4 can't produce such graphics and most PC can't either. Not even the biggest publishers dare yet to up the PC specs to "RTX card only, 5 GB/s NVME drive required". An indie dev doing that is impossible if they want any sales on PC.

Metroiddarks said:
giphy.gif


In other topics the people of media molecule created a monster of game/engine.

Click to expand...

It's some kind of a joke... right? If not, Sony should hire that guy immediately!
 
FeiRR

FeiRR

Banned
icerock said:
The dick-measuring contest wrt specs have been done and beaten to death, everyone is aware of the advantages of each console. Throwing a snarky comment here and there on capabilities of these consoles will inevitably lead the discourse to a point of no return. Just watch the existing footage already out there and try to appreciate the jump in quality from current-gen to next. I'm sure, there are few on here, who are disappointed to not see anything running at the fidelity of UE5 demo or HB:2 teaser trailer in the revealed games so far. But, just realize how early we are in the life-cycle of a next-gen console. 6-7 years from now, we'll again look back and think how we saw certain graphical benchmarks of gameplay experiences which we never envisioned at the start. And, that will be down to the organic nature of development on these consoles, the devs will learn the machine better as time goes on and once again make them sing well beyond what we can think of right now.
Click to expand...
I don't agree with this point. We haven't seen a single second of gameplay of a next gen game captured on Xbox Series X. Until they provide it, I can claim Xbox Series X is just a marketing lie from Microsoft. They have a long track record of lying and misleading their customers:
- beginning of 7th gen - lying about quality of X360
- beginning of 8th gen - lying about the impact of DX on game development
 
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AeneaGames

AeneaGames

Member
FeiRR said:
It was lacking in both audio and video in comparison to Amiga 1200. And by audio I don't mean MIDI but the Yamaha chip. I used ST only once ever but I remember my astonishment when a simple text processor couldn't keep up with my typing. Back then, Discord was called IRC and it worked pretty well :)
Click to expand...

Ah, so not really hardware issues, they were just inferior to the Amiga's. That I agree with.
And yes, I know that little editor you're talking about, it was an unoptimised mess, I believe it came bundled but it didn't exactly show of what the the thing could do. Many editors and word processors that didn't have that at all. Heck the ST was really rather popular for DTP, desktop publishing, and it had no issues with keeping up with typing with those.

IRC stands for Internet Relay Chat BTW and am really quite familiar with it but back in those days (talking about 1982-1987) it was almost impossible to get access to Internet unless you were at some research lab, university or at defense organisation or contractor. Back then it was all dial up to BBS'es, get your mail and anything else quickly and hang up. I started working in 87/88 and then I finally had some contacts to get access to Usenet and their digests, Internet email, etc. Ahh good times...

Anyway IRC was actually much later!
 
AeneaGames

AeneaGames

Member
FeiRR said:
Your post made me google the first thing I owned, I think I was 5 at that time.

Atari ST still sucks balls ;)
Click to expand...

Pong like device huh? No wonder you went Amiga after that, comparable....

:messenger_tears_of_joy: :pie_roffles:

Back then I also really disliked it when Amiga fans claimed stuff that simply wasn't true so had to 'correct them', hehe, but the thing is that I just wanted to code for them all, I also always wanted to own all the 8-bit computers, code for them, get to know them inside and out, ahhh, I was just a computer/gaming fan and even tho as a kid I could not afford to buy the others as well I could still appreciate them....

Same thing with consoles really! Tho I have had an anti-MS thing going since the mid 90's
 
Alex Scott

Alex Scott

Member
HotChips is a paid event. But RGT will likely covered it tomorrow considering he has done this in the past. for both the xbox one and xbox one x.
Sorry to get your guys hoped up if you were planning to live stream it.
 
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