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Phil Spencer admits defeat in console space, and doesn't think great games would help Xbox's market share.
- Thread starter FunkMiller
- Start date
RedC
Member
You're right. It's business.
However, those acquisitions can accelerate a vision coming to fruition.
Topher
Gold Member
Perhaps Microsoft should follow trend-setting models of Sony and Nintendo that lead to great games?
Nankatsu
Gold Member
Watched his entire interview and the vibe I got is that he is kind of beaten after all these years.
Even when he expresses that Xbox has great games coming up, you can clearly see that he doesn't sound pumped up about it.
I like Phil and his approach to the community even though he doesn't represent the brand I support, but this was legit a really weird interview, seemed more like a therapist session.
Even when he expresses that Xbox has great games coming up, you can clearly see that he doesn't sound pumped up about it.
I like Phil and his approach to the community even though he doesn't represent the brand I support, but this was legit a really weird interview, seemed more like a therapist session.
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“When you're third place in the console marketplace, and the top two players are as strong as they are, and have, in certain cases, a very discrete focus on doing deals and other things that make being Xbox hard for us”
A leader with an enormous amount of resources at his disposal claiming that he has essentially no agency, that failure is guaranteed due to forces outside of his control. That is not the way to run a company. Clearly there is a path to success, but he has not found it.
A leader with an enormous amount of resources at his disposal claiming that he has essentially no agency, that failure is guaranteed due to forces outside of his control. That is not the way to run a company. Clearly there is a path to success, but he has not found it.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
FunkMiller
Member
Hmmm. I wonder what part of their latest earnings report is doing so well?
Would it be the part that the CMA have cited in their blocking of the ABK deal?
MasterCornholio
Member
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Perhaps Microsoft should follow trend-setting models of Sony and Nintendo that lead to great games?
Yup
A king exists for his inferiors to follow
ToadMan
Member
Phil is Victim-in-chief. And that has spread to the fanbase.
Xbox always did have a kind of uncool Emo vibe even back in the 360 era which has just gotten worse since.
I thought it was just MS’s boring image coupled with mountain dew swilling bro gamers who couldn’t see past the FPS genre. But it seems like this persecution complex was emanating from the top under Phil and it attracted a fanbase that just identified with it.
“Woe is me, it’s so unfair, no one understands me!”
It’s tough for these tiny companies to compete with big bad Sony and Nintendo what with their products and content that people purchase and enjoy
This slow motion train wreck will come to an end when MS shake up Xbox management and force them to proper 3rd party publisher status rather than the 1.5 party status they currently occupy.
No they won’t dominate gaming thankfully for us, but they’ll make nice money and that’s better than where they are today.
Neo_game
Member
I do not understand my Xbox guys like Phil spencer so much 
Microsoft have all the money in the world, all they needed is good leadership and management. They should have always focused on 100 million consoles first. Then they can consider trying to win billion of gamers around the world. They have chosen different path and now banking on gamepass and cloud as first then PC and Xbox is their last priority
Microsoft have all the money in the world, all they needed is good leadership and management. They should have always focused on 100 million consoles first. Then they can consider trying to win billion of gamers around the world. They have chosen different path and now banking on gamepass and cloud as first then PC and Xbox is their last priority
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Ar¢tos
Member
Ceadeus
Gold Member
It is! What's your favorite console?
Raven117
Member
This was absolutely strategic. He didn't go on some gaming podcast to say their brand sucked.
In the end, some of his analysis is correct though. Last generation was a bad one to lose. Sony, while they took a big L in the beginning of the ps3 generation, did focus on one thing...Their exclusives. By the time the ps4 generation came around, they were ready. Ps5 just kept up with that hype. (Xbox 1 reveal was a disaster of epic proportions).
Fundamentally, I don't think they understand game development like Sony does. And Nintendo...their IP is just bonkers strong and works on a different segment of the market.
In the end, some of his analysis is correct though. Last generation was a bad one to lose. Sony, while they took a big L in the beginning of the ps3 generation, did focus on one thing...Their exclusives. By the time the ps4 generation came around, they were ready. Ps5 just kept up with that hype. (Xbox 1 reveal was a disaster of epic proportions).
Fundamentally, I don't think they understand game development like Sony does. And Nintendo...their IP is just bonkers strong and works on a different segment of the market.
AltogetherAndrews
Member
So the money-bags bully method didn’t work, so now they feign weakness and play the victim? Yikes.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
It's the truth though. . It would apply to anyone beyond MS. Picture Amazon, Google, Samsung, or anyone else trying to make a new console. It's such a steep incline to be competitive it is virtually impossible. I'm not saying that to agree with him. I've thought this for a while. Amazon can barely even get a single game made without issue. Google already gave up. Meta is doing .... okay.
ComputerBlue
Member
Pumping out Halo Gears Forza isn’t success, they’ve never won a gen, and even when they were leading in console sales at some point during 360‘s lifespan, those numbers were inflated because of the red ring of death, and because they had a jump on sales because they dropped their console before Sony did. They’ve been sucking since part way in the 360 lifecycle and haven’t delivered on anything prominent since, maybe it hasn’t been 20 years, but it’s been 15.
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Ordnasella_Edadnirt
Neo Member
What absurdity is that ? great games is what drives people to buy consoles that's common knowledge. yes Sony and Nintendo are in a fantastic momentum but at previous generations they struggled badly Sony and Nintendo nearly cease to exist, Xbox in the other hand has daddy MS wich in a quarter alone makes more cash then the market cap of Nintendo and Sony combined ! resources are not the issue ! Xbox doesn't do any effort to improve their studios Sony for example is boosting their studios with more employees shifting those studios to multiple projects wich will improve their output, throwing the towel when you own beloved franchises such as Halo, Gears, Forza, Elders Scrolls, Fallout, it is unaceptable, It's time to Phill, Aaron and Matt to go.
systemr123
Member
I missed the part in his interview where he’s saying he’s gonna fix things. He’s not doing anything as per usual, just admitting he created a shit show with no games and even going as far as saying it doesn’t even matter if the Xbox games will turn out great
. Please let this man get some nice long holiday to contemplate and put some actual leader in charge.
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
look if you buy the same damn console twice despite it failing on you and proving to be unreliable.... that's not an indictment on the console, that's a testament to how good it is. Otherwise everyone would have bought a PS3 after their 360s failed on them once
it hasn't been 15 or 20 years it's been 10
Dr_Ifto
Member
They stopped pumping out exclusives outside forza/halo/gears around 2009. From that point on, the 360 died, and they continued that into the x1 era.
Setsuna Mudou
Member
Phil's interview in a nutshell...
Luipadre
Member
He sure sounds like it in the interview my god
March Climber
Member
If Sony one day said that you can download their storefront on PC, and your purchases for Playstation will also be accessible through it?
90% chance of me saying yes.
That's the only tether they have left that holds me to their platform. Otherwise no, I will still be tethered to Playstation and their exclusives(and third party JP exclusives) until this happens.
Again, no one is seeing it right now because the Steam Deck is on Gen 1. It's still a baby. It will grow and everyone will eventually see the future I'm seeing. Like think about it, there's a literal 4th console, that will grow to be a super-console, just sitting there in the corner of the room and everyone is ignoring it or dismissing it for now and are too busy distracted by Xbox vs Sony. It's wild stuff.
drganon
Member
The only vision they had was trying to create a monopoly. Now they're just upset it's not going through.
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ComputerBlue
Member
A great console does not mean success, the Dreamcast was fucking great and it killed Sega.
solidus12
Member
Now that you mention it, it is "UNE console PlayStation" in french...Yes, It Is "LA PLAY" in Spain
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Just go third party, Phil. Then the PR spin catchphrase will finally see the light.
"When everybody plays, we all win."
"When everybody plays, we all win."
Ar¢tos
Member
Who is Welma? Why is Mattrick one of the kids?Phil's interview in a nutshell...
It honestly comes off like a big crying session. I worked in Gamestop back during the release of the OG Xbox. I distinctly remember it not selling worh a shit. Nobody liked it and everybody that came in clowned it. Of course you had a few loyalist that stuck with it because it was MS and they wanted competition ... but for the most part customers bought Gameboy, Game Cube, n64, PS one and 2 merch and that was it.... until Halo got out by word of mouth.
Halo single handidly got that console out into the wild and in peoples hands. Then they realized some of the benefits it had, like a hard drive you could rip songs too. For Phil to say that great games dont help is pure BS. Its a cop out statement. He would have been better off saying something like ... we put our eggs into the wrong baskets and made poor choices. Then focus on making some fun games
Venom Snake
Member
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
80 million units spold in the lifetime is pretty damn successful. it's not like a 70/30 split it's pretty much 51/49.
balls of snow
Member
Remember ps3 early days had baaad games and that didnt help shit with being second place for a long time. You had Haze and Lair and the B series Resistance/Killzone. Not even mgs4 move the needle much at that time.
I recall it was the moment Uncharted 2 became THE talk of gaming town was when sony got their wind back. And then god of war 3 hits, Uncharted 3, the fucking Last of Us. Great games that turn the brand around and momentum did the rest till this day. Great games do matter Phil.
I recall it was the moment Uncharted 2 became THE talk of gaming town was when sony got their wind back. And then god of war 3 hits, Uncharted 3, the fucking Last of Us. Great games that turn the brand around and momentum did the rest till this day. Great games do matter Phil.
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Crispy Gamer
Member
Idk man I'm hearing more and more people on Xbox focused podcasts express the feeling that maybe Activision would be better off not getting purchased by MS after Redfall combined with Phil's new admission today how can they expect people to have confidence in them 
what's the calculation? This interview was a PR nightmare
what's the calculation? This interview was a PR nightmare
Nitty_Grimes
Made a crappy phPBB forum once ... once.
Ignore me I am blind drunk.
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So I think it was successful, but I think by that point... it was too late. The Saturn is what killed Sega. That and the jump into the Sega CD and the 32 X adapter and all that other shit they put out.
I loved the dreamcast, but once EA took over the NFL liscense..and they lost that 2k football game, it just seemed as if they gave up. Sad really as it had some bangers.
The Saturn (I had it) was plain shit... no games what so ever and just not supported well.
Atari did it similar with the jaguar if I remeber it correctly. By the time it released.. atari was just a bad taste in everyones mouth.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Absolute nonsense. They didnt fail in every way. They succeeded in the main aspect which was to provide VIDEO GAMES. Yes, they fucked up with the $599 price tag and shitty architecture, but by the end of 2007, just one year in NOT the majority, they already had a great line up of exclusives which continued to grow year after year. That told gamers that Sony is interested in making VIDEO GAMES and by 2009, the console was selling for $299 and the convuluted architecture no longer resulted in awful ports. In 3 short years, they had fixed all the issues while offering AAA exclusives like Uncharted 1, 2, KZ2, MGS4, LBP, Resistance 1 and 2, Motrostorm and Motorstorm PR, Socom Confrontation, Warhawk, Heavenly Sword, Infamous, Ratchet and Clank Future Tools of Destruction, and ended the last 4 years releasing GOTY contender after GOTY contender.
All Phil had to do was follow the same model. Release games while fixing shit like taking out the Kinect and reducing the price of the console. He did everything except for releasing games. Don Matrick had Titanfall, Ryse, Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive, Coalitions New IP, Scalebound and Fable all lined up. All Phil had to do was continue that work. Instead, he cancelled Coalitions New IP, Scalebound and Fable. Then cut ties with Respawn, Remedy and Insmoniac instead of investing in them like Sony did with Sucker Punch, GG, Media Molecule and Evolution Studios.
This whole mindshare argument is mind numbling dumb considering MS WON the mindshare from Sony in the 360 era. Every single third party game sold better on the Xbox. Thats where the hardcore went. MS lost the mindshare when they went full kinect in 2010 and never looked back. Every single E3 conference was kinectimals, kinect sports, douchbags pretending to play star wars, jumping around like they are playing football. Every single one. That is what turned the mindshare. Those same Xbox owners looked at that trash and saw sony showing GOW, Heavy Rain, TLOU2, KZ3, Uncharted 3, Infamous 2, Beyond, and thats when MS lost the mindshare. Thats how the PS3 caught up to the 360. because MS refused to release games people want to play.
Literally the same thing we have seen play out since Phil took over.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
This is PR messaging, don't let it fool you.
Nitty_Grimes
Made a crappy phPBB forum once ... once.
Needs a vote thing is will you get banned for making that poll?
FrankWza
Member
It sure is. It's also a last ditch effort. It's their only shot after being consistently beaten and outmaneuvered, generation after generation. He's admitted that today. But there's nothing at all that's shrewd or strategic. It's as uninspired as a plan can be.
It's a plan that comes from losing. It wasn't their plan when they started xbox and it wasn't their plan during the 360 days or when the introduced kinect and xb1.
NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
As a Xbox user since the 360 era who was never in for the strongest Xbox exclusives, I appreciate Spencer saying this and I think he’s just stating the obvious.
Iwata once said, “all it takes is one game”. Yet WiiU had some terrific first-party lineup and exclusives, and it didn’t mean shit. People weren’t interested in the hardware and, as often is the case with Nintendo, it’s the lack of third party and (closely related to it) the hardware being undesirable that sealed the WiiU’s fate. WiiU would have failed even without the cumbersome GamePad. Heck, even a hypothetical exclusive God of War or Final Fantasy game would have struggled to make the system reach 15 million sales.
So yes, Spencer is absolutely right in saying that Starfield being an 11/10 wouldn’t shake things an inch.
PlayStation is simply synonymous with console gaming in most of the world, and has been for almost 30 years. This hasn’t been a race ever since the OG Xbox came in a distant second against the PS2, except for maybe a few years with the 360 and strictly in the US, thanks to a good headstart. Sony’s world dominance was never in jeopardy. Never.
Furthermore, since the 7th gen, gamers polarized around walled online communities. This means that PS always had the biggest online console community in the world, and no game in the Xbox space ever tipped the scales. With online in the frame, people aren’t going to drop their PS5s to buy another $500 that plays a lot of the same games, but not a few precious ones, and leave behind their online pals. It’s just not going to happen, and walled online communities had this exact goal: at one point, people would have to make a choice, and now there’s just too much to lose to jump ship. Sunk cost fallacy and all that jazz.
I appreciate my Series X for what it gives me - ie, a console that gives me 4K gaming and lots of games to play that I otherwise wouldn’t for a convenient monthly price. Plus the occasional new release when I give in to FOMO. All of that without having to go through the hassle and the expense of building a gaming PC and keeping it updated. I don’t care if it’s never going to be the market leader.
Iwata once said, “all it takes is one game”. Yet WiiU had some terrific first-party lineup and exclusives, and it didn’t mean shit. People weren’t interested in the hardware and, as often is the case with Nintendo, it’s the lack of third party and (closely related to it) the hardware being undesirable that sealed the WiiU’s fate. WiiU would have failed even without the cumbersome GamePad. Heck, even a hypothetical exclusive God of War or Final Fantasy game would have struggled to make the system reach 15 million sales.
So yes, Spencer is absolutely right in saying that Starfield being an 11/10 wouldn’t shake things an inch.
PlayStation is simply synonymous with console gaming in most of the world, and has been for almost 30 years. This hasn’t been a race ever since the OG Xbox came in a distant second against the PS2, except for maybe a few years with the 360 and strictly in the US, thanks to a good headstart. Sony’s world dominance was never in jeopardy. Never.
Furthermore, since the 7th gen, gamers polarized around walled online communities. This means that PS always had the biggest online console community in the world, and no game in the Xbox space ever tipped the scales. With online in the frame, people aren’t going to drop their PS5s to buy another $500 that plays a lot of the same games, but not a few precious ones, and leave behind their online pals. It’s just not going to happen, and walled online communities had this exact goal: at one point, people would have to make a choice, and now there’s just too much to lose to jump ship. Sunk cost fallacy and all that jazz.
I appreciate my Series X for what it gives me - ie, a console that gives me 4K gaming and lots of games to play that I otherwise wouldn’t for a convenient monthly price. Plus the occasional new release when I give in to FOMO. All of that without having to go through the hassle and the expense of building a gaming PC and keeping it updated. I don’t care if it’s never going to be the market leader.
DJ12
Member
Well he's now off script. Phil just said xbox consoles are done.
He made the big pitch saying he could make them compete, and now he's just told the world, and those same shareholders, that he cannot.
Ps6 will have no direct xbox equivalent, I'm expecting a fairly decent budget gaming pc for around $1000-$1500 that will become the base spec for ms games for a few years.
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